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The Spectacle Blog
As one of the first ones to start the ball rolling on critiques of Herman Cain’s 9-9-9 plan (even though I like it in a theoretical vacuum), I am obviously no shill for Cain. Still, in response to Joe’s post, it is worth noting that while Cain himself has not previously made clear that his plan contained an exemption for those below the poverty level, that exemption actually has been part of the plan as scored all along. In that sense, Phil Klein (cited by Joe) is wrong that this “change” would mean a loss of revenue, because the original scoring by the estimable Gary Robbins actually adjudged 9-9-9 as revenue neutral even WITH the exemption. To quote from Gary Robbins’ 10-page “scoring” analysis:
“Recognizing that relief for low income taxpayers will inevitably be part of any tax reform, we also estimate tax rates assuming that each plan will provide a refundable tax credit equal to the tax rate times the poverty level.” And later: “The aggregage poverty amount is just subtracted from the gross tax base for each proposal.”
So, again, this is nothing new; it’s just that Cain never made it clear before. I’m all for vetting the plan, and Mr. Cain, thoroughly, but I don’t want to criticize him for inconsistency or arithmetical problems when he’s actually remaining consistent with the same arithmetic as always.
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More Blog Posts by Quin Hillyer
http://spectator.org/blog/2011/10/21/9-0-9-plan-isnt-new
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Clint| 10.21.11 @ 4:07PM
Apparently, TARP Recipient Wells Fargo Division Employee Rich Lowrie Didn't Tell Cain What To Say About The Plan That Lowrie Wrote.
9-9-9, 9-0-9 Is Dead In The Water.
Conservative Will Not Allow Big Government To Have A National Sales Tax & An Income Tax.
Oldefarte| 10.21.11 @ 4:32PM
Low income taxpayers is an oxymoron of sorts, since said group pays no income taxes to begin with. Again, this '9' plan should be shelved, as our economic problems are essentially GOVERNMENTAL SPENDING/EXPENSE related, not REVENUE/TAX ones. It's insanely stupid to concentrate on the latter, when our defecit/debt demand attention by any/all supportable politicians. The little bit I've read about Paul's plan of governmental reduction makes entire sense to me, and I would only disagree with his brief time frame for accompolishing same. The federal government should be forced by taxpayers-voters to begin dismantling/eliminating entire departments for the governmental expense savings accompolished from same as of 1/1/13 when hopefully the new Republican administration takes control of our government!!!!!
Oldefarte| 10.22.11 @ 2:16PM
'......Ron Paul’s irresistible budget plan
By Bruce Fein 10:43 AM 10/20/2011
Republican presidential candidate Ron Paul’s proposed FY 2013 budget, which was released on Monday, slashes federal government extravagance by more than $1 trillion. The budget honors the vision of limited government and individual liberty enshrined by the Founding Fathers in the United States Constitution....Candidate Paul would freeze Department of Defense spending at approximately $500 billion annually, a sum vastly more than the military spending of any other nation. He would terminate the $200 billion squandered in objectless wars or the projection of military force abroad in Afghanistan, Pakistan, Iraq, Yemen, Uganda, Somalia and against any suspected adherent of al Qaida anywhere on the planet. .... The Paul budget would freeze spending by the State Department at a modest $7.9 billion. And tens of billions uselessly sprayed on foreign countries every year in vain hopes of winning their allegiance to United States interests over their own national interests would be ended. ....The Department of Energy would be abolished, yielding an annual savings of $34 billion. The Department of Commerce would be axed, netting an additional annual savings of $10 billion. The Department of Education would die, lowering annual federal government spending by more than $70 billion. The Department of Housing and Urban Development would be jettisoned, saving American taxpayers more than $46 billion per year. And the Department of Interior would be ended, which would cut annual federal spending by an additional $12 billion.None of these five departments plausibly advances a legitimate constitutional objective of the federal government. The Department of Energy obstructs a rational energy market by skewing incentives to favor so-called “green” technologies. The department’s Solyndra debacle is emblematic. The Department of Commerce does nothing the private sector can’t do with greater efficiency. The Department of Education has presided over a frightening decline in student achievement as its spending has ballooned. The Department of Housing and Urban Development has given the nation less net housing and development than it would have had without federal government meddling. The demolition of the federally funded Pruitt-Igoe public housing project symbolizes HUD’s staggering economic waste. The Department of Interior is largely engaged in land management that should be left to the private sector. ..... All current Social Security benefit promises would be honored, but youth would be afforded an opportunity to opt out of the system and assume responsibility for creating “rainy day” funds tailored to their unique circumstances. To encourage private savings, the Paul budget would end taxation of personal savings accounts. Private enterprise would be equally boosted by slashing the corporate tax rate to 15%.
Ron Paul’s budget is lean, muscular and achievable without pinching the American people. It aims to reduce federal expenditures to 15.5% of GNP — a figure that was obtained in the early 1950s without engendering economic misery......'
Politicalgal1| 10.21.11 @ 4:52PM
What Cain hasn't addressed is the new sales tax of 9 percent on purchases of gas, food, and other services by seniors living on fixed incomes and other low income earners. What is next? Possibly an ID card issued that says "I am poor and exempt from federal sales tax?"
SpiralArchitect| 10.21.11 @ 7:39PM
No problems with electing someone that has to date delivered on one campaign promise?
- no, getting the dog was not the one promise...
...neither was 'hope & change' nor transparency.
I was going to jsut start listen the unkept promisses & considered it much more effecient to provide a link, one of many, showing all the lies smeared accross the public in Zero's bid for office:
http://liambean.hubpages.com/h.....s-Not-Kept
Want more? Just google...
Simon Templar| 10.21.11 @ 11:26PM
How about going out and reading it yourself before writing about? You would not be a shill just a more effective journalist.
Maybe you could tell me just how he was suppose to address it in the detail you were looking for within a 10 second window or on a national debate where he got no more than 3o seconds and had to answer the questions constructed and thrown at him, and the others, by smarmy political hacks only interested in starting a fight among the candidates?
aware| 10.22.11 @ 6:57AM
It proves Cain either has not thought this through or he isn't much of a thinker to start with. I think the latter. And to have "conservatives" defend the State taking 25% of GDP annually just to "fund" government(revenue neutral) shows what a muddled confusion conservatism has become.
With the millstone of government sitting on the economy's chest it's a wonder it can even wiggle its arms and legs. Instead of advocating cutting government and taxes, now "conservatives" are just rearranging how the same amount can be confiscated. How far the goalposts have moved.
Quin| 10.22.11 @ 10:19AM
I did read it myself. It appears I was the only one. Nobody else reported it; everybody else treated it as new.
I never said he was supposed to have said it before. I just said that because he had NOT done so, it explains why other journalists didn't know about it. But I had already known it, because I read the whole 10-page "scoring" paper more than a week ago.
I don't get it: What's your beef, dude?
Minuteman78| 10.22.11 @ 7:05AM
Bravo, Templar, for channeling Mr. Gingrich!
I could not have put it better & I'd give my front row seat in hell to see one of the candidates just walk over and punch one of those liberal talking meatheads right in the mouth. At least Herman Cain HAS a plan. All Obozo can come up with is hope (of which 70% of America has none), change (changing America from prosperity to depression), and sticking the taxpayers with a big bill for his vacations.
Clint| 10.22.11 @ 5:06PM
Sooooo, If Ya Ain't In Cain's Opportunity Zones Then,
" The business portion of Cain’s plan apparently does not allow employers to deduct wages and salaries, which means — for all intents and purposes — that they would levy a 9 percent withholding tax on employee compensation. And that would be in addition to the 9 percent they presumably would withhold for the flat tax portion of Cain’s plan.
Employers use withholding in the current system, of course, but at least taxpayers are given credit for all that withheld tax when filling out their 1040 tax forms. Under Cain’s 9-9-9 plan, however, employees would only get credit for monies withheld for the flat tax.
In other words, there are two income taxes in Cain’s plan — the 9 percent flat tax and the hidden 9 percent income tax that is part of the VAT (this hidden income tax on wages and salaries, by the way, is a defining feature of a VAT)."
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