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Eminentoes
Liberals Who Cling to Their Guns
Next thing we’ll learn is that they’re big on designer guns.
Few things animate the ire of liberals more than the right to bear arms. Liberals loathe the Second Amendment and when horrific tragedies like the massacre at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Connecticut rear their ugly head, they are quick on the draw to call for more gun control. But just don’t ask liberals to practice what they preach.
Senator Dianne Feinstein of California is readying legislation to re-introduce a ban on assault weapons. Yet, as Mark Levin pointed out, Feinstein owned a concealed firearm. She said, “If somebody tries to take me out I’m going to take them with me.”
When NRA President Wayne LaPierre called for armed guards to be placed in schools late last week, an irate David Gregory derided the idea during his interrogation of LaPierre on Meet the Press. Yet Gregory’s children attend the same school in Washington, D.C. as President Obama’s daughters. And yes, Sidwell Friends, a Quaker school, employs armed guards.
Of course, such sentiments are hardly new amongst liberalism’s leading lights. Back in 1981, the late Washington Post columnist Carl Rowan argued that anyone who wasn’t a law enforcement officer who committed a crime with a handgun should be sent to prison for ten years without parole. However, in 1988, Rowan would run afoul of the law when he shot and wounded an intruder at his D.C. home with an unregistered .22 caliber pistol. Well, Rowan didn’t acquire a badge in the intervening seven years.
So why is it liberals abhor the right to bear arms unless it concerns their right to bear arms? Why is it liberals ridicule the idea of an armed guard protecting the children of others but don’t give it a second thought when it comes to the protection of their own families? Because liberals believe that if only the world was as wonderful as they are there would be no problems. They see themselves as being in possession of enlightened, progressive virtue and that gun laws should be used to keep arms out of the hands of uncivilized, uncouth conservatives or anyone else who has the temerity not to share their worldview. It is the same sort of thinking that allows liberals to own SUVs, send their children to private schools, and obtain waivers from Obamacare without batting an eyelash.
On a personal note, I do not own a gun nor do I plan to purchase one. Nevertheless, I respect the rights of other Americans to make their own choices when it comes to protecting themselves and their families. I say this because I know most Americans are not Jared Lee Loughner, James Eagan Holmes, Wade Michael Page, or Adam Lanza. As such, the federal government and the mainstream media should not treat us as if we are.
With this in mind, I do not begrudge Senator Feinstein for carrying a concealed weapon to protect herself against those who had threatened her life. Nor do I begrudge David Gregory for sending his children to a school that employs armed guards. Nor, for that matter, do I begrudge Carl Rowan for brandishing a weapon when he found an intruder on his property all those years ago. But I do quarrel with Feinstein depriving other law abiding Americans of the right to defend themselves. I do quarrel with Gregory mocking the NRA for trying to protect all schoolchildren, not just those whose families can afford to send them to Sidwell. I also quarrel with Rowan for suggesting Americans who possess firearms should go to jail when he did not go to jail after he breached the law. Above all else, I object to liberals, living or dead, who engage in a policy of “do as I say, not as I do.”
So the next time you hear a liberal call for yet more gun control or decry a proposal from the NRA, there’s a good chance that liberal either owns a gun or has seen to it that his children are protected by, as LaPierre put it, “a good guy with a gun.” If liberals are honest with themselves they would tell you that they too cling to their guns.
About the Author
Aaron Goldstein writes from Boston, Massachusetts.
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SCMike| 12.27.12 @ 7:32AM
Thanks for the column. The Left believes that they know best what's good for everyone and are all too willing to put their crazy schemes into action.
Whether I need a firearm or a particular type of firearm is immaterial. As a citizen, not a subject, I deal with wants. As long as I remain law-abiding, it's my call, not theirs or some government official's.
Do not many officials at all levels enjoy taxpayer-provided bodyguards? How dare some try to deny the rest of us the ability to protect with deadly force if necessary what's near and dear to us?
cowgirl| 12.27.12 @ 7:40PM
Diane Feinsten has a CCW permit. I think she turned it a couple of years ago. Harry Reid also has a CCW permit.
Frank Drackman| 12.27.12 @ 7:33AM
You don't own a gun???????????
Do you have a jack in your car? jumper cables? that little thingy to get ice off your windshield?
Oh yeah, you probably don't have a car either, take the L, or the Tube, whatever that thing is where Bernie Getz showed those thugs a little "Sum-Sum".
Funny, last time I was in the Big Apple I asked a cop where the Bernie Getz statue was, I might as well been speaking Chinese...
Hey, I live in Atlanta, when it snows it's like Sherman's back...
And I know, its been a while since someone committed a mass murder with jumper cables, but but but but
Must be one of those Yankee Thangs, like letting a Football Coach committ buggery for 30 years, too bad none of those kids had a Raven 25 Auto(Made in America!) and not a bad gun actually, for what it is, last resort, when all thats between you and a hole in the ground is 6 rounds of 55 grain .....
But hey, thanks for supporting the ammendment so important, the founders even put it ahead of that one outlawing Slavery...
Frank
c. j. acworth| 12.27.12 @ 7:56AM
A .25 Auto? You're joking, right? Must be a Rebel Thing. I can't answer for all my neighbors, but this New Hampshire Yankee wouldn't consider anything less than a 9mm Auto, or a .38 Revolver. What I actually keep is a .45 Auto (1911. Classic U.S. hardware!) and a .44 Spec. Revolver. And a 12 GA. And that's just the first line. A .25 wouldn't stop the chipmunks that live under my back porch. ( Well, maybe if you shot twice.)
c. j. acworth| 12.27.12 @ 8:00AM
And by the way , Frank, Bernie Goetz was from New Hampshire. Unfortunately, we don't have a stsue of him up here, either. Cheers.
irish19| 12.27.12 @ 10:36AM
Is the .44 the Charter Arms? How do you like it?
Frank Drackman| 12.27.12 @ 11:17AM
Son of Sam loved it...
Eagle Creek| 12.27.12 @ 5:55PM
Son of Sam toted a .44 Bulldog..
c. j. acworth| 12.27.12 @ 11:18AM
Not Charter, Rossi. Not sure they are even produced anymore, I've had it for years. Like the Charter it's a 5-shot 3" barrel. Shoots well enough for the purpose. As I handload my own ammo I'm not restricted to the low-power factory stuff, which makes a big difference.
Frank Drackman| 12.27.12 @ 8:05AM
Only carrying one gun? must be a Yankee Thang.
Frank Drackman| 12.27.12 @ 8:07AM
and I was talking about a gun you wouldn't mind getting wet in the shower. As my teenage daughter(who packs a Smith & Wesson model 37 in her purse, like Joe Friday, umm I don't mean Joe Friday carried a Purse, although, lets see, not married, didn't seen interested in Strange...)would say, DUH!!!!!!!!
Frank "I carry a Magnum in my pants, and a gun too" Drackman
Moe Blotz| 12.27.12 @ 9:19AM
That little thingy for removing ice from a windshield is called a scraper. City residents ride the El, or elevated train, unless one lives in London where the City slickers ride in the Tube.
JohnD| 12.27.12 @ 8:33AM
I am saving up to buy a GI model 1911; best sidearm ever made, great stopping power. In the meantime, I rely on my 9x18 mm Czech Makarov CZ-82 auto. Polygonal rifled 3-inch barrel, very accurate for a small handgun, low recoil axis. My 11 year old can shoot it. I get dinner plate sized groupings at 25 yards with it. For home protection I have a modified semi-auto SKS with detachable 30-round mag, tactical side-folding pistol-grip stock, and a scope. Very reliable weapon, and very effective within 50 yards.
Frank Drackman| 12.27.12 @ 8:37AM
Ha! when I bought my CZ-82 I thought someone had forgot to put the rifling in the barrell...
Frank Drackman| 12.27.12 @ 8:42AM
@ John D, you probably know this already,
but dont waste your Shekels on a Colt, if you want the GI style, Springfield Armory's is nice, Mrs. Drackman likes the "Mil-Spec" basically GI with a larger ejection port and whatever they call it where they make the magazines easier to insert(Easier to Insert is Good).
For gun that can double as a club, the Norinco version of the GI is nice, if you can find one.
And since you have a taste for the Czech, the CZ-97 is one of the finest 45 autos ever made, but you need Janet Reno's hands to handle it...
Frank
JohnD| 12.27.12 @ 9:13AM
I wouldn't get a Colt, too expensive and you can get similar quality for half the price. I have a friend I shoot with who has a Springfield M1911 and I got to fire it and it is really nice. They make a cheaper "Range Officer" model as well. I wil get one soon, I just need to save up some money.
The great thing about polygonal rifling is that one cloth through the barrel and it is clean. The other great thing is that unlike grooves, polygonal rifling never wears out.
Frank Drackman| 12.27.12 @ 9:20AM
A gun barrel that never wears out??? How can that be?? Seems like that would violate one of Newtons laws or something, which is the other nice thing about a .357 magnum revolver, besides being able to practice with cheaper 38 special (what a great band!)rounds, ability to check your flinch with blank rounds,
where was I, oh yeah, Newton,
let your precocious 8 yr old shoot a 357 mag, he won't have to read about Newton's 1st law...
Frank "What?! I don't need hearing protection!" Drackman
JohnD| 12.27.12 @ 9:27AM
Maybe it does wear out eventually, but the bottom line is that polygonal rifling lasts longer than grooved rifling.
Bill8472| 12.27.12 @ 9:40AM
It's true you can save a couple of hundred dollars buying a Springfield Armory pistol than a Colt, but to get accuracy that approaches the Colt, you have to get an XDm. It's too bad Colt doesn't make the snakes anymore.
JohnD| 12.27.12 @ 9:46AM
If anyone out there could recommend a Make and model of 1911, I am all ears. I'd love to find a decent one for about $500. Anyone have the American Tactical Imports .45 or the Rock Island Armory? These can be had for about $400 but I am skeptical as to the quality and accuracy. Anyone have a make and model to recommend?
Frank Drackman| 12.27.12 @ 9:56AM
you should be able to find a SA GI or Mil-spec for $500, at least in Jaw-Jaw, see, thats what we do down here, buy guns at wholesale, and drive barefooted in our 69' Chargers with the Rebel flag on the roof and the "Dixie" horn, up to New York and make a 000 profit...
Umm Rock Island Armory? they're not made in Rock Island.
And the Springfields aren't made in Springfield either,
They're GUNS for cryin out loud, they've sort of figured out how to make them.
But seriously, if you have Man-Sized Hands the CZ-97 holds 10 rounds, you can carry it "Cocked & Locked" if you enjoy explaining to the Cops why you shot a hole in your wall, and it looks like something a Eurotrash bad guy would carry, i.e. "Cool"
Fra nk
Bill8472| 12.27.12 @ 10:12AM
The Rock Island clones, I've heard, are not good. I don't have any details, just scuttlebutt.
If I were you I'd get a Colt M1911A1 Government Model. They cost less than $1,000. The original is still the greatest. If you have about $1100 to spend, I'd recommend the Colt Gold Cup National Match M1911A1.
Colt is presently working on developing a new .45 semi-auto for the U.S. armed forces. They have a contract for 20,000 of them. The story I'm hearing is that the Army is not happy with the Beretta M9 and wants a new .45. Keep your eye on the firearms news. Colt makes great guns and the new military .45 seems as if it's worth waiting for.
In any event, if you want an M1911, get a Colt.
Bill8472| 12.27.12 @ 10:23AM
Remington came out a couple of years ago with what looks like a high-quality M1911A1 clone. I don't know how good it is, no one I talk to knows anything about them.
Bill8472| 12.27.12 @ 10:31AM
The Remington is called the R1. The American Rifleman did a review of it. They shot it at 25 yards and got patterns of between 1.5" and 3." Pretty darn good if you ask me, at 75 feet.
Here's what they concluded their argument with: "... the R1, while perhaps a bit rough in some aspects, is nonetheless generally solid and reliable. Its accuracy is much better than what you would expect for an entry-level pistol, and at $699 it strikes me as a very good buy."
They said problematic trigger pull, good barrel, very good overall workmanship cosmetically. Darned accurate to my way of thinking if what they say about those 25-yard results is true.
Cpm| 12.27.12 @ 1:08PM
Smith & Wesson, Taurus, and Ruger also have high quality clones of the fabled 1911 Colt.
JohnD| 12.27.12 @ 10:24AM
I heard the Marines were buying .45s. I don't know why they switched. I know the 9mm Beretta loads 15 rounds and the 1911 8 rounds, but with the 9 mm you have to shoot someone three times, the .45, just once.
Riff Raff| 12.27.12 @ 11:05AM
As I understand it, the Military switched to the Beretta because they wanted to standardize on the 9mm Parabellum NATO round. Beretta just won the contract. I have a Glock .40 and a Colt .45. I have no 9mm and no plans to acquire one. Unimpressive.
SUBVET| 12.27.12 @ 11:16AM
A little pricy but a Sig Sauer 226 40cal...... the Navy Seals use this as a weapon of choice.
Bill8472| 12.27.12 @ 12:55PM
P226 Elite Dark. Adjustable tritium sights. You can get it in either 9 mm. or .40 cal. Holds 15 9 mm. or 12 (I think) .40 cal. in its mag.
SUBVET| 12.27.12 @ 1:08PM
Bill....the P226 - 40 cal. Tactical Operations comes with 4-(20) round super capacity mags.
Bob James| 12.28.12 @ 3:43PM
Most Marines still use the Beretta M9. IIRC, special operations forces are armed with Kimber 1911s (as is LAPD SWAT), which are given some fine tuning by USMC armorers at Quantico.
c. j. acworth| 12.27.12 @ 11:21AM
Mine's a Springfield, had it for years, shoots great. Also have a .22 conversion unit for it from Ceiner, which adds to the versatility and makes for cheap practice.
Ronsch| 12.27.12 @ 12:28PM
John, I used to have 3 before the tragic canoe accident and all of my firearms were lost overboard.
I had 2 GI models, and one concealed carry model of the RIA pistols. I put about 4K through the GI models and another 500 through the concealed carry within 3 months (I know, not a lot.) Never a hiccup on any of them. I had additional Chip McCormick magazines for them as well. I got all three originally for slightly under $1200.00 from Sovereign Guns in North Carolina, IIRC. the really cool thing was that the GI models were consecutively numbered and came in hard plastic cases. Generally, my groups suck anyway with sidearms, but out to 50 yards I was hitting a paper plate (9" size roughly) with the sights provided.
The fit and finish is way better than what I was first qualified on in the national Guard back in the early 1980s and what we had in the armoury.
irish19| 12.27.12 @ 10:39AM
I have the Norinco. Once I got the barrel replaced with a GI spec one and had some new sights installed, it was very reliable. Several thousand rounds through it without a hitch.
Occam's Tool| 12.27.12 @ 4:35PM
CZ-82? Thanks.
JohnD| 12.27.12 @ 4:45PM
I recommend it. Nice pistol, decent stopping power, excellent accuracy, easy to handle. Great sidearm for females, too, as it is easy to handle but powerful.
Gr0w1er601| 12.27.12 @ 3:07PM
Carried a .45 ACP Colt Commander in my SV-2 during deployments in the Nav. (Had to open-purchase my own SV-2 and have it modded to take the 20G instant acceleration requirement to hold the Colt plus one extra 7-round clip.) Never did like the S & W .38 snub-nose we were issued.
Matthew Quigley| 12.27.12 @ 7:56PM
.45 Long Colt revolver, rifle in same caliber, 12-gauge pump-action shotgun, double-barreled 12-gauge coach gun, and a Sharps sporter in .50-90...those are just the first line of defense. An AR-15 and an M1911A1 are backing these up.
We do things right in the West.
Frank Drackman| 12.27.12 @ 8:33AM
correction,
I mean to say,
"last resort, when all thats between you and a 250 lb Homo Penn State Coach who wants to play Hide the Salami is 6 rounds of 55 grain....."
Frank
Bob K| 12.27.12 @ 1:19PM
And here I thought there was an Annual Bernard Goetz Subway Shoot held every year in his memory!
Cobalt| 12.27.12 @ 8:15AM
Federal Premium Self Defense 9mm Hydra- Shock JHP 147 Grain
c. j. acworth| 12.27.12 @ 8:41AM
Cobalt, do you remember all the hooraw over Winchester's line of Black Talon ammo? They "shot themselves in the foot" with their marketing campaign, the gun contol crowd freaked and the stuff was banned. I bought a box for my .45 as a reminder of how crazy these people are. Still have it. Of course, there is plenty of comparable stuff available, but I handload my own ammo. Components are easier to find than comleted ammo these days.
Cobalt| 12.27.12 @ 9:28AM
I think my nephew had some Black Talon ammo, just to collect. Now he reloads his own ammo.
I have heard that if one use reloads for self defense, instead of using what law enforcement officers use, that you could someday have a bad day in court. However, I have no idea where the truth is on this subject.
RAMIII| 12.27.12 @ 10:26AM
'tis true -- just be prepared for the lawyers to eat you alive. Best to buy self defense ammo.
irish19| 12.27.12 @ 10:41AM
I think that if you can prove you're not warming up your loads-or if you use hardball rather than hollow point-you will have an easier time.
Still be a pain, though.
c. j. acworth| 12.27.12 @ 11:27AM
I've never heard of a case where someone got in hot(ter) water for defending themselves with handloads instead of factorty stuff. Fact is anyone who shoots a bad guy is in for a bad time. He (or his surviving relatives) will almost certianly sue in civil court even if the Prosecutor says you were justified. Be prepared for big legal bills at the very least. Still, as 'tis said, "better tried by 12 than carried by 6."
JohnD| 12.27.12 @ 8:26AM
I think the gun rights crowd is winning this argument. As the media beats the drum for gun control, the great unwashed seem to understand that it is not a solution. Now we are seeing the hypocrisy of the gun grabbing crowd: David Gregory feels the DC gun laws are for me, but not him, Obama sends his kids to a Quaker school with armed guards, but doen't want YOUR kid protected, and guns and ammo are flying off the shelves in a spree of panic rivaling the fall of Saigon. (The web sites I buy ammo from are all announcing 5-10 day delays in just PROCESSING orders).
One thing to consider. Since I doubt the rest of the world is prepared to devote 25% oif their GDP to financing our debt, the dollar will collapse, and the army and cops will cease to be paid. How can the Govt that cannot pass a budget and has racked up $16 trillion in debt decide its last official act i to disarm private citizens before the government we are supposed to rely on to pretect us ceases to exist?
danimal| 12.27.12 @ 9:24AM
Simple. They printed/ borrowed more money from China so the Department of Homeland Security could buy 1.4 billion rounds of hollow point .40 cal to better 'protect us'.
Rhoetus| 12.27.12 @ 7:58PM
Are they afraid that the PRC is going to send thugs to re-posses the White House?
SUBVET| 12.27.12 @ 11:22AM
John.........the day after sandy point in CA they had over 5000 apps. for weapons.
JohnD| 12.27.12 @ 1:51PM
I think these stories of fevered gun buying is proof the anti-gun crowd is losing the argument. Sounds too like people agree that "the only protection against an evil man with a gun is a good man with a gun."
Frank Drackman| 12.27.12 @ 8:28AM
9mm? guess it was enough to kill Hitler, hard part is getting the bad guy to shoot himself in the mouth...
When you absolutely, positively, need to kill every MoFo in the Room, except no substitutions*...
.357 magnum I like a few 158 grain fmj's if your target, I mean the bad guy's hiding behind something, and the 125 grain JHP for(insert gruseome anal-ology here)
*HT "Jackie Brown" 1997
Thom| 12.27.12 @ 9:16AM
Frank,
I used to use a .357 (aka high speed 38. Special). The problem with every magnum is that it takes a lot more powder, recoil and a longer barrel to produce the same energy that an auto can and the resultant package is either a very large and heavy handgun or a very light one that hurts most people to shoot. Your typical 4” or less .357 doesn’t produce any more power than a .38 Super but recoils to such an extent to make accurate rapid fire impossible. To get .357 power out of a revolver you need a 6-8 inch barrel. Out of anything less you will get the .357 recoil and muzzle blast but not the power. A 2 inch .357 snub firing 125s produces the same energy as a 9mm with same weight bullets. One is uncontrollable for rapid fire; the other is controllable. It wouldn’t matter what you give NYC Cops as they can’t hit their targets at point blank range half the time.
JohnD| 12.27.12 @ 9:25AM
Not a fan of revolvers. Double action revolvers have too heavy a trigger pull to stay on target, and the gap between the cylinder and the barrel causes a loss of muzzle velocity due to escaping gases. I do have an old Nagant 7.62 gas seal revolver which is fun to shoot, but its not what I'd grab if I heard glass breaking in the middle of the night.
Frank Drackman| 12.27.12 @ 9:29AM
Other nice thing about revolvers, you don't have to hang around the scene picking up your spent casings...
I mean HANG AROUND THE RANGE, bent over(bad for your back)looking for your spent casings TO RE-LOAD...
Frank
Thom| 12.27.12 @ 9:57AM
True but you had better get the job done in 5-7 rounds. If you look at FBI violent assault stats you will see why a 5-7 shot revolver is not where you want to be today. 50% of assaults are 2 or more attackers these days. Most people are little better than NYC Cops for hit percentage….
Bill8472| 12.27.12 @ 10:21AM
If it takes more than 5-7 rounds to finish a firefight, you're in above your head.
Thom| 12.27.12 @ 10:40AM
How many rounds did two NYC Cops fire at a guy who didn't fire at them that missed and hit 9 bystanders? Clearly the NYC's finest were over their heads....?
Bill8472| 12.27.12 @ 12:57PM
People have this fantasy about cops. Just remember they qualify with the 12 gauge shotgun and the 9 mm. pistol once a year. The rest of the time they might never touch a firearm. I wouldn't give the NYCPD cops much credit for marksmanship.
JohnD| 12.27.12 @ 1:53PM
I practice every Friday, with rifles, assault weapons and handguns. I typically spend at least three hours there at the range when I go, and shoot 300-500 rounds all told.
Thom| 12.27.12 @ 4:03PM
I don't give NYC Cops credit for anything but demostrating what happens when you get "free" ammo to shoot.
Rhoetus| 12.27.12 @ 8:00PM
Or the Los Angeles County Sheriff Deputies.
Bill8472| 12.27.12 @ 9:32AM
I, a shooter with the .22 and the .45, whose handgun shooting is right on the cusp between NRA Marksman and Sharpshooter, probably making me a slightly above average handgun shooter, am able to shoot nearly as good shooting double action as single action. The heavier trigger pull of the double-action firearm can be managed with practice and patience.
Another advantage is that a double-action firearm equipped with a decocker can be carried with greater safety with a round in the chamber and deployed more quickly than a single-action firearm, which is more dangerous if carried with a round in the chamber.
JohnD| 12.27.12 @ 9:42AM
Bill, good points all, especially about shooting in double action. I have one revolver and the trick is to hold the trigger just at the point before the hammer striking which makes the final trigger pull lighter. That does take practice and getting a feel for the trigger.
I have several friends who have revolvers bease they feel they are more reliable than self-loading automatics that can jam or malfunction. I guess it is a mtter of personal tastes.
Frank Drackman| 12.27.12 @ 9:27AM
Hey, not every Man can handle a Man's loads, its why they make Corvettes with automatic transmissions...
Frank
JohnD| 12.27.12 @ 9:30AM
I just prefer an automatic, its easier to shoot on target and better muzzle velocity.
JohnD| 12.27.12 @ 9:48AM
Frank, if you can put one round between the targets eyes on the first shot, it doesn't matter what you are carrying.
markenoff| 12.27.12 @ 11:04AM
Even if you can do that on the range it doesn't mean you can when you are defending yourself or your loved ones in a high pressure, probably low light situation. I want something that stops with a torso shot.
JohnD| 12.27.12 @ 11:17AM
Also a good point. Its one thing to be on target on the firing line of a range, but getting the job done in a stressful life or death situation is another thing altogether, very hard to simulate at a range.
Pecos Pete| 12.27.12 @ 10:39AM
My revolver is a Dan Wesson 357, 6" barrel. Loaded with 125 grain hollow points. This revolver is a double action and very accurate out to 25 yards. One reason I like it is that it makes one hell-uva-a loud bang that scares anything within a quarter mile. Oh yeah, and it stops what it hits.
I agree that this type of revolver is too heavy for most people.
Thom| 12.27.12 @ 10:44AM
Pete,
I carry a long barreled .357 or .44 Mag in the “field”. The things I carry it for can’t shoot back and don’t bring friends….
Frank Drackman| 12.27.12 @ 10:53AM
Can't shoot, no friends??
YOUR'E GONNA SHOOT STEVEN HAWKINS!?!?!?!?!??!?!
I'd watch out, he's probably got some bullet deflector shield or something...
Occam's Tool| 12.27.12 @ 4:37PM
And a laser on the wheelchair. Voice activated. Stephen Hawking.
markenoff| 12.27.12 @ 10:55AM
Must be a pretty small room holding 6 or fewer targets and you can't even engage with controlled pairs if there are more than 3.
When I "absolutely, positively, need to kill every MoFo in the Room" I'll take my Glock SF21 in .45. I replaced the plastic guide rod with titanium for better control and it accepts a standard 13 round magazine and a hi cap 26 round magazine. Two hi cap mags and 4 standards allows me to fire 104 rounds of JHP before I need to reload a single magazine. Should allow me to take out every zombie (by zombie I mean Obama voter of course) in almost any room. Back that up with my Beretta 92 series in 9mm (like to be able to practice with the same type of gun the Army issues me and I can use JHP in my personal weapon) with 11 magazines holding 15 rounds each and I could clear a whole floor of a public housing project without pausing.
Al Adab| 12.27.12 @ 8:42AM
If laws prevented crime, there would not have been a murder since Moses came down from Sinai. Law defines the limits but it does not create proper behavior or a moral society. Respect and adherence to the law comes from with mixed with a healthy dose of fear of retribution and punishment. The criminal class is just that and does not care about consequences.
Job| 12.27.12 @ 1:00PM
very true, folks don't want to spank little Johnny and the first time he hears the word no is when a cop is telling him put down the gun. Maybe they should train the cops to say "time out".
CJW| 12.27.12 @ 1:26PM
Al Adab
If criminals would obey the law they would obey the law to not kill, rape, steal, etc.
Got Richard Brookhiser's biography of James Madison as a gift. Madison wrote most of thc Constitution and Bill of Rights, and with Jefferson, founded the Dem party. It was called the "Republican" the "Republican Democrats" then just Democrats.
Madison believed the purpose of the Second Amendment was to give citizens and states the power/ability to keep the federal government from usurping the rights of citizesns and states. He cites Federalist 46 to support this argument.
Interesting that the founder of the Dem Party believed in the Second Amendment, state's rights, and a small federal government of enumerated powers. As president, he vetoed a bill to build canals and roads. He thought it was a great idea, but not enumerated as power of the federal government. Today's Dems believe in a powerful federa government passing laws on every conceivable area.
Hope you had a pleasant Christmas.
Warrior| 12.27.12 @ 4:23PM
They believed in "r"epublican ideals and principles and were statesman. Today we have "R"epublicans and Demcrats with no "r"epublican ideals (needless to say, none of them are principled) and I can count the statesman on the fingers of one hand.
markenoff| 12.27.12 @ 3:33PM
One fundamental premise I believe is that our civilization is constantly being invaded by barbarians....we call them children. The most barbaric are teenage boys. The traditional patriarchy has served two fundamental purposes throughout history 1) to inculcate civilized mores and values into these barabarians, something that often requires the implicit threat of physical force to the teenage males (Lord knows I needed that "incentive") which the father provides but a single mother cannot and 2) to protect young women from those predatory barbarian males who have not been civilized.
Liberal social policies have destroyed the patriarchy in the inner city and the rot is spreading (where was Adam Lange's father?). So we have a higher and higher proportion of young male barbarians who are preying on a higher and higher proportion of young women who have no patriarch to defend them and they in turn give birth to boys who grow up into barbarians and girls who grow up to be impregnated and abandoned by barbarians and the cycle continues until civilization breaks down.
We are always one generation away from "Lord of the Flies".
Thom| 12.27.12 @ 8:50AM
Aaron,
Not having a “gun” means you have no stake or skin in the game. Like those that aren’t registered to vote or don’t but complain about the direction of the country your words are hollow in effect.
Those that embrace their rights end up bearing the burden of exercising them. That means protecting you and yours while you can’t return the favor to your neighbors. Think of the guy who comes over every week to borrow one of your tools but owns none and has nothing you need to borrow from him. You are freeloading in effect.
Those that do embrace and exercise their 2nd amendment right are subject to a variety of government inconveniences and cost. They are also subject to punitive actions simply because they do. With any liberty goes responsibility. Choosing to not exercise your 2nd amendment rights means in effect that you are avoiding the responsibility that goes along with that. That’s your right but until you and other’s with your mindset have skin in the game you are as much a part of the problem as those that want to keep their guns but take those of others.
The 2nd amendment underpins every other enumerated right including the one you exercise here every day and take for granted the cost paid to enshrine those in the Constitution. You don’t have the rights you have as a result of pretty words written in a blog. The first 8 amendments in the Bill of Rights came about as a direct result of tyranny and were paid for in blood.
Nancy in NC| 12.27.12 @ 9:07AM
I disagree. You chastising Mr. Goldstein is similar to the thinking of the liberal that wants to tell you what to do. A true conservative does not make those type of judgements. It's none of your business.
JohnD| 12.27.12 @ 9:21AM
Given where Aaron lives (he has mentioned it here before) I understand why he doesn't have one. For years, I was where Aaron is; didn't own any guns but was a staunch supporter of the 2nd Amendment. When I married my first wife I sold my Remington 870 pump 12 gauge because I didn't want to get shot with it. Now that my son is old enough to learn how to use them, I have guns again. I feel much better knowing that if something happens, I have the tools to defend my home and myself.
Frank Drackman| 12.27.12 @ 9:24AM
You were afraid your wife would shoot you with a Shotgun?? Talk about your rough sex.
Frank "8 inches of Hard Cold Steel, and a Gun too" Drackman
Moe Blotz| 12.27.12 @ 9:33AM
My compliments on your HUGE imagination, Frank.
Moe "Stick this in your smoke and pipe it" Blotz
Thom| 12.27.12 @ 9:40AM
Really Nancy? About half the country doesn’t pay income tax and the bulk of those people vote for things they don’t have to pay for. Same principle here. The bulk of those that don’t own a “gun” depend on others for their “defense” even indirectly or are morally cowards and buy into the arguments that disarming those that have “guns” is a solution to a problem. People who say things like “I disagree with what you say but will fight for your right to be free to speak” often can’t follow through on that sentiment in reality. “Arms” have a very specific capability and function throughout history. We aren’t talking about the right to keep and bear condoms here. The abled bodied and minds in Switzerland and Israel don’t get the option to opt out of defending the republic. They have nothing like the per capita crime we have because they exercise the rights and responsibilities that go along with that most conservatives in this country only talk about.
jothepro| 12.27.12 @ 9:18AM
Hey Thom, Where did you get your reasoning skills? The 2nd amendment wording has nothing to do with the government telling people they must own guns. It gives you the right. If Aaron wouldn't have mentioned that he doesn't own a gun, would we know that the words he spoke were hollow?
Moe Blotz| 12.27.12 @ 9:27AM
The second amendment does not give us the right to keep and bear arms. The second amendment tells the creeps in government that they can not take the right away from freedom loving Americans.
Riff Raff| 12.27.12 @ 11:09AM
Correct! Government likes to tell us that Government "gives" rights to people. Government is wrong and should be frequently reminded.
danimal| 12.27.12 @ 9:33AM
No! The 2nd Amendment doesn't 'give' you the right, you were born with it. The bill of rights merely recognizes and codifies certain restrictions on what government can't do. That's why liberals hate the Constitution. It doesn't grant government any authority to decide what a right is and who gets to exercise it.
Thom| 12.27.12 @ 9:51AM
I’m not telling Aaron what he has to own; I’m simply telling him that by choosing to not own one he has no power to protect all those other rights he takes for granted. It is easier to disarm 10 guys with arms than 20. The whole game plan here is to disarm a few (like the Rich bearing the majority of the tax burden) in order to make it acceptable to disarm more later. Aaron has self-disarmed thus no effort will need to be expended there. A right not exercised disappears in time. History is real clear on this. No skin in the game; no liberty in time.
markenoff| 12.27.12 @ 10:39AM
Notice the difference between the wording of the 1st and 2nd Amendments. The first says "Congress shall make no law...." whch would still allow for the possibility of other governments making laws regarding free speech, religious freedom etc (at least until "incorporation" under the 14th Amendment). However the 2nd says "the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed." Period end of story, by any level of government at any time. No incorporation needed for this amendment to apply to states and cities.
irish19| 12.27.12 @ 10:46AM
"Period end of story, by any level of government at any time. No incorporation needed for this amendment to apply to states and cities."
We have a winner.
Bill8472| 12.27.12 @ 9:27AM
The First Amendment allows Aaron to express his opinion in a public forum on any issue he chooses.
Frank Drackman| 12.27.12 @ 9:41AM
Aaron can say he's a sissy, and we can make fun of him.
WHAT A COUNTRY!!!!!!!
Bill8472| 12.27.12 @ 9:43AM
Amen.
danimal| 12.27.12 @ 9:47AM
Sorry. The 1st Amendment doesn't 'allow' anyone anything. It, along with the rest of the bill of rights limits what government can do. Aaron was born with the right to speak his mind and worship any deity as he sees fit. The 2nd Amendment is there to reinforce that fact. It is an expression of our right to be governed by advise and consent. Armed citizens have at their disposal the ultimate form of redress when government abuses their authority.
Bill8472| 12.27.12 @ 9:51AM
Sorry. The First Amendment ALLOWS Aaron to express himself because it acknowledges the existence of the right to free speech and bars government from restricting Aaron's speech. The existence of the First Amendment places a restriction of government action and by doing so, allows Aaron to exercise his God-given right to free speech without government intrusion into that right.
So yes, "allows" is the correct term in the context in which I used it.
mike 3/505| 12.27.12 @ 4:04PM
Bill,
Sorry....Your usage of "allow" was absolutely incorrect. We, aren't "allowed" to express ourselves...We inherently have that right by the grace of God and because we exist. We would have it, whether or not, the Constitution and the Bill of Rights existed. Words mean something. How you use them and in what order, adds or detracts from the meaning...often turning truth into falsehood.
Bill8472| 12.27.12 @ 4:58PM
Yeah, tell it to the Russians who got "tenners" in the gulag because they said something the powers that be didn't want them to say.
It's all well and good to claim that you have the right to say what you want, but when it comes to acknowledging that right, governments don't always do that, and they can wreck your life for exercising that right.
Therefore, as a practical matter, "allow" is the correct term. You're mistaking the concept of government "allowing" you to do things with the "allowing" that a law that restricts government from interfering with your rights can do to permit you the God-given rights you have.
Sturmudgeon| 12.30.12 @ 12:13AM
I would think that you meant to say: 'by advice and consent'
markenoff| 12.27.12 @ 3:39PM
Only if "public forum" is defined in a very narrow sense to include "traditional" public forums but not necessarily all public property. The First Amendment only restricts Congress, and by extension the federal government and , with incorporation, state and municipal governments from engaging in the banning of speech, really political speech as the Founders saw it. Neither the Founders nor the current Supreme Court would agree that "The First Amendment allows Aaron to express his opinion in a public forum on any issue he chooses" if what Aaron chose to do was to read graphic pornographic literature out loud on a crowded street corner or outside a place of worhip as the worshipers were leaving.
N8tivTxn| 12.27.12 @ 9:04AM
The author has ably demonstrated that our liberal rivals really only wish to live within a class system, with special laws for themselves, leaving the unwashed masses apart, as a social experimentation laboratory, they can view from behind bulletproof glass, amusingly tweaking after each new census reveals another decade of progress lost to their frivolous ideas.
RichTex| 12.27.12 @ 10:37AM
Remember that the rules are different for the Vanguard of the Proletariat. They get to have the guns. Nobody else can.
Frank Drackman| 12.27.12 @ 9:23AM
Thats Right, Aaron has the right to cheer for a baseball team of overpaid prima-donna has-beens in an over-rated park that wouldnt be allowed in double A ball if it wasn't for it's "History"(Losing to the Yankees ump-teen times is History?) and if he had a gun, he'd probably have shot himself 30 years ago...
Frank
Bill8472| 12.27.12 @ 9:26AM
The liberal push for restrictions on guns except for themselves (who NEED those guns to be available for protection, unlike the Great Unwashed, who are "bitter clingers") reveals and clarifies the great problem with modern-day progressivism: most of us are stupid rednecks who must be led by the enlightened among us, to wit: the liberals, who as the current equivalent of Plato's philosopher kings, know better than the rest of us.
Riff Raff| 12.27.12 @ 11:12AM
To understand the politicians' mindset of keeping guns for themselves and disarming innocent victims, one must realize just who it is that politicians are afraid of, and it ain't your common criminal.
JGW| 12.27.12 @ 9:28AM
I guess, in Aarons case, or anybody elses, it depends on where you live.
I've always lived in rural and suburban areas since owning my first.
I like to target shoot. I also like the self defense, just in case, aspect, and what I currently own reflects that.
Ruger Single Six .22LR/WMR, 10/22, SR9c and Remington 870 Express. Plenty of ammo for all.
The Single Six has a 9" barrel. The 10/22 has an optonal Ruger 25 Bx magazine and scope.
The SR9c will shortly have a CCW to go with it.
Forunately, I live in UT. Low crime rate, probably because practically everybody out here has something and we have concealed carry.
Would I like an AR type? Maybe, but I would most likely go with a Mini 14.
JohnD| 12.27.12 @ 9:36AM
The Ruger 10-22 is a nice rifle. Very accurate. As I mentioned above, I used to own an Remington 870 pump 12 gauge which was a very nice shotgun I used to use for deer and rabbit hunting. a 12 gauge is the best weapon for home defense, although I currently do not own one. I really like the Mossberg 500 series, the only shot gun that meets U.S. Mil Spec. I know a Marine who carried one in Afghanistan. Very nice tactical shotgun.
markenoff| 12.27.12 @ 3:45PM
I like my Mossberg Persuader in 12 gauge with pistol grip. It is my home defense weapon of choice. My wife uses a Mossberg 20 gauge semi auto. Eliminates the need for her to rack another round and the SA action absorbs some of the recoil. Only drawback might be that an assailant, not hearing her rack the gun might think she doesn't have one in the chamber. They might find out the hard way.
Like my Ruger mini 14 in .223. A little more difficult to disassemble/assemble than an AR but the accuracy is awesome.
Frank Drackman| 12.27.12 @ 9:44AM
Bill Ruger is one of the biggest Gun Control Supporters in the US, and I'd sooner buy an AK made by Chink Slave Labor than contribute one Shekel to that Commie.
Umm at least that's what they used to say at the Gun Shows I went to 25 years ago when you couldn't just go on the Internet and buy whatever you wanted.
And what real American (Man)would want a gun called a "Mini"??
Frank
JGW| 12.27.12 @ 10:09AM
Frank,
Bill Ruger has been dead for a number of years now and I've never heard that comment about him you allude to.
As to the Mini 14. It is a very capable Carbine about the same length as an AR-15, chambered in .223 as well as .30 cal. All so available with 20 rd. magazines. Also known as the Ranch Rifle, if that makes you feel better. Go to the Ruger web site and check it out.
Frank Drackman| 12.27.12 @ 10:23AM
JGW, I was disparaging Mini-14,s when you were but an undifferentiated spermatogonium in your dad's Scrotomium..
OK, I don't know how old you are, but Mini-14's are finick-ier than Morris the Cat, and good luck finding spare parts.
I know, Ruger will fix it, IF it's under warranty, and you registered it, bla bla bla.
Oh yeah, those magazines are wimpy too, compare one to the bludgeon the AK magazines could do double duty as..
Frank
JGW| 12.27.12 @ 10:31AM
Frank,
That would be 65. To each his own, but I prefer a walnut stock as a bludgeon.
markenoff| 12.27.12 @ 3:49PM
Spare parts have never been a problem for my mini. Midway USA and Wolfe gunsprings have just about everything you need to do a complete rebuild. I expect when I get home today my new recoil spring for my mini will have arrived.
Mine isn't "finicky". Takes any lot I have fed it (off the top of my head PMC, Winchester, Remington and a couple of off brands) with never any issues.
Frank Drackman| 12.27.12 @ 10:26AM
And this is just summarized from Wikipedia,
"In 1989 Bill Ruger sent a letter to every member of Congress recommending a federal ban on magazines GREATER than 15 rounds"
Hmmm would have meant alot of business for his Company, Nicht Wahr???
But if your happy with small copies of the real thang, blaze on!
Frank
JohnD| 12.27.12 @ 10:28AM
The Ruger Mini-30 hoots the 7.62x39mm round (same as the SKS and AK-47) which is not a very accurate round beyond 100 yards. I was talking to someone at the range who had one, and he was disappointed with its accuracy and range. I'd prefer the Ruger Mini-30 chambered in NATO 7.62x51mm (Winchester .308) which would be more accurate and have better range, but then basically you would have an M-14.
Bill8472| 12.27.12 @ 10:47AM
If you're thinking Ruger Mini- rifles, why not go whole hog and get a Springfield Armory M1A? Or a semi-auto non-select-fire M14 (they're out there; look at gun shows)?
They're expensive but they're great rifles.
Riff Raff| 12.27.12 @ 11:17AM
Th reason I don't own an M1A is the two-grand price tag. Otherwise I would. I have heard nothing but praise for this weapon, and the Army is actually re-issuing the M14 in the field because of its power, range, and accuracy. Someday my M1A will come...
JohnD| 12.27.12 @ 11:20AM
The M1A is a nice rifle, but a disaster on full auto.
I have a Springfield arms, wartime manufacture, M-1 Garand. Beautiful rifle, great accuracy and rate of fire. Feels good in your hands and is fun to shoot.
Frank Drackman| 12.27.12 @ 11:40AM
can't control a 7.62NATO in full auto??
like (Dirty) Hairy Callahan said,
"Man's got to know his limitations"
umm OK, I can't either..
Frank
Bill8472| 12.27.12 @ 1:01PM
I'm having trouble understanding why anyone would want to fire an M14 on full auto. Expensive, the rifle isn't configured for full-auto firing, and I can't remember if the M14 was even designed for full auto. If it wasn't, it would have to be butchered into being full auto.
Frank Drackman| 12.27.12 @ 1:11PM
umm Bill, its like my old grandmother used to say,"Better to keep ones mouth shut, and appear to be a dumbass, than to open it, and remove all doubt" what can I say, she was a horrorcost survivor..
TBS, the M-14 was ORIGINALLY DESIGNED TO BE FULL AUTO, and I know I was yelling,
You ever see a real GI M14 stock? see that little empty space that looks like something should be there? Thats where the selector went.
OK, until they realized full auto 7.62 NATO in a non pistol gripped rifle wasn't the best thing.
And they actually had to butcher them to make them semi-auto only, grinding off the selector lug.
Frank
Bill8472| 12.27.12 @ 1:16PM
Given that it's been about 30 years since I held an M14 in my hands (although I see them, and M1As from time to time at the gun shop), I stand corrected.
Thanks for yelling at me. If you hadn't, you would have somehow failed in your life mission.
Bill8472| 12.27.12 @ 1:19PM
Still talking promiscuously about all the specific firearms you have at home, speaking about fools keeping their mouths shut, Frank?
Bill8472| 12.27.12 @ 1:20PM
"Dumbasses," not "fools," sorry about the error.
Bill8472| 12.27.12 @ 1:13PM
Oh yeah, now I remember, they were made with a select-fire feature, at least some of them were. It seems as if I heard somewhere long ago that they were intended to be used as a squad automatic weapon, and the full auto ones were issued one or two to a squad. Wow, that was a really long time ago.
JohnD| 12.27.12 @ 2:00PM
The M-14 was supposed to replace the M-1 Garand, the Browning Automatic Rifle, and the Thompson submachine gun. On full auto select fire, the weapon was uncontrollable due to the recoil of the 7.62 NATO round. It is a great semi-auto rifle, possibly the best ever made, but on full auto it was a disaster. Didn't last long in service either before being replaced by the M-16.
If you watch R. Lee Ermey's (Gunny) Mail Call show, he shoots a rifle by holding his left hand on top of the handguard (rather than below it). I think he was in the USMC when they issued M-14s, and that must have been how they were taught to shoot it on full auto to counter the muzzle climb.
I've fired an M-14 on semi-auto and loved it; very very nice rifle. My friend has one and he has let me shoot it.
Bill8472| 12.27.12 @ 5:00PM
The USMC loved the M14, and that rifle was issued to Marines headed for Vietnam for years after the M16 was adopted as the standard-issue rifle.
Thom| 12.27.12 @ 10:31AM
JGW,
The Minis are adequate for brief encounters with Orcs but not real suitable for sustained use. Once they get hot they shoot all over the back forty unless “glassed in” (Like their parent, M1A1, M14). While popular at some levels, they are not as popular as ARs nor are parts as available. Given they have the same capability and function as any AR/AK they will ultimately be subject to the same non sense. The “look and feel” nonsense fools morons only. A Mini is better than nothing but the last time I looked their price had risen to beyond a basic AR type and once you do what is required to maintain its accuracy it will cost even more in most cases.
JGW| 12.27.12 @ 10:40AM
John and Thom,
Thanks for the analysis and advice. Reasoned and informative. Plus, I'm glad I did'nt have to read a comment about your equipment package. Heh.
Von Mises Jr| 12.27.12 @ 9:32AM
Newsflash: The guns are to protect us from DiFi.
SUBVET| 12.27.12 @ 11:47AM
Hey guys..........TLP on vacation ?
Von Mises Jr| 12.27.12 @ 12:09PM
He is in the gulag. Obama has him in "prolonged detention" for "thought crimes."
It was deemed that he may be dangerous in the future: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v.....e=youtu.be
SUBVET| 12.27.12 @ 1:11PM
By who TAS..................?
Bill8472| 12.27.12 @ 9:42AM
Nice-looking firearm Ms. Feinstein is holding in the picture. Since I currently have a right to own one, maybe I'll start saving to buy one.
Bill8472| 12.27.12 @ 9:59AM
I saw on the TV news last night that firearms that look like that one are selling like hotcakes. Nice move, gun-control types. You made a so-so firearm a commercial craze.
dominic1955| 12.27.12 @ 9:50AM
I love it when DiFi does "Assault Weapon" show n' tell for us. Go on DiFi, jam the "high caliber SKS drum clip" into that "Bushmaster M16". You'd think she would bother to at least be familiar enough with what is what and what goes where for what so as not to look like a moron.
Our "progressives" as philosopher kings? Please. They are petty fascists/commies with a chip on their shoulder-at most.
Bill8472| 12.27.12 @ 9:52AM
I missed that altogether! ROTFLMAO!
Bill8472| 12.27.12 @ 9:56AM
The commies and fascists, when they held sway, also thought they were the modern-day equivalent of Plato's philosophers.
All people who believe in leadership by an elite in order to lead the Great Unwashed into their elite brand of Paradise are wannbe philosopher kings.
Too bad that if people really took the trouble to read The Republic, they'd understand that no one is ready to be a philosopher king until he's about 50 or 60 years old.
Robert Pinkerton| 12.27.12 @ 10:27PM
You and I are kindred spirits, Sir. Many years ago, I read the Princeton University Press Bollingen edition of Plato, all of the dialogues and all of the epistles collected between one set of covers. I re-read it four times, and the experience gave me a man-to-man gut-personal hatred for Aristocles Platon, b.k.a. Plato. You are at least as right as you know in identifying him as a totalitarian. But his mellifluous style prompts me to remember Norman Podhoretz' comment of Hannah Arendt coverage of the Eichmann trial: "... perversity of brilliance..."
PolishKnight| 12.27.12 @ 9:52AM
Liberalism takes hypocrisy to the sublime. Their whole agenda doesn't make sense: make the world into Sweden by changing the USA, and even Europe's, demographics into that of Mexico and Africa. Bash white males as the source of racism and sexism while simultaneously living in white male neighborhoods. The only thing their agenda is successful at is creating corporate fascist environments where their cronies and oligarchs exploit the masses as bad as robber barons of 100 years ago.
But... and here's the but, the Republicans are not much better in that they're truly stupid embracing socialism and racists to make a quick buck at the expense of their electorate. Those lawns don't have a leaf on them. That's what is important to them.
markenoff| 12.27.12 @ 10:46AM
Please do not insult the so called "robber barons". If your talking about Carnegie, Rockefeller, Morgan, Vanderbilt etc. they made their money making goods and services, whether steam ship rides, kerosene or steel rails cheaper and better than their competitors. They were market entrepenuers. Contrast them with the political entrepenuers such as Stanford and Fulton who used the power of the government to throttle their competition and obtain subsidies for their businesses. They are the true robber barons whose descendants are the "crony capitalist" of today.
Frank Drackman| 12.27.12 @ 10:00AM
How about a "Million Magazine March" on Washington,
Millions of Gun, I mean Magazine Owners marching up the Mall, "Free David Gregory" T-Shirts...
OK, it would sort of suck leaving the guns behind...
Frank
Bill8472| 12.27.12 @ 10:19AM
I'd buy a "Free David Gregory" T-shirt just to savor the irony.
OregonBuzz| 12.27.12 @ 10:20AM
"If liberals are honest with themselves....."
Aye, there's the rub.
spike59| 12.31.12 @ 5:40AM
the "with themselves..." is superfluous; when has a lib been honest about anything?
Yardbird| 12.27.12 @ 10:26AM
One in twenty Floridians have carry permits. They walk among Floridians every day. They are the polite ones.
Lawrence Kennon | 12.27.12 @ 10:29AM
Don't own a gun, in New Hampshire, the "Live Free or Die" state? For home defense your absolute best choice would be an "Assault Rifle. The "carbine" version (similar to the military M4) would be best with a collapsible stock and 16" (legal minimum) barrel. That means you can make it relatively short - good in confined spaces (which is why SWAT uses them). Handguns are harder to learn to use well. The military in WWII and started issuing young officers the M1 Carbine instead of a handgun. Millions of M1 Carbines were made and many were later sold to the public with a "high capacity" magazines (20 rounds).
The .223 is nearly perfect for home defense. It is more powerful than a handgun, but less powerful than almost any other centerfire cartridge you can find on the shelves at a sporting good store. You can buy a 45 grain "frangible" version designed to not penetrate walls but poweful enough to dissuade criminals. Ammo is relatively inexpensive meaning you can go to the range and afford to put in some practice (which can be fun in itself). For home defense maybe just put in 20 rounds in the magazine. That way the spring doesn't spend months, or years, under full compression which can weaken them.
The really great thing about the 30 round magazine is you probably won't have to reload to defend your home. That is a very, very good idea. The short carbine version of the AR-15 with a high capacity magazine firing a not so powerful cartridge is the PERFECT home defense weapon.
Thom| 12.27.12 @ 10:35AM
"Millions of M1 Carbines were made and many were later sold to the public with a "high capacity" magazines (20 rounds)."
15 rounds..... 30 rounders came along with the M2 later...
Frank Drackman| 12.27.12 @ 10:54AM
later? as in late 1944...
Thom| 12.27.12 @ 10:58AM
Standard issue was the 15 round mags even in '44. The ratio of 15 round to 30 round GI mags is considerable.
JohnD| 12.27.12 @ 11:23AM
Yes, but the .30 cal carbine round is really a glorified pistol round. Not as good stopping power as an M-1 Garand firing a .30-06 round, and very poor range and accuracy.
Thom| 12.27.12 @ 4:18PM
John,
I actually shot NRA High Power with an M1. To the limits of its effective range it can be as accurate as it needs to be but it has the same inherent problems a wood stock Garand, M14 has. Mine was “glassed” like every other Garand and M1A1 is in NRA High Power shooting. Stopping power isn’t its strong point for sure but an M1 Carbine with a 30 round mag walks all over a 9mm pistol even at 50 yards. If Horandy loaded Critical Duty/Defense for 30 Carbines it would be more effective on top of that.
JohnD| 12.27.12 @ 4:53PM
I would agree it is better than a pistol, but not as good as a rifle. It was intended to replace the .45 for NCO's, and people who's specialty was not as a rifleman. My Dad carried one in Korea, because he worked in the Signal Corps. That said, it became clear to military planners early in WWII that most engagements were within 50 yards, so range and accuracy was not as important as rate of fire. The M-1 Carbine is really for personal defense, not offensive operations.
Frank Drackman| 12.27.12 @ 10:56AM
Aaron, I think its like they said when the Pope came out against Birth Control..
"You No Playa da Game, You No makea da Rules"...
Frank "playin like a mofo" Drackman
Frank Drackman| 12.27.12 @ 11:02AM
I think its a Cultural Thang Aaron,
When you live in a part of the US that actually lost a war, was occupied by an invading enemy army, in large part, because they didn't have enough guns, its only natural to want to be ready for the next time...
And there's just something about shooting an old Tube TV(gettin hard to find) with a 30:06....the painful bruise in the shoulder, ringing ears, faint smell of toxic gasses that probably aren't good for you...
Thats right, if Atlanta ever gets invaded by 25 inch Magnavoxes, I'm ready!!!!!!!
Frank "Rebel Yell" Drackman
Jack London| 12.27.12 @ 11:23AM
Feinstein had a carry permit way back in the 1970s. I think she's allowed to change her mind.
Does anyone here actually think we have a problem with guns?
c. j. acworth| 12.27.12 @ 11:35AM
The problem with guns is I just can't decide which one I "need" next. So many guns, so little time! (And money!)
markenoff| 12.27.12 @ 3:55PM
No, just a problem with gun free zones. Apparently the signs aren't big enough and psychos keep bringing their guns into gun free zones and killing a bunch of people. We don't need gun control. We need bigger "Gun Free Zone" signs so when someone decides to shoot a place up they will know that they and their guns aren't welcome there and they should go somewhere else like a shooting range or gun shop to commit "suicide by cop".
Thom| 12.27.12 @ 4:22PM
By your standards Jack, we have an enormous problem with “cars”. They kill 38,000 each year and half of them are drunk and 62% were drunk but not at fault. What are we going to do about our “car” problem?
Jack London| 12.27.12 @ 4:46PM
I thought we were talking about guns. But if we are talking about cars, is it not true we have done a lot of things to make them safer? It is also true that by about 2015 gun deaths will cross over and be the number one death cause ahead of cars.
JohnD| 12.27.12 @ 4:55PM
Yes, and many of those, if not most, are suicides.
Jack London| 12.27.12 @ 5:10PM
You mean like Adam Lanza?
But anyway:
"There are at least a dozen U.S. case–control studies in the peer-reviewed literature, all of which have found that a gun in the home is associated with an increased risk of suicide. The increase in risk is large, typically 2 to 10 times that in homes without guns, depending on the sample population (e.g., adolescents vs. older adults) and on the way in which the firearms were stored. The association between guns in the home and the risk of suicide is due entirely to a large increase in the risk of suicide by firearm that is not counterbalanced by a reduced risk of nonfirearm suicide. Moreover, the increased risk of suicide is not explained by increased psychopathologic characteristics, suicidal ideation, or suicide attempts among members of gun-owning households."
http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMp0805923
spike59| 12.31.12 @ 5:39AM
"Feinstein had a carry permit way back in the 1970s. I think she's allowed to change her mind."
---------------------------------------------------
Agree; but HAS she? Has she turned in her permit and gotten rid of her guns? I HIGHLY doubt it...
Petronius| 12.27.12 @ 11:34AM
When the Liberals talk "gun control", what they really want is opposition control. If you are one of Them, you can have anything. The plan has always been to disarm the rednecks they kicked out of Their Party so that the parasites they whore for votes can kill them. And the gang bangers on the streets of the cities will become true "agents of change." This is the meaning of those words, "vote for revenge."
Robert Pinkerton| 12.27.12 @ 12:04PM
The detriment of automatic and semi-automatic firearms, is their dependence upon ammunition regular from one round to the next, a luxury that just might become unavailable in an advanced SHTF situation. Automatics and semi-automatics spray brass all over the countryside, to the consternation of those who must reload ammunition.
Too, if I wanted a semi-automatic rifle, I would avoid the whole cohort of M-16 lookalikes, and go for the Ruger Mini-14. But if you insist on 5.56x45, there is always the Sako turnbolt.
Frank Drackman| 12.27.12 @ 12:45PM
ammuntion regular from one round to the next??
Oh you mean like Chinese Com Block Ammo, made by slave-wage peons who also all look the same from one round to the next.
If you really want a gun that'll shoot no matter what, and can be fully field stripped, cleaned, and put back together in less time than it takes to type this(hey I'm a slow typer) paraphrasing Ordell Robbie(Samuel Jackson)
"AK47, the very best, When you abso-lutely, posi-tively got to kill every mother fucker in the room, accept no substitutes"
Plus they look cool with the Banana Clip(How come noone calls em that anymore?)
Frank
Bill8472| 12.27.12 @ 1:06PM
I like the AK too. Can't beat that 7.62 x 39 round for under 100 yards or so. I had a buddy who said he had an AK-47 in Vietnam. He stored in his footlocker. He'd sometimes go into the field for lengthy periods of time; when he returned, he'd sometimes find the AK all rusted out. He never cleaned it. He said that all he had to do with it was step on the bolt and break the rust lockage, and he could take it out to the range and shoot just fine. Kalashnikov said he developed it for that kind of use.
fmm| 12.27.12 @ 12:31PM
To paraphrase your comment: I know most liberals are just like Jared Lee Loughner, James Eagan Holmes, Wade Michael Page, and Adam Lanza.
Cpm| 12.27.12 @ 1:19PM
The language of her new Bill mentions "Assault pistols". Swell.
Alan's Girl| 12.27.12 @ 2:00PM
I own one gun. Purchased earlier this year. What I have learned since:
Gun owners are always thinking about their next procurement. (That now includes myself.)
Frank Drackman| 12.27.12 @ 2:44PM
guns are like shoes,
theres shoes you wear to sin-O-gog, and shoes you wear to Kick a Little Commie Butt...
Or like Mrs. Drackman, a pair for every day of the year..:(
Frank
JohnD| 12.27.12 @ 5:01PM
Its true. I have more guns than I really need, but I am always looking for more. Sometimes it bothers me how much I enjoy going shooting at the range, but hey, I am not hurting anyone. The bulk of my gun collection is old military rifles. I have an M-1, a 7.35 mm Italian Carcano, a Russian Mosin Nagant 91/30 (great accuracy at very long ranges), a Spanish M43 Mauser, etc. I enjoy firing these old weapons, and getting a feel for their capabilities. I will never be able to know what it was like to be a Red Army soldier on the Eastern Front, but I do know what it felt like when they pulled the trigger on their rifles.
My next rifle acquisitions will hopefully be a Lee Enfield Mark II, a German K-98 Mauser, and a 1903 Springfield. I might also pick up an old Japanese Arisaka Type 99, as they can be had pretty cheap.
Gr0w1er601| 12.27.12 @ 2:56PM
I recommend a Colt Commander .45 ACP. It's easy to hold, even with small hands and packs a wallop. And don't forget the Trijicon® night sights.
Thom| 12.27.12 @ 4:30PM
Guns are like most tools. No one tool is suitable for all jobs and the jobs asked of them has created specialties over time. Like the child’s game of Rock, Scissors and Paper, each class of gun (pistol, shotgun and rifle) has specific strengths and weaknesses in certain situations. Tiger Woods has a cart full of different clubs for specific purposes and no one is telling him he has to use one club of all shots are they?
The_Faster_Gun| 12.27.12 @ 9:24PM
Guns are like the 'Barbie' for men.
My personal carry is a Ruger Bisley Vaquero .44mag SA. with 240gr. HE FMJ
Stan Redmond| 12.30.12 @ 11:58PM
Don't forget the ammo.
Gr0w1er601| 12.27.12 @ 2:51PM
An honest liberal... Talk about an oxymoron.
Anthony| 12.27.12 @ 3:27PM
I made the point about Carl Rowan last week.
But things are going to get even more dicy folks, perhaps your local leftist rag intends to copy the NY newspaper that published the names and addresses of people in the county with gun permits.
This was a dispicable act of personal infringement by a lefty paper that has no shame or qualms about doing anything in order to advance the leftist cause of banning guns.
Be prepared if this happens in your state. Be prepared to publish the names and addresses of any reporters or editors you might know.
These people have to be stopped cold!!
Alan's Girl| 12.27.12 @ 3:52PM
And to think how the ACLU howled when the names & addresses of the local registered sex offenders were put online.
markenoff| 12.27.12 @ 3:59PM
From NBC via Townhall:
"Adam Lanza, the madman who killed 18 children and two adults last week at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Connecticut didn't use a semi-automatic AR-15 style rifle, or what the media calls an assault rifle, to carry out his carnage according to NBC News. The media has been reporting for nearly two weeks that Lanza used a Bushmaster AR-15 inside the school. Now, authorities are saying four handguns were used by Lanza and that the AR-15 was left in the car and was never used."
My God! The mainstream media got their facts wrong!
Thom| 12.27.12 @ 4:34PM
This has been known from day one but the Media continues the lies...to advance its agenda. I've confirmed this through a state police source in the state I happen to be in right now. It never left the car which was what was reported on that Friday.
Will the truth please stand up?
Jack London| 12.27.12 @ 4:54PM
The CT medical examiner says the AR-15 was the primary weapon. Why would he lie?
Petronius| 12.27.12 @ 6:09PM
And who's side is he on?
Bill8472| 12.28.12 @ 10:22AM
Seems like it would be fairly easy to distinguish a 9 mm. pistol round from a .223 rifle round, even after it's been deformed. Even a doctor could do it, I bet.
bison cookie| 12.27.12 @ 7:55PM
A WARNING TO GUN GRABBERS AND COLLECTIVIST MEDIA: BY CALLING FOR GUN CONTROL, YOU ARE UNLEASHING YOUR OWN WORST NIGHTMARE
By screaming about how they wish to destroy the Second Amendment and disarm the American people, … READ MORE: http://bwcentral.org/2012/12/a.....nightmare/
Rhoetus| 12.27.12 @ 9:19PM
There are so many bed wetting Liberals in Washington that to own the laundry franchise there would make one a very rich man.
The_Faster_Gun| 12.27.12 @ 9:27PM
They can do whatever they want, pass whatever they want.... I'm just waiting for the zombie apocalypse.
;-)
Marc Jeric| 12.27.12 @ 9:28PM
If guns kill people then: pencils misspell words, cars make people drive drunk, spoons make people fat, matches result in arson, water drowns kids, heights make people fall, and socialism makes everybody rich.
President Obama sends his kids to a school where armed guards are used as a matter of fact. The school, Sidwell Friends School in Washington, DC, has 11 security officers. This is standard operating procedure for the school. And this is the reason people like NBC’s David Gregory, a gun control devotee, send their kids to Sidwell; they know their kids will be protected from the carnage that befell kids at a school where armed guards weren’t used – you know, “gun-free zones”.
Marc Jeric| 12.27.12 @ 9:36PM
If guns kill people then: pencils misspell words, cars make people drive drunk, spoons make people fat, matches result in arson, water drowns kids, heights make people fall, and socialism makes everybody rich.
President Obama sends his kids to a school where armed guards are used as a matter of fact. The school, Sidwell Friends School in Washington, DC, has 11 security officers. This is standard operating procedure for the school. And this is the reason people like NBC’s David Gregory, a gun control devotee, send their kids to Sidwell; they know their kids will be protected from the carnage that befell kids at a school where armed guards weren’t used – you know, “gun-free zones”.
Robert Pinkerton| 12.27.12 @ 10:15PM
Nowadays it goes by the name of "SXT Ranger." Gun stores here hid it under the counter if they had it, but most did not. None the less, when the company for which I worked had a Federal contract, a local LEO supply-type gun store sold it to me, but only after ascertaining that I did, indeed, work on a Federal contract.
cnredd | 12.28.12 @ 12:30AM
Let's not forget about Michael Moore's bodyguard getting arrested for trying to get on a plane with his gun.
Political Wrinkles
http://politicalwrinkles.com
Bill8472| 12.28.12 @ 10:20AM
What specific makes and models of firearms are specifically named in the Feinstein bill for gun prohibition? Can anybody give me a link to a site where I can find the list of 120 guns proposed to be banned?
jdmeth| 12.29.12 @ 8:45AM
I live in a rural area, I'm old and weak, yes I have a gun. I would rather have it and not need it than not have one and need one.
spike59| 12.31.12 @ 5:37AM
Feinstein: "rights for me, but not for thee"
Lgbpop| 1.4.13 @ 11:02AM
"If liberals are honest with themselves they would tell you that they too cling to their guns."
I couldn't care less if they were honest with themselves or not, but it certainly would be an epiphany if they were honest with the rest of us for once.