The American Spectator : Something Is Wrong

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Something Is Wrong

By Ben Stein on 9.24.12 @ 8:27AM

Don’t look now, but Islam is becoming the MSM’s official religion of America.

Now, it’s not just that no one bats an eye at the amazing truth that the United States is beaming TV ads all over Pakistan apologizing for a derogatory Internet trailer for a nonexistent movie demeaning the being that Muslims call “The Prophet Mohammed.” No one in the MSM even slightly hints that doing the kowtow in the same country that sheltered Osama bin Laden to a group that reveled in, delighted in the terrorism against American civilians and still provides the framework for the terrorist Haqqani network, might be humiliating and an insult to the memory of the great Americans who were murdered just last week in Libya.

No, we just take it in stride that our President and our Secretary of State will apologize to the people who hate us and want us dead. That’s not what I am referring to.

I am referring to something worse: Have you noticed that in the past few years, and especially in the past few weeks since the murder of the Ambassador and his guards and colleague in Benghazi (a city that Erwin Rommel loved and whose inhabitants he praised), whenever the New York Times refers to Mohammed, they always call him, without quotation marks, The Prophet Mohammed, as if everyone with any sense understands that OF COURSE Mohammed is The One True Prophet and that it’s just understood that Mohammed is The Prophet.

I see this in other news outlets and on TV, too. Sober-looking newsmen and newswomen mention Mohammed as The Prophet Mohammed. No ifs, ands or buts. I hear it on the BBC World Service, too.

Now, if Muslims want to believe that Mohammed is The Prophet, God bless them. Fine and dandy. If anyone wants to believe that, good luck to him or her. But why does our mainstream media here in the USA, an overwhelmingly Christian country, refer to Islam’s prophet as “The Prophet”?

Have you ever seen any major newspaper here in the USA refer to Jesus Christ as “The Son of God, God Incarnate, The Lord Jesus Christ”? Can you imagine the New York Times running a story about a crucifix resting in urine at an “art gallery” as an offense against “The Lord Jesus, Son of God”? Can you imagine any large newspaper in this country running a story about the Pope and referring to him as “The Holy Father, The Bridge Between Heaven and Earth”? Or about Mary, as “Holy Mary, Mother of God”? It would never happen.

But somehow, probably because the people writing the articles and editing them or the producers on TV news shows fear being beheaded — and who doesn’t? — we have adopted in our media the Muslim assertion that Mohammed is The Prophet while giving other religious figures the back of our media hand.

This is frightening. We are not supposed to be doing obeisance to a religious group that has many adherents who want us dead. We are not, as journalists, supposed to be labeling anyone as “The” Prophet. But somehow, it’s happening. The MSM has become a voice for Islam.

Hitler saw it long ago. Terror and fear of violence can bring about amazing changes in people’s behavior. So can a misguided political correctness and self-loathing for the greatest nation on earth.

I overheard a conversation between two women at a dining table just yesterday. One said, “I don’t care what anyone says, Obama is a Muslim” (she has said it before) and the other said, “He’s not a Muslim. He’s just stupid.”

I didn’t say anything to them. I am just telling you, these do not feel like normal days. They feel like latter days.

There is just a feeling in the air, a look in the sky at dusk, a look on people’s faces. Fear is everywhere. Mr. Obama cannot lose this election unless enough people believe it’s within their power to stop the ticking of the clock, and I do not feel that groundswell. Not at all. When the American media turns its back on our own religions of tolerance and adores a religion of intolerance, times are upside down. The MSM says it’s all fine, trust The Prince of Grant Park, Chicago. But I have always preferred the admonition, “Put not your trust in princes.” Something is wrong.

About the Author

Ben Stein is a writer, actor, economist, and lawyer living in Beverly Hills and Malibu. He writes “Ben Stein’s Diary” for every issue of The American Spectator.

Letter to the Editor View all comments (266) | Leave a comment Leave a comment

Louis Jenkins| 9.24.12 @ 8:42AM

Dear Mr. Stein:

You haven't heard? The MSM is in the tank for everything that Obama says, does, or acts out. If he suddenly declared Islam the defacto religion of the USA the MSM would sing the praises, and blot out every mention of Christianity. The MSM is not just the spokesman for Islam, they're the megahorn. But don't be too concerned, they are scheduled for an appointment with the chopping block, just like the rest of us.

Jack in Wi| 9.24.12 @ 11:19AM

Ben makes some good points I guess. I wouldn't know. I watch no main stream media of either the right or left and haven't for many years. The only thing I do know is Obama's puss is stinking up every football game I am trying to watch. I have to reach for the mute button fast or else change channels. I live in Wi, and the commercials are incessant.

KyMouse| 9.24.12 @ 1:06PM

This thread has a tie-in to 9/11 (Islam and the threat it poses to America), so I'll post this here.

I was cleaning out some old files at home last night, and came across an op ed piece written by George Will during the Carter administration, which means that it was written a good two decades before 9/11 (on the back of the newspaper page, there is an article that mentions Carter’s meeting with other officials).

This gave me such a creepy feeling; I don’t remember anyone mentioning it in the years since 9/11. Will’s article “World Trade Center: An energy glutton built on the eve of the energy crisis,” concerning his dislike for the WTC, ended with these thoughts:

“Some say that the towers are America’s pyramids, expressions of our civilization’s hubris that will compel the awe of distant generations. But the towers won’t last long enough.

“One supporter of the WTC brags that the towers will last 100 years. Fine. Then what? How do you take them down? The tallest building ever demolished was only 47 stories. I have a recurring nightmare — if that is the word — in which two Concorde supersonic airliners, one British and one French, slice the towers in half, a collision of modern achievements.”

TLP| 9.24.12 @ 4:23PM

What are you saying, Ben? That the Political Party that just got done Booing God, and Isreal, somehow has a soft spot for the Religion of Blowing up Jews into little Peaces?

Is that what you're saying?

Are you saying that the Party of Infanticide, where Millions of Babies are SLAUGHTERED in, and OUT of their Mother's wombs, is Pro Terror World? Pro Murder World? Pro Honour Killing World.

This is the Party of Piss Christ, Elephant Sh*t on the Virgin Mary, and Robert Maplethorp with a Bullwhip shoved up his @ss.

The Party of Anal Sex Education. Masturbation Education, Sex with the Adult next door, and Driving YOUR 12 Year Old, outta State for an Abortion, WITHOUT YOUR CONSENT.

They're Soft on Crime. Weak on Defence. And, they REFUSE to Protect our Sovereignty at the Borders.

Their Leader goes to Vegas, to Campaign, even as our Embassies are still burning, and our People are still Dead.

Yet, somehow, you seem perplexed that the Party of "America Sucks" and "Human Shields" for Saddam Hussein, seems to be Pro the Religion of their Leader.

A man named after Mohammed's Horse.

Where ya been?

Oldefarte| 9.24.12 @ 6:17PM

I think Ben's point concerns the Lewinskyfacation of the Islamic religion. The same radical extremism that now controls the Democratic Party is personified by its mouthpiece, the MSM. When radical terrorists take over a country, its press system is captured and controlled in order for the conquerers to disemibnate their brainwashing propaganda to the country's public. This is what occurred on 11/4/08 [and way beyond but never to this extreme extent], and they use the persuasive power of newspapers, TV and Hollywood produced movies and programs to infect the thoughts of citizens from their messaging. Calling the Islamic religion's head a "prophet" is insulting and stupid [but it equates to its religiously devoted followers sadly]. Muslims are stupid and violent toward non-believers, due to their strict adherence to the teachings of this un-prophet. For the MSM to """"stupidly"""" buy into the radical extremism of the Democratic Party's political correctness regarding this non-religion etc is perverted and putrid, and Americans should reject same by simply concelling their subscriptions to and refusing to view their productions!!!!

Sjccoach| 9.24.12 @ 9:00AM

The reason MSM loves Islam is that it is the religion of intolerance and dictatorships. This is what the MSM wants in this country.

Von Mises Jr| 9.24.12 @ 10:03AM

Rush has been explaining how the liberal progressives and Islamist are identical in their totalitarianism.
Barry makes people buy health insurance while his ten-pounds-of-potato-in-a five-pound-bag wife tells us what to eat. Pelosi tells us we have to pass ObamaCare to find out what is in it, a grown up version of eat your spinach. Hillary apologizes for us to people who want to kill us for eating Bread they disapprove of.
I am starting to think liberal progressives are Islamist.

John Navratil| 9.24.12 @ 11:02AM

Von Mises Jr,

It may seem hard to believe, but I actually have bona fide liberal friends. People who say things like "we survived Bush, we'll survive Obama." We have disagreed on politics in spirited, but polite, conversation. They are a lot more quiet today. They just don't want to discuss things like the economy.

They seem to be uncomfortable with their religion. I pray that bodes well for Romney.

Occam's Tool| 9.24.12 @ 11:08AM

John:

I see NO enthusiasm for Obama except for the far lefties here. I hope many stay home.

Cut taxes, bomb scum. That's how to get America back on its feet. Bengazi should be nuked.

Occam's Tool| 9.24.12 @ 11:11AM

I have warned and warned about Islam, and laid out a simple approach to victory. People are starting to notice the problem, and one day they will embrace THE solution---hit back, a thousand to one.

When hit hard enough, even the Nazis and Japanese stopped, and both became prosperous after they left their madness. I do NOT endorse genocide, but I do insist on them stopping their savagery. They need to learn the lesson in their flesh, that freedom triumphs over savagery and evil (and cheeseheads).

John Navratil| 9.24.12 @ 12:47PM

Occam's Tool,

It is the nature of the West to respond disproportionately after suffering from minor skirmishes. It's the way it will end in the Middle East. We ARE at war and it will not stop until one side tires of it. Islam hasn't tired in over a millennium. Iran is forcing a confrontation. We WILL be drawn in unless we are prepared to see 1/6 of the world's crude bottled up. Russia and China will fight over Iran and a lot of people will die.

TLP| 9.24.12 @ 4:27PM

What I love about all of this, is the fact that, if these @ssholes ever get their wish?

They'll be the first ones these Animals Seperate from their Heads.

How many examples does anyone need, before they realize that Liberalism is a Mental Disorder?

Oldefarte| 9.24.12 @ 7:34PM

IMHO in order to have a "Mental Disorder" one must fist and foremost possess a MIND, so that leaves out liberals from this discussion!!!!!

nathan| 9.24.12 @ 1:50PM

Sir: You do understand right, that in one of your posts last week, you said withdraw from our embassies and consulates and then nuke their two largest cities. That was a direct response sir to the attacks we had faced the previous week.

Say what you will but at that moment you were advocating mass murder. And given that for some of these countries the two major cities may have 60 percent or more of the populations of the countries involved, that's functional genocide. And sorry sir, the response you proposed was just GROSSLY out of proportion to what we had been subject to.

And I refuse to be like those in Germany or Russia in the 30's and be silent on this. We complain about the failure of "moderate" muslims to speak out against radicals in their midst. The same applies to us sir. We cannot stand by and let statements like the one you made, the exhortation to mass murder and functional genocide policies that are totally against our principles, go unchallenged.

We note that with Germany Harris's population attacks had little impact on the outcome of the war. (Read Max Hasting's "Bomber Command".) What ultimate led to their defeat was the soviets just pushing in and seizing control. Mass murder in reverse was not the solution.

nathan| 9.24.12 @ 2:01PM

Let me make a final point. Defend ourselves, yes. But within the bounds of the Constitution, the laws of this country, and the international agreements that we helped write and are signatories too. Within the bounds of the precedents of the policies we established at those war crime trials 60 years ago and still support today. We cannot send people to the gallows for torturing our own soldiers and then turn around do the same to detainees in our custody. We cannot advocate mass murder as a solution to dealing with our enemies. We need to remember that most people regardless of religious persuasion, they included, want to be left alone. The NYPD study after the attacks where they went into mosques, cafes, you name it found virtually nothing actionable. The "great domestic conspiracy" for the most part isn't.

We do not do good by doing evil. We do not defend ourselves by becoming them. We act like them at any level, we ARE them. That's not what we are about, not what we can be about. We can, should, and will find ways to defend ourselves within the bounds of our principles. We're Americans after all. The voices of moderation are out there. Let's see how we can find ways to get them to talk louder.

Jacob McCandles| 9.24.12 @ 2:33PM

Nathan,
We are the greatest nation on the planet. Most of the world's population lives in poverty. There is enslavement, honor killing, mass starvation, executions, etc etc going on in other parts of the world right now. I submit that we must do everything in our power to preserve our nation. It is not difficult to imagine a time in the near future at which we will not be able to defend ourselves. The issue of unleashing horrible weapons of destruction in order to preserve this nation is not a simple one. It is not black and white. As I've mentioned before, war is hell, but it is necessary.

nathan| 9.24.12 @ 3:36PM

Do I defend Hiroshima? Based on everything I write what do you think? We read that Truman should have dropped it off shore, or done something else. I know all this. So where do think I stand on this?

As ghastly as it was, it was at that moment in time probably the right decision. Because the Japanese probably don't cease hostilities otherwise. Because THEY were working on a bomb. Because an invasion of the islands would have killed far more, our conventional attacks were doing the same thing, just more bombs, and the Russians were contemplating an invasion northern island which would have been horrible for Japan and the Pacific.

I had the honor, and I consider it an honor to have met Ferebee before he died. A fine man.

So you see, I'm more complex perhaps than you realize. But understand that was 70 years ago, this is now. And I stand by what I said above. I am all too disturbed by the similarities I see between what I read I hear and what I read in history books about 30's Germany. We can not let our hate, our anger drive us to actions that are not consistent with our values today. We can't be them. And I will not be Martin Neimollor. Not here.

KennesawJack| 9.24.12 @ 3:36PM

Nathan, well argued but you cite two very important historical events in your arguement that are simply not germaine. Neither the Jews in Europe nor the Kulaks in Ukraine were belligerent, threatening actors who posed an existential threat to the countries they lived in nor their countries' neighbors. While Occam's suggestions are a bit, and only a bit, extreme, I have no problem with taking out their leadership with a massive strike. Make no mistake, we are going to either fight these radicals on their terms or ours but we ARE going to fight them. Either that or surrender to the blackmail of terrorism.

KennesawJack| 9.24.12 @ 3:37PM

Further. As to the hanging of war criminals after WWII as punishment for the torture of prisoners, assuming you are referring to waterboarding, they are most assuredly not analogous. You cannot fairly compare the physical beating and execution of prisoners-of-war by firing squad while fellow prisoners looked on, by the Nazi, nor the execution of prisoners-of-war by Bushido, again while fellow prisoners looked on, on the part of the Japanese to waterboarding. It simply doesn't wash (no pun intended). You can be applauded, to a degree, for your high-mindedness, but hoisting ourselves on our own petard for the sake of "our principles", is ridiculous. Our actions against Dresden, Berlin, Hiroshima, and Nagasaki did not reflect the principles of which you speak, principles above the ability of barbarians to understand or accept. They did reflect the harsh reality of dealing with barbarians on a level of principle they DO understand and accept. That is, at the end of the day, simply the way it is.

TLP| 9.24.12 @ 4:31PM

Kill'em all, and let GOD sort it out.

We're gonna have to do it anyway.

I say DO IT, now, instead of waiting til Millions of Americans are Vaporized, first.

If they had a Nuke on 911, they would have Used It!

And, EVERYBODY KNOWS IT.

KennesawJack| 9.24.12 @ 4:43PM

I do believe we're gonna get around to doing it, Tim. Just a matter of time.

Gary B| 9.24.12 @ 5:38PM

Start with the Saudis.

Occam's Tool| 9.25.12 @ 8:55PM

Hey, KJ, I may be extreme, but I ain't wrong. :-)

Folks, watch and see. I'm a student of history, and an expert in manipulating psychopaths. I'm telling you what will work, and all my critics like Nathan can do is talk about how they won't go that low...

Lincoln said it best when he noted that extreme measures are justified in time of war and will not carry over into peace. And, if we lose this one they will kill us without trial for being us, and if we win they won't be in a position to criticize our excesses, and we will be alive and democratic.

By the way, Cheesehead Jack, I note that you haven't disputed that my approach IS cheap.

Folks, with the maniacs we are dealing with, the lesson must be taught on their skin. Heinlein noted that pain is a wonderful teacher in Starship Troopers. He had a lot of good points in that book.

Oldefarte| 9.24.12 @ 7:48PM

I disagree with Nathan's turn the other cheek philosophy, which may have worked for Christ but none of us are equal to Him. Fight fire with fire! No what stopped WWII was Nagasaki and Hiroshima, which killed thousands by the bomb but stopped the war and prevented millions of deaths if same had continued. My approach is a bit more subtle, in that economic measures could bring about the destruction equal to the bomb: Evacuate all personnel from the middle east, begin oil drilling operations in all three of our oceans and on productive inland lands thereby repalcing the 2/3 oil supply that we import/buy from the middle east, naval blockade the entire region preventing their exports of their one/only revenue resourse/oil, and then let them EAT EXCREMENT AFTER THEIR COUNTRIES HAVE NO MORE REVENUE IN WHICH TO SUSTAIN THEIR ECONOMIES AND CORRESPONDINGLY TO FUNNEL THEIR OIL REVENUES TO THEIR DOMESTIC TERRORISTS [the resultant domestic citizenry riots from starvation from lack of jobs etc will rid their countries of the radical authoritarian leaders]. It would be much more effective than bombing!!!!!!!!!

Occam's Tool| 9.25.12 @ 8:49PM

Actually, the bombing had a LOT to do with the war---much antiaircraft and fighter support was withdrawn from the eastern front to deal with it. Hasting's is not the only view.

Secondly, the Germans after WWI HAD A BELIEF THAT THEY WERE "STABBED IN THE BACK BECAUSE THEY WEREN'T ACTUALLY BEATEN."

Not true after WWII.

We have to win to protect our freedoms. Give me an alternative that will deter the rabid beasts that they are, and that does not involve being a flower child. I'll listen. But you are wrong.

I'll be happy to be screamed at and alive. The Nuking of Hiroshima and nagasaki saved lives. So would this.

Jack in Wi| 9.24.12 @ 11:28AM

Occam: Very intelligent comments. Cut taxes and nuke millions. You really are insane. As for the 2 candidates the less said the better. Both are horrible. I live in the most Republican part of this state and a lot of pro-life conservatives are very disappointed with Romney's, so far, incompetently run campaign. I actually thought he had a great chance in Wi. and the whole Midwest if he ran a good campaign, after he picked Ryan.

moey2720| 9.24.12 @ 3:06PM

So did I!!!

KennesawJack| 9.24.12 @ 4:02PM

Occam, it ain't over 'til it's over. Romney didn't get where he is by not knowing how to play hard-ball. I agree his campaign appears incompetent, but I still believe he's saving the best for last. He'd better be.

TLP| 9.24.12 @ 4:42PM

These Polls are Bullsh*t.

Go to Drudge.

Yesterday RCP was telling us that The Muslim was up 10 Points in Pennsylvania.

Today?

It's 2.

Everything, Everywhere, is a Disaster.

More Coal Mines CLOSED.

UP TO 300 Coal Fired Electric Generating Plants have been marked for Shut Down, by Obama's EPA.

11,000 Layoff Warnings just sent out by American Airlines.

GM outsourcing New Plants to China.

High Gas Prices. High Food Prices. Low Home Prices. Incomes going Down. Food Stamps, Welfare, and SUICIDES going Up.

Trust Me.

He's dead, already. (Hat Tip - Star Trek III)

Gary B| 9.24.12 @ 5:42PM

The fat lady hasn't sung yet. What's that rule in politics? When the other side is screwing up, stay quiet and let them continue... The fact that Romney is even in rigged polls says a lot. He's doing a lot better than the MSM liars claim and better than Reagan at this stage of the game. Every dollar he doesn't spend now will be available in the final stretch. Have faith. He knows a lot more about his status than we do.

jpmccn| 9.24.12 @ 7:05PM

Lets hope so Gary. Must say it is good to read from people who make sense in this comment section.

Oldefarte| 9.24.12 @ 7:58PM

A rotten ham sandwich would be preferable to the sleezy domestic terrorists that the Democratic Party offers. If you sit-at-homers allow these Muslim Brotherhood North members to be re-elected, your country will resemble the US consulate in Bengazi right now with you and yours deceased on the compound floor. Whether you Paulistas are stupid or mentally ill no one can determine, but your purist gold-standard idiocy in no-holds barred fashion resembles Thelma & Louisa clasping hands before cascading off of the cliff into oblivion. Grow up and grwo a brain! If you desire the possibility of the continuation of this country, hold your GD noses and vote for R/R and all Republicans on your ballot. If you want these domestic terrorists to complete their total destruction of this nation, then simply GTH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Occam's Tool| 9.25.12 @ 8:50PM

Jack, I don't spread my asscheeks as you do.

Seek| 9.25.12 @ 6:40PM

Blacks always can be counted to vote for Obama. It doesn't matter whether they are "enthusiastic" about it. They'll just do it. It's our job as whites to vote for Romney -- with or without enthusiasm.

pogybait| 9.24.12 @ 9:06AM

Ben, I am surprised by this article, why during the last few years MSM has become our moral compass leading us along the path of social progress in ways that the Tea Party and people with bad hair ever could. It is a well known fact that the various programs, producers, writers and news people consistently prod us to a better place. Simply put Ben, if you don't have any morals to betray, then there's no way you can be guilty of hypocrisy. It's just what make those wonderful folks at MSM better than any conservative brainwashed Christofacist.

Cobalt| 9.24.12 @ 9:11AM

"Hitler saw it long ago. Terror and fear of violence can bring about amazing changes in people's behavior. So can a misguided political correctness and self-loathing for the greatest nation on earth."

"RULE 3: “Whenever possible, go outside the expertise of the enemy.” Look for ways to increase insecurity, anxiety and uncertainty."

Saul Alinsky's Rules for Radicals

Nick| 9.24.12 @ 11:10AM

Jackboot the Nazi (a.k.a. Jack in Wi) would refer to him as "The Prophet Mohammed," too, if Jackboot didn't already consider Hitler a prophet, and a hero.

I'm sure Jackboot is also a big fan of Alinsky.

TLP| 9.24.12 @ 4:43PM

Where were YOU, on Friday?

Hardcard| 9.24.12 @ 9:11AM

Dear Ben,
We can't be civil with these obamanites, they will lie,cheat, steal, to save their gifted leader and destroy the USA as we know it.

Bob From District 9| 9.24.12 @ 3:54PM

As you Romneyites are already doing?

Skippy| 9.24.12 @ 4:12PM

You ain't seen nothin' yet!

TLP| 9.24.12 @ 4:45PM

I'm guessing that District 9 is a Gay Bar in Provincetown.

KennesawJack| 9.24.12 @ 4:51PM

Fire Island.

Occam's Tool| 9.25.12 @ 8:57PM

Bob, I hope you don't mind me calling you boy, do you, boy?

I'm willing to lie, cheat, and steal to win. Obama is a traitor. Franken stole to win.

Bill8472| 9.24.12 @ 9:22AM

As in "good will be called evil, and evil will be called good," haven't you noticed that the two religions that actually have a claim to being religions of peace, Judaism and Christianity, are denounced for the violence perpetrated in their name while Muslim, which is nearly synonymous with holy war, is touted as a peaceful religion? I mean, one could leave Judaism and Christianity out of the matter altogether, and Islam is still dripping with blood and remains unsated in its bloodlust after 1400 years.

If the United States and the West did what the Muslims are doing, there would be wholesale weeping, wailing, and gnashing of teeth on the part of the MSM and a lot of the Western public. There would be a condemnation of Christianity as an entire religion; no one would escape. Let the Muslims do it, and all we hear is the crickets chirping.

Anthony| 9.24.12 @ 9:23AM

You're a tad late on the uptake there Ben, but better late then never.
Islam and leftism have much in common, I think a publication called The American Spectator has commented on this quite often.

TLP| 9.24.12 @ 4:47PM

He's been busy Boring the Sh*t outta everybody with his Travel Itinerary, all Summer.

Kinda like Kaminsky.

Bill8472| 9.24.12 @ 9:24AM

What image comes to mind when you have heard the term "Muslim" in your lifetime? One of the common images for me is the image of some turbaned and robed jihaist riding his horse with his curved sword extended to his front, in a charge against some enemy, shouting "Allahu akbar!"

Bob From District 9| 9.24.12 @ 3:55PM

That's because you are ignorant, and your ignorance has twisted you.

Bill8472| 9.25.12 @ 9:03AM

You've seen right through me.

KennesawJack| 9.24.12 @ 4:48PM

I get an image of a 54 year old pedophile f**cking a 9 year old girl in front of her mother while humming the most beautiful sound in the world which is, according to Barack Hussein Obamarx, the Muslim call to prayer.

Skippy| 9.24.12 @ 5:21PM

If ever we meet, don't extend your shitty left hand to me.
I will keep it as a remembrance of our introduction.

KennesawJack| 9.24.12 @ 5:34PM

'scuse me?

Occam's Tool| 9.25.12 @ 8:59PM

Not you, KJ---Bob.

Remember, in some places, toilet paper doesn't exist...

You haven't read your Kratman yet?

Occam's Tool| 9.25.12 @ 8:58PM

And I'm willing to nuke them to stop them. And then take their women to a better, more blissful realm.

Bill8472| 9.24.12 @ 9:32AM

So 'ere's ~to~ you, Fuzzy-Wuzzy, at your 'ome in the Soudan;
You're a pore benighted 'eathen but a first-class fightin' man;
We gives you your certificate, an' if you want it signed
We'll come an' 'ave a romp with you whenever you're inclined.

Stormzeye| 9.24.12 @ 9:39AM

Bill,
Here's some Kipling for you:
"Afghanistan"
If you find yourself dying on the Afghan plain,
And the women come down to pick your remains,
Then roll to your rifle and blow out your brains,
And go to your God like a soldier.

"The only thing that's new is the history you don't know." Harry S Truman

Bill8472| 9.24.12 @ 10:01AM

Wow, you know Kipling -sigh...-

irish19| 9.24.12 @ 10:04AM

Kipling understood.

Alej| 9.24.12 @ 10:21AM

He certainly did...

"East is East, and West is West,
And NEVER the twain shall meet."

Occam's Tool| 9.24.12 @ 11:12AM

Don't Forget my favorite, "The Gods of the Copybook Headings."

Oldefarte| 9.24.12 @ 10:25AM

And here is some GUMPISM for you.....STUPID IS AS STUPID DOES [and if the American people display the same level of stupidity on 11/6/12 that they did on 11/4/08, this country is toast]!!!!!!!!1

moey2720| 9.24.12 @ 3:08PM

I'm afraid I agree with you and people really do not seem to be paying attention. Perhaps the debates will wake them up. Certainly the Ryan/Biden one should.

KennesawJack| 9.24.12 @ 4:54PM

That will be akin to an ass-whuppin than a debate.

mzk| 9.24.12 @ 3:19PM

I've remembered that line ever since Time or Newsweek quoted it during the Russian invasion. Although the poem itself is not about Afganistan.

G.S. Patton| 9.24.12 @ 9:35AM

The MSM fawn over "the prophet," as Islam is nothing more than totalitarianism clothed in a religion. Marx was nothing more, than "the prophet," reincarnate. Both misfits and deviants. The so called "prophet," Marx, and the progressive left/MSM have a common enemy; The U.S. Constitution, Jesus Christ, and Winchester.

Al Adab| 9.24.12 @ 9:36AM

Given that Americans are rioting in the streets. That they have burned the Egyptian embassy, lynched the Libyan ambassador and destroyed many mosques we have no right to criticize others. Remember the COEXIST bumper sticker?

Joellen| 9.24.12 @ 9:38AM

Perfect timing Ben. In NYC, once again, they are submitting the "artwork" of JESUS CHRIST in a jar of Urine. Congressman Michael Grimm (Staten Island) is demanding Obama & Hillary to denounce it - but what's that we hear - crickets from the marxist regime and their cohorts the useful idiots the media. Cant make this stuff up folks.

C. Vernon Crisler | 9.24.12 @ 9:41AM

Ben, the "last days" began at Pentecost. No need to get bent out of shape over deranged Moslems and journalists.

"It will come to pass in the last days, says God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh... " (Acts 2:17).

R Martin| 9.24.12 @ 9:45AM

Finally, a little substance from Mr. Stein. Two observations:

“shows fear being beheaded -- and who doesn't?” I don’t. In fact I would love to deal with a Prophet fanatic whose intent is to behead me. And second, those two women at the dining table are both correct, he’s a stupid muslim.

Cat Shot| 9.24.12 @ 10:23AM

Boom!

Bob From District 9| 9.24.12 @ 3:57PM

You lie.

Skippy| 9.24.12 @ 4:13PM

You lose!

Oldefarte| 9.24.12 @ 10:23AM

11/6/12 is NOT about Romney, Ryan, Republicans, etc; but rather about SAVING OUR NATION. Do your duty and vote the total Republican ticket on your ballot....PLEASE!!!!

Lyneuss Fields | 9.24.12 @ 10:38AM

You've turned into a paranoid old Jew Mr. Stein. That is also too bad, because this is what rational people will remember you as.
http://lyneussfields.blogspot......gious.html

C. Vernon Crisler | 9.24.12 @ 11:49AM

What?

Lyneuss Fields | 9.24.12 @ 1:12PM

When you pull your head out Mr. Crisler, Google: Arabic or click this hyperlink, scroll down and look to your right.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arabic_language
If you believe, as I do, that language determines a culture's values and beliefs, there is no greater symbolism of David and Goliath. America has always been with Israel and it will always be. Anyone who messes with them, including Persia, will be bombed into oblivion. Therefore, Mr. Stein's rant above is nothing but the paranoia of an old man.

TiminAL| 9.24.12 @ 1:18PM

Hey Arrogant Ass,
While we would all like to believe your premise of "will be bombed to oblivion", I do not think it safe to assume that the current "Occupant" necessarily shares your foregone conclusion.

Lyneuss Fields | 9.24.12 @ 3:35PM

When you're able to pick your knuckles up off the pavement, explain to me what's arrogant about my statement. President Obama clearly has the majority of the Jewish vote. He has already stated to the American people that Iran will never have a nuclear weapon. Romney has given us nothing different. Congress and the American people--including me--are with Israel all the way.
Does this mean we have to put boots on the ground throughout the Mid East? Russia learned this lesson the hard way in Afghanistan. Why should America play this same game? This is guerrilla warfare, and America should fight it as such. We can fly drones and build high-tech robots—creating good paying jobs—and deploy them throughout the Mid East and possibly around the world. The hate against us is great, so we must fight a lean and mean conflict.

C. Vernon Crisler | 9.24.12 @ 1:36PM

What's with the "old Jew" stuff?

Skippy| 9.24.12 @ 2:51PM

I saw David Brenner in Vegas in May of 2003.
He was explaining how he carried a laminated copy of the 9/11 attackers in his carry-on, and would tell TSA morons as they searched it, "this is who you are looking for; not the old Jew comic."
Hilariously sad.

mzk| 9.24.12 @ 3:22PM

Any Jew who is not paranoid is ignoring both reality and history.

Appleby| 9.24.12 @ 11:01AM

" I am just telling you, these do not feel like normal days. They feel like latter days."

I bin tellin' ya. Ain't I bin tellin' ya? For further information, turn to Matthew Chapters 24 and 25.

Appleby| 9.24.12 @ 11:05AM

Signs of the End Times24 Jesus left the temple and was walking away when his disciples came up to him to call his attention to its buildings. 2 “Do you see all these things?” he asked. “Truly I tell you, not one stone here will be left on another; every one will be thrown down.”

3 As Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately. “Tell us,” they said, “when will this happen, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?”
4 Jesus answered: “Watch out that no one deceives you. 5 For many will come in my name, claiming, ‘I am the Messiah,’ and will deceive many. 6 You will hear of wars and rumors of wars, but see to it that you are not alarmed. Such things must happen, but the end is still to come. 7 Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in various places. 8 All these are the beginning of birth pains.

9 “Then you will be handed over to be persecuted and put to death, and you will be hated by all nations because of me. 10 At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, 11 and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. 12 Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, 13 but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved. 14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come.

Nick| 9.24.12 @ 11:28AM

I'd hate to burst your bubble, Appleby, but, chapter 24 of Saint Matthew's Gospel is about Christ's prediction of the destruction of Jerusalem & the Temple, in A.D. 70. Matthew 24 is known as the "Little Apocalypse."

If you read further, it becomes fairly evident:

"33 'So also, when you see all these things, you know that he is near, at the very gates.
34 Truly, I say to you, this generation will not pass away till all these things take place.
35 Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will not pass away.
36 But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, nor the Son, but the Father only."

In Jewish parlance, a "generation" was 40 years. And, forty years after the Crucifixion, the Temple was destroyed, animal sacrifice ended, and the liturgy practiced since the time of Moses ceased.
This was the end of the Jewish world, and the end of the Old Covenant age.

C. Vernon Crisler | 9.24.12 @ 11:47AM

Dittos....

Appleby| 9.24.12 @ 12:00PM

Believe it or not, suit yourself. But it's all fitting in nicely, isn't it?

Nick| 9.24.12 @ 12:26PM

I should've added, Appleby, that Christ's prophecy, in Matthew 24, also contains eschatological aspects, of course.

But, the specifics that are predicted by Christ are to serve as a warning for the Christians in Jerusalem and Judea, when the Romans come to put down the Jewish uprising. As Eusebius tells us, this is precisely what happened, when the Christians fled to Pella.

When Christ comes again, for the Final Judgement, there will be nowhere to which we can flee, will there?
Don't waste your time trying to figure out if we are in the "end times." Spend your time praying that our country, and the world, returns to God.
(Which I'm sure you do already!)
God Bless!

Bob From District 9| 9.24.12 @ 4:02PM

Thank you for making all that plain. What is worse than predicting the end times is trying to force God's hand. Which is what the end timers are doing. Think about it.

I don't think God is impressed.

Skippy| 9.24.12 @ 4:14PM

Correct.
You don't think.

RCV| 9.24.12 @ 1:35PM

Well said again, Nick.

mzk| 9.24.12 @ 3:31PM

Well, to start with, a generation is normally twenty years; I don't know where you get this 40 from. Secondly, everything else he said would happen within a generation did not (I just re-read it to check), so Jesus was proven to be a false prophet. Finally, there were synagogues and prayers all along, so the liturgy never ceased.

Bob From District 9| 9.24.12 @ 4:04PM

He said the Jewish measure was 40 years. A generation is the average time from birth of parent to birth of child. That can sun from 20 to 40 years typically. I have calculated it out for 10 generations and found it to be very close to 30 years.

Skippy| 9.24.12 @ 4:17PM

Thanks!
So in one biblical generation we can pave the entire ME with dried Muzzie blood.
Sounds like a plan.

C. Vernon Crisler | 9.24.12 @ 7:33PM

A generation is usually 30 or 40 years. Twenty years is the average reign length of kings, not a generation count.

JGW| 9.24.12 @ 11:23AM

Well the MSM certainly does not want anyone to think badly of Muslims.

Its not particularly what they say in support, its what they do not report.

Last week Camp Bastion in Afghanistan was attacked. It was reported that two Marines were killed and Prince Harry was in a little danger.

During that raid ( not reported by the majority of the MSM ) was that six AV-8B Harriers were totally destroyed and two very badly damaged. Thats out of ten at the base. One of those dead Marines was the Harrier flight commander, a Lt. Col.

Any of you see that on the alphabets?

How about the fact that we have lost more troops there during Obamas three years in office than during Bushs eight?

Religion of Pieces.

wrongheifer| 9.24.12 @ 12:58PM

Amen and piss on Islam!

JGW| 9.24.12 @ 11:33AM

To Jeff Babbin,

Sorry Jeff. I had'nt read your article yet. Thanks for reporting on camp Bastion.

Who Knows?| 9.24.12 @ 11:33AM

Google Pat Condell and watch his Muslim riot youtube---astounding!

astorian| 9.24.12 @ 11:40AM

Mr. Stein, things may be even worse than you believe.

I haven't observed this is in the "mainstream media" yet, but I've already seen writers in college and "alternative" newspapers follow mention of The Prophet Muhammad with a parenthetical "(peace be unto him)".

It may be just my conservative paranoia talking (I honestly hope it is) but I can't help thinking mainstream media writers will begin following suit shortly.

Skippy| 9.24.12 @ 2:55PM

If I ever see that "pbuh" in print, I promptly use the page to wipe my ass...at the appropriate time, of course.
Or use it to drain bacon fat.
Mohammed is funnier when he's dripping pig grease.

Bob From District 9| 9.24.12 @ 4:06PM

Muslim religious teachers follow mention of Jesus with "peace be unto him."

Skippy| 9.24.12 @ 4:16PM

They do that to impress the infidels.
As a committed infidel, I am not impressed.
Neither is Jesus.

OregonBuzz| 9.24.12 @ 11:43AM

The MSM are controlled by Zero's puppet masters. Zero is analagous to the "Sorcerers Apprentice" and the Sorcerer is Soros. (What's in a name?) All of this plus the fact that Zero is a Muslim, which most Americans are in denial about, adds up to only one thing; here comes the Muslim horde. If the Idiot in Chief is annointed again in November, start buying head scarves for your wife or girlfriend and get ready to let your beard grow, and be sure to pitch your bible. Otherwise you may lose your head.
Don't believe it? Read the following from the Qu'ran.
Kill the Jews and the Christians if they do not convert to Islam or refuse to pay Jizya tax (9:29)
Any religion other than Islam is not acceptable (3:85)
Terrorize and behead those who believe in scriptures other than the Qur’an (8:12)
Any more questions, Ben?

Collectivist| 9.24.12 @ 11:50AM

Our Great Leader will guide us to the bright upland of uniformity and correct thinking. What have you got to be afraid of?

wrongheifer| 9.24.12 @ 12:57PM

are you really that ignorant?...the collective? Really?....seriously?...Commie?

Skippy| 9.24.12 @ 2:56PM

He has to be kidding.

Joe Mudd| 9.24.12 @ 12:17PM

Really Ben? Really?
After all the BAD you wrote about Palin your going to suggest Islam is pushing Christianity out.
Excuse me if I see YOU as hypocrite here.
Palin is the epitome of Christian and you TRASHED her, way to go.

Bob From District 9| 9.24.12 @ 4:07PM

Palin was as unChristian as you can get.

Skippy| 9.24.12 @ 4:20PM

To a Mohammedan, I'm sure it would appear that way.
Sarah is as Christian as they get.
She is willing to beat her plowshares into swords to prove it to ya'.

Poppakap| 9.24.12 @ 4:37PM

...and it's remarkably unChristian to say so.

C. Vernon Crisler | 9.24.12 @ 7:36PM

In what way Bob from District 9?

Bill8472| 9.24.12 @ 12:38PM

What you haven't mentioned, Ben, is the fact that there is not one single web site other than one called "Bare Naked Islam" that will either publish the cartoon published in the French humor magazine (Charlie something), or even so much as provide a link to it.

The fear to provide a means for people to view the cartoon by ANY significant web source, such as, for example, American Spectator, FrontLine Magazine, National Review, American Thinker, Fox News, CNN, MSNBC, CBS, NBC, ABC, or anyone else other then "Bare Naked Islam" strongly suggests that the modification of behavior has reached the level of a well-learned lesson by those who claim to resist Dar al-Islam.

mzk| 9.24.12 @ 3:38PM

Not true. I've seen it several places, including Beck's site.

BShep| 9.24.12 @ 12:42PM

'Now, it's not just that no one bats an eye at the amazing truth that the United States is beaming TV ads all over Pakistan apologizing for a derogatory Internet trailer for a nonexistent movie (demeaning) telling the truth about the being that Muslims call "The Prophet Mohammed." '

TFTFY

Bill8472| 9.24.12 @ 2:04PM

The fact that the U.S. government is paying for, has produced, and is showing an ad saying the video was not made under the aegis of the United States government is evidence to the Islamic world that the U.S. government is fully behind this imagined slight to Muhammed.

Vic| 9.24.12 @ 12:44PM

Ben, I agree that the problem lies in Islam and our MSM is giving it a pass (x'cept for FOX). We got to call a spade a spade and tackle it as such. However, I have my doubts this will happen because of the religion of both Obozo and his challenger Mitt

Richard S.| 9.24.12 @ 12:44PM

I was thinking about this the other day, but the fact is that there are so many people named Mohamed that I don't think it is really that inappropriate.

When people say "Jesus Christ" I think people get the idea, because not many people have that name.

John786| 9.24.12 @ 12:46PM

Nothing is wrong Mr stein. You are just losing your marbles. The neocon wars you have supported have brought nothing. All that blood and treasure all for nothing. The Prophet Muhammad is indeed the prophet for all humanity. Why don't we all try peace for once. America- you bring all your bases, troops home and the people in the ME will try not to be mean to you. No you don't want that I hear. You will continue to support murder in historic Palestine. That ain't going to win you many friends. More tears for everyone im afraid. Peace with Iran. 67 or bust ? Ah! Bust it is then. I dare you to attack Iran. Mr Stein may get his End times.

AmericanPatriot52| 9.24.12 @ 1:03PM

You're twisted.

Alej| 9.24.12 @ 1:09PM

Thank you for your input, Achmed. Now go back to your correspondence course on goat clitorectomies

Poppakap| 9.24.12 @ 4:38PM

Spoken like a true dhimmi.

KennesawJack| 9.24.12 @ 5:02PM

The Prophet Muhammed was a f**king pedophile. Nothing more.

drbill| 9.24.12 @ 12:50PM

well, Ben you missed 1 key item
look back at Mr Obama
he constantly says
the HOLY Quaran but never the Holy Bible
or holy new testament or Holy anything else
coincindence or sad reference to his internal beliefs?

wrongheifer| 9.24.12 @ 12:56PM

This will not happen on our watch! Thank you Mr. Stein!...Thank you and may God Bless You and America!

Patriot58| 9.24.12 @ 12:58PM

"There is just a feeling in the air, a look in the sky at dusk, a look on people's faces. Fear is everywhere."

Actually, if you're still up in Sandpoint, that look in the sky is all the smoke from the fires by the Cascades...

AmericanPatriot52| 9.24.12 @ 1:00PM

Mr. Stein -- Are you just waking up to this? Where have you been in the past decade or so? You strike me as a very nice, intelligent man, but come on! The MSM, Hollywood, and a number of other "groups" have been taking this country in this direction for quite some time. It's part of why so many of us felt so disassociated for so long and led to the creation of The Tea Party. Welcome to my world!

As for me, I wear my crosses, I talk about God, I talk about conservatism and the Constitution and the Founding Fathers whenever I can to whomever will listen. Some people roll their eyes, some yell at me and some just walk away.

It's gotten to the point in this election, where I'll do what I can, I'll continue to talk to people, but I'm leaving a lot of it up to the Lord. I am trying to trust in Him and that enough people have turned back to Him, have called on Him to help us and He'll take care of it. Otherwise, America as we've known and loved her, is gone.

Bob From District 9| 9.24.12 @ 4:11PM

Ben Stein is not a nice, intelligent, man. He is one of those who wish to send others off to fight and bleed and die for Israel.

The is no Arab country nor any rational alliance of Arab countries that threatens the existance of Israel.

Skippy| 9.24.12 @ 4:23PM

As soon as we pick through the rubble of Tehran, I'm sure the evidence of your wisdom will become apparent.
Till then, Rock the Casbah!

Bob From District 9| 9.24.12 @ 5:41PM

Israel is the military power in the Middle East. Has been since pretty much after it was founded.

According to US military officials an Isreali attack on Iran would require planes to fly about 1000 miles, and refuel midair. The same applies to the reverse attack.

Iran is no threat to anyone, Saudi Arabia is.

Poppakap| 9.24.12 @ 4:48PM

You're correct only because Iranians are Persians not Arabs. Other than that, you're laughably ignorant of proclamations repeatedly stated by the likes of Achmadcrazydad and his proxy murderers in Hezbollah.

However, I'm inclined to believe you know these statements have been made, but your foaming-at-the-mouth anti-semitism puts you in league with other holocaust deniers.

Bob From District 9| 9.24.12 @ 5:45PM

What proclamations? Even Israeli spokesmen say many of the reports are false. So Iranians do not like Israel, that's not a crime, and they are not a threat.

What make you think Iran has any proxies in Lebanon? Do you really think the Lebanese don't have far more reason to fight Israel than Iran does? Do you really think they need any incentive? IF so, you are the one who is laughably ignorant.

"However, I'm inclined to believe you know these statements have been made, but your foaming-at-the-mouth anti-semitism puts you in league with other holocaust deniers."

You are a lying bastard. Speaking the truth does not make you an anti-Semite. Hating Arabs and calling for their destruction does make you an anti-Semite, since Arabs are Semites. Or did you forget that? Persian or Arab is a matter of ethnic hate in that area, not a meaningful distinction.

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 6:03PM

Actually, Bob, I have to disagree: I think republicans officially had the word "anti-Semite" redefined to mean "someone who says something I don't like." I've seen republicans demonstrating this new definition countless times. It doesn't mean anything more than that.

Which is a shame. Because the old definition describes a phenomenon that still exists.

Occam's Tool| 9.25.12 @ 9:05PM

Yes, especially from assholes like Pablo.

Pablo| 9.26.12 @ 1:03PM

There are so many examples of my anti-Semitism on display here, that there's no way your comment was utterly meaningless. Isn't that right?

Occam's Tool| 9.25.12 @ 9:04PM

Bob, anti-semite traditionally refers to Judenhass, you twat.

You also have no clue as to the Israeli land psotition and how that effects military defense needs.

In short, you're an ignorant idiot.

Occam's Tool| 9.25.12 @ 9:02PM

Bob: you have no clue. You have NO clue about the basics of military power and what is needed to withstand an initial attack. Israel MUST strike first if threatened---it has no choice. It has no land to absorb a hit with---the Sinai is gone.

dickdata| 9.24.12 @ 1:03PM

Seriously, don't conservatives have anything better than some unsubstantiated claims and the standard invocation of Hitler??? It appears that some Muslims have created "outrage machines" to serve their local political purposes. There is no measurable percentage of the actual population who are involved in these riots/attacks. Everybody needs to get a grip, and we need to live in the world as it is, and not as we would have it be.

sly311| 9.24.12 @ 3:59PM

I don't know--maybe your name says it all. Kinda like the Hokey Pokey.

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 1:17PM

I'm not surprised to see that, being a republican, you have a fundamental misunderstanding of what an "apology" even is. Let me explain about this essential element of human relations.

An apology is where, through a variety of words and approaches, someone essentially says "I was wrong to have done that and I regret it." I know to a republican these are the worst words a human could ever utter, but there it is. (Hit the dictionary if you don't believe me.)

Now let's look at the messages from Obama and Clinton:
http://www.thegatewaypundit.co.....ica-video/

There is no contrition in those statements, no admission of wrongdoing. Therefore, those aren't apologies. Those are clarifications. "Just because that shitty film trailer was produced by Americans, that is not representative of all Americans nor its government." Is there anything untruthful about that?

And with that (probably unwelcome) injection of reality, I leave you to return to your partisan howling.

Skippy| 9.24.12 @ 3:02PM

I will issue a more appropriate apology at your graveside.

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 4:35PM

It's a bit refreshing to see republicans show their true homicidal stripes. Who needs that "I'm so Christian" nonsense? Bellow for the deaths of your enemies!!! That's how you show who's more civilized.

Poppakap| 9.24.12 @ 4:51PM

...and your unrestrained use of hyperbole demonstrates your exalted civility?

Hey pot, this is kettle, you're black.

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 5:00PM

Please explain precisely how I exaggerated.

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 5:09PM

Here, let me help. Show me where I made any implicit call for violence as Skippy did. Show me where I wrote something violent and inflammatory (assuming that writing something that exhibits reason is not in itself violent and inflammatory). Show me those things, and your comment about my civility might have some weight. Otherwise, not so much.

Skippy| 9.24.12 @ 5:25PM

Being a Christian definitely does not require one to submit to any crazed butcher who comes along.
That would be suicide; a sin.
We fight!

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 5:37PM

I...see. You wish you could act out in violence against me, because I pointed out some inconvenient facts. And you also consider yourself a follower of Christ who recommended turning the other cheek in the face of actual violence (not just arguments you don't agree with).

And you see no conflict in any of this. Anything else you'd like to add? Any genuine Christian would be trying to distance themselves from you right now.

Bob From District 9| 9.24.12 @ 4:12PM

Are you sure it was even made by Americans?

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 4:37PM

I don't think anyone is 100% sure, but the uncontested story of the moment is that it was Nakoula Basseley Nakoula of Cerritos, CA.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.co.....fraud.html

Skippy| 9.24.12 @ 5:27PM

I speak to muzzies in the language of Mohammed.
Deathspeak.

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 7:21PM

Give me a break. If you ever met an actual Muslim in real life, the sheer terror of it would compel you to wet your pants in no time. If anything is utterly predictable, people who talk the way you do are uniformly cowards in real life.

Occam's Tool| 9.25.12 @ 9:06PM

Asshole, I've been in fights with them outnumbered 3:1. My pants were dry; theirs afterwards were wet---nothing like a legal threat of deportation to the West Bank to dampen a Pali's trousers and make his girlfriend plead.

Pablo| 9.26.12 @ 1:04PM

Hahaha!!! I haven't made up a story that silly since I was in the 7th grade.

Bankrupt_R_Us| 9.24.12 @ 1:29PM

Ben, Check out the 1965 Immigration Reform Act. I am sure you know many individuals who came to the USA on green cards and love the country, work hard, pay taxes, etc.

However, the 1965 Immigration Reform Act gave first preference to 3rd world country applicants. It also quadrupled admissions, which are now 80,000 to 100,000 A MONTH.

What if half the green cards are given to people whose entire culture despises America? Just asking.

Poppakap| 9.24.12 @ 4:58PM

The 1965 Immigration Reform Act has been an unmitigated policy failure for the United States. Prior to that legislative abortion, the US had a rather rational immigration policy. But in the midst of the democrats 40+ year majority in both houses of Congress the 1965 immigration law was passed with strong championing by the "lion" of the Senate Teddy Chappaquiddick.

The Central Valley of California today is testament to the folly of this legislation and a view of what the rest of the country will suffer if not changed.

Seek| 9.25.12 @ 6:45PM

Finally, someone here understands the real issue. It isn't "values" or "liberals." It's the gradual replacement of an entire historic population of a nation -- ours -- that began in earnest in 1965 with the Hart-Celler immigration amendments. And this program has the support of leaders in both major parties. George W. Bush, Newt Gingrich, Grover Norquist and the late Jack Kemp are as guilty as any Democrat.

PM Stanton| 9.24.12 @ 1:51PM

Ben,
I think this makes it official. September 24, 2012 is when you went from a far right conservative blogger to a Tea Party Spokesperson. If you think a country with separation of church and state that has Judeo-Christian religion on every piece of currency and at the opening and closing of every political session/speech without a word from the media has fallen into Islamic hands you fit right into their world of inaccuracy. You have clearly left any Republican politicians you worked for in the dust and moved off the ledge to the right of Goldwater. As with most Tea Party talking heads you have no and long since have had no connection to the actual Republican Party.

StanAmSpec| 9.24.12 @ 3:07PM

First of all PM, there is no such thing Constitutionally of "separation of church and state".

But that's not his point, it's bizarre how Islam is treated by the Left. 3-5% of the country yet they are treated with kid gloves. You seem so determined to undermine the Tea Party movement (for undetermined reasons) that you are looking for problems.

Bob From District 9| 9.24.12 @ 5:11PM

Both the second amendment and Article VI sect 3 of the constitution require separation of church and state.

The Tea Baggers are giving America the finger. Which is why "Tea Bagger" is an appropriate name for them.

Skippy| 9.24.12 @ 5:29PM

The 2nd Amendment says nothing of church, only of arms.
You know, the things we own that our Big Govt and your little deity fear most.

Poppakap| 9.24.12 @ 4:59PM

Another dhimmi speaks.

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 5:40PM

It's interesting how you quickly accede the fact that you have no argument you can use to refute those with whom you disagree. And yet you still tell yourself that you're right.

I'm sure there's a psychiatric condition for this, no?

Occam's Tool| 9.25.12 @ 9:08PM

I don't make psychiatric assessment without examination, Pablo, but there's no need for one to diagnose you as pendejo, maricon.

Pablo| 9.26.12 @ 2:25PM

That comment would have been devastating back in elementary school.

HD Thoreauaway| 9.24.12 @ 1:55PM

Wow, Ben, where to start?

You're a writer, so let's start with basic grammar. Referring to Mohammed as "The Prophet Mohammed" doesn't mean he's the only prophet, just like saying "columnist Ben Stein" doesn't mean you're the only columnist. You need a comma for that, i.e.: "The Prophet, Mohammed.".

While we're on the topic of titles, you ask whether "any major newspaper here in the USA [has referred] to Jesus Christ as "The Son of God, God Incarnate, The Lord Jesus Christ." You are aware that Christ is his title, not his last name, right? Anyone referring to him as "Jesus Christ" is calling him "The Anointed One."

What's more, Philip Corbett, the NY Times associate managing editor for standards, explained three days ago that "We try as much as possible to respect the terms and language used by religious groups. Muslims routinely refer to Muhammad as “the Prophet Muhammad,” but I’m not aware of any Christian denominations that use ‘the Prophet Jesus.’” (Notice how the commas separate Corbett's name from his title? That means he's the only one with that title.) Did you see this in the Times and then write an article predicated on pretending not to have?

I also admire your -- not one, but two! -- irrelevant-to-the-topic invocations of Nazis, your implication that Obama heralds the End of Days, and your mention that some think Obama is a Muslim (followed by a conspicuous lack of a refutation of this obvious falsehood).

Something is wrong, indeed.

John786| 9.24.12 @ 3:09PM

Mr HD,
Brilliant put down. You're obviously a genius. I'm in love- platonically of course.

C. Vernon Crisler | 9.24.12 @ 3:19PM

If journalists start referring to Jesus as "The Christ Jesus," then you might have a point; otherwise they are just pandering to the false prophet Mohammed.

HD Thoreauaway| 9.24.12 @ 5:44PM

As I mentioned both below and above, Mr. Crisler, the New York Times uses the most commonly adopted terminology in talking about religious figures. And to employ the same method I did below once again, there are 11 million for "Christ Jesus" and 119 million for "Jesus Christ." Do you find use of the latter term offensive?

C. Vernon Crisler | 9.24.12 @ 7:51PM

A lot of people think "Christ" is Jesus's last name; you know, the ignorant 47%. Only the more literate understand that it means the Anointed One, i.e., the Messiah.

Googling "Christ Jesus" tells us nothing relevant about how JOURNALISTS refer to Jesus. What a ridiculous methodology.

Journalists are bending over for Islamists when they use the definite article, THE Prophet Mohammed, whereas one will never find a journalist refering to Jesus as THE Christ Jesus.

Journalists are just weaklings who are afraid to offend violent people.

JP| 9.24.12 @ 3:58PM

When was the last time NBC, the Times, or Post referred to the Vicar of Christ by his proper title - The Holy Father?

Can you imagine MSNBC or Sixty Minutes calling the Pope, "The Holy Father", or Mary, Our Blessed Mother?" Or Elijah the Prohpet Elijah?

HD Thoreauaway| 9.24.12 @ 4:11PM

Again, to reference the quotation above from the associate managing editor for standards of the New York Times, they use the titles in widest common usage. A Google search for "pope benedict" returns 25.7 million hits; a search for ""holy father" benedict" returns only 1.6 million. (Incidentally, the title of Pope Benedict's biography at www.vatican.va is, "BIOGRAPHY
OF HIS HOLINESS, POPE BENEDICT XVI.")

Do you disagree that "the Pope" is the title in most common usage? Do you find that title offensive?

Bob From District 9| 9.24.12 @ 5:12PM

Well said.

Occam's Tool| 9.25.12 @ 9:09PM

Better to refer to him as the Pedophile Muhammed. More accurate.

StanAmSpec| 9.24.12 @ 2:31PM

It may seem like hyperbole, but the scene in Independence Day, with all the people on top of the buildings trying to greet the aliens with open arms. With no understanding of who they were or what they are about. For the ignorant masses sometimes the "idea" of something is more important than the reality. This is how the left rolls, so it's not surprising that they treat Islam this way.

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 2:59PM

Stan, in your Independence Day example, the aliens were 100% united in their desire to destroy mankind, and they had the means.

Do you see any difference between that and the conflict with Muslim terrorists? Any difference at all? Here, let me help. Muslims are by no means united in their desire to see the US destroyed; it's a fringe viewpoint in the Muslim world. Even the most hardened group of Muslim terrorists could never dream of destroying the US; the best they can do is hope we destroy ourselves, and judging from our reaction to 9/11, this is clearly the way things are going.

So, hyperbole. Yes.

StanAmSpec| 9.24.12 @ 3:09PM

First of all if by fringe you mean 20-30% yes, it is fringe. But, why the bizarre glazing of the eyes, the innate desire to genuflect to Islam by the left? Why is their no "Piss Quran"?

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 4:18PM

No, not 20-30%. You might want to read this (assuming your ideology has any room for facts in it). While support for terrorist attacks against the US range from 9% to 30% depends on how the question is asked, that is not the same as wanting the US destroyed.

Next, no one on the left that I see is "genuflecting to Islam." That's more of your hyperbole. What you're seeing is a reluctance to ridicule Islam. Those aren't the same thing. Fact is, many on the left find all organized religion to be ridiculous, so there isn't going to be any genuflecting.

As for why there is no "Piss Quran," that's probably due to intimidation. See South Park's attempts to insert Muhammed into their cartoon, then thwarted by Comedy Central. The desire to not have your head cut off is not the same as genuflecting. Look up the definition if you don't believe me.

I look forward to a day when we can ridicule Islam the way we can ridicule Christianity. I'd love to see the Islamic version of Life of Brian that the whole world (Muslims included) can laugh at.

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 4:31PM

This:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M....._terrorism

Skippy| 9.24.12 @ 3:11PM

The Muzzies that want us dead are the only ones that count.
The silent majority of Muzzies are complicit by their silence.
IOW, when the Kansas funeral-busting scum church does their thing, they are loudly and roundly condemned by every Christian pastor and congregation in the country.
Muzzies riot and kill and the "big, fat silent majority of the religion of body parts" stays silent.
I say, f*ck 'em all.
When they start calling out their own crazies, I'll start to care.
Till then, f*ck off and die like Mo did.

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 4:21PM

===================
The Muzzies that want us dead are the only ones that count.
===================

That's simply the voice of a warmonger. The same has been said about every enemy of every past age. Fact is, the non-violent ones matter very, very much.

===================
When they start calling out their own crazies, I'll start to care.
===================

Glad to hear it. You can start today. First read this.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I.....t_ideology

Skippy| 9.24.12 @ 4:40PM

Wikipedia? Wow!
The unquestionable global authority speaks!
Obviously the leaders cited have had a huge influence on the faithful.
Islamic butchery ended...when?
Talk is cheap, Mo.
And we know what taquiya means.
Nice try; thanks for playing.

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 5:04PM

You said you wanted to see Muslims calling out their own crazies. I showed you that this is happening in a way you cannot refute. The Wikipedia article is sourced, of course, and you're free to investigate those sources and decide whether or not they're valid.

But you know they are valid, and for that reason you punted and inferred that anything from Wikipedia by definition cannot be true. Good luck with that one.

As far as "Islamic butchery ended," that's not what you asked for. You asked to see Muslims condemning the violence and that's what I've provided. Now that I've done that, you're moving the goalposts. That is the hallmark of a dishonest argument.

Thanks for playing. Feel free to call me names like poo-poo head, because I don't think you're left with much else.

Skippy| 9.24.12 @ 5:34PM

Their calls for tolerance and restraint are as sincere as Arafat's calls for peace in english followed by calls for war in...whatever gutter language muzzies speak.
Even a Grand High Exalted Mufti is ignored.
How likely is it they will listen to Prince Bambo and his incompetent Sec of State?

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 5:41PM

Have you always been psychic? More to the point, can you put me in touch with Elvis?

Skippy| 9.24.12 @ 5:46PM

Show me the peace.

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 5:58PM

I already did, remember? (It was about an hour ago and is just up the thread.) You got so worked up over it, you had to infer that Wikipedia is in the bag for the terrorists.

JD| 9.24.12 @ 8:27PM

The fact that this wikipedia article's first listed explanation for Muslim terrorism is US actions against Muslim countries tells us all we need to know. That it speaks extensively of the Quran's "peace", dedicates only one sentence to 9/11, and uses the word "infidel" only once, to describe supposed Christian mandates to kill nonbelievers, only reinforces the point.

The article is grossly biased.

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 8:52PM

==========================
The fact that this wikipedia article's first listed explanation for Muslim terrorism is US actions against Muslim countries tells us all we need to know.
==========================

Yeah. It tells us that the article is historically aware. Only republicans and idiots (sorry for the redundancy) believe that US/Muslim relations began on 9/11/01. Others understand it's longer and more complex.

In the case of 9/11, bin Laden specifically claimed it was in retaliation for the US's unconditional support of Israel over the Palestinians, and for keeping troops in Saudi Arabia. Those two things did happen before 9/11, did they not?

I understand your job here is to pretend that mainstream Muslims have all been silent in the face of terrorist attacks. Part of that job is figuring out how to ignore that wikipedia page. However, you've done a shabby job. If you want to dig specifically into the supporting articles, and explain clearly why they're invalid (the lack of the word "infidel" doesn't mean anything), then be my guest. If you want to continue to wallow in your ignorance, you're free to do that as well. But the latter will get you ridiculed, whereas the former will make you more informed, and therefore more intelligent.

Of course, it's up to you.

JD| 9.24.12 @ 11:39PM

Writing smugly doesn't make you right. You lace every post with straw men, link to naught but biased sources, and have the audacity to suggest that I'm the one who's closed-minded.

You speak of what happened before 9/11, yet ignore prior acts of aggression from the Muslim world before 9/11. The simple fact is that only Muslim apologists would lead with the explanation that most justifies terrorism, then progress to less and less defensible rationales, writing less about each one, and in each case spinning them defensibly.

Informed and intelligent? You have no idea what you insult, and you don't want to.

Pablo| 9.25.12 @ 12:18AM

Your comment contains only generalities but no specifics. Why is that Wiki page biased? You haven't begun to demonstrate that. Which strawman are you referring to? You didn't say. Instead you used meaningless words to stand where you could have actually refuted my comments in concrete terms. Interesting.

Yes, Muslims showed aggression before 9/11. USS Cole. Americans did too. Overthrow of Mossadegh in Iran. If you want to trace this back to an original conflict and point out one party who's to blame, good luck to you but we adults will be thinking about solutions.

Bob From District 9| 9.24.12 @ 5:20PM

Nobody not involved owes you any apology nor are they required to denounce those who don't like you.

Immediately after 9-11 Iranians in Tehran took to the streets in support of America. Iran supported the invasion of Afghanistan and democritization of Iraq, for which Bush tied them into the Axis of Evil.

Saudi Arabia is the home base of Wahhabism, the source of the 9-11 terrorists. Today the US is serving the interests of the Saudi's against Iran.

Most Muslims in the world don't really feel they owe us anything more than we feel we owe them.

Oh, and the thousands of Libyans who attacked the extremist militia compound still get labeled by you as targets.

The Libyans in the streets carrying signs demanding justice for our Ambassador are just drone targets to you.

JD| 9.24.12 @ 3:21PM

Fringe? Empirical evidence suggests that the fringe is the group that likes America. Meanwhile, a fringe group of Baptists from Westboro are allowed to define all of Christianity in the eyes of the Left, and none on your side complain.

"Muslim terrorists could never dream of destroying the US" - actually, many of them dream of exactly that. Whether it's feasible doesn't prevent them from dreaming it, and as you say, they ARE making progress.

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 4:29PM

==============
Fringe? Empirical evidence suggests that the fringe is the group that likes America.
==============

This is an opinion unencumbered by any real information. Would you like to be informed? (That's a serious question.) If so, you might start here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M....._terrorism

==============
Meanwhile, a fringe group of Baptists from Westboro are allowed to define all of Christianity in the eyes of the Left, and none on your side complain.
==============

That never happened. The Westboro Baptist Church does not define Christianity in the eyes of the left. I see you wish it did, so it could serve to justify your own bigotry. But like most underpinnings of your philosophy, that is a lie.

==============
"Muslim terrorists could never dream of destroying the US" - actually, many of them dream of exactly that. Whether it's feasible doesn't prevent them from dreaming it, and as you say, they ARE making progress.
==============

"Many" of them is meaningless. Fact is, it's a small percentage. Are you saying we should kill millions of Muslims because some of them have homicidal dreams? Meanwhile, many Americans on this very thread openly dream of annihilating all Muslims. What should be done about that?

About Muslims "making progress" towards our destruction, you completely misread my comment. WE are making that progress by dismantling our freedoms. The Muslim terrorists are just sitting back and watching.

JD| 9.24.12 @ 8:16PM

Your wikipedia page is just that - "your" page. It clearly violates wikipedia's NPOV guidelines and exists solely to propagandize. It should be deleted. Even its "polls" section (such polls seem inherently very unreliable" cites a more than "fringe" group supporting the attacks, and many more falling in the "other" bucket that claims that America was behind 9/11.

------------

Westboro is commonly cited in anti-Christian rants, and all Christians are tarred with their beliefs by a host of leftist talking heads in the media. Your denial will not convince me that what I witness doesn't happen.

------------

"Muslim terrorists could never dream of destroying the US" - actually, many of them dream of exactly that. - Having established that we're talking about Muslim TERRORISTS, as opposed to all Muslims, who are you to say that only a small percentage dream of the demise of the enemy they've dedicated their lives to attacking? That makes no sense. In order to hide your absurdity, you decided to accuse me of supporting murder, which does not align with anything I've written. Pure straw man.

You originally suggested, correctly, that we were destroying ourselves as a result of 9/11 and the like. Muslim terrorism had a role in that, and based on bin Laden's statements, he intended that outcome. Those involved in terrorism continue to work that angle, and once again, it's absurd to claim that they don't even dream of succeeding.

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 8:41PM

No, it's not "my" page. I simply linked to it. If you have any specific critiques, let me know. But if you want to simply allude vaguely to its problems as a means to write it off out of hand without actually refuting it, then that's a pretty poor argument.

As for how "the Left" regards Westboro, I’m sure there are SOME lefties that feel as you say. However, unlike the right, the Left does not march in lockstep. We all foster our own ideas. (Yep, that’s even encouraged!) As a result, all true Christians are actually on the left (as was Christ himself). Many non-Christian lefties are too open-minded to make blanket condemnations based on fringe groups like Westboro. Of course, you will continue to believe otherwise, because you think it provides you an excuse to be bigoted against others. That's pretty easy to see.

When I said "Muslim terrorists could never dream of destroying the US," that's a saying. It means it could never happen. I don't claim to know what Muslim terrorists dream about. I expect some of them aspire to the destruction of the US. However, that assumption is no justification for killing huge numbers of Muslim civilians as we've done. One could just as easily justify killing lots of Americans because some of them openly dream of destroying all Muslims. (I am not advocating either of these, just making a point.)

(continued)

JD| 9.24.12 @ 11:46PM

Your post drips with hypocrisy. You demand detailed proof from me while providing nothing defensible on your side. You tell me that what I experience isn't real, then backtrack and claim "ok, SOME do it", but act as if I'm still wrong, even though my point only ever was that SOME do it (in response to your earlier claims of NONE).

You arbitrarily decide that I advocate murder or am a "bigot", or that your closed-mindedness represents open-mindedness and my insistence on truth is closed-mindedness.

Let me close with two quotes from you today:

8:41 PM - "I don't claim to know what Muslim terrorists dream about."

2:59 PM - "Even the most hardened group of Muslim terrorists could never dream of destroying the US"

Pablo| 9.25.12 @ 12:26AM

About liberals' opinion on Westboro, you were wrong. You claimed that The Left condemns all Christians en masse for the crimes of Westboro. That is wrong. Liberals are by no means united in that opinion. I expect those that share that view are in the minority.

The reason I called you a bigot is because you hold bigoted views. You hate Muslims, am I right? And what did all Muslims ever do to you? Nothing. A handful of them attacked your country. A handful out of billions. That is bigotry.

I didn't say you advocate murder. I asked if you did.

And finally, about those quotes....dude. (Facepalm) You really don't understand the saying "they could never dream of..." meaning that such a thing is flat-out impossible? Sorry if you're having trouble with that. See if maybe someone smarter than you in the room can come explain it to you. Long story short: I never seriously claimed to know what Muslims dream.

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 8:42PM

(continued)

Yes, we are destroying ourselves just as bin Laden hoped. The terrorists are winning without a single successful follow-up attack on US soil. Are you crediting bin Laden with setting up the PATRIOT Act, creating a citizen surveillance system, initiating a torture program, etc? Or can you not see that a minority of corrupt Americans who wanted to do that stuff all along simply used 9/11 as an excuse?

JD| 9.24.12 @ 11:41PM

Like a good liberal, whether you credit a chain of events to the initial event or assign those in the middle the blame for their actions depends not on any sort of reason or consistency, but on political expediency.

Pablo| 9.25.12 @ 12:29AM

What on earth are you prattling about? I credit a chain of events to those who were involved, to the depth of their involvement. Bush majorly dismantled constitutional protections, supposedly in response to 9/11. Obama has continued those policies. This is one area where both parties agree. In fact, it's an area on which most power-hungry human beings throughout history have agreed. Remove freedoms of the vast majority, increase control, and get them to work.

Authoritarians are unable to see that.

JP| 9.24.12 @ 3:55PM

"Muslims are by no means united in their desire to see the US destroyed; it's a fringe viewpoint in the Muslim world. Even the most hardened group of Muslim terrorists could never dream of destroying the US;"

Pablo,
Have you even heard of Byzantium?

Bob From District 9| 9.24.12 @ 5:21PM

Have you ever heard of "Ancient History"?

Skippy| 9.24.12 @ 5:45PM

How about WTC?
Izzat ringing a bell?

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 6:36PM

What does the WTC have to do with Byzantium? You guys aren't even trying to be coherent.

JP| 9.25.12 @ 8:11AM

Pablo,
Your ignorance speaks for itself. Try reading a bit of history. If you were better versed in history, my comment would have made perfect sense.

Byzantium was once the greatest Empire in Europe. At its height, it extended from North Africa through the Middle East, Aisa Minor, and Southeast Europe. It was the seat of the Eastern Empire. Its armies were strong, its culture deep, and its riches unparalleled. When Islam began spreading in the 7th Century, no one thought that it would endanger the Empire. Seven Hundred years later it fell. Its last outpost of Constantinople fell they same time Columbus sailed for India. Hubris, pride, and sloth were to blame. Sound familiar?

Pablo| 9.25.12 @ 10:55AM

Of course I'm familiar with Byzantium. I was simply curious how you planned to connect that to this in order to show that Islam has always been bad. So what you seem to suggest is that, had all the Muslims been killed off when they started spreading, that perhaps the Byzantine Empire would still exist to this day? Are you prescribing that course of action on present day?

Hubris and pride are certainly in evidence in your argument that presupposes non-Muslims to be the chosen people who should rid themselves of a Muslim scourge. It's also very lazy thinking to assume historical conflicts simply repeat themselves forever, without the mitigating influence of modern events. So yes, sloth is in there too.

Occam's Tool| 9.25.12 @ 9:11PM

Pendejo, it is not a fringe viewpoint in the Arab world, it is THE major POLITICAL viewpoint. Now, if you want to say most are not political, OK, most are illiterate vermin, fine.

But there is no moderate major political movement that is gaining traction, maricon.

Pablo| 9.26.12 @ 1:07PM

There is absolutely nothing supporting your claim that wanting destruction of the US is a majority viewpoint in the Muslim world. You know that, right? The only available data supports my claim, that it's a minority view.

But you're compelled to believe your bullshit, because you think it gives you carte blanche to hate all Muslims and demand they be bombed. This is pretty obvious to see. Were you trying to keep that under wraps?

Ned Ferguson| 9.24.12 @ 2:57PM

I believe the official state religion is actually pantheism, but virtually anything anti-human will work as a stand-in.

gene| 9.24.12 @ 2:59PM

Mark.4
[39] And he arose, and rebuked the wind, and said unto the sea, Peace, be still. And the wind ceased, and there was a great calm.
OR the O.T instead of the N.T.:
Pss.46
[10] Be still, and know that I am God: I will be exalted among the heathen, I will be exalted in the earth.

Michael| 9.24.12 @ 3:13PM

MSM? That's a new one to me.

Nixonfan| 9.24.12 @ 3:29PM

Who says tolerance is better than theocracy?

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 4:29PM

Modern civilization starting back in the 1490s.

Skippy| 9.24.12 @ 4:42PM

Tolerating Islam is suicide.
No thanks.

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 5:43PM

So basically, where moderate Muslims have their Salaafists and Al Qaeda, we have our Skippy's and Michelle Bachmann. Given that, it's tough to claim moral superiority on either side except perhaps that Skippy is more outnumbered on our side than Al Qaeda is outnumbered on the Muslim side. (But I actually don't know that that's true.)

Skippy| 9.24.12 @ 5:49PM

I accept that rattlesnakes are real.
I do not accept that I must let them sting me in order to show how tolerant I am.

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 6:34PM

Do you want to destroy all rattlesnakes? Or do you restrain yourself until one comes within threatening range?

JD| 9.24.12 @ 8:21PM

I keep them out of threatening range, with a healthy cushion.

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 8:44PM

A healthy cushion. You mean like a few oceans plus the TSA screeners? Is that healthy enough for you? Or do you need to hunt them down in their own countries and kill them all, as we've been doing for the past 11 years?

Are you able to tell the diference between some people who move into a house down the street and happen to be Muslim, versus Khalid Sheikh Mohammed? Does such a distinction even matter to you?

JD| 9.24.12 @ 11:55PM

Are we talking about snakes or Muslims?

You seem no less than DESPERATE to slime me with an accusation of wanting to murder an innocent person. I have not that want, and will not bite. That you so desperately need me to bite suggests a fear that your argument is lost otherwise.

Pablo| 9.25.12 @ 12:30AM

I'm glad to hear you're opposed to the murder of innocents. Please forgive me for assuming that. Every single other person who is afraid of Muslims at large and applauds our various military adventures in the Muslim world (I'm assuming here), has been totally A-OK with the murder of innocents, so long as they're Muslim.

I'm glad that's not you.

delahaya| 9.26.12 @ 9:14AM

Pablo,

You're a moron, plain and simple.

Pablo| 9.26.12 @ 11:01AM

I understand you really wanted to refute me with facts and logic, but neither of those are available to you.

JD| 9.24.12 @ 8:18PM

That the Left calls tolerance is anything but, and is a despicable form of theocracy.

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 8:45PM

Could you elaborate on that a bit? How is tolerance for, say, black people a form of theocracy? How is saying "don't kill innocent Muslim civilians" an example of theocracy? Do you even know what that word means?

JD| 9.24.12 @ 11:54PM

Those who invoke "tolerance" are the least tolerant people in America. Though "tolerance" is definitionally a treatment of things with which you disagree, a great many on the American left call all disagreement "intolerance". This contradicts the meaning of the word "tolerance" by requiring agreement as a condition of tolerance.

As a simple thought exercise, please describe how one could disagree with the practice of homosexuality without being labeled "intolerant".

By the very nature of the definition of words, to value something, anything at all, is to be to some degree intolerant of attacks on that thing. The "tolerance" that the political Left requires (selectively) allows for nothing less than complete support, robbing people of the ability to disagree in any way or to protect what they value, should it not be what the Left demands that we value. To be completely tolerant in this way demands that one value nothing, at which point one is still intolerant of those who value something!

In the name of "tolerance", the Left practices great intolerance and imposes great pain on the victims of its social policy. Who this policy chooses to favor or disfavor is arbitrary in a vile way, as bad as any theocracy.

Pablo| 9.25.12 @ 12:37AM

You're wrong. You completely misunderstand the left's view of tolerance. Tolerance is to accept that so long as no harm is coming from what someone else is doing, that you should take no ACTIONS against them. That includes voting to have their rights taken away, etc.

YOU WROTE:
As a simple thought exercise, please describe how one could disagree with the practice of homosexuality without being labeled "intolerant".

Easy. Say this: I'm not gay, and the thought of gay sex actually makes me feel kinda sick. But I accept that other people lead their lives differently, and I'm fine with that so long as they keep it out of my house, etc.

Advanced Answer: Even though gay sex makes me sick, I actually have a few gay friends that are really cool. We don't talk about whose dicks they suck, and they understand I don't wanna go there. But we all like football.

You don't have to agree with it. That's where you've got it wrong. All you have to do it accept that other people do other things, and we have to make room for each other.

We have to tolerate people wearing argyle. We don't have to agree with it. But we can't vote against their right to wear it, nor can we beat the crap out of them. It's not totalitarianism.

Bob From District 9| 9.24.12 @ 5:21PM

I do.

JP| 9.24.12 @ 3:53PM

Perhaps Stein #1 (Ben) should make an appointment to see Steyn #2 (Mark). Mark Steyn has made a career these last 10 years sounding the alarm bells that Ben Stein now is hearing.

I could actually point to the day this all officially began. 12 Sep 2001. That was the day President Bush made his famous visit to a Mosque. Bush's astute political correctness was appalling. Could you imagine FDR visiting a Bushido Temple on 8 Dec 1941 and calling the Samurai religion a Religion of Peace? But, that's exactly what Bush did. One of the first offical warnings the FBI issued to Americans on 12 Sep 2001 was to be alert for hate crimes targeting Muslims. Our PC elites couldn't even wait until the funerals were over.

And it's been downhill ever since. Mark Steyn even wrote a piece on how Islam would spread. Fiction writer Robert Ferrigino believes it will really take hold when Hollywood joins the Dhimmitude. In one of his novels, a very young and popular female pop icon will make a well publicized conversion to the Religion of Peace. And not wanting to miss out on the gravy-train other pop stars (both male and female) join her. Before you know it, young people, emulating their heroes join them. And before you know it Gays will be out and Islamic Family Values are the new in.

As they saying goes, it only takes a spark. And that spark was lit by none other than George Bush in 2001.

Brian Richard Allen | 9.24.12 @ 8:02PM

.... September 12 2001, the day that will forever live in infamy as the day then president, Mr Bush, made his infamous visit to a mosque ....

When the ONE absolutely correct action would have been to have dropped a nuclear bomb on Osama's head and to have thus - thousands of wasted lives ago - appropriately Projected America's then massive -- and then respected -- power.

And have thus so inexpensively have purchased another hundred years of peace on Earth.

sly311| 9.24.12 @ 3:55PM

It's part of the long time plan; Marxism and Islamism for eons and now tied together and finally arriving on our shores. Ask Hillary, a huge Arab supporter and her chief of staff with familial ties to the Muslim Brotherhood. This is overall plan, worldwide Sharia and this great nation is bowing--taking its cue from our President Barack Hussein Obama, bowing to the Saudi King. Didn't everyone realize by his name alone who he was. This was no Tony Soprano folks. He is the real deal. A radical Muslim. Groomed from his earliest days for this moment. Saying I told you so doesn't even matter. Just keep watching your Emmy-award winning shows and leave the rest to them.

DesertFlower| 9.24.12 @ 4:06PM

I disagree, Ben. The MSM have not become a voice for Islam because they fear beheading. They have done so because most of them are on the political Left ... the Left sees itself as an advocate for the oppressed ... and the Left has come to regard Muslims as oppressed. This began with viewing the "Palestinians" as oppressed by Israel and has extended, in the minds of Leftists, to include all Muslims.

The MSM are agenda-driven and, when it comes to Islam, the agenda is one of siding against Israeli "oppressors" (who are abetted by the US) and with the Muslim "oppressed."

The Left's contradictory embrace of advocacy for Islam and advocacy for women has always struck me as particularly jarring, considering the standard condition of women throughout the Islamic world.

delahaya| 9.26.12 @ 9:16AM

The Leftwing media sees Islam as a foil to Christianity - which they hate. Cowardice is part of it yes, but not the main driving factor yet.

Pablo| 9.26.12 @ 1:09PM

The left wing sees Islam as marginally more ridiculous than Christianity, but in most respects they're the same religion. However, we believe that people should be able to follow whatever religion they choose without being persecuted or attacked by our military, no matter how ridiculous their faith is. Christians benefit from this view as well, so enjoy.

Alex Feltham | 9.24.12 @ 4:42PM

The reason is, of course, that the Liberal elite are as in thrall to multiculturalism as they used to be to Marxism.

How this dire situation is likely to get much worse is dealt with in "Game Changer" at:

http://john-moloney.blogspot.com/

TSIndiana| 9.24.12 @ 5:00PM

Well, another Stine piece where hate will again rule the day.

SicSemperTyrannis | 9.24.12 @ 5:21PM

Stein.
No hate here, Indiana.
Just calling it as he sees it. And I'm not a big Stein fan, but there is no hate going on here. You folks just love the mantra of hate, racism, and intolerance. When you don't have any ideas or policies that have ever worked, it's all you have left.

Hugh Manatee| 9.24.12 @ 5:02PM

One possible explanation is that the MSM is so cowed and intimidated by beheaded reporters and by knifed to death film-makers and authors on the wrong end of fatwas that they have simply adopted the Islamic line.

Or, it's possible that the MSM has simply been purchased by the Saudis and the media echos the Wahabist line for that reason.

It's very strange because one might have thought that the media would be the first to stand up for and to defend the First Amendment.

But, one might have made a similar incorrect guess as to how our feminists might have responded to women in burqas and to honor killings and to lack of drivers' licenses and so on.

In addition to cowardice and/or venality, it's also possible that the MSM and women are simply in denial - they do not want to or cannot accept the reality they helped create.

Perhaps some of them might consider voting next time for someone who spent twenty years in some church other than the one run by Reverend Wright.

Gary B| 9.24.12 @ 5:56PM

I think it's simpler. They're just anti-American, anti-Christian, anti-family, anti-self reliance, anti-personal responsibility and anti-freedom. And, to be all of that, you have to be a member of a weird cult with crazed, power-hungry leadership.

delahaya| 9.26.12 @ 9:17AM

We have to remember also that many of the current reporters were literally bought and funded through George Soros' Journalism project several years ago.

Bob From District 9| 9.24.12 @ 5:47PM

Mr Stein, you are an opportunistic hate filled liar.

Yet you are the one who feels such contempt for the 47%, and for the working class in Ameria.

Skippy| 9.24.12 @ 5:52PM

Hey, don't leave me out!
I loathe/pity the 47% too!

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 6:53PM

So you hate veterans and seniors? They make up the majority of that 47%. Good to know.

Intelligent Design| 9.24.12 @ 5:48PM

Islam is about the totalitarian merger of state and so-called "religion". Religious freedom is impossible and a "bill of rights" is impossible. Nothing could be more hostile to our Constitution, and freedom everywhere. Congress should identify Islam as a subversive political organization.

Muslims would do well to leave the 7th century and join the 21st by committing apostasy, but they will have to be brave since Islam's penalty for that is death. Islam is not a religion.

John II| 9.24.12 @ 6:06PM

Interesting posts, but I'd like to think about all this a tad more concretely, for starters.

1. Islam (not just the so-called "radical fringe"), when it's in charge, oppresses women, persecutes and kills homosexuals, discourages study of other cultures, forbids free speech, suppresses other religions, supports child abuse, perpetrates judicial torture, and violently restricts high culture.

2. That's only a partial list of depredations, but every item on that list is allegedly a preeminent concern of Western secular-left intellectuals and the attendant culture of airhead media types. When Christianity comes under fire from such people, Christians are accused of precisely the aforementioned depredations.

3. Yet Islam, which actually practices such depredations in faithful observance of its teachings, gets the warm-fuzzies from the Western secular-left chattering classes.

More below if anyone's reading . . .

John II| 9.24.12 @ 6:07PM

4. I think something deeper is going on here than
mere contradiction. And it begins in earnest in the 18th century with the rationalist so-called Enlightenment. (Compare Gibbon's treatment of Islam with his relentlessly hostile treatment of Christianity, and think about it.)

And now back to "The Message" (1977), in which the Syrian-American director Moustapha Akkad strains mightily to put a human face on Mohammed without violating the Islamic injunction against images of the Prophet. So Anthony Quinn plays Mohammed's uncle Hamza in the former's (I'm not making this up) hammy fashion. After a cheesy and failed epic, Akkad went on to do the "Halloween" series. In 2005, while scouting Jordan for the backdrop to a film epic about Saladin, he was murdered by . . . you guessed it: an Islamic terrorist.

C. Vernon Crisler | 9.24.12 @ 8:02PM

For the Left, "tolerance" is the prime principle. In their book, it's mainly White Anglo Saxon Protestants who contain the germ of intolerance, which threatens to break out into an epidemic of victimization, of racism, of Hitlerism, if not closely watched by the vigilant Left.

In their twisted view, Moslems are regarded as part of the victim class, and are seen as less of a danger than the closet Nazis or Fascists who supposedly want to defend the country against them.

The Left has elevated the principle of tolerance to such an absurd level that they have become intolerant themselves, and see no real danger from an intolerant religion like Islam.

delahaya| 9.26.12 @ 9:24AM

Leftists are Utopians. That is why their policies can fail time and again and they never stop them. Conservatives see the world as it is and try to do the best they can knowing nothing is perfect. Liberals see a perfect utopia in their minds that they accept as absolute truth, then strive to make reality conform to that vision.

Pablo| 9.26.12 @ 11:05AM

Failed liberal policies: social security, medicare, the 8 hour work day, banning child labor, etc. Failures all.

Successful republican policies: tax cuts for the rich and unending war. The tax cuts have resulted in the lowest effective tax rates for the ultra-rich in history, and as we can see, they're creating jobs hand over fist, right? The economy is the strongest it's ever been. And that never-ending war has brought about world peace, have made our country a symbol for justice and democracy, and have made Americans totally safe.

Amiright?

Abu Nudnik| 9.24.12 @ 6:31PM

I've been complaining about this behavior by news readers for years. Thank you!!!!

Thom| 9.24.12 @ 7:01PM

Ben, I think you getting worked up over nothing….. I have it on good authority that King Obama will announce he is converting to “Judaism” from being a “Christian” during some trivial Jewish celebration in October. That should solve several problems for “jews” and you alike. Perhaps you can invite him over for a Saturday service? He hasn’t seemed to make many “Christian” Sunday services over the last 4 years….

Don’t fret Ben, the lucky ones will be the ones that see the flash up close….

f111a| 9.24.12 @ 7:47PM

Apparently our incompetent State Department "stars", led by Mrs. Clinton, have little, if any, sense of history, and are largely ignorant of Islam's record of continual aggressive expansion over the past fourteen hundred years and the heroic efforts by Western Europeans that were required to stop them: 1) Charles Martel stops Islamic spread throughout Northern Europe at the Battle of Tours, 732 A.D.; 2) Ferdinand and Isabella halt the Moorish expansion through Spain in 1492, and 3) Jan Sobieski stops the Muslims cold at the gates of Vienna in 1683. There seems to be a trend and lesson here, even if there are centuries between: there simply is no realistic accommodation with Islam, then or now; in the end it's them or us. The sooner American leadership acknowledges this and acts, the easier it will be for our descendants. We're dealing, not with people of reason, but with a savage tribal system largely unchanged since the Seventh Century, and now they're about to have nukes along with their little Toyota pickups.

Pablo| 9.24.12 @ 8:20PM

What Muslim expansion has occurred in the last few hundred years? Anything? Perhaps Saddam's attack on Iran and invasion of Kuwait. But he was by no means a fundamentalist Muslim. More like a fascist ruling over a Muslim country, similar to fascists that have ruled over Christian and Socialist countries.

Meanwhile, there is one country that has invaded countless others in the past 100 years (and for the past 67 years, without even the cover of self-defense but simply as aggression), creating a death toll larger than that of any Muslim country invasions. Do you know which country that is? Don't you think a country with a far more recent (and current) history of aggression against other countries deserves more concern than nations that apparently gave that up hundreds of years ago?

Occam's Tool| 9.25.12 @ 9:12PM

Pablo, go fly away, little prancing butterfly. Spread cheek, pendejo, and welcome your islamic master.

delahaya| 9.26.12 @ 9:20AM

Pablo,

Your historical ignorance is astounding. EVERY country now Muslim was converted by force. Past 100 years? Oh yes, Germany, Japan, USSR, get it? The US is not the root of all evil in the world. Once you quit playing a "contrary for the sake of it" college brat and grow up then get back to us.

Pablo| 9.26.12 @ 11:01AM

You acede 2 facts: Muslim countries have not expanded through force in a very, very long time, and that in order to present the US as not the primary aggressor of the modern age, you need to refer to past ages (WW2 or the Cold War).

So, you've made my points. Now where do we go from here?

As you and I have demonstrated together, if international aggression is our problem, our focus should be the US over any Muslim country. There's nothing contrary about that, except it's contrary to the fact-free idiocy that plagues this country's least intelligent residents.

Brian Richard Allen | 9.24.12 @ 7:53PM

May the G-d of Israel keep you well and another hundred years of Life, Brother Stein. For I fear yours and Brother Steyn's and Sister Melanie's -- and mine -- are close to being Judeo-Christian/Western/Human Civilizational sanity's last living voices!

B A:. B) - L A - CA 90028 -- and The Very Far Away

Vasu Murti | 9.24.12 @ 10:26PM

Mohammed taught that Jews and Christians have been worshipping Allah under a different name. The Koran recognizes Adam, Noah, Abraham, Moses, John the Baptist, Jesus and other biblical personalities as genuine prophets through whom God spoke.

Whereas the Jewish people are said to be descended from Abraham through Isaac, Mohammed’s family lineage is traced to Abraham through the patriarch’s grandson Kedar, son of Ishmael (Genesis 25:13).

Muslims, however, regard Mohammed (570-632 AD) as the greatest and last (or "seal") of the prophets.

"We of Islam," Muslims will carefully point out, "are monotheists. People of one God, like the Jews. We honor Moses and Jesus as prophets. And we honor Mohammed as the final and greatest prophet. But we do not worship him. We worship only one God: Allah."

Many Muslims, too, are alarmed at the resurgence of Islamic fundamentalism sweeping the Middle East. In an interview before his assassination, Anwar Sadat, President of Egypt, pointed out that the brutality of the Khomeini regime in Iran could not be called true "Islam" any more than the Crusades or the Inquisition could be called genuine "Christianity."

The taking of hostages—especially diplomatic ones—is clearly forbidden in Islamic tradition. "I do not break treaties, nor do I make prisoners of envoys," Mohammed insisted. Many Muslims saw the taking of American hostages by Iran in 1979 as an embarrassment to Islam.

delahaya| 9.26.12 @ 9:22AM

So where is this embarrassed majority? Why is country and after country in the Middle East run by Islamic nutjobs? Why is every armed conflict around the world have Islamists at the heart of it? www.thereligionofpeace.com

Pierre Montagne| 9.25.12 @ 1:58AM

It is as if the editors beind the Journalists at Mainstream Media have had a Visit from CAIR or a Jihadist promising they and their families will be eliminated under a Fatwah if they publically question Islam and Islam's goals.
As if??? ....Maybe more likely.
Nothing else can really explain what Islam calls "dhimitude" or the subservience of the infidel.
Fear of Fear.
Jihad is a two way street - except when liberals make it one way calling terrorism "mere political expression".

PedrApWilliam| 9.25.12 @ 4:42AM

It's a big problem. The MSM has reporters in muslim majority countries and their lives would be in danger if they and their employers were not seen to be very sympathetic to the Islamic cause. Islam therefore gets the respect it does not dererve. This cannot be allowed to continue. What if muslims everywhere were asked "What evidence do you have that Mohammed's writings were divinely inspired?"

delahaya| 9.26.12 @ 9:14AM

Of course something is wrong. The GOP has not even tried to stop illegal immigration or further reform the welfare state. It may not even be demographically possible for a Republican to be elected President anymore.

Bill8472| 9.26.12 @ 3:41PM

I, for one, am quite well pleased that we have managed to develop a society that is so dedicated to cutting the obligation of so many people to pay income taxes to 53% of the taxpaying population. The fewer who have to pay income taxes, the better as far as I'm concerned.

But I don't want 47% of the taxable public avoiding income tax because other people are paying more than they should have to.

We must now focus on lowering the taxes of the 53%. Elect Romney!

JJ| 10.25.12 @ 2:46PM

Amen, Ben.

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