When will Nancy Pelosi recant?
Pope Benedict XVI met with a holocaust-denier yesterday. Bishop Richard Williamson? No, Nancy Pelosi.
A Pelosi-led delegation of Catholic Democrats who dismiss the moral significance of millions upon millions of abortions turned up at the Vatican yesterday.
Last month these same abortion-holocaust deniers had lectured Benedict for mishandling the flap over Richard Williamson’s lifted excommunication.
Seizing on a chance to embarrass the Pope, fifty Catholic Democrats, Rosa DeLauro and George Miller among them, wrote a letter to him demanding a “clarification” in the Williamson matter. (He had already done so, but they felt it just wasn’t emphatic enough.)
“Bishop Williamson has said as recently as this past November that, ‘historical evidence is hugely against 6 million Jews having been deliberately gassed in gas chambers as a deliberate policy by Adolf Hitler.’ Yet, the Holocaust is a verifiable fact and as people of good will would agree, one of the darkest chapters in our history as a human family. There are still thousands of people amongst us — Jews and non-Jews — who can attest through eye-witness accounts to the horrors of the Holocaust,” they wrote in part.
“As a spiritual leader and the head of the Catholic Church, we believe it is vital that you publicly state your unequivocal position on this matter so that it is clear where the Church stands on one of the most consequential events of the 20th century…”
William Delahunt, who pulls down a 100% rating from the National Abortion Rights Action League, piously explained to the Boston Globe the pressing need for this letter of rebuke. “The moral authority of the church is important to retain, and having those statements out there was unacceptable,” he said.
Pro-abortion Catholic Democrats don’t normally warm to the cause of preserving the Church’s moral authority, and certainly not to the concept of excommunication. But in Williamson they had finally found a Catholic not fit for entrance to their communion line.
They would of course say that an important difference exists between them and Williamson. And they are right: He opined egregiously about a historical evil; they finance and facilitate a contemporary one. Engaging in appalling historical speculation about past evil is bad; paying for a present evil as they do is worse.
It is rich that after slapping Benedict’s hand over Williamson they would tumble over themselves to kiss it on Wednesday. To its credit, the Vatican denied them a photo-op, though quickly after the meeting Pelosi cranked up the PC wind machine to spin it as constructive.
“It is with great joy that my husband, Paul, and I met with His Holiness, Pope Benedict XVI, today. In our conversation, I had the opportunity to praise the Church’s leadership in fighting poverty, hunger, and global warming, as well as the Holy Father’s dedication to religious freedom and his upcoming trip and message to Israel. I was proud to show His Holiness a photograph of my family’s papal visit in the 1950s, as well as a recent picture of our children and grandchildren.”
Global warming? The last time I recall Benedict broaching the subject of global warming he pointedly observed that environmentalists need a “human ecology” with which to stop killing unborn babies.
The Vatican’s post-meeting description was diplomatically devastating in its clinical tone: “His Holiness took the opportunity to speak of the requirements of the natural moral law and the Church’s consistent teaching on the dignity of human life from conception to natural death which enjoin all Catholics, and especially legislators, jurists and those responsible for the common good of society, to work in cooperation with all men and women of good will in creating a just system of laws capable of protecting human life at all stages of its development.”
In January pro-abortion Catholic Democrats angrily asked if the Vatican would force Williamson to recant. This month the Pope in effect asked them if they will. Will Pelosi, DeLauro, and company disavow their views? Or will they continue to rationalize, minimize and revise the massive, ongoing holocaust of unborn human life?
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The New Nazis in Israel| 2.19.09 @ 7:14AM
The New Nazis in Israel.
Certainly, compared to the giant-scale mass murderers of Auschwitz, Goldstein was a quite petty mass murderer. But the recorded statements of him and his comrades prove that they were perfectly willing to exterminate at least two million Palestinians at an opportune moment. This makes Dr. Goldstein quite comparable with Dr. Mengele, and the same holds true for anyone saying that he would welcome more of such Purim holiday celebrations. [The massacre occurred on that holiday.] And let us not devalue Goldstein by comparing him with an Inquisitor or a Muslim Jihad fighter. Whenever an infidel was ready to convert to, respectively, Christianity or Islam, an Inquisitor or a Muslim Jihad fighter would as a rule spare his life. But Goldstein and his admirers are not interested in converting the Arabs to Judaism. As their statements testify, they see the Arabs as nothing more than disease-spreading rats, or lepers, or lice, or other loathsome creatures: which is exactly how the Nazis depicted the Jews. The Nazis believed that the Aryan race alone had laudable qualities which were inheritable, but which could get polluted by sheer contact with the dirty and morbid Jews. Kahane, who found nothing in the Nuremberg Laws to learn from, had exactly the same notions about the Arabs.
Undeniably, Preuss is right.
Threat to World Peace| 2.19.09 @ 7:31AM
The Talmudic World View
In the end, Shahak reported, “Neither the Israeli, nor the diaspora, rabbinical authorities ever reversed their ruling that Jews should not violate the Sabbath in order to save the life of a Gentile…It became apparent to me, as, drawing on knowledge acquired in my youth, I began to study the Talmudic laws governing the relations between Jews and non-Jews, that neither Zionism, including its seemingly secular part, nor Israeli politics since the inception of the State of Israel, nor particularly the policies of the Jewish supporters of Israel in the diaspora, could be understood unless the deeper influence of those laws, and the world view which they both create and express is taken into account.”
The Hatanya—the fundamental book of the Habbad movement, which is one of the most important branches of Hasidism—declares that all non-Jews are totally Satanic creatures “in whom there is nothing absolutely good.” Even a non-Jewish embryo is said to be qualitatively different from a Jewish one. The very existence of a non-Jew is “inessential,” whereas all of creation was created solely for the sake of the Jews.
Shahak points out that a widespread misunderstanding about Orthodox Judaism is that it is a “biblical religion,” that the Old Testament has in Judaism the same central place and legal authority that the Bible has for Protestants and even Roman Catholics. He notes that, “…the interpretation is rigidly fixed—but by the Talmud rather than by the Bible itself. Many, perhaps most, biblical verses prescribing religious acts and obligations are understood by classical Judaism and by present-day Orthodoxy in a sense which is quite distinct from, or even contrary to, their literal meaning as understood by Christians or other readers of the Old Testament, who see only the plain text.”
In the Decalogue itself, the Eighth Commandment, “Thou Shalt not steal” (Exodus 20:15) is taken to be a prohibition against “stealing” (that is, kidnapping) a Jewish person. “The reason,” Shahak writes, “is that according to the Talmud all acts forbidden by the Decalogue are capital offenses. Stealing property is not a capital offense (while the kidnapping of Gentiles by Jews is allowed by Talmudic law)—hence the interpretation.”
In numerous cases, Shahak shows, general terms such as “thy fellow,” “stranger,” or even “man” are taken to have an exclusivist and chauvinistic meaning. The famous verse “Thou shalt love thy fellow as thyself” (Leviticus 19:18) is understood by classical (and present-day Orthodox) Judaism “as an injunction to love one’s fellow Jew, not any fellow human. Similarly, the verse ‘neither shalt thou stand against the blood of thy fellow’ (Leviticus 19:16) is supposed to mean that one must not stand idly by when the life (‘blood’) of a fellow Jew is in danger; but a Jew…is in general forbidden to save the life of a Gentile, because ‘he is not thy fellow.’”
The differentiation in appropriate treatment for Jews and non-Jews to be found in Talmudic commentaries is, Shahak shows, not simply an academic question. Instead, it relates to current Israeli government practices which are justified by reference to religious law.
A book published by the Central Region Command of the Israeli army, whose area includes the West Bank, contains the following declaration by the command’s chief chaplain: “When our forces come across civilians during a war or in hot pursuit or in a raid, so long as there is no certainty that those civilians are incapable of harming our forces, then according to Halakah [Jewish law] they may and even should be killed….Under no circumstances should an Arab be trusted, even if he makes an impression of being civilized….In war, when our forces storm the enemy, they are allowed and even enjoined by the Halakah to kill even good civilians….”
Many contemporary Israeli policies refer to Talmudic rules. Thus, Shahak declares, “The Halakah forbids Jews to sell immovable property—fields and houses—in the Land of Israel to Gentiles. It is therefore clear that—exactly as the leaders and sympathizers of Gush Emunim say—the whole question of how the Palestinians ought to be treated is, according to the Halakah, simply a question of Jewish power; if Jews have sufficient power then it is their religious duty to expel the Palestinians….Maimonides declares; ‘When the Jews are more powerful than the Gentiles we are forbidden to let an idolater among us; even a temporary or itinerant trader shall not be allowed to pass through our land.’”
Jewish Fundamentalism
In the book Jewish Fundamentalism in Israel, Shahak and co-author Norton Mezvinsky lament the dramatic growth in recent years of Jewish fundamentalism which has manifested itself in opposition to the peace process and played a role in the assassination of Prime Minister Yitzhak Rabin and the murder of 29 Muslims at prayer by the American-born fundamentalist, Baruch Goldstein.
They cite, for example, Rabbi Yitzhak Ginsburgh, who wrote a chapter of a book in praise of Goldstein and what he did. An immigrant to Israel from the U.S., Ginsburgh speaks freely of Jews’ genetic-based spiritual superiority over non-Jews; “If you saw two people drowning, a Jew and a non-Jew, the Torah says you save the Jewish life first….Something is special about Jewish DNA….If a Jew needs a liver, can you take the liver of an innocent non-Jew passing by to save him? The Torah probably would permit that. Jewish life has an infinite value.”
Shahak and Mezvinsky point out that, “Changing the words ‘Jewish’ to ‘German’ or ‘Aryan’ and ‘non-Jewish’ to ‘Jewish’ turns the Ginsburgh position into the doctrine that made Auschwitz possible in the past. To a considerable extent the German Nazi success depended upon that ideology and upon its implication of being widely known early. Disregarding even on a limited scale the potential effects of messianic…and other ideologies could prove to be calamitous….The similarities between the Jewish political messianic trend and German Nazism are glaring. The Gentiles are for the messianists what the Jews were for the Nazis. The hatred of Western culture with its rational and democratic elements is common to both movements…. The ideology…is both eschatological and messianic….It assumes the imminent coming of the Messiah and asserts that the Jews, aided by God, will thereafter triumph over the non-Jews and rule them forever.”
It troubled Israel Shahak that the lesson many Jews learned from the Nazi period was to embrace ethno-centric nationalism—just what had created such tragedy in Europe—and to reject the older prophetic Jewish tradition of universalism. He was particularly dismayed with the organized Jewish community in the U.S. and other Western countries, which promoted ideas of religious freedom and ethnic diversity in their own countries, but embraced Israel’s rejection of these same values.
It was Shahak’s view that bigotry was morally objectionable regardless of who the perpetrator is and who the victim. He declared: “Any form of racism, discrimination and xenophobia becomes more potent and politically influential if it is taken for granted by the society which indulges in it.” For Jews, he believed, “The support of democracy and human rights is…meaningless or even harmful and deceitful when it does not begin with self-critique and with support of human rights when they are violated by one’s own group. Any support of human rights for non-Jews whose rights are being violated by the ‘Jewish state’ is as deceitful as the support of human rights by a Stalinist….”
In an article about his childhood for The New York Review of Books, Shahak recalled listening to some Polish workmen talking during the Nazi occupation. Discussing the situation, one young man defended the Germans by pointing out that they were ridding Poland of the Jews, only to be rebuked by an older laborer, “So are they not also human beings?” It is a phrase that Shahak never forgot.
During his life, Israel Shahak was rebuked, spat upon and threatened with death for his defense of human rights. How long will it take before he is recognized as a genuine Jewish prophetic voice in an era when such voices were difficult to find? After all, as the Bible tells us; “A prophet is not without honor, save in his own country, and in his own house” (Matthew 13:57).
Israel Shahak may be unlamented in his own country today, but future generations may well look back to his example, much as contemporary Germans do to figures such as Dietrich Bonhoeffer, the Lutheran pastor who opposed Nazism and was executed for his part in the plot to assassinate Hitler.
Israel Shahak understood all too well the violations of human rights and the human spirit all around him. He insisted on telling that truth to his fellow countrymen and to the world, upholding a Jewish tradition far older than that established in 1948.
Allan C. Brownfeld is a syndicated columnist and associate editor of the Lincoln Review, a journal published by the Lincoln Institute for Research and Education, and editor of Issues, the quarterly journal of the American Council for Judaism.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Home > Archives > October01 > With Israel Shahak’s Death, A Prophetic Voice Is Stilled
The Talmudic World View
In the end, Shahak reported, “Neither the Israeli, nor the diaspora, rabbinical authorities ever reversed their ruling that Jews should not violate the Sabbath in order to save the life of a Gentile…It became apparent to me, as, drawing on knowledge acquired in my youth, I began to study the Talmudic laws governing the relations between Jews and non-Jews, that neither Zionism, including its seemingly secular part, nor Israeli politics since the inception of the State of Israel, nor particularly the policies of the Jewish supporters of Israel in the diaspora, could be understood unless the deeper influence of those laws, and the world view which they both create and express is taken into account.”
The Hatanya—the fundamental book of the Habbad movement, which is one of the most important branches of Hasidism—declares that all non-Jews are totally Satanic creatures “in whom there is nothing absolutely good.” Even a non-Jewish embryo is said to be qualitatively different from a Jewish one. The very existence of a non-Jew is “inessential,” whereas all of creation was created solely for the sake of the Jews.
Shahak points out that a widespread misunderstanding about Orthodox Judaism is that it is a “biblical religion,” that the Old Testament has in Judaism the same central place and legal authority that the Bible has for Protestants and even Roman Catholics. He notes that, “…the interpretation is rigidly fixed—but by the Talmud rather than by the Bible itself. Many, perhaps most, biblical verses prescribing religious acts and obligations are understood by classical Judaism and by present-day Orthodoxy in a sense which is quite distinct from, or even contrary to, their literal meaning as understood by Christians or other readers of the Old Testament, who see only the plain text.”
In the Decalogue itself, the Eighth Commandment, “Thou Shalt not steal” (Exodus 20:15) is taken to be a prohibition against “stealing” (that is, kidnapping) a Jewish person. “The reason,” Shahak writes, “is that according to the Talmud all acts forbidden by the Decalogue are capital offenses. Stealing property is not a capital offense (while the kidnapping of Gentiles by Jews is allowed by Talmudic law)—hence the interpretation.”
In numerous cases, Shahak shows, general terms such as “thy fellow,” “stranger,” or even “man” are taken to have an exclusivist and chauvinistic meaning. The famous verse “Thou shalt love thy fellow as thyself” (Leviticus 19:18) is understood by classical (and present-day Orthodox) Judaism “as an injunction to love one’s fellow Jew, not any fellow human. Similarly, the verse ‘neither shalt thou stand against the blood of thy fellow’ (Leviticus 19:16) is supposed to mean that one must not stand idly by when the life (‘blood’) of a fellow Jew is in danger; but a Jew…is in general forbidden to save the life of a Gentile, because ‘he is not thy fellow.’”
The differentiation in appropriate treatment for Jews and non-Jews to be found in Talmudic commentaries is, Shahak shows, not simply an academic question. Instead, it relates to current Israeli government practices which are justified by reference to religious law.
A book published by the Central Region Command of the Israeli army, whose area includes the West Bank, contains the following declaration by the command’s chief chaplain: “When our forces come across civilians during a war or in hot pursuit or in a raid, so long as there is no certainty that those civilians are incapable of harming our forces, then according to Halakah [Jewish law] they may and even should be killed….Under no circumstances should an Arab be trusted, even if he makes an impression of being civilized….In war, when our forces storm the enemy, they are allowed and even enjoined by the Halakah to kill even good civilians….”
Many contemporary Israeli policies refer to Talmudic rules. Thus, Shahak declares, “The Halakah forbids Jews to sell immovable property—fields and houses—in the Land of Israel to Gentiles. It is therefore clear that—exactly as the leaders and sympathizers of Gush Emunim say—the whole question of how the Palestinians ought to be treated is, according to the Halakah, simply a question of Jewish power; if Jews have sufficient power then it is their religious duty to expel the Palestinians….Maimonides declares; ‘When the Jews are more powerful than the Gentiles we are forbidden to let an idolater among us; even a temporary or itinerant trader shall not be allowed to pass through our land.’”
Jewish Fundamentalism
In the book Jewish Fundamentalism in Israel, Shahak and co-author Norton Mezvinsky lament the dramatic growth in recent years of Jewish fundamentalism which has manifested itself in opposition to the peace process and played a role in the assassination of Prime Minister Yitzhak Rabin and the murder of 29 Muslims at prayer by the American-born fundamentalist, Baruch Goldstein.
They cite, for example, Rabbi Yitzhak Ginsburgh, who wrote a chapter of a book in praise of Goldstein and what he did. An immigrant to Israel from the U.S., Ginsburgh speaks freely of Jews’ genetic-based spiritual superiority over non-Jews; “If you saw two people drowning, a Jew and a non-Jew, the Torah says you save the Jewish life first….Something is special about Jewish DNA….If a Jew needs a liver, can you take the liver of an innocent non-Jew passing by to save him? The Torah probably would permit that. Jewish life has an infinite value.”
Shahak and Mezvinsky point out that, “Changing the words ‘Jewish’ to ‘German’ or ‘Aryan’ and ‘non-Jewish’ to ‘Jewish’ turns the Ginsburgh position into the doctrine that made Auschwitz possible in the past. To a considerable extent the German Nazi success depended upon that ideology and upon its implication of being widely known early. Disregarding even on a limited scale the potential effects of messianic…and other ideologies could prove to be calamitous….The similarities between the Jewish political messianic trend and German Nazism are glaring. The Gentiles are for the messianists what the Jews were for the Nazis. The hatred of Western culture with its rational and democratic elements is common to both movements…. The ideology…is both eschatological and messianic….It assumes the imminent coming of the Messiah and asserts that the Jews, aided by God, will thereafter triumph over the non-Jews and rule them forever.”
It troubled Israel Shahak that the lesson many Jews learned from the Nazi period was to embrace ethno-centric nationalism—just what had created such tragedy in Europe—and to reject the older prophetic Jewish tradition of universalism. He was particularly dismayed with the organized Jewish community in the U.S. and other Western countries, which promoted ideas of religious freedom and ethnic diversity in their own countries, but embraced Israel’s rejection of these same values.
It was Shahak’s view that bigotry was morally objectionable regardless of who the perpetrator is and who the victim. He declared: “Any form of racism, discrimination and xenophobia becomes more potent and politically influential if it is taken for granted by the society which indulges in it.” For Jews, he believed, “The support of democracy and human rights is…meaningless or even harmful and deceitful when it does not begin with self-critique and with support of human rights when they are violated by one’s own group. Any support of human rights for non-Jews whose rights are being violated by the ‘Jewish state’ is as deceitful as the support of human rights by a Stalinist….”
In an article about his childhood for The New York Review of Books, Shahak recalled listening to some Polish workmen talking during the Nazi occupation. Discussing the situation, one young man defended the Germans by pointing out that they were ridding Poland of the Jews, only to be rebuked by an older laborer, “So are they not also human beings?” It is a phrase that Shahak never forgot.
During his life, Israel Shahak was rebuked, spat upon and threatened with death for his defense of human rights. How long will it take before he is recognized as a genuine Jewish prophetic voice in an era when such voices were difficult to find? After all, as the Bible tells us; “A prophet is not without honor, save in his own country, and in his own house” (Matthew 13:57).
Israel Shahak may be unlamented in his own country today, but future generations may well look back to his example, much as contemporary Germans do to figures such as Dietrich Bonhoeffer, the Lutheran pastor who opposed Nazism and was executed for his part in the plot to assassinate Hitler.
Israel Shahak understood all too well the violations of human rights and the human spirit all around him. He insisted on telling that truth to his fellow countrymen and to the world, upholding a Jewish tradition far older than that established in 1948.
Allan C. Brownfeld is a syndicated columnist and associate editor of the Lincoln Review, a journal published by the Lincoln Institute for Research and Education, and editor of Issues, the quarterly journal of the American Council for Judaism.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Home > Archives > October01 > With Israel Shahak’s Death, A Prophetic Voice Is Stilled
Trackback| 2.19.09 @ 9:20AM
Benedict and the Abortion Holocaust-Deniers, on babies, links to this page. Here’s an excerpt:
Mike M| 2.19.09 @ 9:36AM
Horray for Pelosi!! Now she can sleep well at night knowing with her kiss of the Pope's hand she is going to heaven.
J David| 2.19.09 @ 11:06AM
*Catholic* *Democrat*...Hmmmmm, seems like an oxymoron.
The fact the the Catholic Church does not excommunicate homo-huggers and baby-killers, at least if they are rich and important, enough means something... Hmmm, what could it mean??
TennesseeVolunteer| 2.19.09 @ 11:09AM
As an imperfect Catholic I am still shocked that these legislators, who say they are Catholic, can somehow vote PRESENT when it comes to abortion. there is no wiggle room on abortion. As a young boy growing up in Ohio, every Catholic was democrat and the I never saw a num cry until JFK was elected. Ahh... the Beaver Cleaver days.
When the demos went for abortion , the Catholics somehow followed. I just don't get it.
Caped Crusader| 2.19.09 @ 11:34AM
The fact that the Pope does not excommunicate every one of the despicable Democrats is proof positive he does not beleve his own propaganda of having the "keys to the kingdom". He is an empty suit AND mitre as are all other clergy of any denomination who accept this point of view. HE COULD do something meaningful but does not. A pox on all their corrupt houses! How could any thinking person have any respect or continued belief in any of the cowards? Christ must be crying to see his church in such corrpt and foul hands!
Doctor Right| 2.19.09 @ 12:36PM
In a very technical sense, Bishop Williamson is correct.
6 million Jews did not meet their end in the gas chambers during the Holocaust.
Many of them were shot, hung, bludegeoned, starved, bombed, burned alive, buried alive, drowned, bayonetted, strangled, or killed in bizarre medical experiments. If I left anything out, please forgive me.
Benedict erred by not de-frocking Williamson. And despite his obvious rebuke to Pelosi et al, he's making another error by not excommunicating each and every American legislator who openly supports the slaughter of the unborn.
Support for abortion is CLEARLY contradictory to Catholic teaching.
Either the Pope is the head of the Catholic Church, or he's not. If he is, according to the Church, his word is law, and must be followed.
Additionally, excommunication is how those who stray from the teachings, yet still call themselves "Catholic", are punished. If it is not used, especially in this grave situation, then what purpose does it serve??
Excommunicating Pelosi, Kennedy, Miller, Kerry, DeLauro, et al would send a VERY strong message to American Catholics. Some would disagree, but then, by their actions, they're not really Catholics anyway.
If Benedict REALLY wanted to end the horror of abortion, that would be a fantatstic first step...And long overdue. So one is left to wonder why he doesn't.
I hope it has nothing to do with the flow of dollars towards Rome that pro-abortion Catholics still send each Sunday...Really, I hope that has nothing to do with it...
Doctor Right| 2.19.09 @ 12:39PM
Oh...One more thing.
Please (PLEASE!) remove that photo of Rosa DeLauro from today's TASOnline home-page!
I don't mean to be petty, but that woman could haunt houses.
YIKES!!!!
Jeremiah| 2.19.09 @ 1:25PM
Doctor Right --
Can't you for one second see that support for Roe V Wade is NOT support for abortion?
You're making a terrible category error.
I say this, again, as someone who believes R v W should be overturned.
As for the women who get abortions, I wouldn't look at Nancy Pelosi or her daughters. Women get abortions who are born again Christians, Catholics, Republicans -- you name it.
The attempt by reactionaries to pin abortion on Democrats is ludicrous.
George HW Bush is pro-choice, Dan Quayle was pro-choice, all of the Bush women have publicly endorsed a pro-choice stance.
If Republicans ACTUALLY cared about abortion -- which, folks, BELIEVE me, they don't -- they would have done something about it during Reagan's TWO terms, or W's TWO terms.
They manipulate people like you far too easily to ever want this issue to go away.
Patrick| 2.19.09 @ 1:28PM
"But in Williamson they had finally found a Catholic not fit for entrance to their communion line." Great line, George. Thanks.
Doctor Right| 2.19.09 @ 1:51PM
Jeremiah:
You're speaking from a position of ignorance regarding the process by which abortion could or would be over-turned.
To state that Republicans don't really care about over-turning Roe vs. Wade or they would have done it during either Reagan or Bush 43's two terms is demonstrates an ignorance of both history and civics.
Reagan served two terms, but he NEVER had a House AND Senate simultaneoulsy controlled by Republicans. Additionally, as you should know, the issue of abortion is not a legislative issue, it is a JUDICIAL issue, with Roe V. Wade having been imposed upon us by the Supreme Court in 1973. Therefore, to over-turn it, we neede to go through the courts.
Since Supreme Court Justices serve FOR LIFE, new Justices can't be appointed until sitting Justices die or voluntarily retire. The opportunity simply doesn't present itslef often. In fact, it is possible for a President to NEVER have the opportunity to appoint Justices to the Supreme Court. Reagan did, in fact, appoint Sandra Day-O'Connor, Antonin Scalia, and Anthony Kennedy to the Supreme Court. Scalia was and has always been a reliable Conservative; O'Connor and Kennedy, not so much. And this points out another phenomena in the process - Judges are not bound by any particular ideology AFTER they assume their seats. So despite his best efforts to appoint Conservatives to the Court who would pursue a Conservative agenda (including the over-turning of Roe v. Wade), Reagan was unsuccessful.
Bush 43 appointed two stalwart Conservatives to the Supreme Court in John Roberts and Samuel Alito, but since a 5-4 decision is AT LEAST needed to overturn Roe v. Wade, he was unable to achieve that also. Bush did, however, ban the practice of partial birth abortion (which President Osama will reinstate, of course...)
Additionally, please don't forget that although lower courts can have a profound impact on over-turning some abortion statutes and practices (such as partial birth abortion), the Democrats undertook an unprecedented filibuster to deny Bush as many appointments as possible to the lower courts. If any fault could be laid at the feet of either Bush or the Republican Congress in this affair, it would be that they did not fight the Democrats hard enough on this issue and "go nuclear", meaning approve Judges with a simple majority rather than 2/3.
Som please...Before you say things like "Republicans don't really want to overturn abortion" again, do your homework.
Marc Jeric| 2.19.09 @ 2:08PM
The right to abortion which "emanates from the penumbras of the Constitution" - how about that abortion of language? Let us all agree that during the first 12 weeks of pregnancy we should respect the woman's right to abort. But after those first 12 weeks? The baby is recognizable as a future live human being and should not be summarily disposed of, let alone forcing the taxpayer to pay for that murder.
Red Phillips | 2.19.09 @ 2:26PM
"Either they don't care, or they are the biggest moral cowards in history.
I'd say it's the former, but you be the judge.
If you are middle class and socially conservative, you have been REPEATEDLY betrayed by a party that does NOT CARE about you, your family, or your values. "
Jeremiah, you are absolutely right. The GOP uses the abortion issue to keep conservatives in line every four years.
Doctor Right, I don't think that Jeremiah meant self identified Republicans don't care, although some don't. He meant the Republicans in power and about that he is absolutely right.
You are wrong that it is not a legislative issue. The Congress could pass legislation restricting the jurisdiction of the SCOTUS. That would only take 50% +1 of both Houses. The GOP could have done this when they controlled both Houses and the Presidency, but they didn't.
ruth| 2.19.09 @ 2:29PM
Jeremiah, what's really insane is you claiming to be pro-life. Marxists like you don't care about the preborn because you can't buy their votes. Whoremonger. You're as much of a Catholic as Nazi Pelosi.
ruth| 2.19.09 @ 2:32PM
What is it that you care about, Jeremiah? Besides power. In the past, you would have been a slave owner--because they were considered sub-human, too.
J.C.Eaton| 2.19.09 @ 2:59PM
Jerry, I believe you are among those that truly "don't care." I am neither a Democrat, nor a Republican, as Judicial canons in my state(at least until yesterday)' forbid such membership. I don't resent the fact because the Republican party is a comparatively weak-kneed and pusillanimous outfit and the Democratic party is utterly abortifacient.(not to mention a host of unrelated flaws). But here is the juice on the issue of abortion: you are in or you are out. If you are going to be an orthodox Democrat, you can't deny the left's catechism. You claim to be a liberal and if so, your business and I don't care. You claim to be a recent convert, I take you at your word but frankly, take none of the usual joy in such a conversion. No element of the Democratic party hierarchy wants to hear a voice unfriendly to the secular sacrament of abortion. You are a bright guy Jerry, but not, I think today. Best, Judge E
Dustoff| 2.19.09 @ 3:19PM
Jeremiah
Democrats do not march women into abortion clinics
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
So are you telling me that pople should NOT be allowed to protest? WOW very LEFT of you.
This is what cracks me up about the lib/dem it's alright what you do in protesting, wrecking, burning when you don't get you way. Yet if someone doesn't agree with it... NO it's wrong!
Jeremiah| 2.19.09 @ 3:20PM
Doctor Right --
Your sense that abortion is only a judicial issue is false, and it is not I that needs the civics lesson.
First, a Constitutional amendment could be passed that would erase Roe V. Wade. "That's too hard," you might say, but there it is. Life's tough.
Second, abortion could be more restricted than it is now, and it requires politicians repeatedly taking political risks to do that.
Finally, the government could act to reduce the number of abortions through non-legislative or judicial means. Republicans have never been all that interested in these activities.
And Red Phillips is right. Obviously I don't mean citizens who are pro-life and Republican. I'm talking about the party and those in power.
However, to conflate Roe V Wade with abortion introduces a hopeless logic, constitutionally speaking.
Imagine if I were to suggest that police should be allowed to violate the 4th amendment if it would demonstrably result in lower crime rates. Your heads would explode at the very mention of the idea. Lesson: just because someone supports Roe v Wade, which is a reading of the Constitution that is supported by some very smart people, does NOT mean they approve of abortion. (Again, I don't happen to agree with the reasoning of Roe v Wade.)
As to the person who wants to speculate on my motives or the reality of my opposition to abortion, all I can say is: get a life, sister. What's it to you?
Jeremiah| 2.19.09 @ 3:23PM
JC Eaton --
I don't care whether you happen to believe that I hold the beliefs I claim to hold. What could it possibly matter to me whether you or Ruth believe I am sincere?
ruth| 2.19.09 @ 3:24PM
Funny you should mention life, hypocrite, why don't you get one and stop lecturing us? Hopeless logic defines you, Jeremiah. Liberals are hopeless.
ruth| 2.19.09 @ 3:26PM
Hey, Jeremiah, if you don't like it here, don't let the door hit your a** on your way out.
Jeremiah| 2.19.09 @ 3:27PM
The intellectual dishonesty and moral stupidity of comparing people who disagree with you on abortion to Nazis is simply stunning.
People, like the author of the piece above and a few posters, really should learn more about the Holocaust.
It's pathetic. George Neumayr should be ashamed.
ruth| 2.19.09 @ 3:34PM
Interesting. You try to shame Mr. Neumayr. Liberals have no shame but they have unmitigated chutzpah.
ruth| 2.19.09 @ 3:36PM
You should learn more about the Holocaust happening right now. You don't care because they can't vote.
Bill Hussein O'Stalin| 2.19.09 @ 3:44PM
You have to understand the economics of abortion. Nancy Pelosi claimed it was a good move and would help the economy. In a twist of irony, Joseph Stalin was kinder to the unborn than Nancy Pelosi. Stalin banned abortion to increase the birth rate. Although Russian abortions are common now Stalin did ban them. In another twist of fate Stalin executed millions of those same fetuses once they progressed. The similarities between my home state and the United States are fascinating or alarming depending on your point of view.
http://catholicexchange.com/2009/01/29/115271/
Appearing on ABC’s “This Week with George Stephanopoulos,” Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi claimed, “Contraceptives will reduce costs to the States and to the federal government.” The petulant lawmaker, who is the mother of five children and six grandchildren, and who at one time opined, “nothing in my life will ever, ever compare to being a mom,” now feels the children of others are a drain to the economy.
Pelosi told Stephanopoulos that, “family planning services reduce cost…the states are in terrible fiscal budget crises now and part of what we do for children’s health, education, and some of those elements are to help the states meet their financial needs. One of the initiatives…mentioned, the contraception, will reduce costs to the states and to the federal government.”
J.C.Eaton| 2.19.09 @ 3:46PM
Jerry: Of course you care what Ruth and I think about you, your beliefs, your sincerity and all the rest. The fact that you inflict your deep thoughts on us and respond to the slightest tease reflects that clearly enough. In your anxiety to respond to my very amiable comment though, you missed the point. You are an orthodox liberal.In 21st century America, you can't be that and an orthodox Catholic. Your petulance notwithstanding, you align with the abortifacients and you're comfortable there. So be it.Be firm in your deeply held convictions, just know what they are. Best, Judge E
J.C.Eaton| 2.19.09 @ 3:46PM
Jerry: Of course you care what Ruth and I think about you, your beliefs, your sincerity and all the rest. The fact that you inflict your deep thoughts on us and respond to the slightest tease reflects that clearly enough. In your anxiety to respond to my very amiable comment though, you missed the point. You are an orthodox liberal.In 21st century America, you can't be that and an orthodox Catholic. Your petulance notwithstanding, you align with the abortifacients and you're comfortable there. So be it.Be firm in your deeply held convictions, just know what they are. Best, Judge E
Dai Alanye | 2.19.09 @ 3:50PM
It takes a very special level of hypocrisy to claim Republicans are as bad as Democrats when it comes to abortion. That some--even many--Republicans have been weak on the issue of abortion is true, but the Democrats have made themselves into cheerleaders for what can better be called baby execution.
Every leading Dem politician is either an enthusiastic supporter of abortion or has rolled over to the abortion lobby. I give you former Presidential candidate Dennis Kucinich as one example out of multitudes. For decades he declared himself against the sin of abortion but his ambitions got the better of him during the recent Dem primary contest.
That's how bad off the Dems are--even a laughable pixie like Kucinich threw his views on human life under the bus when he thought it might advance his unrealistic hopes for a VP spot.
It's good, though, that the consciences of such as Jeremiah and Red are sufficiently tender that they feel the need to defend what they know is evil by saying, in effect, "Sure, I drive drunk, but you're a known jay-walker."
ruth| 2.19.09 @ 3:55PM
Thank you, J.C. Jeremiah's purported Catholicism has got nothing to do with his soul's salvation. Poor fool. He's a paper tiger, I'm tired of his hectoring.
Pat| 2.19.09 @ 4:04PM
As the most prolific child murderers in history (47 million and counting), you have to take your moral justification where you can find it. Many Americans do find relief in the ethical-moral defense. Basically, their personal ethical position is never to have an abortion themselves (women won't do it, their men won't support a decision to abort). But, abortion is a free choice according to the law of the land, so there's nothing they can do to stop it. This defense conveniently serves two masters, personal ethics and peacefully obeying the law (the moral choice is to obey).
Ethically, this rationalization works just dandy, the individual objector can say I can't control what others do, I can't stop them doing whatever they want. The surviving Nazi bigwigs testifying at Nuremberg used the same defense regarding the ethnic cleansing of Jews and many others - "we didn't know about it, we were in no position to stop it, we didn't personally condone it". The Allies rejected this defense and either hanged or imprisoned the Nazis.
Americans, as they view themselves, reject any notion they resemble those Nazi leaders with their sefl-serving justifications. We're not Nazis! As the American death toll from abortion alone rapidly approaches the total number of estimated world-wide deaths resulting from World War II, there are some second thoughts, brief qualms, minor reservations, but Pelosi, like other Americans, will find a way to suppress any niggling doubts.
Like the Nazis, only history can render the final judgment, but future historians have no power to turn back the clock and change the present. As an interesting aside, Josef Mengele, the Angel of Death, the doctor who performed bizarre experiments on concentration camp inmates, escaped Germany to Argentina, found sanctuary there and made his money performing abortions. Figures. But if Mengele is to be considered an inhuman degenerate, what does that say about us?
ruth| 2.19.09 @ 4:09PM
That's why I call her Nazi Pelosi. Thanks for your eloquence, Pat. Heartbreaking but true, and there will be a reckoning. That whirlwind thing and all.
ORF| 2.19.09 @ 4:40PM
Bunch of baby killers on this Web site. Or, do Iragi children, a.k.a. "sand-niggers," not count?
Homo Hugger| 2.19.09 @ 4:43PM
J David, re: homo-huggers:
I'd hate to think God is bigoted toward gays, but that's just my God, and apparently not yours.
ruth| 2.19.09 @ 4:46PM
Settle down, OAF, unlike you liberals, we don't want any children to be slaughtered.
Ruth| 2.19.09 @ 4:51PM
God loves everyone, even you, Homo Hugger.
Obama Rules| 2.19.09 @ 5:00PM
ruth, your pimp just called, so get your lazy a$$ back to work.
Jeremiah| 2.19.09 @ 5:00PM
Pat --
The comparison is spurious and entirely foolish.
You people are crazy. Thank God it's only on these absurd fringes that people think this way.
Dustoff| 2.19.09 @ 5:03PM
OAF
Bunch of baby killers on this Web site. Or, do Iragi children, a.k.a. "sand-niggers," not count?
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Are you kidding me. We had a nice talk yesterday and I thought maybe you had some insight.
Then you "post' this CA*P!
Dude. )-:
ruth| 2.19.09 @ 5:04PM
Well, look, it's that little piece of human garbage, OR. All the swamp things are here today. See, Jeremiah, OR is your comrade, the filth you swim with in your party of 'tolerance'. LOL
Jeremiah| 2.19.09 @ 5:08PM
JC Eaton --
I'm not sure what about your post I was supposed to consider a mere "tease" or even "affable."
Because I think differently than you do you claim to find it impossible to accept that I've converted.
That's fine. Fortunately, convincing JC Eaton of my faith is not something I'm charged with doing.
Abortion is a painful, heart-breaking issue. But you people need to learn how to talk about it without calling people you disagree with Nazis.
"Nazi" Pelosi is a grandmother, head of a large Italian family. I hardly see what good it does to talk about her in the way you people do. It's repulsive. I used to say the same thing when people were writing in hateful remarks about Sarah Palin. It's all so stupid, and it does pretty much make think I'll finally bow out. There's no point engaging in an intellectual debate with people who are willing to compare you to Dr. Mengele. For the love of God.
As a citizen and as a human I do need to insist that those of you talking this way -- including the author of the piece that began this thread -- go to a library and take out some books about what actually took place in Europe between 1933 and the 1945. You seriously need to be educated better about the Holocaust.
You might also read books by survivors: Premo Levi is a great place to start; Eli Weisel's Night is another excellent book. Whatever you do, get yourself to a place where you can begun to understand the magnitude of what occured there.
ruth| 2.19.09 @ 5:27PM
Jeremiah, don't call people you disagree with Hitler, as in BusHitler. Stop lecturing us, tool. Also, you might watch the video, 'Silent Scream'. Maybe, just maybe, you might start to understand a little of the hideous holocaust that is occurring today and everyday in your friendly local Planned Parenthood Abortuary, Jeremiah. Where is your outrage for these innocents?
ruth| 2.19.09 @ 5:30PM
Jeremiah, when you are alone one night, think hard about the fact you've been compared to Mengele, real hard.
Bill| 2.19.09 @ 7:30PM
Getting back to 'Bishop Williamson.' He is NOT a bishop of the Roman Catholic Church. He is a member of the Schismatic Society of St. Pius X and not a Catholic in good standing. He does not represent or speak for the Roman Catholic Church. The withdrawing of the formal excomunication of these 'bishops' was done primarily to facilitate the possible reinstatement of them through dialogue with the Church and correction of their errors. This is something they had been seeking.
Doctor Right| 2.19.09 @ 10:58PM
Jeremiah,
The sum total of your argument is "Gov't could do this, gov't could do that, waah-waah-waah...
A "Constitutional Amendment" banning abortion? Uh-huh...Yeah...Right.
Listen, Jerri...I hate to tell you, but there's the possible, the impossible, and the stupid.
Guess which one applies to you?
The mere idea that the same Congress which is rabidly opposed to allowing Republican Presidents to appoint Judges (as is their Constitutional authority) would amend the Constitution to ban abortion is laughably stupid.
It ain't happenin'. It's a Joke.
Now come back when you finish High School, and we'll talk then.
Doctor Right| 2.19.09 @ 11:02PM
Oh, Jerri...One more thing sweetheart...
Since you're such a Constitutional scholar, please...Do tell...Where exactly in the Constitution do these "smart" people you refer to find a justification for abortion?
Hmmmmmmmmmm????
Do you even KNOW how this fictitious "right" was derived???
[...crickets...]
Yeah...I thought so.
ruth| 2.20.09 @ 12:34AM
From the fevered minds of crazy liberals sprung the almighty 'penumbra' hidden all those years in our 'Living Constitution'.
Boria| 2.20.09 @ 7:25AM
1. Williamson is bad, wrong, and nuts!
2. Pope Benedict should not have rescinded Williamson's excommunication. He received bad advice.
3. Those, including Jews, who support abortions, are supporting a new Holocaust. 49 million since 1973... How ironic!
4. Abortion and euthanasia devalue the worth of human life.
5. Government health care, because of its need to artificially allocate scarce resources ($), eventually leads to acceptance of abortions, euthanasia, and mercy killings...
6. Forging ahead with supposed more freedom to choose for women, to choose to die, or to choose to kill will lead to a more callous culture where a (National) Socialist will be very happy to oblige us with a new Holocaust bought and paid for by everything-goes-liberals/progressives. Reminds me of pre-Wold War II Europe.
John Thomas | 2.20.09 @ 9:22AM
Quite right, George. the abortion holocaust is much, much bigger than the mid-20th century holocausts, and these people who criticise the Pope are just gross hypocrites. The Nazi Jewish holocaust is normally put at 6m, Stalin's about 12-15m, Mao's 60-70m - the abotion holocaust - well, I've heard 100m in the US, and here in Europe, the figures are also very, very high (EU promotion is responsible) ... and Russia ... and Asia (females particularly) ... Well, as you Americans say, "Do the math!"
Alan Brooks| 2.20.09 @ 10:40AM
guys like Jeremiah and Bob are all over the place.
Jeremiah is plastic... and Bob has four doctorates...
Alan Brooks| 2.20.09 @ 11:14AM
... and Intergroper has a poker up his a**.
these guys are lucky their moms didn't have abortions carrying them. but bad for the rest of us.
Rev Ray Dubuque | 2.20.09 @ 12:50PM
This article says "A Pelosi-led delegation of Catholic Democrats who dismiss the moral significance of millions upon millions of abortions turned up at the Vatican yesterday. " and quotes the Catholic Democratic Congresspeople as challenging the pope
"As a spiritual leader and the head of the Catholic Church, we believe it is vital that you publicly state your unequivocal position on this matter so that it is clear where the Church stands on one of the most consequential events of the 20th century…"
These people are barking up the wrong tree. The role of the Catholic hierarchy in the Nazi holocaust is muddled. Not so its role in the Croatian Holocaust!
In the same way that German citizens were forced to view what had been done at their concentration camps during the Jewish Holocaust, every Roman Catholic bishop, beginning with the pope - and those who take the claims of these men to be "men of God" - ought to be required to view the videos below.
The Prefect of the Congregation of Eastern Churches at the time, Cardinal Eugene Tisserant, substantiated their basic accuracy when he wrote in a letter sent in March of 1942 to Croatia's representative to the Vatican:
"I know for a fact, that it is the Franciscans themselves who have taken part in attacks against the Orthodox populations so as to destroy the Orthodox Church. . . I know for sure that the Franciscans in Bosnia and Herzegovina have acted abominably, and this pains me. Such acts should not be committed by educated, cultured, civilized people, let alone by priests."
Catholic holocaust perpetrators - Part One : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWGyTPu6UDE
Catholic holocaust perpetrators - Part Two : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hQqObZm-Y8I
Jeremiah| 2.20.09 @ 4:20PM
The reactionary worldview, I conclude, is inherently deranged.
To engage in this kind of relativism -- for that is what this is -- and to compare the belief that the government should not outlaw abortion with Nazism is moral insanity.
I repeat my opposition to abortion. Surely there is a better way to make the case than the stark lunacy of this article and this thread.
Doctor Right --
There is no right to abortion mentioned in the Constitution. Of course, there's no right to own an automobile in it either. You're argument is spurious.
The "penumbra" of privacy rights in the Constitution is a well-reasoned Constitutional argument. I don't happen to believe it legitimates abortion, but that is in fact a separate issue.
The sloppiness of arguments argued here is in part a pretty good explanation of why pro-life arguments so often fail: if all you can do is kick and scream and call people Nazis, who is going to listen to you?
In the end, you people need first and foremost to learn something about the actual Holocaust perpetrated by Nazis and others in Europe in the 1930s and 40s. If you were to know what you're talking about, you wouldn't make these absurd and completely wrong comparisons.
Second, you need to learn how to separate a person's moral being from their stance on an issue like abortion. Speculating on the culpability of people who support Roe v Wade, for example, is hopeless and bad.
Argue your points. Leave ad hominem attack to experts in cynicism and sarcasm like Rush Limbaugh.
CKA in Red State USA| 2.20.09 @ 10:14PM
"Will Pelosi, DeLauro, and company disavow their views? Or will they continue to rationalize, minimize and revise the massive, ongoing holocaust of unborn human life?"
Hades' first ice-skating rink, along with its Sn0-Cone stand, will open before any of them recant.
But, then, of what will they recant? They've gone so far afield, how can they be called Catholic?
Besides, Pelosi et. al. fit into the new apostate era in anti-Christian America. Barack Obama's election signalled unmistakably it's full blooming.
And pretend-Christian and Chief Infanticidist Obama leads the carnage with his own unique secular gospel.
But, then, he's called himself a devout Christian just as Pelosi's called herself an ardent Catholic.
Leave it to the Democrats, liberals and leftists to continue their linguistic thievery.
ruth| 2.20.09 @ 11:38PM
Jeremiah, it doesn't matter what a few conservatives say to you, we have chosen our side, and it's on behalf of Life. What matters is that, at the end of the day, each of us has to live with our own choices and decisions. We've made peace with ourselves, why haven't you? Seen 'Silent Scream' yet?
ruth| 2.20.09 @ 11:39PM
Peace, Jeremiah.
Alan Brooks| 2.22.09 @ 9:41PM
maybe jeremiah and Intergroupie aren't as bad as Obama Rules and ORF. daphne is just a dumb c***.
ORF, what about the children Saddam's dungeonkeepers tortured?
ruth| 2.22.09 @ 9:44PM
Gross! Don't be a liberal, Alan.
Alan Brooks| 2.22.09 @ 10:42PM
alrighty, Ruth
i apologize; daffy daphne kenward is too dumb & dopey to be a you-know-what.
it's not daphne's fault that she is a dope, though-- she was born that way.
Brian| 2.24.09 @ 2:48AM
I am certain the day is comming when todays abortion supporters will be seen on par with the nazi' of yesterday. Pelosi, Kennedy et al will live in infamy!
DancingNancie| 2.26.09 @ 6:44PM
I found this video today that shows the story from a few different news sources. It's interesting to see the difference in perspectives:
http://www.newsy.com/videos/controversial_bishop_returns_to_the_u_k/
tomg | 8.21.09 @ 2:27AM
Hades' first ice-skating rink, along with its Sn0-Cone stand, will open before any of them recant.
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On evolution, my readings convince me of the soundness of the concept. Though I reject utterly his atheism, Richard Dawkins' books on evolution as a process are utterly persuasive. They're worth a read.
There are many leading scientists who are believers on a rational basis. One of my favorite is a fellow named Francis Collins, who headed the Human Genome Project. He has written two wonderful books, The Mind of God and The Language of God. In the first, he marvels at how the human brain developed the abstract mathematical reasoning capacity, which really serves no purpose --- except to understand the mathematical way God constructed the universe.
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