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The Spectacle Blog
As a Patriots fan, I couldn't have asked for a better Super Bowl than last night's: well played, close, hard-hitting, and ending with the perennially overrated Peyton Manning throwing a deliciously inexcusable pick six.
I was overjoyed with the return of the Manning Face because, unlike Phil, I didn't think before the game that Manning belonged anywhere near the discussion about best quarterbacks ever. I think it's pretty obvious that he isn't even the best quarterback in the league today, and I was glad to see my beliefs reinforced.
Look at Manning's line from the game:
|
|
C/ATT | YDS | AVG | TD | INT | RATING |
| P. Manning | 31/45 | 333 | 7.4 | 1 | 1 | 88.5 |
And compare to Tom Brady's line from a similar game, his Patriots' 2007 upset at the hands of the New York Giants:
|
|
C/ATT | YDS | AVG | TD | INT | RATING |
| T. Brady | 29/48 | 266 | 5.5 | 1 | 0 | 82.5* |
Those box scores are fairly similar, except that Manning threw for more yards and also had a terrible, game-losing pick six.
But QB lines only tell half the story. QBs have to play with teammates and against defenses. Famously, in the 2007 Super Bowl Brady was sacked five times, was knocked down many more, and faced constant pressure from Osi Umenyiora, Justin Tuck, and Michael Strahan -- all great pass rushers having the best game of their lives. Last night, conversely, Manning was not sacked once, and only knocked down three times, none of them hard. I can't remember the last time I watched a football game where the QB wasn't sacked at least once.
So if you want to talk about the best QB ever or the best QB playing, let's start with those two games. Biggest stage possible, both QB's trying to cement their reputations, both losing against underdogs. Brady faced incredibly tough pressure and managed to engineer a late game drive. Manning faced no pressure at all and choked.
Now consider that Brady already had all the single-season passing records, not to mention three Super Bowl rings.
I think that Phil accidentally led into a larger point about comparing QBs when he wrote "But as far as I'm concerned, if I was going into the big game and could choose one quarterback, I'd still choose Joe Montana in his prime over Manning in a heart beat."
Having made the point that Manning's success is attributable in large part to his offensive line's success against the opposing team's pass rushers (which I would argue has been the case over Manning's whole career), I think it's easy to extend that argument to Joe Montana's success.
Montana is actually the example Michael Lewis used in his book The Blind Side to make a point that I'm amazed has not had a bigger impact on football. Lewis really was trying to do for football what he did for baseball with Moneyball -- inject some stats into the prevailing folklore-style modes of analysis. Instead, the book turned out to be interpreted as an inspiration story and tailor-made Hollywood plot.
Joe Montana obviously was a great QB in both the NFL and college (and bear in mind that while I'm biased against Manning, as a Notre Dame fan I'm biased for Montana). Is it a coincidence, though, that his replacement for the 49ers, Steve Young, was also wildly successful immediately upon succeeding Montana, and is now considered another of the all-time greats?
In The Blind Side, Lewis makes a convincing case that lightning didn't strike the '80s 49ers twice. Instead, much of both Montana's and Young's success can be explained by the excellent offensive lines that both played behind, and the implementation of the West Coast offense. Lewis presents the evidence that the most important indicator of a QB's success -- which Bill Walsh understood at some level -- was the time between the snap and when a rusher got to the QB. All of the other factors, like the many nebulous virtues assumed of successful QBs, are distant seconds.
Bottom line: don't ask me to be amazed at a QB like Manning who puts up amazing numbers behind great O-lines. Brady did much more with significantly inferior O-lines. What I am amazed at is Manning's refound ability to squander his advantages in big games.
UPDATE:
I see that Jim, a fellow Pats fan, has managed to write a much less partisan judgment of Manning's relative status. His point is that Drew Brees deserves to be in the discussion of best QB in the NFL right now. I agree. He had the best season by far, in my book. And the ring has to count for something.
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More Blog Posts by Joseph Lawler
http://spectator.org/blog/2010/02/08/peyton-mannings-super-bowl
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Pete| 2.8.10 @ 1:24PM
Give me a break. I am no Colts fan but Manning is twice the QB that Brady is. After all, "it's easy to be cunning, when you know what play is coming..." At the end of the day, however, in the post-cheating era (past 3 years), what we plainly have in terms of similarities is two AFC teams who choked against inferior NFC competition.
WJ| 2.8.10 @ 2:14PM
You must be a lame stream "journalist" as you left out key information in your comparison between Manning and Brady.
1) What happened after Brady went down for the season, the Patriots collapsed that season right? Wait a second, a QB who hadn't started since high school led the Patriots to a double digit win season.
2) Regarding Manning, is there any QB in the NFL since Unitas who is as much of play caller, absolute leader of the offense?
Manning threw a pick six, no doubt about it. However, that was a team Colt loss (dropped passes, not going for it on 4th down and trying a too long field goal, not letting Manning try a few passes before halftime and then maybe run out the clock) and a very impressive Saints played game.
Gutsy on-side kick that was recovered. Brees really on target. Great offensive line blocking. A kicker who hit 3 40+ yard field goals in the Super Bowl.
I would take Manning over Brady all the time, and Montana over both of them.
joetheplumber| 2.8.10 @ 3:41PM
Manning sucks. All the QB`s are over-rated, over protected and over avertised. The problem is the media wants to grade the athletes by who's the nicest and not by who is the best player. Chris Johnson was this years League MVP being only the sixth player in NFL history to rush for over 2000yds. Johnson didn't get one vote. When Manning broke the single TD record he won. 4 MVP's and 1 ring. They baby him and thats the reason he choked.
Crusader| 2.8.10 @ 4:56PM
Brady is overrated as hell. When he doesn't know what play the defense is running, well, is it a coincidence that since "Spygate" NE hasn't won a SB?
Pat Clemens| 2.8.10 @ 5:01PM
You've got to be kidding me! You Pats fans will throw every rationalization to mitigate the guilt of Spy-Gate which, in the wake of, your team has accomplished nothing. Manning, who is better than every other player in the league, served up a bad pick that cost them the game. Tough break. That he hasn’t played for an ethically bankrupt coach his entire career, like Brady, is reason enough why he only has one ring. And that he won his on the up-n-up, unlike Brady's Pats, is - unfortunately for Brady - going to throw popular opinion his way for the balance of their careers. If Pats fans wish to wash the away the taint of their team’s Super Bowl wins, they should throw Belichick in the Pool of Lourdes after the team fires him.
Occam's Tool| 2.8.10 @ 7:09PM
The Colts showed disrespect to the game by not playing for a perfect season when they could have had one. They deserved their loss karmically.
astorian| 2.9.10 @ 11:48AM
Up front, I’m a Giants fan. I don’t have much use for the Patriots, but think Bill Belichick is a magnificent coach, and have never understood why he wasn’t the Giants’ clear choice to replace Bill Parcells (Ray Handley?????).
Is Tom Brady a superb quarterback? Of course. Is he a Hall of Ffamer already? Sure. Would I replace Eli Manning with Brady in a heartbeat? Obviously! But the fact remains, Brady HASN’T been the cool, unflappable, mistake-free, clutch player he’s reputed to be! He's made huge mistakes in big games at least as often as Peyton Manning has.
Want proof? Look at the record:
1) “Tuck Rule,” my foot. He FUMBLED away the ball against the Raiders, at the worst possible moment. Brady knew better than anyone that it was a fumble (you’ll recall HE never tried to tell the officials it was an incomplete pass). The refs gave him a second chance, and he took full advantage. Good for him. But don’t pretend he didn’t cough up the ball. Even Brady knows how lucky he was.
2) In the snowy AFC finals against the Colts, Brady had a chance to deliver a knockout blow- instead, he threw a dumb interception into the end zone, giving the Colts new life. He was LUCKY the Colts couldn’t take advantage.
3) In the Super Bowl against the Carolina Panthers, Brady had a chance to put the game on ice. Instead, he threw an unforgivably dumb interception right into the end zone, giving the Panthers a chance to take the lead. Give Brady credit for staging a big comeback to win the game, sure, but don’t forget that it was HIS blunder that made a miracle finish necessary in the first place.
I repeat: Brady IS a great quarterback. But do you see what a fine line it is between “clutch player” and “choker”? WHAT IF the refs had called “fumble” rather than incomplete pass? WHAT IF Peyton Manning had been able to capitalize on that dumb interception? WHAT IF Adam Vinatieri’s game winning kick against the Panthers had gone wide?
If those things had happened, Brady would NOT be seen as a hero by New England fans. He’d be regarded as a choker who “always finds a way to screw up in big games.”
That wouldn’t be accurate or fair, but that’s what would happen.
Derek Leaberry| 2.9.10 @ 3:19PM
Peyton Manning is one of the greats of the game but he certainly was outplayed by Drew Brees Sunday night. Otherwise, the Colts were significantly outcoached by Sean Peyton and the Saints staff. Brees picked apart the Colts defense, the Colts never adjusting to Brees' mastery. The Colts pass rush was next to negligible and the failure of the Colts staff to blitz is hard to fathom. Given that the Saints have a mediocre ground game, the Colts should have teed off on Brees. Top coaches can alter their game plans when circumstances change. The Colts coaching staff was not up to the task.
Kudos to the Saints offensive line. The played big.
Claiming that Brady is "overrated" and Manning "sucks" is pretty childish. Along with Brees, they are the dominant quarterbacks of their era.
Derek Leaberry| 2.9.10 @ 3:21PM
Add Bret Favre to the Manning, Brees, Brady listing.
Brian Graber| 2.16.10 @ 9:15AM
Brees has out played Manning more than just in this Superbowl. It is high time Drew was inserted into these discussions on who is the best QB. Steve Young gets it and he called Brees elite . Brees is younger and has time but IMO he is already there. He just eclipsed Tom Brady's superbowl completion record as well as set the new season completion record. He also was dangerously close to Marino's record last season. He has just as many Superbowl Victories as Manning even though he has only been to the playoffs half as many times as Manning.
Pingback| 2.15.10 @ 3:26PM
The American Spectator : AmSpecBlog : Peyton Manning's Super Bowl | Football Pro Spor links to this page. Here’s an excerpt:
Pingback| 2.16.10 @ 2:01PM
Super Bowl Lessons for the Right, Part II: Don’t Look to the Candidate, Look to Yours links to this page. Here’s an excerpt:
mili8951| 5.8.10 @ 1:52AM
http://www.edhardycawholesale.com/