The American Spectator : The Spectacle Blog : Pat Robertson and Haiti

Patriot| 1.13.10 @ 3:41PM

I like Pat Robertson, but his big mouth and intemperate language have shocked me more than once. His timing is terrible and there's nothing 'christian' about his cruel remarks.

Shame on him.

Liberal Reader| 1.13.10 @ 3:59PM

Then is it fair to say you dislike him, Patriot?

Patriot| 1.13.10 @ 4:33PM

Not as much as I dislike you.

Alan Brooks| 1.14.10 @ 10:06AM

Pat Robertson is fine-- even if he isn't Catholic.

Alan Brooks| 1.14.10 @ 10:09AM

... nowadays, I'll accept ANY Christian.

If God accepts them, then that person is okay by me.

Flee| 1.13.10 @ 3:47PM

Haiti is vastly Catholic in faith. Why would he think fellow Christians are cursed for a political choice? Better to keep ones mouth closed and ...we know the rest.

Margie| 1.13.10 @ 3:52PM

If God really did repay in this tit-for-tat way, who could possibly stand?
~"If thou, O LORD, shouldst mark iniquities, Lord, who could stand? But there is forgiveness with thee, that thou mayest be feared." Ps. 130:3&4.

Alan Brooks| 1.14.10 @ 10:07AM

Margie,
"no one knows the day, no one knows the hour.''

of the Return

Rod Miller-Boyer| 1.13.10 @ 3:54PM

Dear Pat --

It is on your account that the name of God is blasphemed among the pagans.

BD57| 1.13.10 @ 3:57PM

Pat:

Seems to me God settled this argument ("bad things are always punishment from God") way back in the beginning .... please review the Book of Job again, OK?

Mike| 1.13.10 @ 11:01PM

hey moron- why don't you flip to the page where it says go F yourself. a hole.

old white guy| 1.14.10 @ 7:45AM

very clever mike.

Janice| 1.14.10 @ 12:37PM

Hey, Mike--hate the message not the messenger.

Conscience bothering you much?

Liberal Reader| 1.13.10 @ 3:58PM

Pat Robertson is a fool. I've never heard him say anything sensible, interesting, or wise. The notion that he's some sort of spiritual leader is absolutely chilling. The credulous and the sick and homebound who turn to him for comfort are to be pitied, but please, let's give this man no more attention than he deserves. What a fraud!

Patriot| 1.13.10 @ 4:34PM

Robertson is better than your Marxist gods.

Steve J. | 1.14.10 @ 2:14AM

There aren't any "Marxist gods." In fact, there are no gods at all.

Janice| 1.14.10 @ 12:40PM

I beg to differ: Liberals bow before the gods of power and control--and licentiousness.

roger donaldson| 1.13.10 @ 4:21PM

Pat Robertson is becoming a False Prophet of the endtimes... beware who you trust. In fact, you can probably NOT trust anyone who sells their faith on television. Jesus flipped tables at the synagogue over less than what people like Pat Robertson have done to Christianity. "HE will come like a thief in the night."

ncatty| 1.13.10 @ 4:28PM

The reports indicate that the destruction is widespread. And that was before the earthquake. What an unfortunate country.

Margie| 1.13.10 @ 4:41PM

Is that supposed to be funny? Because it's not.

Andrew Ian Dodge | 1.13.10 @ 4:32PM

Not exactly the first time he has said this sort of thing. Remember his post 9/11 comments about the US and how it deserved it because of gays et al?

Patriot| 1.13.10 @ 4:42PM

I think Robertson meant that God had withdrawn His protection from us because we had broken our covenant with Him. I believe Robertson cited rampant abortion and homosexuality as two examples of our transagressions.

I didn't disagree with that statement.

Liberal Reader| 1.13.10 @ 6:29PM

Idiot.

3,000 Americans were murdered because of homosexuality?

Next you'll chime in with those who blamed Hurricane Katrina on a gay pride parade.

Someone on this thread wisely recommended that Robertson go back and read the Book of Job.

All of us should. Human beings suffer terrible misfortunes for reasons that baffle the mind. It is natural to want to understand why, but to give in to the temptation to ascribe facile causes -- e.g. homosexuality caused 9.11 -- is just weak and contemptible.

The Brits had a saying during WWII when their country was being terrorized by German bombs:

Stay Calm; Carry On.

If I could get Americans to adopt any saying for these times, it would be this one. Stay Calm, Carry On!

Patriot| 1.13.10 @ 6:58PM

That's not what I said, Stupid; and if you'd get your head out of your Marxist rear-end, you'd understand. I didn't say anybody DESERVED anything.

I said I agreed with Robertson's belief that our sinful actions broke a covenant with God which led to God's withdrawal of His protection of our nation.

I still agree with it--as is my right. I also have the right of Freedom of Speech, to which Marxists like you object.

That's precisely why I detest liberals like you: You Cultural Marxists believe in 'Freedom of Speech for me but not for thee'.

Arrogant toad.

Liberal Reader| 1.13.10 @ 7:05PM

Ass. When did I deny you had the right to your crackpot ideas?

You can believe and affirm any nonsense you like.

You can worship whom you choose in any way you see fit; you can believe what you want about the Bible, even if you insist upon not reading it properly. It's a free country!

Now clearly you introduced the idea that somehow I objected to your right to agree with Robertson's nonsense in order to distract from an argument you cannot win.

Why don't you try responding to the points I actually make?

Patriot| 1.13.10 @ 10:13PM

You don't have any points, moron--you just put words in my mouth. Nice 'debating' technique.

I am stating my opinion, and last time I checked, this is still a free country and I am still entitled to my opinion. Got it, little Fuhrer?

November 2, 2010 can't come soon enough.

Dixie Pixie| 1.13.10 @ 4:44PM

The people of Haiti have my sympathy for their loss during the earthquake.
That island has certainly had more than its share of troubles.

But I still have a question that pops up whenever the subject of Haiti comes up.
Why is it everyone will consider any other fantasy, illusion, delusion or deception to keep from considering the people of Haiti might be part of the Haitian problems. Everyone and I mean everyone avoids even considering the Haitian population is screwed up in some way. In short how is it one half of the island easily recovers from a natural disaster but the other half is permanently screwed up.

At the very lest the Haitians should rebuild hurricane and earthquake buildings.

Margie| 1.13.10 @ 4:56PM

How about considering the fact that the Haitians have been under despotic leaderships and the people are too poor to help themselves, and need help?

I was with a Christian organization that has been in Haiti (3 orphanages including schooling) since the mid 70's. The Haitians are a willing and humble people and have thrived with their help. The children are starving and the Parents have to watch them die. They have raised hundreds of the children and taught them how to become good citizens. I am afraid that these good people are probably affected as I think one of the orphanages was in Petionville, and I don't know if the orphanages with the children have survived.
Pray for them, please, and for the country.

Margie| 1.13.10 @ 5:10PM

http://www.cbuhaiti.org/MountainFeedings.htm

Dixie Pixie| 1.13.10 @ 5:27PM

Hello Margie
I am glad to hear from the Graceful Slayer of Internet Trolls.

Consider the following. The Japanese just after the Waring States Period was even more wretched and oppressed than the Haitians were after the French Colonial Period. Yet the Japanese recovered to become the second largest economy. The Haitians seem to have sunk below the standards of a slave culture.

Poverty does not seem to be a rational explanation. The USA has sent troops many times to eliminate political oppression. Yet the Haitians never grow as a nation.

Oh Graceful Lady, My questions are simple.

What are the cultural / political / economic factors which explain why the Haitian fell and the Japanese rose.
Is it what troubles the people of Haiti is the people of Haiti?

Margie| 1.13.10 @ 6:27PM

Hi Dixie!
Thanks for your kindness. Sorry I took it the wrong way the other day.. after being called a Bimbo, amongst other degrading insults.. I couldn't tell where you were coming from.. it's not clear sometimes when you're not talking face to face.
About Haiti~ (I'm late in getting back to you, as my browser keeps getting rid of my posts so I have to shut down. etc...) Your question about why Japan prospered. Well, was Japan's people under a dictator or did they have a good leader who allowed them to prosper? I honestly don't know but that would explain it. Haiti hasn't had much of that but has had a lot of despotic dictators where the leaders have all the wealth. You know the story. It's beginning here now under Obama.
I haven't spoken to my old friends there in a while but perhaps I'll call them to see if they are alright and ask that question..

Dixie Pixie| 1.13.10 @ 9:54PM

Hi Margie
Not a problem about yesterday.
Stuff happens on the wild TAS thread frontier.

I am not a Japanese historian so your questions about the Sengohu Jidai period and the rise of Japan is best directed to someone knowable in Japanese history or a expert in cross cultural analysis. Maybe there is someone on the thread who is both knowable and can give a brief explanation? If not there is always “Bob Of The Cacophonous Funnel Head”.

After looking through my modest library, I came up with David S Landes “The Wealth and Poverty of Nations” In it he suggest the major factor in eliminating poverty is implementing the tenets of the Industrial Revolution. This seems reasonable as the island was split between the British and French half's. It was French which not only resisted the tenets of the Industrial Revolution but actively suppressed colonial industrialization. If so, the Haitians are out of luck as the Liberals are on a deindustrialization warpath. The really sad part is the Liberals want us to live more like Haitians than the Haitians living like Americans. I pray your friends can turn the situation around.

Stay strong Graceful Lady and I wish you the Best Of Luck.
Hammer a Internet Troll for me.

Margie| 1.13.10 @ 10:30PM

LOL.. (I know, I said LOL) I didn't know you were talking about sooo far back.. I thought you meant after WWII. That's when we beat the Japs back into the stone age.. after that they wanted to rebuild, and they wanted our help to rebuild, and their emperor and their government wanted our help. Haiti hasn't had that..
~anyhow thanks for the best wishes.. btw, hubby tells me it's Sears Craftsman sale time, perfect for picking up a troll size hammer and nailing your own troll. I think Sears carries troll hammers.

Dixie Pixie| 1.13.10 @ 11:13PM

Greetings Margie
Oh Graceful Slayer of Internet Trolls.

There is considerable debate among the “Dungeons and Dragons” groups on which weapon works best on Trolls. Personally I have found a 20 pound wood maul works best. ( I have two.) But for Internet Trolls a keyboard is the more suitable tool.

Also I think the idea that the French Socialism is the cause of Haiti's long term problems and not the Robertson theory is the more reasonable assumption. At the very least expunging socialism from Haiti is a worthwhile goal.

Keep up the Good Work, Oh Good and Graceful Lady.

Franklin| 1.13.10 @ 10:44PM

What a pleasure to read such civilized posts!

I have volunteered for Kids Against Hunger, http://www.kidsagainsthunger.org/ , and Feed My Starving Children, http://www.fmsc.org/Page.aspx?pid=398 .

One of the last times we saw a vide0 from Haiti where they showed Mothers making and feeding their children "dirt cookies". Yes, main ingredient is real dirt. I think they must mix a bit of flour, but the kids are at least comforted with something in their stomachs.

Dirt.

God, please melt the hearts of the insensitive and open the eyes of those who do not know.

Tammy| 1.13.10 @ 11:09PM

Please, God, let Your light fill the souls of those who transgress against You so that they might see the error of their ways.

We can all do better.

Le Cracquere| 1.13.10 @ 4:46PM

I didn't know about the story, but as soon as I saw the "Pat Robertson and Haiti" tag, my heart sank. Not again... [click] ...yep, again. Blast it, Pat.

Derek Leaberry| 1.13.10 @ 4:56PM

Robertson is the King Lear of the fundamentalist movement. To be charitable, he is probably flirting with senility. I can only pray for the sad people of Haiti.

Margie| 1.13.10 @ 4:59PM

I won't allow your snide remark, as you say "the fundamentalist" movement. If you are trying to insult Christians, you have done excellently.

Liberal Reader| 1.13.10 @ 6:30PM

Would that Robertson had grown wise before he grew old.

Patriot| 1.13.10 @ 7:03PM

Like you'd know anything about wisdom; talk about a fool.

Margie| 1.13.10 @ 7:20PM

Don't infer that what I said meant something derogatory toward Robertson. I don't know how God looks at him, and it's none of my business. My comment was toward Derek's tricky little snipe at the "fundamentalists".. as he knows we are Christians, and not his Religion.
And stop taking swipes at Patriot. He's on the right side.

mr | 1.13.10 @ 11:04PM

100,000 people are dead. God doesn't exist.

Tammy| 1.13.10 @ 11:11PM

Sometimes bad things happen, it's juvenile to blame God.

maryvonne| 1.14.10 @ 12:33PM

mr, mon ami,
je t'ai connu quand tu avais la fois en Jesus. Il y a beaucoup d'annees, je sais. Et il y a beaucoup de choses qui nous arrive. Et il y a toujours les mysteres de la Foi, mais ces chose ne changent pas l'existence de Dieu. Jesus disait, qu'il ne venait pas au monde pour la condemnation mais pour la salvation pas pour ce monde qui va passer, mais pour le monde eternele. Souviens-toi, "je louerai l'Eternel...je ferais de Toi le sujet de moi joie, alleluia." Nos yeux ne restent pas, nos joies ne restent pas sur ce monde, le bon ou l'horrible, mais sur Lui, qui venait de nous donner la vie eternele.
avec tout mon bonnes memoires de nos jours ensemble, maryvonne.

Janice| 1.14.10 @ 12:42PM

Thanks for that.

Pat| 1.13.10 @ 5:10PM

Even if such a story is true about a pact with the devil is true.do we condemm their desendants many hundreds of years later. Sounds like a White Man speaking to me. I am white and these kind of statements to me make me sick. Christ never meant for one man to bring down a race and condemn them for something done without their knowledge or consent. Most on the island are Catholic, perhaps that is the bigger sin for Robertson. .

Jesus must weep when he reads this kinds of statements said in his name.

God has no room in his house for Pat Robertson or anyone else who profits from others misery. How does he know what God's will is? I am sick when I hear of this man and his remarks. He makes all good Christains winch in pain. Pain for one of God's creatures means pain for all. He is very very wrong and should be roundly critized for his remarks.

Patriot| 1.13.10 @ 5:31PM

Isaiah 14:21--"Prepare a place to slaughter his sons for the sins of their forefathers; they are not to rise to inherit the land and cover the earth with their cities."

Liberal Reader| 1.13.10 @ 6:31PM

Patriot --

Fool. Surely you know better than to read the Bible in snippets.

Patriot| 1.13.10 @ 7:00PM

I take no counsel from a Marxist b@stard like you.

Richard Baker| 1.13.10 @ 5:16PM

Well, since Voodoo is a very popular "religion" in Haiti, then he may be correct. Regardless, his organizations' Operation Blessing will have a part in the recovery. The people who believe God has a connection to the affairs of man and those who don't believe will just have to hold fast and wait for the End and we'll see what happens. Unfortunately, Haiti was a disaster before the quake and will remain one after. Sadly, the same people there who have been robbing that nation in the past will continue to do so regardless of how much aid is injected. That is, ultimately, the greater tragedy.

Robert| 1.13.10 @ 5:18PM

If Pat Robertson has historical evidence, he should bring it forth.

Rob| 1.13.10 @ 5:34PM

Certainly Robertson has some proof to back this claim up? Otherwise, wouldn't this be essentially "Bearing False Witness"?

I have a feeling that God will want to have a word with Roberson when he shows up on Judgment Day as little children were suffering and dying in Haiti - Robertson was essentially blaming the victims of this natural disaster.

Patriot| 1.13.10 @ 6:03PM

I'm sure Robertson's group, Operation Blessing, is already in Haiti helping those in need. He's a good man who has helped many thousands of the suffering around the world.

I just wish he would use more temperate language.

Franklin| 1.13.10 @ 10:54PM

Rob,

He's going to have a word with us all.

I do wish that he hadn't made that comment. The world hates Christians enough as is. We don't need another wacky sounding comment like this (or the 9-11 comment).

HOWEVER, do any of us know the full context of what he said? You know how all media (yes...ALL) hypes sensation.

For me, I prayed for Robertson as well as all the souls in Haiti.

Richard Baker| 1.13.10 @ 6:02PM

Some of you folks really should read the Bible if you're going to deride Pat's comments. The Lord is fairly uncompromising regarding sin. The wages of sin is death, Romans 6:23. Last I checked sin was sin in God's eyes or should that be negotiable in the Modern World?

Margie| 1.13.10 @ 6:21PM

Richard,
Do you read the Bible? You left off the second half of that verse! It says in full: "For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord." Rms. 6:23.
~There's rather huge "but" in that verse, and without it we would all have no hope.
Because this happened doesn't mean everyone in Haiti is evil.. if that's your implication.

Liberal Reader| 1.13.10 @ 6:32PM

I hate to say it, but I'm obliged. Nicely done, Margie.

Patriot| 1.13.10 @ 7:01PM

I'm sure you just made Margie's day, clown.

BD57| 1.13.10 @ 6:23PM

"Now there were some present at that time who told Jesus about the Galileans whose blood Pilate had mixed with their sacrifices. Jesus answered, "Do you think that these Galileans were worse sinners than all the other Galileans because they suffered this way? I tell you, no! But unless you repent, you too will all perish. Or those eighteen who died when the tower in Siloam fell on them—do you think they were more guilty than all the others living in Jerusalem? 5I tell you, no! But unless you repent, you too will all perish."

Margie| 1.13.10 @ 6:37PM

Perish meaning in the final sense.. perish meaning you go to Hell. That's why Rmns. 6:23, above is so hopeful. We are sinners but by God's Grace can repent and be saved. So that no matter WHAT situation we happen to be in when death comes, whether it be an earthquake or a car crash or whatever, we will go to be with Him. So it on NO way means that because this happened that ALL were being judged as having to "perish" in the final sense.
This is what it means to be ready.. prepared inwardly, when death dooes come. Make sure our hearts are right with Him.

Patriot| 1.13.10 @ 6:11PM

The Lord has a right to be uncompromising, Robertson doesn't. What Godly purpose did it serve for Robertson to heap scorn on those suffering and dying right now?

I don't think Jesus Christ would have done that, do you?

Archie B.| 1.13.10 @ 7:11PM

It's time real Americans see that Haiti made a pact with the Devil just like America did by allowing homosexuality. Taxes are tools of the Devil, and so is schools and the lamestream media. You woke the sleeping dragon. Palin / Beck '12!

Bugler| 1.13.10 @ 8:12PM

[ Begin Twilight Zone theme NOW]

Patriot| 1.13.10 @ 10:17PM

Are you kidding? The Twilight Zone theme song has been blaring since Obama was elected.

I keep hoping this democrat nightmare will end and I will wake up. November 2, 2010 will end this nightmare. Hopefully.

Richard Baker| 1.13.10 @ 9:08PM

Margie:
I knew that my leaving the second half of Romans 6:23 would engender a question. For the sake of brevity and to illustrate a point I used the first half. It does makes a point that is found throughout the Bible. No implication. I'll be clearer then. Haiti is possessed by Voodoo, witchcraft, and the occult. That is distilled sin by any measure. God tells us throughout the Bible that engaging in this sort of thing will have consequences. No mystery there.

Franklin| 1.13.10 @ 11:16PM

Mr. Baker,

Sin is sin. Is Voodoo worse than lying?

Don't yell, I'm just making a point.

Point is - we aren't God. He can overcome any consequence of sin...it's called a "miracle" by us. It's called "grace" by God.

Notice I said He CAN overcome ... He doesn't usually, but He can. He knows more than we do.

I'm also not saying we should ignore the sin of Haiti, Africa, our neighbors or ourselves. We need to talk to God first to find out what He wants us to do: pray, talk or confront.

Let God be Lord of your life. He's better at it.

Janice| 1.14.10 @ 12:44PM

Hate to burst your bubble, but voodoo is certainly worse than lying. Equivalency is absurd.

Franklin| 1.14.10 @ 8:34PM

God says that sin is a condition of our heart that rejects Him as Lord. Voodoo and lying are the same thing to God - choosing evil and rejecting Him.

Of course, here on Earth, the ramifications of sin are not equal. In our culture killing a person is much worse than cheating on your taxes.

Society changes; God does not.

Janice| 1.15.10 @ 2:02AM

True, but since we're living on this earth, it's wise to discern the difference beween bad and evil.

Franklin| 1.16.10 @ 12:02AM

Agreed!

Janice| 1.16.10 @ 8:00PM

I'm glad. You sound like such a nice person. :)

Richard Baker| 1.13.10 @ 9:12PM

Margie:
As a Catholic, I look at the weird blend of animism and Catholicism practiced in Africa and note that many of those countries are little better off than Haiti. One can't just dip one's toe in evil and not have strange and evil actions occur. This will eventually happen here unless we heed 2 Chronicles 7:14.

Patriot| 1.13.10 @ 10:30PM

I agree; too bad the hedonistic liberals among us don't.

Pingback| 1.13.10 @ 9:26PM

Twitter Trackbacks for The American Spectator : AmSpecBlog : Pat Robertson and Haiti links to this page. Here’s an excerpt:

…WordPress Web Sites 3 Shortened Links Linking to the spectator.org page http://bit.ly/6cjLxB info http://bit.ly/53mehW info http://bit.ly/8ZHyjQ info 6 tweets tweet The American Spectator : AmSpecBlog : Pat Robertson and Haiti spectator.org/blog/2010/01/13/pat-robertson-and-haiti – view page – cached It has been reported on places like Drudge and elsewhere, that Pat Robertson said the…

Margie| 1.13.10 @ 9:38PM

Matthew 24 says that there will be earthquakes in many and various places, along with major tribulation before Christ's 2nd coming. We all need to fear God and get on our knees for the forgiveness of our sins because we all have sin inside of us... John 3:3. says unless one is regenerated from above he can't see the Kingdom of God. Romans 10:9&10; says if you believe in your heart that Jesus is Lord, and that God rose Him from the dead, and confess it with your lips you will be saved. Each individual God looks at. Each person's heart.. not which Religion anyone is. Jesus loves us so much and wants all to be saved.. whoever is willing to come. He says "Whoever calls on the Name of the Lord will be saved." Acts 2:21.
So no matter what happens, earthquakes, famines, pestilence, you can have the assurance that when you die, you will be with Him.

Liberal Reader| 1.13.10 @ 9:39PM

With death tolls in Haiti mounting into the tens of thousands (and at least one news agency suggesting it could be in the hundreds of thousands), Robertson's comments strike me as callous and devoid of any compassion.

The notion that the people of Haiti brought this on themselves by making a pact with the Devil is -- I think clearly -- is something only an imbecile would take seriously. What surprises, however, is that Robertson cannot muster any sense of pity for the terrible suffering in that country. Contrast this to the response of the Pope, for example, which showed deep moral solidarity and true Christian compassion.

Margie| 1.13.10 @ 9:53PM

Well LibRead~ If Robertson uses his resources to actually send help there then that would indeed be "showing a sense of pity", would it not. Remember "Let us love one another in deed not in word only." Don't try to stir it up between the Pope and him. It isn't a matter of Religion. It's a matter of truth. There are words and then there are deeds. I'm sure or at least I hope everyone who can will be helping.

Franklin| 1.13.10 @ 11:18PM

Amen, thank you, Margie

Patriot| 1.13.10 @ 10:27PM

Lunacy? Only a lunatic would support someone who promotes infanticide like Obama.

Now, that's imbecilic lunacy. Pick your poison, troll.

How convenient that you'd ignore the vast amount of good, decent and compassionate work Pat Robertson has done for the poor and suffering around the world. He has saved an untold number of lives because of his love and compassion for his fellow man.

But what would you know about the often bitter, heartbreaking work of missionaries? Nothing. As a liberal, all you can do is flap your lips and run your mouth about the unfortunate; all you really care about are power and control. Creep.

Franklin| 1.13.10 @ 11:19PM

Amen to you too, Patriot!

Margie| 1.13.10 @ 9:43PM

Richard,
My point in my post above (my browser messed up again..) was to say that Haiti is no different~ no better or worse than any other people as far as sin goes. All these things (above Mt. 24) are going to come upon the whole Earth.. that includes us I would imagine.. it says the whole Earth.. but like you said sin is sin. It's in all of us.. but there is a way of escape. (above post).

Pingback| 1.13.10 @ 10:12PM

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…dime!) attitude: After Obama tells America “everyone must sacrifice” the White House throws one party every three days.” With wagyu, too. On the Pat Robertson and Haiti nonsense at American Spectator. I’m not sure what to think of this over at NiceDeb, but since Obama campaigned on a let’s-start-up-a-national-defense-force-funded-as-well-as-the-military promise (and he really needs to…

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Niveksi | 1.13.10 @ 11:37PM

It is interesting to note that every time an earthquake happens people pull out the verse in Matt 24 -- if you check the website (http://earthquake.usgs.gov/eqcenter/recenteqsww/) you might have to wonder regarding the extent of voodoo and other devil practices. Maybe if Christians actually acted like the Christ they claim we would have a great deal less suffering in the world. One reason for the spread of Christianity in the first place was the love and compassion for their fellow humans--pagan or believer. Today, that would translate as love for liberal or conservative. Both parties on this blog should show that love towards each other instead of throwing rocks at each other.
One thing 'conservative' bloggers should consider, it usually isn't the 'liberals' who claim to 'prophesy in [Jesus] name, drive out demons and perform miracles' it is though what MANY conservative 'Christians' claim to do--
Matthew 7:20-23 (New International Version)

20Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them.

21"Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?' 23Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'

Margie| 1.13.10 @ 11:40PM

I was just thinking.. Robertson said Haiti is cursed? The only curse I know of is the one from which Christ set me free.
"Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us--for it is written, "Cursed be every one who hangs on a tree"--" Gal. 3:13.
How he could say any nation in particular is under a curse, is to me ridiculous.
Matthew 24 includes the entire world as far as the end times is concerned. The whole world is "fallen" because of sin.. not just Haiti. Each individual has to see to their own soul to be ready when it's our time..
Haiti has voodoo (which not everyone practices) and what do we have? Lots of "idol worship" other than God.. it's all because of sin.
Sin can be forgiven.
"For God SO loved the world He gave His only begotten Son that whoever believes in Him should not perish, but have eternal life." Jn. 3:16.
It says WHOEVER!
That means you. :^)

Bob| 1.14.10 @ 8:19AM

Margie, I may be an atheist and we disagree on religious issues, but I want to congratulate you on your big heart and open mind when it comes to Haiti. Obviously, I don't like mixing religion and politics or opinions based on belief over reason and analysis, but when it comes to helping a fellow human being on a voluntary basis, we are on the same page.

Janice| 1.14.10 @ 12:49PM

And so is Pat Robertson: The man has saved thousands and thousands of lives. The poor, sick and most wretched among us; Pat Robertson has extended a loving hand to all.

He walks the walk--he doesn't just talk the talk.

Davey| 1.14.10 @ 1:02AM

Look at the simple truth. There is no Santa Claus. There is no Easter Bunny. There is no redeeming saviour who sails about the clouds, hanging with his father, who boned a 14 year old chick and then sort of confused exactly who the family name was (was it David or Benji?) and there is no Book of Revelation that tells how the next 10 years are going to go - and on and on.

There aren't these things. They are all child tales that we tell our kids to get them to eat their veggies and play nice. They are stories that have real moral truth to them and offer wonderful guidance for living a life of service and compassion. But they aren't true. Like as in - happened. There is no Ark, no parting of the seas, no whale, no - it just never happened.

bottom line for you fundy nuts - you just KNOW you never talked to God. He NEVER spoke to you. You just KNOW that. At least not if you are sane, and I suspect you are. Now I knew a woman who heard voices. Real as the day. But she was crazy. And rather than convince her otherwise, therapy was "just don't do what they say"

Good therapy for all of us voice hearers.

Now go in service of your fellow man.

Warren Piece| 1.14.10 @ 8:09AM

Davey: If there is no God and this life is all there is, what is so damn special about our "fellow man" that I should give up one moment of my life "to serve"?

You think the people you help will really be grateful? Easily 95% won't and those few who do likely will never think of you again for the rest of their lives five minutes after you're done.

Believe me. If you "serve your fellow man" long enough, you will end up feeling pretty empty inside.

Davey| 1.14.10 @ 3:34PM

Currently, I am 52 years old. I don't, and never have, felt "empty" inside. Though when I was a boy the christian leaders of my youth group said that non-christians feel empty inside. That Jesus fills a space. I believed them then, but I don't believe them now. I have a family, a wife, loving children that everyone else admits are the kindest, most special kids they know. We as a family are devoted to each other, to doing good, and to all around trying our damndest to be "serving our fellow man". What is so special about our fellow man? Well, when I'm in the grocery store, and I bump into someone with my cart, I apologize. For that one moment, that is all there is in my world. Just they and I. There is no god there. There is no lutheran, methodist, anglican, catholic, jew, etc. Just me - and him. If he drops his keys, I'll bend over and pick them up. I'll open the door on the way out. Simple little things that act as a glue to bind us togther in life. Almost like the rules of the road. Yield. Stop.

Are we empty? I'm not. None of my family claim to be empty. Busy, yes. Frazzeled, for sure.

I am always wowed by your argument. In other words, had you not been told about god as a child, you would be a total prick, and have nothing - not one moment as you say, to give to your next door neighbor. That only the bible's commands make you able to give up one moment?

Warren, you are either a very bitter man, or else you are trying to make a point at the expense of your personal character. Either way, I suspect that if we were to bump into each other at the store, you would say oops sorry. And really mean it. And I'll bet that if you knew me and I asked you for a quarter, you'd give it to me. Long before you even thought of you God's commands.

Warren Piece| 1.14.10 @ 6:08PM

It goes well with you that you are the generous fellow you are.

But you miss the point. You make your claim that one should abandon notions of the supernatural and thus freed to live the moral life. You leave unanswered why another rational man might do the calculations and conclude to leave the "good doing" to the chumps. You and I would find such a man despicable; but what compelling case is there to say he hasn't found what is true for him?

I will easily be one of the first to say that many people of faith are a poison on the earth. Clearly, belief is no magic that necessarily makes people good and generous. Unbelief is no obstacle to living a moral life. At the same time, unbelief has no ability to command that moral life.

I am sixty. I have worked in medical hospitals in several capacities since I was fifteen. It is simply a hard truth that, if you are looking for people to be grateful what you've done for them, you are in the wrong place. Many go into medicine and nursing thinking their sacrifices will be rewarded in the grateful eyes of their patients. They in time will be disillusioned. Indeed, they do come to feel empty. Medicine is hard on those on the frontlines. What you see is often heartbreaking and emotionally draining. You will pour your heart out day after day until there is nothing left. Many leave their professions—professions they had spent thousands of dollars to become a part of.. The rest find their purpose for caregiving elsewhere. Unfortunately, some cope with drink or drugs. Others find their purpose in serving the craft of medicine itself. The truth is that in medical situations you will see people at their worst. You will find that "serving your fellow man" in and of itself ain't all it’s cracked up to be. You have to find some other reason to be on the receiving end of so much crap. Some find it. Some do not. But “serving your fellow man” isn’t good enough.

Davey| 1.14.10 @ 11:58PM

Most likely Mr. Peace, you and I would have a fine time together, should we ever meet in that imaginary grocery store. That you have worked in the medical field for you life's work, is both noble and honorable. I respect it and with it, your character. You are doing what is good. That few appreciate it? or it is losing it's reward? Well, they say idealism is for youth and wisdom is for the old.

You ask the question - how do we control human behaviour? How can we inject altruism into regular human discourse unless we do it out of fear/honor of god?

I think that in the very short term, altruism might not necessarily result in positive returns (though in many cases it does - witness "green investing"). But there is this thing called consience, which evolved long before Christianity. Much Easten ideology is not what we would consider church religion, or even god dominated thought. Yet it appeals to the individual to do good things. That we don't even have to define "good things" shows just how innate this is and beyond the simple God or Jesus told me to do it. We have evolved over 3 million years this social contract we call consience (we don't have to bore each other with an evolution discussion - though I'll venture a guess you aren't hostile to that thinking.)

But know what? I find doing good ie helping people is actually fun. Taking care, nourishing a friend, it's fun. Assuming that depression is a bad thing for someone to drag around, a useful antidote is to turn around and start helping someone else. People who volunteer, don't have time to be depressed. The act of giving is actually a positive gift to yourself. I would feel sorry for someone to join a fraternal/service organization out of duty to god. Where is the payback in that? Join out of altruism, join out of the "goodness of your own heart". That is spiritually rewarding. Might even fill you up!

But whatever is our motivation, if kindness and compassion result, who should complain?

Nate| 1.18.10 @ 12:58PM

Davey and Warren - Here's an interesting op-ed column by Nicholas Kristof. It reviews some recent phychological literature suggesting that altruistic activities DO make people happier in the long term (generally speaking).

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/01.....of.html?hp

Take care
-Nate

Janice| 1.14.10 @ 12:54PM

Davey, bet you wouldn't spew your nonsense to Muslims--yellow bellied coward. You'd get your head cut off.

Moron.

Davey| 1.14.10 @ 3:47PM

Now Janice! I suggested that the real nonsense here was Santa Claus and other fables. Well intentioned but childish all the same.

Look at your reply! I'm not sure what to make of it, other than raw anger. And the fact that you are annonymous. My HEAD CUT OFF. And I'm a coward? Huh? Janis when did we bring muslims into the conversation? You do speak for the Pat Robertson club very well, though.

They are equal parts, inarticulate, mean, nasty, vindictive, and without real charm once you get past that fake, bullshit smile they put on when entering church on Sunday. Yep, they really dig the smiting part and only pay lip service to the eating locusts and praying part. I've met quite a few. Once you get behind the scenes they are power playing and wacked out as much as anyone.

Indeed your answers thoughout this blog belie your character. Or maybe you just didnt take your meds today?

Janice| 1.14.10 @ 5:42PM

Davey, I'd be more impressed by you if you had the gonads to insult Muslims, too. It's easy to vent your spleen on Christians because you know we're no threat--it's quite another matter to insult Muslims because they'd exact a piece from you--and you know it.

You Christian haters are all the same and you make me laugh--you're balless wonders, cowards to the core.

I don't care if you're an atheist: I just thank God everyday that I'm not.

Davey| 1.14.10 @ 6:02PM

That you feel you are better than a radical muslim sure is a feather in your cap. It should be noted and it is accepted amongst most historians, that muslims at one time were the only thing that saved western civilization. Of course western civilization came from the greeks and romans PRIOR to them taking over the christian faith. So that much of what we today consider civilization are products of non-christian beliefs. And where did you get this christian hater thing? I am no such thing. but you my hysterical friend seem to wish a corner on the hating market.

What with folks like you around, hurling invectives about cowardice and manliness (strange seeing as how you yourself are anonymous and - a female - ) oh well, you would have thought I just told you there was no Santa Claus.

Golly gee, I am here trying to speak nice about my fellow man. And somehow I get thrown in the "to be beheaded category". What gives?

Janice| 1.14.10 @ 7:26PM

Ha ha ha!! You foolish infidel; you'd be a dead man in the Middle East. They don't suffer fools like you gladly like we do.

All talk, big man--as usual, and nothing more.

Believe what you want. If it floats your boat to scream, cry and rail against God--do it; we DON'T care.

I'm happy because I know that Jesus Christ is my Lord and Savior and I have eternal salvation because He sacrificed His life for me. I feel loved.

If you don't believe as I do, that's okay with me--it's your life.

But, if you're so happy, why do you sound so angry? Let byegones be byegones.

Davey| 1.14.10 @ 9:40PM

Um, the Middle East includes Israel. And it's ok to speak as I do in Israel. Similarily so in Jordan and Iraq. Much like our own country, there are wild-eyed fundamentalists afoot, but even in Iran, one's personal belief system is not questioned too much. I suppose denying the godhead of Mohammed would be a bad speach to make in Downtown Tehran, so you might be right is some of the more backward corners of the world. Of course that would also include some little towns in the Midwest. Not that has any bearing on this discussion though you keep bringing it up. I think just to "scare me" with how radical a thinker I am.

What amuses me the most, is how much you "know". This is the most common talk amongst the fundamentalist crowd, but you won't hear this from a Catholic. This talk about how you "know" it to be true and how you "know" me to be a fool.

Quite frankly anyone who believes that all the animals fit on an ark and that Jonah climbed inside a fish till it puked him up, and this fellow Jesus walked on water, and more importantly changed water into wine for his mom when they ran out of the stuff (heck it was good stuff too! why did you save the best for last? they asked our eternal saviour).

But still you know all this stuff. And me, sort of disbelieving that any of this could possibly happen seeing as how I've NEVER seen anyone do any of these things. Nor has anyone in the history of documented time done or seen these kind of miracles. But yeah, little ole' "let's be good to our fellow man" is a giant fool for failing to buy the same silliness that you have.

But my gut tells me - the truth is most people don't believe any more than me. Most people just go along with it. Afraid to really question it. Because then they won't ever get to see grandma again. What the hell they say, if I don't speak up, maybe it'll all turn out ok.

And maybe it will. I sure don't know. In fact there is only one thing I know, and that's - you freakin don;t know either!

Ah, but you say you do, so we'll just have to see...

Meantime, just in case the whole god issue turns out different than both of us think, just be nice to your neighbor, and stop flipping the bird to all the folks and maybe you'll be such a shinning light that folks will see your good example and follow.

Janice| 1.15.10 @ 12:46AM

The difference between me and you is that I have faith--and it sustains me. I know it's a gift from God and I am grateful for it because it helps me live a more harmonious, joyful life.

But you, talk about fairy tales--you live in them.

It's a shame there are so many spoiled, ungrateful Americans like you who don't appreciate the freedom our country affords you.

That's okay, you can't make everyone happy and cranks like you abound; I'm just glad I don't have to be one!

Davey| 1.16.10 @ 3:51AM

Yeah, only Christians are grateful americans. And your harmonius, joyful life? Boy I am just miserable wishing for the fufillment that comes with turning off the major thinking centers in my brain, and thinking of angels floating about in the air. And big bad giants - being slayed by little boys with slings. And those little boys growing up to "love each other like David and Jonathon". Actually it does have a certain sweetness to it.

'Cept when you come on here and see what folks like you become when that little fantasy gets challenged. And the usual, typical rhetoric comes tumbling out. And the name calling begins.

Ladies and Gentlemen of the Jury: I give you Janis - and her harmonious and joyful life! Wish I had some!

Testify!

Janice| 1.16.10 @ 1:02PM

Davey, honestly; most of my posts were half-jest. I do have faith and am most grateful for it, but I would never push my beliefs on others.

I have also had difficult experiences with Christian clergy when I was young but my faith in God has transcended these unfortunate experiences. I will never allow the stupidity of man to keep me from God's love.

You focus on fairy tales a lot, and I realize that's
an issue for you, but it's not something that consumes me.

Maybe you don't realize how offensive your anti-christian snarks are, but if you want to reach common ground, insulting others is a poor way to go about it.

You sound like a good guy--more power to you and your family. Most christians are good, you know? We're just human and make mistakes like everyone else--including Pat Robertson.

It's wrong to ignore the huge amount of good this man has done for the suffering--that's my real point.

Take care of yourself.

Anthony| 1.14.10 @ 4:44AM

The fact that Pat Robertson doesn't have a lightning bolt sticking out of his arse proves that there is no God.

Janice| 1.14.10 @ 12:51PM

Anthony, your fixation on the posterior says a lot about you--none of it good.

Warren Piece| 1.14.10 @ 7:13AM

There have been more than a few million in the Church who realized long ago that Robertson was a bozo. A great bozo, maybe. But a bozo nonetheless. Personally, a generous man; but seriously intemperate.

1.) Robertson should have learned long ago about the "left hand" of God in which God acts to His own purposes in mystery and out of sight. God is under no obligation to make sense of Himself to us. Everything we really know about God was shown to us on the cross.

2.) Just for the sake of argument, let's assume what Robertson said was true about Haiti. He had no authority to say what he did and he was irresponsible in adding to the suffering of the Haitian people (especially the children) by saying that God had turned His back on them.

Dean| 1.14.10 @ 8:25AM

"For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways," declares the Lord. "As the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways and my thoughts than your thoughts." Isaiah 55:8-9

Whenever tragedy strikes, it seems as though many Christians attempt to rationalize it by defining what they believe to be God's role in the tragedy. This verse from Isaiah tells me it is often folly for us to attempt to define why God chose to do something or chose to allow something to happen.

Unfortunately, Pat Robertson is usually on the forefront of this mistake. To make it worse, the media and many non-Christians view him (for some unknown reason) as speaking for all Christians. And in no way is that the case.

We can't understand why the earthquake happened and we can't know God's role in it. If we want to speak for God, we should do it in a way that would be pleasing to him--through our prayers and support (financial and physical) for those who are suffering.

Janice| 1.14.10 @ 12:57PM

If you're going to judge Robertson for his intemperate words, you must praise him for his many years of work helping to feed, clothe and provide medical care for many thousands of poor and suffering.

To ignore his saintly work is unfair.

Derek Leaberry| 1.14.10 @ 8:55AM

I know and respect many fundamentalist Christians and I believe they are a positive force in society. But Rev. Robertson now comes off as that cranky, part-senile uncle many families have, old men who blather about at Thanksgiving, Christmas or Easter dinners, making fools of themselves as the grandkids chuckle and the adults cringe. Sad to say, Rev. Robertson doesn't seem to know the difference between Napoleon III and the more famous Napoleon I. He seems to know enough about Haitian history to get himself into trouble. Rev. Robertson's mental faculties have degenerated as he has aged and he has become a buffoonish strawman for liberals to attack. After being such a leader for social and religious conservatives of all stripes, Rev. Robertson has become a hindrance to conservatism.

Bob| 1.14.10 @ 9:21AM

You mean just like Palin, Limbaugh, and Beck..... Right???? Want proof????

http://www.fivethirtyeight.com.....ative.html

Janice| 1.14.10 @ 12:58PM

Dumbass. You're the one who is senile.

Davey| 1.14.10 @ 6:04PM

Yep. She is a charmer, allright.... I'll bet you are a hoot at the Christmas Party.

Janice| 1.14.10 @ 7:28PM

Davey!! Do you realize there's CHRIST in Christmas? Better be careful, you'll lose your atheist cred.

Davey| 1.14.10 @ 9:47PM

Your right! There certainly was alot of Christ at my office party this year. And the malls are full of christ. Actually the only reference that was made to christ was at the christmas service I attended with my family.

BTW, an atheist is convinced there is no god. I am not so definitive. Not that I care to tell you, but rather than have you falsely accuse me, I don't "believe" the evidence for a god. I hope that is not too subtle a difference for a philospher and articulate scholar such as you.

Janice| 1.15.10 @ 2:05AM

Thanks for the compliments, sweet.

Davey| 1.16.10 @ 3:33AM

See? Lookit that? You be nice to people and they start talkin nice right back.

My pleasure, ma'am.

Mike| 1.14.10 @ 11:02AM

Dudes, before you go banging Robertson any further I would like to see evidence that he is incorrect. His assection has as much validity as the Global Warming wachos and look at the positive press the MSM provides for this idiocy.

Bob| 1.14.10 @ 11:06AM

OK, I'll go and ask that mystical person in the sky...

(1 minute later).

He said that Pat Robertson is a nut.... Do you really need more proof????

Smitty| 1.14.10 @ 1:24PM

His assertion was true, just unnecessary.

Global Warming freaks are the real liars.

Joseph Jenkins| 1.14.10 @ 11:08AM

The day Pat Robertson is useful is the day God makes him choke on his own vomit and feed the daisies.

Smitty| 1.14.10 @ 1:01PM

Wow. Who let out all the nuts, freaks and lunatics? HuffPo?

Get a job, liberals.

Paul West| 1.14.10 @ 11:17AM

I agree 100% with Pat Robertson's bold remarks. We need to re-read the first 4 books of that Bible. There, God is so much more that "LOVE" he is the God of WAR,GENOCIDES, THE MASS KILLING OF CHILDREN, plagues that murder millions, all out of his childish jealousy attributes.

You have all become brainwashed into that Christian way of thinking that Jesus was a nice guy. Haiti was indeed a judgment, with a sovereign God in full control of every aspect of it. Yes, the same (so-called kindhearted God who flooded the earth. That same loving spirit that stood mute by allowing Adolf Hitler the freedom to murder millions. the same righteous fanatic who will torture billions for his pleasure in HELL.

you know not, whom you worship???

Smitty| 1.14.10 @ 1:08PM

Hitler was an atheist like you, Paul. Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot and Castro are/were responsible for the hideous torture and murder of hundreds of millions of innocent people.

Don't forget the killing of many more millions of innocent babies by abortion, Paul--more savagery by you atheists.

And you pretend to be good. Nice try, moron.

Paul, your rubber room called; it's missing you.

Eric Damon| 1.14.10 @ 12:14PM

Some of you anti-God people are patently ridiculous! Look, if you choose not to believe in a transcendent God, that is your prerogative, just as my decision to believe just that is mine. I don't begrudge your decision, I don't condemn you for it, and I am not going to insult your lack of belief. In the end, all of that is a matter of your personal choices.

However, do not think for a moment that your lack of belief in God means that you have no belief in a god; you have simply enshrined man, technology, science, education or something else as god in your life. You are religious, as you have adopted the religion of secular humanism where mankind and his achievements are held up as exemplars and venerated instead of a God that stands outside of mankind, outside of time itself, and establishes a set of morals and beliefs that are a pathway to righteousness. You secular humanists are all of the things that you claim to hate about Christians and other religious believers: intolerant, dogmatic, hateful, and spiteful. Just look at some of the posts here attacking people of faith and castigating Rev. Robertson. You may not agree with him or his beliefs, but the attacks on the man and on the Christian faith I see here would be shameful is secular humanism recognized anything as such.

Pat Robertson's words may have offended you, may have seemed crazy to you, but they are not being responded to in anything like a proportianate manner. He says that the founders of Haiti made a deal with the devil to be free of the French and that the nation has seemed to be cursed ever since, and that he hopes that there is a sincere turning to God there and you people go off the deep end. First of all what he said was not made up, in fact there is an article at FrontPage that covers just that here: http://97.74.65.51/readArticle.aspx?ARTID=14079 . It may not be historical fact, but is a prevalent part of the history and folklore for the Haitian people, so it was open for discussion. Besides which, Pat Robertson has the right to believe that Haiti suffers under a generational curse that has never been confronted by the people there, but has at times been reaffirmed! It may gall the secular humanists out there to think this, but Christians believe that the Blood of the Lamb covers all sins and can break what many believe to be a generational curse on that nation. And what did anyone expect Robertson to do? Ignore what he feels are the spiritual parameters of this situation and launch into some exegis of the failure of past US foreign policy vis a vis Haiti?

Bob| 1.14.10 @ 12:59PM

The problem, Eric, is not that you and Pat believe in a god, it is that you push your beliefs into politics. If he was apolitical and spouted this nonsense, I'd have absolutely no comment as he is entitled to his belief. You must believe that we must be "secular humanists" to justify YOUR belief in Christianity. But this is a construct of your fundamentalism. I don't believe that people who utilize reason and facts need a fake religion -- that simply degrades the use of reason. It's like Jews having "Chanukah bushes" because Christians have Christmas trees.

You and other fundamentalist Christians are the bigoted intolerant individuals since you want to force your beliefs on marriage, abortion, and evolution on the rest of us through political means. As an example, I am perfectly willing to vote for a fiscal conservative, religious politician like Romney or Jindal but you would not vote for a fiscal conservative atheist. Am I right?

Smitty| 1.14.10 @ 1:11PM

More nonsense spewed by the biggest bigoted liar around.

Somewhere there's a rubber room missing you, Bob.

Bob| 1.14.10 @ 1:15PM

Yes, Smitty, that's the way to prove your intellectual capability....

Smitty| 1.14.10 @ 1:21PM

No reason to debate someone who is a liar.

You don't argue in good faith and deserve opprobrium.

Bob| 1.14.10 @ 1:41PM

You're right.... I shouldn't debate you....

Smitty| 1.14.10 @ 2:43PM

Good one, dope. Bob; the pro-abortion atheist who voted for Obama and claims to be a Republican says I'M a liar. Sure, stooge--you specialize in lies.

Smitty| 1.14.10 @ 1:16PM

You're right, Eric; but bigoted atheistic bigots like Bob are blinded by their hate for Christians. Pat Robertson is just their latest target.

Notice that they NEVER acknowledge Robertson's vast record of charity for the poor and sick? They just want to hate.

Hatred is all atheists like Bob know.

somnolence| 1.14.10 @ 12:48PM

It is easy to take Robertson out of context. He concluded his observations by saying that the Haitian people need our prayers and financial support. That sounds like an advocacy of assistance to me; not a blind eye. He is correct about some aspects of the island's religious inclinations, since voodoo is practiced fervently in some quarters. As a clergyman(and I do not adhere to his particular brand of Protestantism, although I am strongly pro-life) being aware of voodoo, satanism, whatever, what else could he say? What I abhor are holier-than-thou commentators like Sheppard Smith trying to take him to task. No wonder somebody popped that egotistical jerk in the mouth a few years back.

Bob| 1.14.10 @ 1:19PM

And Smitty, Hitler claimed he was a Christian -- not an atheist. Here are some of his remarks:

http://www.stephenjaygould.org.....itler.html

But of course, don't let facts get in the way. I guess the actual information makes you a "liar"????

Smitty| 1.14.10 @ 1:23PM

Stop lying. Hitler was a SATANIST like you.

He was deeply involved in the occult.

Bob| 1.14.10 @ 1:43PM

So what did Hitler say to claim he was a "Satanist"? You're right, he was deeply involved in the occult -- he claimed he was a Christian...

Smitty| 1.14.10 @ 2:47PM

We've been through this before, troll. Not only are you an atheist like Hitler and Stalin, you lie like them, too.

Sure, Hitler and Obama both claimed they were Christians--just like you claim to be a Republican--you're all liars.

Bob| 1.14.10 @ 3:01PM

And you, Smitty, are a liar because with hate like that in your heart, you could not be a Christian...

Smitty| 1.14.10 @ 5:46PM

You project your feelings once again, Bob: YOUR hatred is on full display for all to see.

Derek Leaberry| 1.14.10 @ 1:44PM

Hitler turned his back on Christianity at a rather early age. He assuredly was atheist in orientation although Hitler the politician may have turned an occasional Christian phrase to please Germany's religious voters. Hitler had contempt for Christianity's peaceful intentions which were the antithesis of his warlike nature. However, Hitler fantasized over the gods of the German barbarian tribes of the distant past. Actually, Hitler may be pouring over Gothic novels right now as he burns in Hell.

Bob| 1.14.10 @ 1:58PM

An occasional Christian phrase? His history is replete with his claims he was a Christian. You may not like it, but it is fact. Can you prove that he said he was an atheist or are you just trying to tarnish those of us who call ourselves atheists?

http://www.stephenjaygould.org.....itler.html

Smitty| 1.14.10 @ 2:49PM

Admit it, Bob: You, Mao, Stalin, Hitler, Castro and Pol Pot are/were atheists. Nice Rogues' Gallery company you keep, troll.

Pingback| 1.14.10 @ 1:56PM

The American Spectator : AmSpecBlog : Pat Robertson and Haiti | Ispey Hot Trends links to this page. Here’s an excerpt:

…Haiti. By Robert P. Kirchhoefer … of his intent, his comment was incredibly insensitive and inappropriate. It deserves being condemned — fully. Pat Robertson has … http://spectator.org/blog/2010/01/13/pat-robertson-and-haiti No comments currently exist for this post. Leave a Reply: Get a Gravatar Click here to cancel reply. * Name * Email Address Website Address Type your message here... Search Ads…

Derek Leaberry| 1.14.10 @ 2:16PM

Read Joachim Fest's biography of Adolf Hitler. It is a very good read. Historian John Lukacs calls it the best long biography of Hiter. The truth will set you free, Bob.

Janice| 1.14.10 @ 2:52PM

Sorry, Derek--Bob and truth are as different as night and day. The troll doesn't know his butt from a hole in the ground.

Bob| 1.14.10 @ 2:58PM

“This human world of ours would be inconceivable without the practical existence of a religious belief.”

Adolf Hitler in Mein Kampf.... Yes, Derek and Janice, the truth will, indeed, set you free....

Danny| 1.14.10 @ 7:46PM

Yes, Hitler's religious belief was atheism--as is yours, Bob.

Bob| 1.14.10 @ 3:35PM

By the way, even Fest admitted that Hitler considered himself a Christian.

J. Goebbels| 1.14.10 @ 3:44PM

Diary 1939- "The Fuhrer is deeply religious, but deeply anti-Christian. He regards Christianity as a sympton of decay. Rightly so. It is a branch of the Jewish race."

Now back to my slumbers in Hell. Man it is hot down here!

A. Hitler| 1.14.10 @ 4:17PM

“I may not be a light of the church, a pulpiteer, but deep down I am a pious man, and believe that whoever fights bravely in defense of the natural laws framed by God and never capitulates will never be deserted by the Lawgiver, but will, in the end, receive the blessings of Providence.”

( Adolf Hitler, in a speech delivered on July 5, 1944)

Smitty| 1.14.10 @ 5:51PM

Only the most stupid among us would believe what Adolph Hitler said. Ever hear "Actions speak louder than words?"

What about the atheists Mao, Pol Pot, Stalin and Castro? What about the millions of innocents those monsters slaughtered?

Davey| 1.14.10 @ 6:25PM

Smitty, because one is not convinced of a supernatural being, it does not mean that one shares the belief system and action plan of Stalin, certainly one of the wickedest man to grace our planet. I mean, I don't believe in giants, angels, fairies, or hobgoblins, but I sure would agree with you that your actions are more important than your words. OTOH Pat Robertson's latest baloney is more in the corner of action (blaming the Hatians for their trouble) than it is just words. And Pat is more about media presence and money raising than he is about actually ministering to the poor. but that is only my opinion. If Pat would have converted Pol Pot into a kindly old man before he went on a rampage, that would have certainly been of great benefit to the human race. but Pat doesnt so much seem these days about changing lives to kindly old men as much as to bringing about despair and fear. We should all aspire to the former and shun the later. Can't we all agree on that?

Smitty| 1.14.10 @ 7:42PM

You're a liar. You know Pat Robertson has spent his life helping the poor and wretched. What have you ever done to help others?

It's idiocy to claim Pat's words are actions--talk about fairytales.

Your lie is very telling--it's evidence of your hatred toward Christians.

Davey| 1.14.10 @ 10:01PM

Christians, Moslems, Jews, Hindus, 7th day aventists, flat -earth society folks, rosicursions (sp?), shakers, bakers, Quakers, and Holy men of all stripes. Regardless of what smitty says, I love you all. One of you might be right too! Odds are against it being Pat Robertson, but only because of the incredible variety of contradictory religious theories that abound on our planet.

I don't however love murderers, thieves, liars, cheats, and anyone, regardless of how many or few people, injures another.

Most assuredly, I will die for my country and I love the constitution of the united states more than anything else in this world but for my family.

I wish for peace in the world and honesty in government. But I recognize just how hard it is to achieve a semblance of either.

When I die, I wish to be known for 2 things. That I loved, and was loved.

THAT my good people is what I believe. People who know me, would say that is true, I hope.

Smitty| 1.15.10 @ 12:36AM

Pat Robertson has spent many years working to help the suffering; it's disingenuous of his detractors like you to ignore this fact. It's lying by omission.

Would you like it if people lied about you?

I notice you didn't address the fact that I caught you in a lie. Convenient.

Davey| 1.16.10 @ 3:27AM

Lie on this, Jackson.

Tell me which of the following facts are wrong:

Patty R. and company took in nearly 300 mill. (on CBN - who KNOWS what other related enterprises there are). And spent 70% on "programs for the people". Which turned out to be nearly all TV shows directed towards political speach and (good for him) prosletyzing. While he didnt take a salary, his son made 330k. Other family and friends prospered accordingly.

See this is how it's done. You raise money, you spend some of it. Of course it includes charities. The taliban sponsors charities. Then - most importantly - you keep some of it. And everybody is happy. Plus they call you a "saint".

That very same strategy was employed by the good folks back in the early days of the 1st century. And if my Bible reading is correct, a passage describes a certain fellow named Jesus, who found profiteering on the good deeds of the church so vile and contemptible, that he took he took a whip and violently rid the holy place of the folks who were just doing what they thought to be a god sanctioned activity. Hey we're just doing the business of the lord they protested. He, being unconvinced, drove them out with sheer force.

Pat is in mega business to help the poor. It should be noted, I don't profit from my meager efforts to do the same. Who is the better guy? Before you jump on that, did you know that Pat invested in diamond mines in Africa, and other mining activity in Liberia? Diamond mining being one of the scourages of the African continent. A bloody business to be sure. Thinking about following the steps of Jesus. Do you think Jesus would have approved of the synagog investing in the diamonds of Africa? What would his response have been.

PS - Pat lost his shirt on the mining deals too. Wonder who went without dinner over that?

Now tell me more about Saint Pat.

Mother Theresa! Now there is someone who can walk the walk. I don't talk smack about Mother Theresa. Nobody does. Interestingly for the purposes of our little discussion here, 85% of Haitians, believe exactly as she did. So you think Pat has it right in thinking god is punishing them for believing that stuff too?

Your head starting to hurt? Or are you going to stop thinking right about now. Your cognitive dissonance driving you into a fury of calling me names.

Janice| 1.16.10 @ 1:19PM

Have you read any of my posts?

I didn't say Robertson was a saint--I said he was a good man who has done a great deal of good for the most wretched among us.

I have been a 700 club member for many years. I have read copious numbers of letters and facts detailing the missionary work of Pat's charities.

I KNOW the number of children who've been saved from public humiliation because of plastic surgery they've received from Operation Blessing, I know of those countless youngsters who've been fed and clothed because of Pat Robertson and I know of the many lives who've been saved because of medical care from Pat's charities. I know because I took the time to find out.

I'm aware of Pat's mistakes and mis-deeds but I also am aware of the incredible amount of good he has done for the poor.

My problem with you is that you focus on his mistakes and refuse to admit the great things he's done for humanity. I believe that you don't argue in good faith; I believe you're very angry.

Janice| 1.16.10 @ 1:20PM

Oh, I thought you were replying to me! Haha.

Richard Baker| 1.14.10 @ 6:37PM

Margie:
Sin is sin which is correct. Unfortunately, the Haitians have, as a country, been spitting purposefully in God's face for centuries. "The wages of sin is death." Don't why this concept is confusing. As "Catholics" they know which way the wind blows but choose to spit into it.

Margie| 1.14.10 @ 7:50PM

Richard,
And so has the rest of mankind been spitting in God's face. "ALL have sinned and fall short of the Glory of God." You can't condemn an entire nation that way or you'd have to condemn every country because the people in every country sin. Are you forgetting John 3:16? "for God so loved the world He gave His only begotten Son that whoever believes in Him should not perish, but have eternal life." That applies to all people, in every country, everywhere. That means NO curses any more. Christ nailed them to the cross! Curses are Old Testament.. Jesus came to fulfil the Law.. he nailed the curses to the cross. Now Salvation is based individually and depends upon whether or not we accept~or~reject His Son.
Mt. 24 explains that when Christ returns, then it is too late. There are thousands of individuals who, though the earth be destroyed will go to be with God in Heaven. Those who do what Jn. 3:16 says.

Psychotherapy????| 1.14.10 @ 7:20PM

Robertson is in need of a mental health evaluation and long term psychotherapy! Someone tell him to find a therapist here http://www.goodtherapy.org or here http://www.psychologytoday.com/

Dan| 1.14.10 @ 7:44PM

We all know that psychotherapists are the truly insane.

Physician, heal thyself!

Franklin| 1.15.10 @ 5:28AM

CBN said Robertson never said the earthquake was God’s wrath.

"...The 700 Club, during a segment about the devastation, suffering and humanitarian effort that is needed in Haiti, Dr. Robertson also spoke about Haiti’s history. His comments were based on the widely-discussed 1791 slave rebellion led by Boukman Dutty at Bois Caiman, where the slaves allegedly made a famous pact with the devil in exchange for victory over the French. This history, combined with the horrible state of the country, has led countless scholars and religious figures over the centuries to believe the country is cursed. Dr. Robertson never stated that the earthquake was God’s wrath. If you watch the entire video segment, Dr. Robertson’s compassion for the people of Haiti is clear. He called for prayer for them. His humanitarian arm has been working to help thousands of people in Haiti over the last year, and they are currently launching a major relief and recovery effort to help the victims of this disaster. They have sent a shipment of millions of dollars worth of medications that is now in Haiti, and their disaster team leaders are expected to arrive..."

www.cbn.com/about/pressrelease.....haiti.aspx

Tammy| 1.15.10 @ 11:59PM

Pat must consider his words carefully because of all those who wish to do Christianity harm. His unfortunate words allow others to use him as a weapon against his beliefs.

Be wise, Pat.

The American Spectator

The Spectacle Blog

Pat Robertson and Haiti

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