The American Spectator : The Spectacle Blog : Rickey! Don't Lose His Number

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Several months ago, I wrote that former Saints (and 49ers) linebacker Rickey Jackson deserved to be in the NFL Hall of Fame. Now, finally, he at least has been named a semi-finalist. The man is second all-time in fumble rcoveries, 10th all-time in sacks (and would be higher, but sacks were not an official stat during his first year in the league), way up high in tackels, good on interceptions for a LB, won a Super Bowl ring as a starter, and was a six-time Pro Bowler and would have made even more Pro Bowls if he weren't competing for votes with three top teammates at the same position. (In a number of those years, he made the "all-Madden" team, which is to my mind a better barometer sometimes than that of the players voting for the Pro Bowl, as the players don't get to watch all the other games while they are playing in them.) Lots of other people agree that Jackson should be in the Hall.

Seven people can get inducted. My votes would go to Jackson, Ray Guy (as the first punter to so clearly outclass all his competitors that he was a huge strategic and tactical asset for his team), Aeneas Williams (8-time Pro Bowl DB), Emmitt Smith and Jerry Rice (no explanations needed for those two), and then I would have a terrible time choosing among the following for the last two spots this year: OL Russ Grimm, WR Tim Brown, WR Cris Carter, DB Lester Hayes, DL Richard Dent, DL Charles Haley, TE Shannon Sharpe. If I were FORCED to choose, I would go with Tim Brown (barely over Cris Carter, a contemporary with not quite as many yards receiving and without the added benefit of being a great kick and punt returner), and with Russ Grimm because he was the leader of one of the best offensive lines in history, the Redskins' "Hogs," none of whom have received the credit due them. I do, however, think that Dent, Haley, Sharpe, and Carter SHOULD be in the Hall eventually, with Hayes , Cortez Kennedy, Chris Doleman, and Dermontti Dawson and all probably deserving as well....

But back to Rickey Jackson. The man played LEFT outside LB. He had as many sacks as LT, and LT was rushing from the blind side, the easier side. Jackson got his sacks while the QB was looking at him. And Jackson, unlike LT, also was great dropping into pass coverage and also playing every down against the run. And he was a leader in the locker room, a guy who EVERYBODY looked up to. Ask fellow Saints all-Pro LB Pat Swilling, later a state legislator, what he thinks of Jackson: Hall of Fame, all the way. As for me, all things considered, I would choose Jackson as the single player I would choose, all-time, to build my defense around, if I wanted a team to last ten years. The man never missed games due to injury, never made excuses, never dogged it, never let up. He deserves to be in the Hall.

View all comments (13) | Leave a comment

Red Phillips| 11.30.09 @ 6:05PM

That Ray Guy, who has been left out for many years, is not in the Hall of Fame is a travesty.

Eric Damon| 12.1.09 @ 9:53AM

I agree that Rickey Jackson may be deserving, but to say that he was a more impressive pass rusher than LT because he came from the right side doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me. While Jackson was very good, he was not usually being blocked by the elite tackle on a team unless they were playing a left-handed quarterback. The right tackle usually is not quite as good as a premiere left tackle, because the left tackle has to protect the blindside of the quarterback. When the qb can see the pass rush coming he can make any necessary adjustments to deliver the football, whether that means a check down to a back , a dump to the tight end, or a sight adjustment with a wideout. But he cannot see the backside rusher and has to depend on the tackle to keep him clean...which is why the left tackle spot is so crucial (flip it for a lefty qb). So in some respects LT's numbers are more impressive because he had to beat a team's best pass protector if he was coming off the edge, whereas Jackson was usually facing someone who was not the best protector on the offensive line.

As for the rest of the group, I would take Cris Carter over Tim Brown because I think Carter's numbers are better as a reciever:
1101 catches; 13,899 yards; 12.6 ypc; 130 td; 120+ catches in back to back seasons, 6 seasons of 10+ touchdowns; 2 years with 9 td

Tim Brown's numbers are good too:
1094 catches; 14,934 yards; 13.7 ypc; 100 td; 1 year of 100+ catches; 8 years with 80+ catches; 2 years with 10+ td; 4 years with 9 td; 3320 punt return yards, 3 td; 1235 kick return yards, 1 td.

You can't go wrong with either, but I prefer Carter on this ballot. And Ray Guy should have long been in the HOF, Russ Grimm should be in, and they had better not stiff Dick LeBeau again or their HOF will look just as bad as MLB's! How can LeBeau NOT be in? He was an all time great defensive back and a trendsetting defensive mind as a coordinator!

Oldefarte| 12.1.09 @ 1:21PM

Your arguments of LT over Rickey are sound EXCEPT that you fail to recognize the fact that the former was constantly playing HIGH on drugs, whereas the latter played CLEAN & SOBER [without ever a hint of drug activity]. No doubt you're a big Lyle Alzado fan, as well?????

Eric Damon| 12.1.09 @ 1:45PM

Well if LT was high on drugs that much, and he still managed to change the game with his pass rushing ability, that doesn't say a whole hell of a lot about Rickey does it? He was second fiddle to a dope head, yet you act as if he were better than LT! And how do you know that Rickey played "clean and sober"? Just because you don't fail a piss test doesn't mean that you're clean. I'm not saying that Rickey was on any type of drugs, but I am saying that you don't know he wasn't.

And yes, I was a fan of Lyle Alzado. He was a hell of a football player and what he did was no different than what a gang of people were doing at the time...and still are. He used PEDs and people are still using them in the NFL...that's just a fact of football life.

Oldefarte| 12.2.09 @ 10:27AM

I'm NOT saying Jackson was BETTER than LT----READ the first GD sentence of my argument. I'm saying that HE/JACKSON [ALSO] deserves to be in the HOF. 'How do I know.....?'-----don't be an idiot. How do I, you or anyone else KNOW anything about these celebreties? Are you related or close personal friends with any of them that gives you superior/personal knowledge concerning them? I'm saying LT's activities [while consumed] with drugs is thoroughly documented [arrests, car accidents,etc-hell he's even admitted same in his written books, news interviews,etc] through the media [go ask Bill Parcells what problems LT caused him as coach and the NYG's]; while there has never been a stated case of same concerning Jackson [if you in your infinite wisdom have knowledge/PROOF of same, inform the rest of us about it, okay, genius?]. As to a comparison between the two, LT was nothing but a PASS RUSHER, although he was by far one of the very best at same. He wasn't worth a damn as a RUN/RUSH STOPPER; whereas Jackson was. LT wasn't notable for INTERCEPTING PASSES while in DEFENSIVE PASS COVERAGE, now was he? Jackson has noteworthy statistics as same, if you care to destroy your ignorance by researching same! LT was out on INJURED RESERVE [or not playing] numerous times [possibly due to his drug activity?] and for many games, while Jackson never missed playing in a game for his entire career. PS, if Alzado hadn't been taking steriods, he probably wouldn't have even qualified to play in the NFL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Oldefarte| 12.2.09 @ 11:22AM

Okay, DUMMIE, here's the statistical comparison:
Lawrence Taylor/Rickey Jackson----184/227[games played;180/225[games started];133/128[sacks];9/68[interceptions caught];0/40[forced fumbles];11/29[fumbles recovered];10/6[pro bowls];12/14[years played]. Now who's 'SECOND FIDDLE' and who ['ALSO'] deserves to be in the NFL HOF?????????

Eric Damon| 12.4.09 @ 11:42AM

Look dude, Jackson's numbers aren't that impressive when stacked up against LT's, epecially if you take into account the games played. While Jackson did have way more forced fumbles than LT ( I couldn't find a record of LT forcing any fumbles), he had fewer sacks (-4.5) , fewer interceptions (-1), and fewer touchdowns (-2) than LT did...in 43 more games! He played nearly 3 more seasons than LT did and in most categories did not match him statistically.

And since when is it an insult to be considered worthy of the Hall of Fame? I never once said that Jackson did not deserve to get into the Hall or that he was less worthy than LT, I just don't think he had the same impact on the game as LT did. I mean, LT was a Pro Bowler 10 times in his career and Joe Gibbs pioneered the two tight end "jumbo" package and the h-back position just to combat LT's pass rush ability. That type of impact on the game is simply more impressive than the impact Jackson had on the game.

Oldefarte| 12.5.09 @ 1:51PM

Can you NOT READ????? Jackson led Taylor in every catagory [that I noted above in fumbles caused and recovered; AND interceptions] EXCEPT sacks. The linebacker position demands more than just some druggie tackling a QB [which was the only thing Taylor is noted for]. Jackson deserves to be in the NFL HOF just as much as Taylor does, if not more so!!!!

astorian| 12.1.09 @ 10:50AM

For many years, Paul zimmerman was the most influential member of the panel that elects players to the Pro Football Hall of Fame, and he has been the main reason Ray Guy isn't in. Zimmerman argues, correctly, that there have been numerous punters with higher averages (he points to Tommy Davis of the 49ers) and higher net averages than Guy.

Guy's career average was 42.4 yards a punt. Very good? Sure, but Tommy Davis' average was 44.7 yards.

As for net average, well, Guy's best season ever was 1985, when his net average was 36.3 yards a kick. For perspective, Rich Camarillo had a better net average than that in 8 seasons!

Eric Damon| 12.1.09 @ 1:50PM

Paul Zimmerman sucks! He only spouts those numbers to justify keeping a punter out of the Hall, but if those guys were better than Ray Guy then they should be in. Zimmerman just doesn't respect punters/kickers and will make it as hard as he can to keep them out of Canton. He also is a prick who won't vote for Kenny Stabler because he didn't like the Snake's lifestyle off the field when he played for the Raiders...career be damned. He's the reason why fans are starting to lose respect for the MLB and NFL Halls of Fame; too many voters are basing votes on personal considerations and not on the careers of the players they consider.

Oldefarte| 12.1.09 @ 1:25PM

Quin, if memory serves me, there was a small/slight connection between Ray Guy and the Saints------I THINK that one of his punts as a Raider once hit the Superdome's gondola and resulted in some kind of a penalty/referee ruling????????????????

Quin| 12.1.09 @ 2:20PM

Oldefarte,
You are right: Ray Guy did punt a ball into the Superdome gondola. But I don't know if that was during practice or during a real game. I KNOW he did it on purpose in practice, to show that it could be done. I can't remember if it happened in a game; it MAY have happened during a Pro Bowl; I THINK they played a Pro Bowl once in New Orleans, but am not sure....

Oldefarte| 12.2.09 @ 10:41AM

Quin, I wasn't sure either and found the following is from BAYOU BUZZ/Ed Staton:

"Former Raiders punter Ray Guy secured his place in punting lore during the 1976 Pro Bowl in the Superdome.

As he prepared to boot one, Guy peeked up at the video screen hovering high above midfield. Guy said nothing to his AFC teammates. But head referee Jim Tunney caught Guy glancing skyward.

"You're going to try it, aren't you? the ref said.

"Yep," said Guy.

Guy promptly ka-thunked one off the gondola, becoming the first punter ever to hit the Superdome video screen.

"To this day, that's the first thing I get asked about most," said Guy, who is in Hattiesburg helping his alma mater Southern Mississippi plan the school's 2010 centennial celebration. And he headlines a series of camps for punters, kickers with many of his pupils having gone on to college teams and the NFL.

He finds the work fulfilling. He has held camps in every state but Alaska and his work at USM gives him a chance to serve as mentor to young people.

"I love what I'm doing,: said Guy. "I'm trying to give back to them. Not just the student-athletes, but the students in general. When you cross that curb to real life, I'm trying to relate to them what that's like."

"More than the Super Bowls and Pro Bowls I played in, people want to talk about the time I hit the scoreboard in the Superdome.

Saints punter Russell Erxleben hit the gondola when he was with the team.

Guy can expect the topic to come up again these days. In the opener for the $1.2 billion Dallas Cowboys Stadium last week, Titans punter A.J. Trapasso boomed a punt off the underside of the gigantic video screen. The scene irritated Cowboys owner Jerry Jones, who accused Trapasso of goofing around.

"How high is high if somebody wants to sit there and kick it straight up?" Jones told reporters.

Looking back at the '76 Pro Bowl, Guy said he never would have attempted such a silly thing during a regular-season game. To the contrary, he made sure there wasn't a repeat when the Raiders returned to New Orleans for Super Bowl XV.

Guy told a groundskeeper during practice that week that the scoreboard gondola wasn't high enough. The groundskeeper assured him it wouldn't be a problem. Rather than argue, Guy took four footballs out to the practice field and drilled the scoreboard four times in a row."

The next day, that gondola was moved all the way to the top," said Guy.

Guy belongs in the Pro Football Hall of Fame, but he may not make it. He's been a finalist for selection since 1992, most recently in 2007 and '08, Guy didn't make the cut from 25 semifinalists.

Guy was and Brett Favre are the most famous athletes ever to slide through USM, but the fact remains Guy is no tin the Hall of Fame and Favre will be one day. Even worse to Guy, no player whose day job was punting has ever been selected by the voters.

"I'm upset, but it's not something I dwell on," said Guy. "Things happen for a reason. I'm a firm believer in fate, that sooner or later, if you wait long enough and you work hard enough, it will come around."

Guy, now 60, was the starting free safety and punter, backup quarterback and a player on the baseball team at USM 36 years ago. A first-round draft choice, he played for the Raiders from 1973-86. He was selected to seven Pro Bowls and still holds the record for most career punts in the game with 33. He led the NFL in gross average three times, finishing with a career mark of of 42.4 yards per punt.

His punts stayed in the air so long, former Oilers and Saints coach Bum Phillips once had a football he used analyzed to see if it contained helium.

There isn't a punter in the Hall of Fame. Sammy Baugh is in but he also was a star quarterback and defensive back. At least placekickers can point to Jan Stenerud, the lone kicker in the Hall of Fame. Morten Andersen will follow him.

Guy just wants to see a punter in the Hall of Fame, and it doesn't matter if it's him. He points to others who are deserving: The Dolphins' Reggie Roby, the Chiefs' Jerrel Wilson of USM, Herman "Thunderfoot" Weaver of the Lions and the Steelers' Craig Colquitt."

Former Saints punter Mitch Berger put it this way: "It's football, so a guy who is best at his position in the game deserves to be in the Hall of Fame, so if a guy has the statistics and he's been one of the greats in his job, I don't think there's any reason he should be judged unlike any other position. But we all know that's not the real world......."