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Loose Canons
Throwing Conservatives Off the Fiscal Cliff
Will conservatives tolerate Speaker Boehner sacrificing them to make a bad deal?
(Page 2 of 2)
If just a few conservative rebels tell Boehner they won’t vote for a bad deal they can prevent him from making one. They need to agree among themselves on how to tell a good deal from a bad one, and that’s the easy part. A good deal is one that doesn’t raise tax rates for anyone. A good deal makes enough spending cuts — now, not in another “if-then” deal — to cut the federal debt in half in ten years or less without gutting the defense budget. A good deal will reduce and reform both Social Security and Medicare to ensure their solvency and decrease their cost.
If only a few conservatives make that their public position, others will join them both publicly and privately. They can block a bad deal if they try.
In the fiscal cliff negotiations, Obama has an opportunity to moot Republican opposition to his agenda for his entire second term. If conservatives take a stand now, they can thwart him and at the same time rein in their wayward Speaker. If they don’t, they may not get another chance in the next four years. No deal is better than a bad deal, for the nation and for every congressional conservative.
About the Author
Jed Babbin served as a Deputy Undersecretary of Defense under George H.W. Bush. He is the author of several bestselling books including Inside the Asylum and In the Words of Our Enemies. You can follow him on Twitter @jedbabbin.
Letter to the Editor View all comments (117) | Leave a comment
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LONE STAR| 12.10.12 @ 6:44AM
Boehner has been an unmitigated disaster. He has forced House Republicans to continue the bloated Pelose budget for three years, including funding Planned Parenthood and Obamacare...He has formed a coalition with Democrats to marginalize and freeze out the 50-60 true conservatives in the House...He is giving away the store by negotiating directly with Obama instead of allowing House Republicans to vote on what needs to be done: Pass an extension of the Bush tax cuts; end the death tax; lower corporate rates; kill Obamacare by defunding it; protect Medicare by stopping Obama from taking $700 Billion out; pass a Republican budget; impeach Obama for Benghazi and Fast & Furious.
Jack in Wi| 12.10.12 @ 7:58AM
Lone Star: Everything you say is true. Then they should defund the Afganistan war , and close down the bases around the world. Boehner has to go period. We need a real opposition in this country. The Republicans are becoming just like the parties in Ill. New York, and California, weak sisters of the Democrats. Their only intrest is in maintaining their own power.
TLP| 12.10.12 @ 9:03AM
'Boehnor's purge of Conservative Reps from Critical Committees should have sparked outrage amongst the the rest of the Conservatives.'
I don't get it.
That's not true. I do get it, because it's impossible to miss.
The House and the Senate are the Modern Day Equivalent of Sodom and Gomorrah. You've gained the whole world, now hang on to it NO MATTER WHAT, and to Hell those on the outside, and to Hell with your Immortal Soul.
Wasn't Eric Cantor supposed to be a "Conservative"? What about Cobourn? If anyone's kept an eye on him, they know that he is to Conservatism, what a Weather Vain is to the Roof of a Barn. He points whichever way the Wind is Blowing at any given time.
As I recall, Abraham gave birth to the Term: "Jewing the Price down" when he negotiated a better deal for lives of the people in those Cities, to no avail.
Good luck doing that Now, with this Sodom and this Gomorrah. You couldn't find a Whore with a Hearta Gold in that Cesspool, let alone a Righteous Man.
They like the Title. They like the Sweet Office. They like the Driver, the Washroom, and all of the Parties, Banquets and Soirées that people throw In Their Honour, for the Honour of Kissing their @sses. (Did I mention that they Vote for their own Raises?)
Power Corrupts. Absolute Power Corrupts, absolutely. The Unquenchable Pursuit of Mammon is the Root of all Evil. Now, throw in Gerrymandering, Free Mailing, No Term Limits and Insider Trading, and you've got The Devil's Lair.
You seem surprised.
chuck| 12.10.12 @ 10:07AM
Actually, they written it into law that they get automatic pay raises, so they can say that they DIDN'T vote for a pay raise. They have to vote NOT to get the pay raise.
Nice.
TLP| 12.10.12 @ 10:41AM
That's even WORSE.
TLP| 12.10.12 @ 10:43AM
Ya know, we had 293 Comments on Friday.
You coulda put us up over the 300 Marker.
I'm just sayin.
TW in SC| 12.10.12 @ 3:43PM
Boner is simply the example of a generational problem. There is a division in the baby-boomers that (I think) is the result of the first generation of being cool trumping all else. I don't have the space here to expound on all the variables but it has to do with appearing and doing those things that will gain him the most "cool" points. This is where sticking to doing what's right and what's necessary lags. This is where Ronald Reagan stood as the example of what the cool people don't like. They considered him stodgy, out-of-touch with the cool people and just a grumpy old white guy. Conversely, Boner is the kid in high-school who has little or no talent but is in with the cool kids because he has parties, is on "the team", says all the right, cool phrases, has the killer tan, can do some really cool facial expressions that people think are funny when making fun of someone who's like Reagan, etc.
Boner wants, more than anything, to be liked by the cool kids. Yet he never realizes that it's a fool's errand and they won't like him no matter what. Doesn't stop him from trying though. They'll go to his parties and let him patronize them because it serves their purpose. But they won't reciprocate and they don't and won't like him.
Simultaneously, the true conservatives in the party are a threat to his rank and position because they're not afraid to criticize him. And in the "cool" world...you can't have that.
Seek| 12.10.12 @ 6:27PM
A pretty bizarre projection of motive, wouldn't we say? How do you know that House Speaker Boehner's position on a budget deal springs from a desire to be seen as "cool" by baby boomers? He hasn't given the slightest indication of such a motive.
TW in SC| 12.11.12 @ 9:58AM
So what do you say Boner's motivations is/are?
Von Mises Jr| 12.10.12 @ 6:44AM
Red State Republican Governors should realize that no National dictatorial government is better than a bad National dictatorial government.
If Bo(eh)ner wants to be part of the DC Statist regime, he should at least be as honorable (and that's not much honor) as Arlen Specter and Charlie Crist and declare him a liberal Democrat.
Since Social Security and Medicare are bankrupt, and DC is destroying the military and the dollar, who the hell needs them?
The Red State Governors do not have to fall for the straw man argument of Obama and the socialist in the Democrat Party, nor the Statist in the liberal GOP Establishment. It is time to start "nullification" on a grand scale.
TLP| 12.10.12 @ 12:55PM
Here's my Movie Anology of John Boehnor at The Fiscal Cliff negotiations: The Life of Brian.
That was the Funniest Movie of all time.
The People's Front for Judea.
Boehnor is the guy in line for Punishement, who, when asked by the Roman Soldier (Obama): "Stoning or Crucifixion?" He tells Obama that he's been Pardoned. When Obama gets a perplexed look on his face, Boehnor starts cracking up and says: "I was only kidding. I'm here for Crucifixion".
Just like now.
TW in SC| 12.10.12 @ 3:45PM
Always look on the bright siiiide of life, *whistle*.
TLP| 12.10.12 @ 5:07PM
Movie Analogy Contest on Friday.
Join us.
It's a scene, man. (Seinfeld)
If you wanna see what it's like?
Go to Last Monday's Story: Artist as Ethnographer.
Purp| 12.11.12 @ 7:38AM
Leave it to junior to come up with the dumbest idea. You just lost a major election by this kind of shenanigan ... but go ahead piss on America.
See what it gets you. Fool.
benny havens| 12.10.12 @ 7:27AM
After the election Speaker Boner stated “Obama won the election” and said that he would compromise.
What Speaker Boner needs to do is look at the election results map by county. Just viewing this map shows why the Republicans retained control of the House.
In 2010 Boner took the gavel and said that he heard from the voters, (with enormous help from the Tea Party), and would do as they asked. Of course he didn’t listen then and he is not listening now.
Wakeup Mr. Speaker, look at the map!
Jack London| 12.10.12 @ 7:47AM
You left out a word:
"Wakeup Mr. Speaker, look at the gerrymandered map!"
Mike W| 12.10.12 @ 8:25AM
Republicans learned gerrymandering from the best - The Democrat Party.
chuck| 12.10.12 @ 7:50AM
Boehner needs to go. Conservatives need to vote "present" on the Speakership, and deny him the 218 votes necessary.
Payback is a bitch, and Boehner needs to find that out.
Von Mises Jr| 12.10.12 @ 8:18AM
Boehner is Obama's bitch. He will take being beaten and abused just to keep the house, car and driver, as well as the lifestyle. American Exceptionalism be damned.
Purp| 12.11.12 @ 9:18AM
Might as well give up and bend over.
TLP| 12.10.12 @ 9:13AM
Chuck, you have abandoned The Contest?
If you're not coming, anymore, would it be too much to ask you to let your brother chuck, and your other brother chuck, know that they are still welcome every Friday and Saturday?
Thanks.
chuck| 12.10.12 @ 10:12AM
Sorry TLP, I've been swamped under with work lately. My remodeling business is doing really well. The Imperial Federal Government has destroyed home prices, so people are remodeling instead of buying new.
And truthfully, my sense of humor is somewhat depleted right now. I'm still in shock and mourning for the loss of my beloved country.
But I'll get in touch with Chuck and Chuck and get them to join the contest.
TLP| 12.10.12 @ 10:49AM
Cheer up.
As KennesawJack wrote me from his perch on the Toilet Seat, on Friday: This too shall pass.
Why waste time worrying about things that are out of your control?
Let Appleby do that.
KennesawJack| 12.10.12 @ 11:12AM
Still can't believe you saw where I was sitting.
Warrior| 12.10.12 @ 12:19PM
It would be even creepier if he passed you some toilet paper. Real bad mental image.
TLP| 12.10.12 @ 12:56PM
Saw ya?
I swear, I thought I could smell ya.
chuck| 12.10.12 @ 11:17AM
"This too shall pass." LOL
I think KJ is a little older than we are, TLP, so I imagine he's hoped for that a time or two whilst on the throne!
KennesawJack| 12.10.12 @ 11:43AM
Hah!
TLP| 12.10.12 @ 12:57PM
Too bad he's still waiting to pee.
Pecos Pete| 12.10.12 @ 2:44PM
And waiting, and waiting and waiting.
CJW| 12.10.12 @ 3:16PM
The problem with Reps negotiating with the Dems is that the Reps assume the Dems are interested in good faith negotiations for an agreement that benefits the country.
The Reps have not learned that the Dems are all about politics, to win the next election, to appease the looney left base, and to demagogue the Reps.
Reagan negotiated a tax hike and supposed spending cuts with O'Neill. We got tax rate increases and more spending.
Bush 41 agreed to tax rate increases, and was sandbagged by scumbag George Mitchell. Then Bush lost the election.
Now Boenher is in the same position as Reagan and Bush. The Dems want to raise tax rates, it is in their DNA, and will never agree to spending cuts.
Boehner needs to walk away, tell Obama to submit a written proposal, then reply. It is Obama's game, he is the president, let him lead.
Right now we have expiration of the Bush era tax rates scheduled for Jan 1, and automatic spending CUTS. Only in DC are spending cuts considered the fiscal cliff. This is the best deal we will get, go back to the Clinton era tax rates and spending cuts. I do not see this as a fiscal cliff.
Purp| 12.11.12 @ 9:33AM
The "Reps" represent the rich, not the people ...
Let's go over the cliff, the "Reps" are blamed either way. It's their fault we're in this mess.
And before you argue - Polls are 60% favor the Democratic position and 65% favor raising taxes on the rich. Even 51% favor raising all taxes!
You're on the losing side, period.
TW in SC| 12.11.12 @ 9:57AM
Purp said: "The "Reps" represent the rich, not the people ..."
And...Pelosi, Reid (who became a millionaire while in office on his salary as an elected official), Obama (who also has), represent "the people"?
Purp, your uptake on things has always been skewed by an angry tilt. Your love of socialism has also been very evident.
Purp| 12.11.12 @ 11:51AM
The Republicans represent the rich...
I don't love any "-ism" .. that's your problem
rjh| 12.10.12 @ 8:45AM
"After the election Speaker Boner stated “Obama won the election” "...Boehner seems to be confused. He thinks that Congress works FOR the President.
benny havens| 12.10.12 @ 3:03PM
Exactly.
According to my American Government textbook, printed in 1963, there were still three branches of government, all with equal powers.
I also had a constitutional law professor state that the Congress actually has more power then either the Executive or Judiciary branches.
Apparently the “what’s in for me” crowd elected their King. Or at least that is what Boner thinks.
Purp| 12.11.12 @ 7:39AM
Because they rigged the game with redistricting. Don't you know anything?
Kwan| 12.10.12 @ 8:24AM
You can't win a war if you don't first acknowledge that you are in a war. The left has made it clear that they consider themselves at war with our Constitutional Republic. To surrender to the left's agenda only moves us closer to becoming a Communist People's Republic. These are not normal times if Neville Chamberlain Boehner doesn't have the spine to be a War Time resistance leader, then he should stand down and let someone that does assume command. Let me suggest Darrell Issa as a possible candidate.
pogybait| 12.10.12 @ 8:28AM
Agreed, but it just isn't Boehner, the whole party is filled with this type of individuals and it just can't be explained away.
TLP| 12.10.12 @ 9:18AM
Remember the Pilot Episode of Battlestar Gallactica.
The Humans thought they were on a Peace Mission.
The Robots had other plans.
They were on a Mission to Blow the Humans to Pieces.
That is a Story as old as Civilization, itself.
Calling: Santayana.
Kwan| 12.10.12 @ 10:22AM
Good analogy. If more of these Republican politicians can wake-up and see these Democrats as Cylons trying to destroy the nation, perhaps they'll stop playing rope-a-doped chumps, that are complicit in advancing the left's agenda.
TLP| 12.10.12 @ 1:00PM
That's never gonna happen, as long as he stays Black.
Too scared.
Pathetic.
Purp| 12.11.12 @ 9:40AM
Not the Republic, Democrats are battling Republicans for the hearts and minds of the voters. And, Winning!
Darrell Issa? Ha! Corrupt politician and waste of a paycheck and millions of taxpayers dollars on witch hunts.
TW in SC| 12.11.12 @ 10:12AM
And how are they winning? It's pretty easy when they play Santa Claus and give taxpayer dollars to "the poor". Have you even looked up what the definition of "poor" is in the government lexicon? Bet you'd be surprised.
But when the spigot of free stuff is shut off (by the democrats in the future...because, as you said, they're winning the minds of the electorate) what then?
"The problem with socialism is that, sooner or later you run out of other people's money".
Purp| 12.11.12 @ 12:02PM
It's not "Free Stuff" no matter how much your side crows about it.
It's fairness and civil rights, not free stuff, not Socialism...
Stuff and socialism are your ideological words to create a bogeyman, an enemy that the rich think you will hate that is all. And, it works. Listen to you all harangue about something that you are completely clueless on.
And, that's why you lose. Your ideas suck.
Jacob McCandles| 12.10.12 @ 8:34AM
"A good deal makes enough spending cuts -- now, not in another "if-then" deal -- to cut the federal debt in half in ten years or less without gutting the defense budget. "
Goddammit! I'm sure Mr. Babbin knows that even the most aggressive spending cuts will still result in the national debt continuing to grow. Maybe he's talking about the deficit. Either way, I'm so sick of this BS about reducing the deficit. That's the democrats' language. Even if by some miracle we cut the yearly deficit in half, our debt grows to bankrupcy within 10 years. So I ask again: How are we not totally f----ed????
Tim the Enchanter| 12.10.12 @ 11:58AM
I thought you were dead!
Jacob McCandles| 12.10.12 @ 1:29PM
Still lurking about...
Al Adab| 12.10.12 @ 2:52PM
Proper reply is, "Not hardly".
Pecos Pete| 12.10.12 @ 8:38AM
King O wins if we go over the cliff. King O wins if tax rates are raised on those earning more than $250K. Those are, as Babbin states, the only options. So King O wins either way.
The best we can do is oust Boehner and elect a conservative speaker with cojones and a steel backbone. Fat chance that will happen. Boehner controls the committee assignments and the House money tree. Those who vote against him will be committing political suicide.
OP4| 12.10.12 @ 3:55PM
Nope - only the cliff has actual spending cuts, which are a loss for Obama.
Pecos Pete| 12.10.12 @ 6:59PM
The defense cuts will happen. The other cuts, no way Jose.
OP4| 12.10.12 @ 9:47PM
The House controls the spending. Unless they agree to undo the cuts, they stay. Given what a spineless wimp we have for a Speaker, you are probably right.
Purp| 12.11.12 @ 12:21PM
He wins either way ... taxes are raised, deficit goes down. He wins.
Spending cuts ensue, Republicans get blamed, he wins.
We go over the cliff, Republicans are blamed.
Works for me.
PolishKnight| 12.10.12 @ 8:39AM
I'm laughing here in that the Republicans have been throwing away their electorate for years. Now they're reaping the results. If they had protected their electorate via opposing race and gender entitlements, VAWA and the marriage penalty with the same enthusiasm with upper tax rates then we wouldn't be talking about this.
I chuckled at the author's use of the word "sequestration" in describing what the electorate will blame republicans for. How silly. Most are not familiar with the procedural nuances of the American parliament. They will simply blame GW Bush and "The Rich" because that's what the media and their own version of "talk radio" (comedians) will tell them to think. But it really doesn't matter. 75% of Obama's electorate are race and gender entitlement seekers who couldn't care less about such things. In the meantime, the elites of the Republican party might have to eat crow. My heart bleeds.
Purp| 12.11.12 @ 12:24PM
Actually, I agree with most of what you say. Wow.
Except for the "media .... tell them what to think".
Americans know what hurts them, that is all.
Seapuss| 12.10.12 @ 8:41AM
"A good deal is one that doesn't raise tax rates for anyone."
Agreed. But that is pie in the sky thinking.
Doing nothing means (1) draconian spending cuts to defense, (2) tax rates get raised for everyone, and (3) Republicans get blamed for increased taxes on the middle class, which they'd be forced to lower again next year.
A "bad deal" means agreeing to raise taxes on the top 2% (perhaps even higher than the Clinton rates) and doing nothing to rein in spending. Obama would love this because the GOP would have to vote FOR tax hikes on the top 2%--political suicide.
Why not just pass two bills--(1) extending the Bush tax cuts for the top 2% and (2) extending the Bush tax cuts for everyone else--and then go home? The Democrat Senate would table the first bill, as expected. But the Senate would have to pass the second and Obama would have to sign it into law. Same fiscal result as the first two options, but less political damage to the GOP, because (a) the GOP can't get blamed for raising middle class taxes and (b) no Republican has to vote FOR a tax increase.
What other "deal" to you think is possible?
R Martin| 12.10.12 @ 10:26AM
I like it. Have you sent this to Boehner's office AND requested a finder's fee?
KennesawJack| 12.10.12 @ 11:15AM
Yes. It's the only practical mechanism for giving Obamarx ownership of the result. Will Boehnor do it? Not a chance.
KennesawJack| 12.10.12 @ 11:16AM
Above in response to Seapuss. By the way, TLP, where do you suppose the name "Seapuss" comes from?
TLP| 12.10.12 @ 1:02PM
Ooooooooh.
Was she a Mermaid Bond Girl?
TLP| 12.10.12 @ 1:03PM
My mistake.
That was Seapussy Galore.
Never mind.
Seapuss| 12.10.12 @ 3:04PM
Noun 1. sea-puss - the seaward undercurrent created after waves have broken on the shore
Etymology: alteration of dialect seapoose tidal stream, from Unquachog (Algonquian language of Long Island, New York) seépus river
Drunken Sailor| 12.10.12 @ 4:58PM
Dang, and I was going to put my vote that it was Popeye's ex girlfriend.
TLP| 12.10.12 @ 5:10PM
That was the Sea Hag.
Think: Hillary.
Purp| 12.11.12 @ 12:34PM
Your next President - Newt Gingrich says so.
No More Rinos!| 12.10.12 @ 8:46AM
Speaker Boehner:
I DON'T BELIEVE you! I do believe that you will cave, capitulate, buckle, surrender, wave the "white Flag," STAB CONSERVATIVES IN THE BACK, and otherwise betray Americans who believe in limited government and the Constitutionally responsible governance that our Founding Fathers both imagined and codified!
SHAME ON YOU!!! You are as deceitful as the day is long! And, your deception goes well beyond ineptitude; you are purposefully deceitful as you seek to turn America over to the Liberal Left, Radical Egalitarian, Godless Relativists who have taken over Washington D.C. and the complicitous MSM!
TNRebelRouser| 12.10.12 @ 9:12AM
LONE STAR, I agree with you. Also, conservatives need to closely watch what is happening in states that have legalized marijuana and the Feds response to the passage of those laws. IMO, the left and its' supporters have already began the "nullification" process by passing legislation in direct opposition to current federal drug laws. If the Left can set aside and ignore federal law if and when it suits them, Red States should not hesitate to do likewise. Let's pick and fight our battles in the state legislatures and then thumb our noses at D.C. and let the chips fall where they may. Damn the torpedos!!
irish19| 12.10.12 @ 10:44AM
An excellent point!
Purp| 12.11.12 @ 12:37PM
The Red States already do, where have you been?
GobBluthe| 12.10.12 @ 9:29AM
I am no idea why conservatives are going to the mat for the top 2%. Those earning over 250k havent voted GOP in at least the last 3-4 elections. Romney actually carried those earning 50-250k, 8/10 of the richest counties went for Obama.
The low information voter and those on the left think we have $15.t deficits because of "tax cuts for the rich" But raisng the top rate to 39.6% brings in only $70-$80b per year. The Low Information Voter needs to see that happen.
The GOP should agree to raise the top rate, but that is it. No increase in the debt ceiling and no additional spending.
JP| 12.10.12 @ 9:56AM
Yes, it is ironic that the majority of those people earing between $250-500k a year live in Blue States or Blue Districts. And most of the spending increases benefit those well below those levels live in Red States. Yet, it is Red Staters who wish to roll back the spending increases, close loop holes but keep the tax rates structure.
So, to answer your question - it all comes down to power. Red States are willing to forgo the federal gravy train in order to keep the federal government in check. Blue Staters, of course want the opposite.
GobBluthe| 12.10.12 @ 10:03AM
What types of spending levels? Military, definitely benefits those states that lean GOP, but there are plenty of military installations in Dem states as well such as in VA or CA.
One loop hole the GOP should eliminate is the Federal Deduction for state and local taxes.
Al Adab| 12.10.12 @ 1:53PM
Right, pay taxes on the taxes witheld by other jurisdictions.
What I would like to see is a definitive list of the many taxes, not just income tax rates, which are set to begin in January. Everyone is this country is going to be very surprised.
Petronius| 12.10.12 @ 3:11PM
There are millions of US who do Not make $250,000 or more who WANT to become RICH! Obama's tax policies are a direct affront To US, and above all, to Our desires to accumulate enough wealth to insulate Ourselves from him and all his ilk of depraved miscreants regardless of complexion, predisposition, belief system, or any other animus opposed to traditional American Culture. If any on this thread do not understand that this type of taxation is an instrument of political and cultural subjugation, go read The Nation.
Purp| 12.11.12 @ 12:43PM
Please explain how we can pay for all the Republican spending IF we don't have taxes?
Doctor Right| 12.10.12 @ 9:49AM
There's an easy solution to this dilemma; Conservative House members should declare themselves independents UNLESS Boehner steps down.
JP| 12.10.12 @ 9:51AM
A few facts are in order:
The last budget before the recession hit in late 2007 had a $169 billion deficit. Bush implemented a series of emergency spending packages in 2008 totally about $800 billion.
Obama took the $800 billion in spending increases, added to them and made them ($1.2 trillion in new spending) the new normal. We've been running $1 trillion + deficits ever since.
It is interesting how the Beltway works. The Fiscal Cliff really is a one year budget cliff. Yet, Congress loves to do multi-year deals that are non-binding beyond the initial 2 years. So, a 10 year package worth $2 trillion in cuts actually has no cuts during the first year or two. All of the spending cuts are backfilled to later years and are not binding to future Congresses.
Obama and Congress act like the current budgets are "normal" The figure of 3.6 to 3.8 trillion in spending (of which $1.2 trillion) is set in stone. Boehnner never brings this up.
djn1313| 12.10.12 @ 10:10AM
speaker boehner has surrendered his jewels to obama's trophy case. The GOP needs to dump this traitor, otherwise the GOP is no different the the demoRAT progressive/socialists.
Purp| 12.11.12 @ 12:47PM
It's not Boner, it's the Republicants.
PandoraDoggle| 12.10.12 @ 10:30AM
Why insist that the cuts must not "gut" the defense budget? Why not expect America's allies to be more responsible for their own defense? Why not use the opportunity to show that the European welfare state - to the extent that it remains viable - is funded by American defense subsidies? We don't need a military big enough to defend the world from itself - we only need one big enough to defend us from the world.
Who Knows?| 12.10.12 @ 11:40AM
Boehner and his team, the Washington Generals, are just going through the motions, and will be predictably wasted by Obama and his Nigerian Globetrotters.
Relax, Jeb, and all you caring people out there.
The election is over, and over a month has already passed.
It’s too late to continue the “convincing others” game. Orders are being given, by The One, and all we can do is cover our own asses.
There’s really not much else to SAY, except that choices made have logical consequences. It was always going to require an event of huge magnitude to force people to wake up.
I figure a majority of Americans are like someone who’s still in bed, enjoying a pleasurable dream, but noticing the daylight, and wanting the dream to continue a while longer. However, “mother” is in the room, about to shake them out of their dreamy slumber, and they won’t like the waking state they’re going to have to traverse!
Reality always bites, and bites back.
My advice?
At least emulate Harry Truman, by going for brisk walks outdoors, as many times a day as possible. Get to know MORE than mere words about trying to con or convince OTHER people of this or that!
RCV| 12.10.12 @ 11:56AM
The reality is that the GOP has no leverage to work with. None. They lost the 2012 election. Obama ran on an explicit platform of letting the Bush taxcuts for the wealthiest Americans expire. The majority of Americans favor that. He's not going to give in on that point, and the GOP will be blamed for any failure to reach agreement by year's end. Boehner knows that, and the result is inevitable.
Zeppo| 12.10.12 @ 12:10PM
Mene mene tekel upharsin.
Al Adab| 12.10.12 @ 1:55PM
Indeed Zeppo, indeed.
KennesawJack| 12.10.12 @ 5:21PM
That it is.
Warrior| 12.10.12 @ 12:26PM
One question for you liberal geniuses. If the Bush tax cuts only benefitted the top 2% (as every liberal has pointed out now for ten years), then why does letting them expire hurt the middle class and lower income earners?
Al Adab| 12.10.12 @ 1:58PM
Good question that Warrior. With 50% of Americans holding some investments in stocks (mutual funds, pension funds, etc.) the increases in the dividend and capital gains rates will nail them all.
Purp| 12.11.12 @ 1:17PM
First, because the tax cuts for the rich included much more than just tax rates, which is all you hear about.
Also, losing 4% of income for upper income earners isn't going to hurt them or their lifestyles.
Losing $2000/middle class earner is a much bigger impact on tens of millions of people hurting them and the economy.
TLP| 12.10.12 @ 1:10PM
Obviously, with Liberals, FAIR has a different meaning than the Dictionary Definition.
Where I come from, FAIR means that EVERYBODY gets the same. It's only Fair, if everybody gets the Tax Cuts.
Plus, how is it FAIR when the top 2% are Paying 70% of all Income Taxes, while over 50% Pay NOTHING.
Hello?
Al Adab| 12.10.12 @ 2:02PM
FAIR, TLP would require that incomes, if taxed at all, would be taxed at the same rate for everyone regardless of amount or source. In fact, one could argue that the progressive income tax, with varying brackets and rates, violates the equal protection clause of the 14th.
TLP| 12.10.12 @ 2:56PM
Do I know you?
Al Adab| 12.10.12 @ 3:50PM
TLP:
Didn't we have that conversation the other day?
TLP| 12.10.12 @ 5:11PM
Who are you?
Al Adab| 12.10.12 @ 5:18PM
Simply the voice of one crying in the wilderness.
OP4| 12.10.12 @ 3:57PM
Wrong! No House approval, no new taxes.
No House approval, no raising of the debt limit.
They have ALL the leverage.
OP4| 12.10.12 @ 3:57PM
Wrong! No House approval, no new taxes.
No House approval, no raising of the debt limit.
They have ALL the leverage.
Purp| 12.11.12 @ 3:48PM
Not really - the people have the real leverage and they are motivated and paying attention closely.
Occam's Tool| 12.10.12 @ 7:41PM
Except that Boehner still controls where the money comes from. And he can let us go over the cliff by sending a status quo for one year budget and tax bill. Obama and the Senate can quash it, and then the cliff can happen. But they need to pass a bill out of the House.
Occam's Tool| 12.10.12 @ 7:44PM
On the other hand, Boehner is no Newt Gingrich. A balless, worthless, crawling weasel---from Ohio, of course. The most craven and gutless state in the Union.
Purp| 12.11.12 @ 3:49PM
Not very nice statement about Ohio... tsk tsk
Ronsch| 12.10.12 @ 2:03PM
And sadly, there is no way to get rid of Boehner...There are not enough true conservatives in the house to vote him out of the Speakership. Even if someone else were nominated, the few conservatives left would not garner enough votes.
RAM| 12.10.12 @ 2:15PM
If the currently drugged body politic will blame us anyhow, why exactly can't we do the right thing? Lying to everyone and betraying our principles isn't even expedient!
JmsA| 12.10.12 @ 3:42PM
The democrats need to raise taxes on the rich lest it be said, should the recovery ever come to pass, raising taxes on the wealthiest was not required. Besides, that's what their base wants, and keeping their base happy irrespective of the effect on the economy trumps everything else. After all, they control the propaganda machine, so there's truly no downside for the democrats absent an outright or catastrophic economic collapse--which in itself guarantees nothing other than the Republicans getting more than their fair share of blame for it.
cicero| 12.10.12 @ 4:41PM
We seem to be missing the beauty of the current situation. If the Repubs do not cave, and Obama holds his ground, we will have immediate spending cuts, and the pre-Bush tax rates will return. That will add about 20% more taxpayers to the rolls - the same folks that voted for Obama. Won't they be suprised! At the same time, there will be a huge spending cut.
The fact that the military will be cut somewhat presents a minor problem. We can handle that for a while. It will mean that those defense congtractors surrounding D.C. and environs will have to scale back, laying off, guess who - more people that voted for Obama. There will be large cuts in discretionary spending. That will affect those who work for the government - who voted for Obama.
Who knows, it may even cause the Senate to propose a budget just to show their friends where the money is actually going. It may force reform of entitlements just so they can retain some of their other pet projects. It will also have the benefit of showing the Dems that the Repubs are not the rubes they have always thought they were.
Pecos Pete| 12.10.12 @ 6:50PM
cicero: Good comment. I only disagree in that, if the "Bush" tax cuts are rolled back, it won't be for long. King O will demand that the "Obama" tax cuts for the middle class be implemented as of January 1, 2013. Congress will fall all over themselves passing it.
Pecos Pete| 12.10.12 @ 7:03PM
And then will come King O's demands for more spending for ... ummm, like unemployment benefits and extensions thereto. And more stimulus for investments in future good stuff that will be ripped off by the democrat fascists. The national debt cap will be ignored if not increased enough to provide for whatever the czars can think of.
Occam's Tool| 12.10.12 @ 7:51PM
I concur, Cicero. Nothing would amuse me more than seeing my nurses, 90% of whom voted for Obama, get a tax hike.
Go over the cliff. The Dems don't want it. As one of the greatest boxers of all time put it, "what ever it is the other fellow wants to do, don't let him do it."
Pecos, the House is still controlled by Republicans until the last half of Obama's term. And by then the legislature will be running him, not the other way around. Boehner has already been re-elected Speaker. All he needs is a willingness to go into history as a hero of this country. Unfortunately, he's from Ohio.
Ralph Novy| 12.10.12 @ 9:05PM
"Nothing would amuse me more than seeing my nurses, 90% of whom voted for Obama, get a tax hike."
Really?
Give me your real name/address and the names of your nurses, Occam. I'd be more than happy to pass along that sentiment to them. I'm sure they'll welcome you with "open arms" the next time you need their care.
You miserable little ingrate, you.
RCV| 12.11.12 @ 12:36AM
Boehner has come to realize, as have much of the Republican leadership, that the sooner they can disengage from the Bachmann-West tea party nut wings, the sooner the GOP can hope to recover its shattered public image. Your comment about your nurses, Occam, is Exhibit A on why the party needs a divorce from the xtremists on the right.
Purp| 12.11.12 @ 1:22PM
Bush tax cuts were always meant to be temporary ... so let them expire.
Mike Daly | 12.10.12 @ 7:17PM
Why are people assuming Obama is going to win here? People are forgetting his arrogance led to the 2010 election rebuke and 2012 did not qualify as a mandate. People are also forgetting his reckless spending is coming under attack with Obamacare now destined to die of a thousand local cuts with state governments not going to go along with it. For all the talk about Obama, the reality is becoming that the checks his ego is writing are starting to bounce.
Mike Daly | 12.10.12 @ 7:34PM
See also Charles Krauthammer's piece "Cliff jumping with Barack," which shows Obama doesn't hold as many cards as he thinks he does.
Ralph Novy| 12.10.12 @ 9:02PM
Babbin:
Suggest you take a gander at what Mickey Edwards had to say recently:
http://thinkprogress.org/econo.....-not-adul/
Once you've done that, please do get back to us about how unfair "Papa John" has been to these Tea Party Teenagers.
2blumutts| 12.10.12 @ 10:02PM
If the Republicans fold, they will never be forgiven for making a decision based on expediency, not ethics . We need new leadership with the marbles to see beyond, for the peoples' good. I can dream!
Purp| 12.11.12 @ 7:41AM
Forget a deal, let's go over the cliff, all taxes are raised and stay there.
The deficit will be cut 55% overnight, and you can stop whining - even though the budget shortfall is a result of Republican lawmaking.
Then, we can get to some serious discussions on the budget priorities.
Tell Boner NOT to make a deal. Good Idea.
sdfhlk | 12.12.12 @ 3:33AM
what a good topic with you on Merry Christmas