The American Spectator

james23| 1.9.09 @ 12:53PM

Would it be impolite, or too much work, to contact the leadership of the American Israel Public Affairs Committee, whoever that is, and get a reaction to the report?

Alexander A. K. Hoggsbuckle IV| 1.9.09 @ 1:45PM

The notion of President Obama having chats with these Hamas fellows suggests that it is now imperative that Israel eliminates all such possibilities. Hamas should be removed in total.

AXJ| 1.9.09 @ 4:19PM

The international civil and political rights organization AXJ calls for an immediate cease fire to hostilities on both sides. www.axjus.com

Kermit| 1.10.09 @ 1:04PM

Philip, you speak of Hamas wanting to kill your niece and nephew. I would like to bring to your attention the uncontested fact that Israel has killed vastly more innocent Palestinian children than the number of Israeli children killed by Palestinians. I don't know the precise number of children killed by Hamas, but I would guess at this point the ratio roughly mirrors the 100:1 death toll in the current Gaza assault. Israeli leaders for decades have said that for every Israeli killed, Israel SHOULD kill 50 or 100 Palestinians. So, unless you sincerely believe Jewish lives are worth more than non-Jewish lives, you have lost some sense of proportionality. If you are simply concerned about the killing of children, you ought to be more outraged about Obama consorting with the government of Israel.

Kermit| 1.10.09 @ 1:08PM

Here's a source for death statistics for your readers. According to the very good organization If Americans Knew, 123 Israeli children have been killed by Palestinians and 1,050 Palestinian children have been killed by Israelis since September 29, 2000. Go see yourself at www.ifamericansknow.org.

Kermit| 1.10.09 @ 1:11PM

You would expect the Palestinian:Israeli ratio of children killed in Gaza to be higher for two reasons: the population of Gaza is more than 50% children, and Gaza has virtually no armaments and most of the much-publicized home-made rockets land in the desert, not in villages. I trust your readers are interested in facts, and not just accepted faith.

Kermit| 1.10.09 @ 1:16PM

For readers who actually care about the death of children in conflict, here is a precise accounting of the Israeli and Palestinian children killed in that conflict - names, places, dates:
http://rememberthesechildren.org/about.html

I posit that Jewish lives are not worth more than non-Jewish lives: all human life is sacred. I would be shocked if any person of faith would disagree with that, Debbie Schlussel notwithstanding.

S.L. Toddard| 1.10.09 @ 7:08PM

I understand the sentiments of the Israelis on here entirely, but as an American I am of the opinion that President Obama should do whatever he can to stay on good relations with the Arab world in its entirety. Democratically elected Hamas poses no threat to America and should be

S.L. Toddard| 1.10.09 @ 7:10PM

...engaged as such. Any measure that will help to put an end to this dreadful mess in Palestine, or at least to ensure that only a minimum of the hatred inflamed as a result is directed towards America, should be taken.

S.L. Toddard| 1.10.09 @ 7:15PM

"123 Israeli children have been killed by Palestinians and 1,050 Palestinian children have been killed by Israelis"

Correct. But according to Likudniks those 123 Israelis are *victims*, and the 1050 Palestinian children *brought it upon themselves*.

Quite simply it is a matter of fierce sentimental attachment, and people enthralled to it cannot see or use Reason to analyze the situation. There are Americans who declare simultaneously that A) Israel is an independent country which doesn't need America's permission to wage war and B) that American and Israeli interests are identical. More than identical actually - they believe they are literally the same thing. These people, if they are Americans, need to ask themselves to which country they truly belong. Then they might ask themselves the following:

Is there any way in which American security, in which the tranquility that is our birthright, is *enhanced* by our one-sided support of this nation on the other side of the world? What justification is there to subsidize their wars against the Arabs? What American interest is served that is so profoundly significant, so important that it is worth making Israel's enemies - i.e. the whole of the Muslim world, on whom we depend for the very lifeblood of our society - *our* enemies?

American foreign policy, after all, must be based on something more than sentimental attachment.

Kermit| 1.10.09 @ 7:29PM

Well said, S.L. There is nothing about blind support for Israel that is conservative, and it is certainly not in the US national interest.

Kermit| 1.10.09 @ 7:36PM

It is worth pointing out that Obama has merely suggested indirect communications with Hamas, something the Bush administration has quietly done since 2004. Democracy, as the incompetent fool Donald Rumsfeld has pointed out, is messy. Hamas was elected democratically, while Fatah is corrupt and widely reviled by Palestinians. If anything, Israel's latest assault has strengthened the popularity of Hamas, just as Israel's assault on Lebanon strengthened Hezbollah and the US threats toward Iran strengthened conservatives there. Threats and assaults strengthen the rejectionists.

WendyG| 1.10.09 @ 8:10PM

ALL the deaths of Palestinan civilians is the fault of Hamas. The chose war, and like the cowards they are they hide themselves and their weapons among innocent civilians.

>>>>Hamas was elected democratically, while Fatah is corrupt and widely reviled by Palestinians.

When you are talking about the Palestinians, nothing is democratic. It's about intimidation and strong arming - they have mafias that use the barrel of a gun to gain power.

WendyG| 1.10.09 @ 8:11PM

>>>.If anything, Israel's latest assault has strengthened the popularity of Hamas, just as Israel's assault on Lebanon strengthened Hezbollah and the US threats toward Iran strengthened conservatives there.

Baloney. Hamas has been decimated.

WendyG| 1.10.09 @ 8:13PM

>>>>I posit that Jewish lives are not worth more than non-Jewish lives: all human life is sacred.

Really? Hitler's life was sacred? Bin Laden's life is sacred.

I do not agree that all human life is sacred.

Kermit| 1.10.09 @ 10:36PM

Wendy, I struggle to follow your logic, and you don't have a strong command of the facts, but I seek to be patient.

According to international law, and simple morality, Israel is in fact responsible for innocent civilians it kills. For example, the other day in Zeitoon, Israel forced 120 civilians from their homes, herded them all into one building, and then shelled it. 30 civilians are dead and most of the rest are injured. That, my friends, is a war crime. It reminds me of Qibya, frankly, which dear Wendy has never heard of.

Second, you do not weaken Hamas in the eyes of Gaza's population by bombing and terrorizing it - in fact, the population will increasingly see Hamas as justified. Think about it - every innocent civilian killed had a family (unless Israel killed them all) - and the survivors will be committed to revenge, therefore strong supporters if not ready recruits for Hamas. Same situation with Hezbollah in Lebanon. In both cases, moderates are either humiliated for urging negotiations and pacifism, or they are transformed into radicals because of direct personal harm.

In the case of Iran, threats of violence justify the government cracking down on dissent, and humiliate those who favored diplomacy. This is exactly what happened when Cheney said "we are not going to bomb Iran, just undermine them through civil society", and rejected talks with Khatami. It was the worst thing we could have done for that fledgling civil society. Civil society groups were clamped down on, Khatami was humiliated and weakened, and ultimately this led to the (s)election of Ahmadinejad.

Finally, Wendy, are you subtly trying to say Israeli lives are inherently more valuable than Palestinian lives? Go ahead, I dare you, take that last step toward being a nazi. you know you want to. Morality is such a drag, anyway, and God was just kidding about "thou shalt not kill".

WendyG| 1.11.09 @ 9:54AM

I had a feeling this was a trial balloon or a rumor. Looks like I was right.

Saturday 10th January, 2009
Big News Network.com

Obama reportedly will stick with Bush policy on Hamas

The Jerusalem Post is reporting that it has been told president-elect Barack Obama will stay with President George Bush's policy of isolating Hamas in Mideast peace negotiations.

The chief national security spokesperson of the Obama transition team, Brooke Anderson has has told the Post, "Barack Obama has repeatedly stated that he believes that Hamas is a terrorist organization dedicated to Israel's destruction, and that we should not deal with them until they recognize Israel, renounce violence, and abide by past agreements."

The Obama spokesperson was commenting on a story in the London newspaper The Guardian, published on Friday, which said Obama was considering low-level, non-direct talks with Hamas.

"The president elect's repeated statements [about not dealing with Hamas] are accurate," Anderson said. "This unsourced story is not."

And don't patronize people here Kemit. I not only know about the Middle East, I have been there. Again, when you hide bombs and guns in homes, mosques, hospitals (and even ambulances) ALL the civilian blood is on your hands.

Kermit| 1.11.09 @ 1:13PM

I have been to the Middle East too, Wendy, for an extended period, and your conclusions about culpability have no basis in fact, law, or morality. But I get it. What you really mean is that Israel is beyond facts, above the law, and living by its own special covenant with God that supercedes our quaint little notions of morality. You seem totally unmoved by the fact that over the decades, Israel has consistently killed between 10x and 100x the number of its citizens killed. You're totally OK with that. Because you're special!

I have wondered my whole life how human beings manage to do such evil to each other: Germany, Rwanda, Serbia, Cambodia, Darfur. How could "good Germans" possibly go along with what was done to Jews in Germany? I am not Jewish, nor German, but this has tormented me because I believe we all have the same potential within us. This is us, not them. We are the victim and the oppressor.

Wendy, you have provided me with part of the answer in your total indifference to the suffering caused in your name. You are not identified with humanity, but just your little group. You have successfully de-humanized the Palestinians, and you manage the feat of blaming them for your actions. They had it coming, like saying to a rape victim that she was asking for it. You probably believe all the photos of children with severed limbs are photo-shopped, because Israelis are "pure" and wouldn't do that. You probably think the death counts are exaggerated, because the media and the UN are secretly in the tank with Hamas. What it takes for evil to succeed is for good people to stand by and do nothing. Wendy, you're doing one better. Gaza is a concentration camp, and Wendy G will be cheering on the Final Solution with popcorn.

A transformation has occurred that is truly sad and horrifying.

Evermore| 1.11.09 @ 3:08PM

The Palestinians have dehumanized themselves. They and their chosen leaders. Generations have been bred to hate. That's not Israel's fault.

Kermit| 1.11.09 @ 3:19PM

Wrong. That's just something you use to justify killing innocent people. They're not fully human like you. Remember, that's what the Germans said about the Jews in Germany.

WendyG| 1.11.09 @ 3:35PM

Kermit stop calling everyone who disagrees with you a Nazi. Gaza is what the Palestinians made it.

Here is a great editorial that explains why Gaza is what it is.
http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,24898667-5000117,00.html

Kermit| 1.11.09 @ 3:44PM

Wendy, you are not honest. I do not call everyone who disagrees with me a nazi. I say you specifically are happily skipping down that path, in dehumanizing Palestinians as "other", blaming innocent civilians for actions done to them, and painting a fantasy image of your "team" as pure and noble by definition. I feel sad for you, as you must be pretty unhappy deep down at embracing such a horror as part of your personal identity. You can support Israel, without pretending that what it is doing is pure and honorable. It is committing atrocities, and sadly, after the fact the world will pathetically say, "gee, if we'd only known the truth, we might have done something". I support Israel's right to live in peace, not its right to exterminate the Palestinians, and I sure don't want to pay for it.

WendyG| 1.11.09 @ 6:42PM

Again you are dishonest. It is the Palestinians, and Hamas specifically, that wishes to exterminate Israel. Hamas does not recognize Israel's right to exist, while Israel moved it's own people so that Gaza would be Palestinian. You have it exactly backwards.

Kermit| 1.11.09 @ 6:53PM

Wendy, Israel pulled out the settlers from Gaza but imposed a total blockade by land, air, and sea, destroyed Gaza's port and airport, and continued bombing Gaza with thousands of rockets over the last 3 years. Even before this latest crisis, almost all the deaths and injuries were on the Palestinian side, and almost all the shots and missiles fired were on the Israeli side.

You are incorrect that Hamas does not recognize Israel's right to exist - it has repeatedly offered full recognition of Israel if accompanied by an end to the blockade, return by Israel to UN-recognized 1967 borders, and a Palestinian referendum endorsing the settlement. It is Israel that has never endorsed Palestine's right to exist, much less declare its own borders.

You claim to know what Hamas "wishes" and say that Hamas wishes to exterminate Israel. You and I both know that even if Hamas had such a wish - which is reported in Israeli propaganda but not reflected in statements and actions of Hamas - they do not have the means to do so. Israel is the most heavily armed nation per capita in the entire world, with many hundreds of nuclear weapons, backed by the most powerful nation on earth - and yet you claim Israel is mortally threatened by Hamas and use this to assert Israel's right to exterminate 1.5 million starving captives in their western concentration camp. I'm not buying it. I know you trust the talking points you're given, but please try a little harder.

WendyG| 1.12.09 @ 3:27PM

Sacre bleu! Even the French get it more than some American appeasement types...

January 12, 2009
French stop broadcasting Hamas TV

Ethel C. Fenig
Let's give credit where credit is due: The French, yes the French! removed Al-Aqsa TV from their satellite according to the Intelligence and Information Center.

Hamas’s Al-Aqsa TV announces it has begun broadcasting via a European communications satellite. Less than 24 hours later, its broadcasts were removed from the air shortly after the Intelligence and Terrorism Information Center’s bulletin and as a result of the intervention:

1. On January 5, 2009 , the Intelligence and Terrorism Information Center revealed that Hamas's Al-Aqsa TV had begun broadcasting via a European communications satellite called Eurobird , which belongs to Eutelsat , a company whose head offices are in Paris .

2. Following the publication of the ITIC information and after appeals by many factors, the French authorities instructed Eutelsat to remove Al-Aqsa TV's broadcasts from its European satellite. On the morning of January 11, and ITIC examination showed that the broadcasts had in fact been removed from Eurobird .

3. According to official sources in the French satellite industry, Al-Aqsa TV was taken off the air less than 24 hours after it started broadcasting. According to the same sources, the French broadcasting regulator CSA ( Conseil supérieur de l'audiovisuel ) wrote to Eutelsat and warned them that much of Hamas's programming contravened French laws against incitement to hatred and violence (Agence France Presse, January 9, 2009.)

It is comforting to know that the French don't believe that "incitement to hatred and violence" deserve freedom of speech protection

WendyG| 1.12.09 @ 3:29PM

Kermit - I won't converse with you again until you stop using terms like concentration camp and extermination. There are no gas chambers in Gaza. Such language is deeply offensive.

Kermit| 1.12.09 @ 6:29PM

Wendy,

That's fine. In practical terms, Gaza is in fact a concentration camp. No one gets in or out without Israeli permission - and Israel forbids the press and the Red Cross from entering - and there is a total air, land and sea blockade. There are barbed wire fences and walls and observation towers surrounding it. The people inside are starving to death - according to the UN, it is hunger on the level of the worst African suffering. Two thirds of the territory's 1.5M people have no electricity or drinking water - because of Israeli bombing and cutoff of fuel - and 70% of the population depends on food from the UN because Israel has strangled the economy. Dov Weisglass, an adviser to Ehud Olmert, said earlier this year: "The idea is to put the Palestinians on a diet, but not to make them die of hunger". And then bomb the poor hungry people to pieces, and call them all terrorists. 300 dead children in the past two weeks, all of them Palestinian, none of them Israeli.

That sounds an awful lot like the ghettos of WW2 to me. Ghetto, concentration camp, bantustan, call it what you will, Israel looks an awful lot like a combination of South African apartheid and World War 2 Germany to me.