In the end, the Tucker Carlson interview of Vladimir Putin surprised because it was utterly conventional. No weird forced, barking laughs from Tucker. No wild-eyed proclamations from the Russian president. The interview was two hours of two very smart people circling the issues like a matador circling a bull. The question at the end of the interview: Who was circling whom?
Many expected a sycophantic interview by Tucker. Instead, he had an edge of hostility, and Putin obstinately filibustered, explained, and talked around the questions and, in some cases, comically rewrote history — something that was not unexpected.
Watch the interview here. It’s worth viewing because Putin is a historic character and, in some ways, a throwback to a more politically sophisticated time. Putin is both subtle and strangely transparent for a Russian leader. Most of all, he’s serious, something lacking among Western leaders.
When asked why he invaded Ukraine, Putin went on a thousand-year recitation of Russian history, beginning in the ninth century. This circuitous oratorical journey has been hilariously memed. This is one of my favorites (I apologize in advance for the nerdy reference):
Still, the history lesson’s purpose was to explain to the West about borders and the changed European landscape. At one point — and this is absurd — Putin accused the Poles of collaborating with the Germans (ah yes, complying with a knife at the throat is collaboration) while disregarding Russia’s footsie with Germany and then conveniently forgetting Russia’s rape of Poland after the latter had been raped by Germany. Details.
About a third of the way into the interview, Putin talked about Tucker’s attempt to become a CIA operative and smirks, “Lucky that didn’t happen.” Clearly, Putin thinks it did happen. Later, Putin again alluded to Tucker being CIA again. The interesting thing is that Tucker didn’t flinch or roll his eyes or deny the charge. Putin said it with an amused expression. This viewer wondered about the many iterations of Tucker Carlson’s public persona. Stranger assertions have been proven true.
Speaking of the CIA, Putin attributed the Nord Stream explosion provenance to the American spy agency. He rhetorically asked: Who could do the sophisticated operation? He then proceeded to deconstruct the mission.
Back to Ukraine. Putin’s beef with the West and his frustration with Ukraine was the 2014 coup tossing leadership the West didn’t like. Putin groused that no one — and he specifically mentioned the French and the Germans — abided by the Minsk Agreement. (A friend in intelligence rightly notes that the Ukrainians believe the Russians ignore the Budapest memorandum.)
Putin then launched into a soliloquy about de-Nazifying Ukraine. He decried brutal behavior by the Nazified Ukrainians — something chortle-worthy considering Russian war behavior. That aside, Putin never explained why it’s his job to de-Nazify Ukraine. This all seems to be so much bluster.
He did then talk about the Istanbul Agreement, which was scuttled, as Tucker noted, by U.K. Prime Minister Boris Johnson on behalf of the United States. The agreement was a peace accord negotiated between Ukraine and Russia a year and half ago. This should have been done and over. Instead, the Western elites in America, especially, needed a bogeyman, and Putin and Russia are it. Putin rightly stated that U.S. leadership are trying to intimidate their own people to create a Russian threat.
Putin made clear that he’d be willing to come back to peace negotiations now. American leadership doesn’t want and hasn’t wanted that. It’s worth asking why.
When Tucker asked Putin whether he thinks President Volodymyr Zelensky could even negotiate peace on behalf of Ukraine, Putin hedged, saying that Zelensky “considers himself head of state.” It’s an interesting choice of words — not that Zelensky is the head of the state.
Near the end of the interview, Tucker asked Putin how he justifies his actions, since Putin is a Christian. This was a novel question. First, the idea that Putin is a practicing Christian is laughable. Second, that Tucker assumes Putin is a Christian is also laughable. Putin mused on the question and then claimed he is defending the motherland, that it’s his Christian duty to defend Russia against the aggression of the West in Ukraine.
Putin described a good relationship with George W. Bush and talked about wanting a closer relationship with the West after the fall of the USSR. This seemed sincere.
He then dropped, casually, into the conversation Russia’s excellent hypersonic missiles. It was a not-so-subtle threat.
Tucker asked about Russia’s coziness with China. Putin noted that Russia and China share a huge border and that they’ve always worked to get along. He noted the size of China and that they must be friendly.
Putin talked about the East and West being two hemispheres of a brain and that they must work together. At that point, it would have been a good time to challenge him because what he was describing was a kind of globalism when the whole war with Ukraine has been an exercise in asserting a defense of Russia — nationalism in the extreme.
The interview ended with Tucker pressing Putin on the imprisoned journalist Evan Gershkovich. Putin insisted that Gershkovich was involved in espionage and caught holding Russian state secrets. He called him a spy. Tucker pushed back and said that he was a journalist just doing his job. Putin was unmoved. He did say he was open to negotiations to get Gershkovich back to the U.S.
For those who’ve ever played live-action role-playing games, Vladamir Putin is the personification of a lawful evil character. He has a structured and disciplined mind. He’s restrained. And strangely, he’s transparent in a way most Russian leaders are not. He tells the West over and over what he literally thinks, and they seek to find nuance where there is none.
In a follow-up video, Tucker talked about Victoria Nuland desiring to take Putin out. He rightly asks what would follow. Does the world really want a weak leader in charge of the largest nuclear arsenal?
It is this writer’s opinion that the Putin years will be looked back on warmly. Putin has no intention of using nukes and considers the idea risible. He’s not expansionistic. Rather, he wants the West to leave Ukraine alone and to have regional sovereignty.
The leaders who come after Putin may not share his modest aims, and they’ll be sitting on top of advanced weapon technology and a massive nuclear arsenal. The foreign policy elites in America should check themselves. They’ve achieved their aims in Ukraine — to hide their money laundering and graft in the fog of war and to test Russia’s military might and degrade the same. It’s time to end the destruction and give peace back to this region. Let go of the inane mission of killing Putin and be grateful that he doesn’t possess one-tenth of the ego consuming and blinding America’s foreign policy establishment.
