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The Obama Watch
In Government Obama Trusts
The Democrats leave God out of their politics.
On November 10, 2010, Obama delivered a speech, in which he mused on the glories of Islam among other topics, at the University of Indonesia in Jakarta. In the course of his pandering address, he changed America’s motto from “In God We Trust” to “Out of Many, One.” He intoned confidently, “In the United States, our motto is E pluribus unum…” Wrong.
Dismayed congressmen quickly contacted the White House to demand a correction. The White House refused. Congress then passed, 396-9, a bill reaffirming “In God We Trust” as the nation’s motto — a vote that an unapologetic Obama publicly belittled.
Obama’s Freudian slip in Indonesia fit with his secularist project for the United States. He is working to build a country in which Americans place their trust not in God but in government. He can’t rest until Americans recognize no higher power than his will.
Reflecting its master’s wishes, the Democratic Party platform set out to be secularist. Journalist David Brody reported this week that a line from the 2008 platform was revised to drop any mention of God:
This is the paragraph that was in the 2008 platform:
“We need a government that stands up for the hopes, values, and interests of working people, and gives everyone willing to work hard the chance to make the most of their God-given potential.”
Now the words “God-given” have been removed. The paragraph has been restructured to say this:
“We gather to reclaim the basic bargain that built the largest middle class and the most prosperous nation on Earth – the simple principle that in America, hard work should pay off, responsibility should be rewarded, and each one of us should be able to go as far as our talent and drive take us.”
Late on Wednesday, party bosses, in a moment of farcical strongarming and PR-driven panic, forced booing delegates to revert to the 2008 language. But the party’s true intentions had already been revealed.
Brody notes that the platform pays some lip service to “faith-based organizations,” but the paragraph he culled is less than reassuring. It is clear from the passage that the party only has use for religious groups if they push leftist causes, such as “climate change.”
Obama’s interest in religion is in direct proportion to his ability to manipulate it for secularist and socialist purposes. He seeks to destroy the ones that refuse his manipulation and hijack the ones open to it. Thanks to the leftward drift of religion in America for decades, the latter task isn’t that hard for him. Catch the manipulation and condescension in this line from the platform: “We believe in constitutionally sound, evidence-based partnerships with faith-based and other non-profit organizations to serve those in need and advance our shared interests.” What does “evidence-based” mean? Whatever the secularists decree.
The platform’s section endorsing gay marriage claims that Obama won’t try to hassle churches into supporting it: “We also support the freedom of churches and religious entities to decide how to administer marriage as a religious sacrament without government interference.” How big of them. But don’t believe it. Where gay marriage exists, religious freedom quickly disappears. In a second term, Obama’s federal regime of gay marriage would pressure everyone into supporting it through such measures as “hate crime” legislation and withdrawn grants.
Notice also that Michelle Obama has already given the game away, gushing on Tuesday night about the party’s support for gay marriage at the “altar.” She didn’t say “gay marriage”—apparently it is still the love that dare not speak its name at coded conventions—but that is what she meant in his line: “if proud Americans can be who they are and boldly stand at the altar with who they love…then surely, surely we can give everyone in this country a fair chance at that great American dream.”
Trying to edit God out of the platform is what one would expect from a party that boasts the most secularist president ever. From time to time, Obama even edits God out of the Declaration of Independence, referencing our “endowed” rights without bothering to mention him.
And then there are Obama’s secularized judges, all of whom share the “ACLU chromosome,” as Senator Jeff Sessions once put it. One of Obama’s cockiest judges, Michael Urbanski, is famous for ordering lawyers to edit the Ten Commandments down to the Six Commandments to exclude the ones that name God. One befuddled lawyer before Urbanski said that he had never received such an audacious order before. “Well, it’s going to come up today,” replied Urbanski. So it goes in Obama’s America.
About the Author
George Neumayr, a contributing editor to The American Spectator, is co-author, with Phyllis Schlafly, of the new book, No Higher Power: Obama’s War on Religious Freedom.
Letter to the Editor View all comments (176) | Leave a comment
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Darin| 9.6.12 @ 6:41AM
"Choose this day who you will serve."
- Joshua 24:15
"You cannot serve God and man."
- Matthew 6:24; Luke 16"13
Yes, the choice really is that simple.
The Avenger| 9.6.12 @ 10:55AM
Good point Darin, however, the dems think Obama is God.
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 1:49PM
If that's the case, why did President Obama demand that they change it? Which they did. Next non-scandal please! LOL!
TLP| 9.6.12 @ 4:11PM
I'm trying to think of an analogy for what's going on in Charlotte. Something other than Liars Poker.
Herding Cats? Monkeys with Typewriters? The story of the Blind Men and the Elephant?
This Convention is about Celebrating everything that's Wrong with this Country. Like having Everyone's Favourite SLUT speak about the rudeness she received, after attacking a Catholic Institution - Georgetown University - because they wouldn't pay for her Vaginal Creams and Condoms so she could continue Whoring around the town to the tune of 3,000 a year.
This is the same Georgetown University that The Muslim refused to speak at, until every reference to JESUS CHRIST was removed from the room.
There was Pukeahontas, from Massachusetts. The original "You didn't build that" POS. I wonder HOW she did, and was she wearing Moccasins? And why does our Domestic Enemy President insist on Plagiarizing Massholes? "Just Words?"
There was the VOTE to add GOD in to their platform, because everyone knows that GOD is for Taxpayer Funded Abortion on Demand, Partial Birth Abortion, and Snapping the little Bugger's Neck when he disobeys Mommy by not DYING during his Abortion. Everyone knows that HE's for Free Condoms, and Creams. Free Dildos and Vibrators. Free Needles and Meth. All of these things GOD LOVES, because the Children are gonna need these things, after their Anal, Oral, Vaginal Sex Instructions from their 3rd Grade Teacher. And, especially so, if they miss Masturbation Lessons.
TLP| 9.6.12 @ 4:11PM
GOD got booed at the Democrat National Committee last night, while a Lying Slut got a Standing Ovation.
Anyone surprised?
They had a Vote to Add the word Jerusalem to their Platform (which is 1 More Time than the Koran mentions it) and it got booed.
Obviously the little Nazi Propagandists - Jay Carney - was lying outta his ass when he said that his Master's position on Israel was well known. Really? Cause, what I take from his REMOVAL of Jerusalem as Israel's Capitol from the Party Platform, is that his position on Isreal is: Fck You. And, should he be re-elected?
Israel is Dead.
I hope my Jewish Cousins took their Heads outta their Asses long enough to see what happened, down there. Israel got BOOED at The Muslim's Convention. Go figure.
Then there was Billy. The 1st Sitting President to be Impeached, and accused of RAPE and Molestation, by two women, on National Television, in Primetime, on the #1 Show in the Country.
The 1st Sitting President to be charged with Indecent Exposure, and losing his Law Liscence for LYING to a Grand Jury.
The 1st Sitting President to leave DNA on a Fat Intern's Dress.
There he was. America's Favourite Pathological Liar, Serial Misogenyst, standing on the Stage, VOUCHING for The man who would Destroy America.
TLP| 9.6.12 @ 4:12PM
If that wasn't a CLUSTERFCK last night?
Then we need to get rid of that word.
Oldefarte| 9.6.12 @ 9:58PM
Q.What does Clinton and Obama have in common [as law school graduates]?
A. Neither currently has a current/unexpired law license!!!!!!!!
Von Mises Jr| 9.6.12 @ 7:11AM
Rev. Wright's preaching James Cone's "Black Liberation Theory" and "collective salvation" is antithetical to true Christianity. Catholics surrender to the Word of G-d through Jesus Christ and the Bible. "Collective Salvation" simply means that you surrender your soul to the state and the leaders of the state instruct on morals and faith.
I'll stick with Jesus.
Martin kzovich| 9.6.12 @ 7:13AM
The true nature of the Former so called Democratic Party should by now be revealed for anyone who had doubts--but with a functioning brain(required ).
They are Marxist-Leninist Communists supporting a ONE PART DICTATORSHIP of a hybrid type mimicking Western Europe and China and Cuba among others.
They cannot be negotiated with because there beliefs are in fact Anti-American thus against interests of the vast majority of this nation.
Once the their circus is over Romney and Ryan must take gloves and go full throttle exposing
for all to see the damage and and will be done should ( G-D forbid ) Obama be re-annointed.
All Romney and Ryan need do is expose the truth about these morons.
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 2:59PM
Now that the Dems changed their platform to reflect "God" on the request of President Obama, how does your little theory play out? LOL@IgnorantHaters!
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 3:42PM
The Foodstamp President was the one who wanted God & Jerusalem out of the democrat party plank.
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 3:56PM
I'm amazed at your ability to get inside our president's head. LOL! Are you aware of how the platforms, of both parties, are decided on? But let's say your conspiracy theory is correct that Obama took them out of the platform, thinking that nobody (such as his political enemies or conservative media) would notice, only to then ask them to put them back in? Hm, diabolical! Using your logic, Romney wants to force women who have been raped (even children) to carry those babies to term...even if she dies in the process. Nice guy...oh wait, Romney says he doesn't have to agree with his party's platform...completely.
Weasel says what?
TLP| 9.6.12 @ 4:14PM
The Buck Stops with The Muslim.
Is that too hard for you to get your hands around, Dumbass?
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 4:33PM
Why should I grasp an untruth?
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 4:36PM
It's not me, AC, it's according to Politico, brainiac:
"Obama had seen the language prior to the convention, a campaign source said, but did not seek to change it until after Republicans jumped on the omissions of God and Jerusalem late Wednesday. And even then, it had to be forced through a convention hall full of delegates who nearly shouted down the change…"
You were sayin'?
If the Foodstamp President didn't want God & Jerusalem excised from the plank, it wouldn't have been.
The O'Bama regime ordered it back in only when it became a problem. Spineless cowards.
You must be so proud!
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 5:06PM
That's Mr. Brainiac to you! LOL!
I don't take a conservative rag as the gospel truth on the doings of our president. BTW, being spineless is what Romney did in distancing himself from the platform (doesn't reflect all of the governor's views). If Obama had done the same as Romney, you would have tried to hang it around his neck too. And you know it!
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 5:14PM
Politico is....um...conservative?!?!
Bwah-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha!
You are delusional. May I sell you a bridge in Brooklyn?
Besides, it doesn't matter what the Foodstamp President did. Thanks to the moron Villaraigosa, the whole world saw the democrat party vote THREE TIMES against the amendment. Oh, and BOOOOO! God.
Your party is full of extremists, AC.
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 5:20PM
Right, who would think that a former Reagan aid (Frederick J. Ryan Jr.) run organization would lean to the right! LOL!
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 5:38PM
Ever heard of John Dean, Diane Sawyer, or David Stockman, AC?
Politico is full of liberals who swoon over the Foodstamp President.
NOBODY thinks they are conservative, Einstein.
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 5:54PM
I guess I'm the Terence Hill of politics then. ;)
Oldefarte| 9.6.12 @ 10:02PM
It was a Obama conspiracy, but a Democratic Party one [with his consent], but no doubt that [when the cameras are off] he does repeat his Christian mentor's philosophy of ......"G-D DAMN AMERICA"!!!!!!!!!
Purp| 9.6.12 @ 4:54PM
Really? I hadn't heard that... Wow you're sooooo with it in liberal circles. Who'd a thunk it?
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 5:06PM
LOL!
Oldefarte| 9.6.12 @ 10:04PM
Well "G-D DAMN AMERICA" as you athiests /Democrats would say!!!!!!
Stan Redmond| 9.6.12 @ 9:01PM
Obama can't keep track of who he is pandering too. The Godless anti-Israel Americans already vote for Obama and will no matter what. This was nothing more than a political trick to attract independent voters who are largely Christian.
Oh wait, he's still evolving.
Appleby| 9.6.12 @ 7:25AM
As I have said to many of my so-called atheist friends (whose position is usually, when you analyze it, "You don't exist and I hate You!"), whether or not you believe in God is as irrelevant as whether or not you believe in Gravity. Jump off the World Trade Centre screaming "I don't believe in gravity!" and see what happens next. The existence and influence of God in your life is entirely separate from whether or not you believe in Him. I have occasionally found an avowed atheist friend who is willing to try my thought-experiment: "Has something major ever happened to you just in time to save you -- and never again?" One friend admitted that he and his wife were just about to lose their home, when they won enough money, and no more, to save their home until they could get their feet under them again. I never press them to a conclusion, but in some cases at least, it makes them think.
Harry the Horrible| 9.6.12 @ 9:22AM
Don't have much use for atheists.
Six years ago, my daughters and I were in a terrible accident. While stopped to turn left, my Tracker was hit from the rear by a massive SUV at 40 mph (idiot driver was texting). The Tracker knocked off the road and exploded into flame, Hollywood style.
I yanked my daughters out of the back as quickly possible, but my youngest was badly burned. I had to put her out.
Guess what was stopped on the road by the accident? A fully stocked ambulance with two EMTs. While I was getting my daughters out, one of them was running toward me to help and the other was setting up...
My daughter was at the hospital within thirty minutes and on a life flight within two hours.
Don't try telling me it was just a accident of fate that my daughter didn't have to wait an hour or more for medical care, screaming as she started feel those third degree burns. I don't believe in God - I KNOW he that he IS there.
Appleby| 9.6.12 @ 10:28AM
I am sure we can all testify to such manifestations, and so could all the so-called atheists if they once sat down and thought about it. Here's one of mine: I was at my first race at Road Atlanta and standing on tarmac in an area where there were no fences obstructing, to take photos of racing cars. Suddenly a man took my arm and said, "Ma'am, you had better not stand there," or something similar. I was quite surprised, but promptly moved away, and just as I did, a Corvette came roaring down that piece of tarmac on its way to the garages -- it was the escape road from the track! When I turned to thank the gentleman, I saw that he was wearing a team shirt. The team name was "Archangel Motorsports."
TLP| 9.6.12 @ 4:23PM
I did Cocaine for 25 Years.
I was Arrested, more times than I wanna remember.
I stole from my Family, to get Drugs.
MY MOTHER HATED ME.
I lost my business, and everything I owned.
And, then, GOD brought my future Wife to me.
I stopped doing Coke.
I Married my Wife.
We have a House, and two beautiful Sons.
I belong to the Church down the Street.
And, my Mother and my Brother and Sister Love me, again.
I should have been DEAD, at least 10 times.
Don't tell me that GOD doesn't exist.
I'm living proof, that HE does.
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 5:09PM
"I did Cocaine for 25 Years."
Explains a lot, religion is a replacement addiction for many peeps. I'm glad you were able to kick it, but it proves nothing about the existence of a god. It only speaks to your narcissism that something that happens to you is proof of a universal truth.
TLP| 9.6.12 @ 7:37PM
Obviously, you're more of a Stupid Bastard, then I gave you credit for.
GOD is the CURE for Addiction.
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 8:09PM
LOL!!!
Oldefarte| 9.6.12 @ 10:10PM
It's "G-D", AH.....show some respect! Wait though you believe only in THE BLACK JESUS and his do-wop backups, the IT'S A BIG, F*&KING; DEAL FIVE HOMOS AND LESBOS, right??????
AmericanCynic| 9.7.12 @ 12:57PM
Somebody's off their meds.
Stan Redmond| 9.6.12 @ 9:03PM
Congratulations on cleaning up. This does remind me of the oft cited joke,
What's the difference between God and Obama? God doesn't think he's Obama...
JP| 9.6.12 @ 11:23AM
The Dems do believe in God. Wait until 2016. Hillary and Huma will have some Iman give the keynote address.
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 5:10PM
From your lips to Allah's ears!
LOL@SpecualtingHaters!
Oldefarte| 9.6.12 @ 10:17PM
The only "haters" I'm aware of go around apray paintin/defacing CFA buildings and physically harrassing homeless persons reading their Bibles in front of same. thats what FIGS do no doubt!!!!!
AmericanCynic| 9.7.12 @ 12:59PM
Well, that's not right.
Joellen| 9.6.12 @ 9:48AM
Harry, your testimony of your faith is one of millions. The truth is the Democrats/Socialist Party omitted GOD from their platform when they embraced abortion, same sex marriage and full government control. If last nights' debacle does not awaken those who have been asleep, well, then maybe we are lost. However, I do believe with what happened with the victory for Governor Scott Walker, Chic-fa-la, and the all the teaparty elections; I truly believe the country is finally awake - and this will be a victory for those who love Constitutional America. KEEP PRAYING ALL!
Pecos Pete| 9.6.12 @ 9:51AM
A Republican advertisement of nothing more than the God/Jerusalem amendment fiasco would be a fitting end to the democrat convention.
TLP| 9.6.12 @ 4:26PM
No.
A Cruise Missile would be the perfect end to this Clusterfck of a Convention.
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 5:21PM
The Dem convention is not for you, dude, so keep your little missile in your pants. ;)
TLP| 9.6.12 @ 7:39PM
How about I put my Missile in your Mouth?
Why do I think that you'd like that?
Oldefarte| 9.6.12 @ 10:19PM
Maybe like the cruise missle that HillBilly exploded on a Afganistan candle factory in retaliation for the numerous Muslim terrorist attacks upon our embassies and the WTC maybe????????
Mimi | 9.6.12 @ 9:55AM
The anti-GOD Democrats continue their chaos from the Whitehouse (lets do this/lets not) right into the convention. Marked by indecision and confusion...They CAN'T rule us so haphazardly for another 4 years....WE NEED STABILITY, SURENESS, CONFIDENCE.....This usually comes from a long life of CONFIDENCE and DEPENDABILITY in amighty GOD!
Peppermint Tea | 9.6.12 @ 10:01AM
Praying ALWAYS helps. Still, there are 40+ million aborted babies since 1970 who will not be paying for baby boomer retirement. The Ponzi scheme is about to implode.
Lord, bless this nation to see the error of its ways!
Purp| 9.6.12 @ 10:43AM
So what? God can take care of himself.
And, don't miss the part about separation of Church and State.... somewhat blurred in right-wing world.
The Avenger| 9.6.12 @ 11:00AM
Hey Perp, can you cite that part of the constitution for me?
Jacob McCandles| 9.6.12 @ 12:06PM
Nice. I can hear the chirping of the crickets......
Purp| 9.6.12 @ 4:30PM
Do you hear Bells too ? Look HARDER....
WB| 9.6.12 @ 12:10PM
Of course he can't. I sincerely doubt he can even spell the word "constitution" ...
Purp| 9.6.12 @ 4:29PM
wrong brainiac.
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 3:03PM
It's the same part of the U.S. Constitution that talks about God. LOL!
Are you familiar with Thomas Jefferson? After ratification of the Constitution and the Bill of Rights, he wrote in a letter to the Danbury Baptists "Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, & not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should "make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof," thus building a wall of separation between Church & State."
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 3:57PM
Crickets.
spike59| 9.6.12 @ 4:07PM
...and? a letter from Jefferson to some ministers, in which he cribs from Roger Williams, is now a legal document and somehow on a par with the Constitution????
this is what the Constitution says about religion in the First Amendment: "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof"...nothing more, nothing less...Jefferson was entitled to his opinion on the meaning, just like you're entitiled to yours, and i'm enttitled to mine. he didn't write it, and he was never in position to interpret it legally
TLP| 9.6.12 @ 4:31PM
The letter that Jefferson wrote to the Danbury Baptists, was in response to a letter sent by them, expressing their concerns that the State would set up a State Religion, not their own.
Remember, at the beginning of this country, States had State Religions.
Thus, The Establishment Clause.
His letter was an Admonishment to THE GOVERNMENT.
Not to the Churches.
Those are the FACTS.
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 4:43PM
No, his letter was letting them know that a State Religion was not going to happen because of what he described as a "wall." A wall is a wall no matter what side of it you're standing on.
You have the right to think what you will, but that is what a Founding Father thought. John Adams as well, otherwise he would not have written in the Treaty of Tripoli that America was NOT founded on Christianity. The truth hurts so much, that many Christians are willing to lie about what happened back then.
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 4:57PM
Jefferson had nothing to do with drafting the Constitution, AC. He was in France at the time.
Also, several of the states had "state churches" until the early 19th century. Nobody claimed that they were violating the Constitution, at the time. Not even Jefferson.
Try studying the actual Constitution of the United States of America, Einstein. Not marxist, revisionist history of it.
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 5:16PM
Nick, please show me where I said Jefferson drafted the Constitution?
I know it was Madison, Hamilton and Jay (ideas they floated via the Federalist Papers) that is responsible for that. Are you saying that Jefferson or Adams were NOT Founding Fathers? How dare you!? (AC says with distracting straw man outrage as many of you have).
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 5:28PM
Please show me where I claimed that you did, AC?
You keep appealing to a faulty authority, Jefferson & his letter (written 14 years after the Constitution was drafted) in your attempt to defend the bogus wall of separation argument.
I've merely shown that your authority has little to no authority, thus making your argument a logical fallacy. I'll give you some time to look all of that up on wiki, okay?
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 5:51PM
I don't use your source of choice, Nick. I'm also no longer interested in arguing with somebody that is clueless about the legal interpretation of the Establishment Clause.
Do what you have to do to prove the supremacy of your religion of choice.
Maybe you and your ilk should consider removing "God" from the Pledge (that you added in the 50's). If you meddling religious freaks were to do that, it would be constitutional to be recited in schools again! But, noooooooooo it's so much easier to blame the liberals for that. Cognitive dissonance much? Same thing with the motto, "E pluribus unum" is so much better than "IGWT." I'm tired of people like you claiming how important original intent, documents are in America, unless it's where you happen to have glued "God" on it recently!
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 6:10PM
Oh, did I hit a nerve, AC? You have "wiki historian" written all over your comments.
I've dealt with so many in the past, I can spot them a mile away.
Hence, your attempt to change the subject.
It was the racist, anti-Catholic Justice Hugo Black who pulled Jefferson's letter out of his backside in order to justify not reimbursing transportation costs for children who went to Catholic schools.
There is no "wall of separation" between the Church and state. Only the state is forbidden from interfering with religious organizations.
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 6:11PM
p.s. It only took you 23 minutes to look all of that up, AC? Not bad. You must be a speed-reader, huh?
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 7:30PM
Change the subject?
Try answering my question about your people's need to paste God everywhere and then get pissed at liberals when the courts strike down your revisionist addendums.
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 7:40PM
Yes, change the subject, AC.
Which was the bogus argument about a "wall of separation" between church & state being in the Constitution of the United States of America. Oh, and Jefferson's irrelevant letter.
Go re-read Burp's comment @ 10:43AM, and following.
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 7:50PM
"Jefferson had nothing to do with drafting the Constitution, AC. He was in France at the time."
I guess that was just a non-sequitur history lesson. LOL!
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 7:53PM
Proving you have no idea what a non sequitur is, AC.
Go look it up on wiki. I'll wait.
Oldefarte| 9.6.12 @ 10:54PM
No he was banging his slave at the time!!!!
Oldefarte| 9.6.12 @ 10:55PM
The original " Dreams" bestseller!!!!!!
Purp| 9.6.12 @ 7:25PM
Tsk, Tsk Nick ... Jefferson is the reason we even have a Bill of Rights. Madison didn't think it was necessary to spell them out. Jefferson pushed and so we have the Bill of Rights, thanks to Jefferson - THE writer of the Declaration of Independence in case you missed that piece.
Try studying the ACTUAL history of the Constitution, will ya?
TLP| 9.6.12 @ 7:42PM
Jefferson's letter was AGAINST GOVERNMENT INTRUSION into Religion.
Not the other way around, Dumbfcks.
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 7:51PM
A wall has two sides, TLP.
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 7:51PM
WRONG!, yet again, Burp.
How can you continually embarrass yourself, in public no less, on these threads? Are you some kind of masochist?
The first ten Articles of Amendment to the Constitution of the United States of America (a.k.a. the "Bill of Rights") was a result of the Anti-Federalists (go look them up on wiki, Burp) and all the other Americans who didn't want to ratify the Constitution, as written.
Jefferson was in France until September of 1789. Upon his return he became Secretary of State. He had nothing to do with passing the "Bill of Rights," moron.
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 8:12PM
C'mon, Nick, just cut-n-paste the wiki-articles here once you look them up yourself (my bad, I meant "conservapedia").
LOL!!!
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 8:34PM
Quit projecting, AC. Just because you can't refute any of the facts I've presented, so far.
Keep trying, though. I make mistakes....once in a while.
Purp| 9.6.12 @ 4:33PM
It's right up there with a government-created entity, a corporation, that it is a person, with rights of free speech, lobbying rights, etc. .
If you want to be literal, then your boys on the Supreme Court ought to heel... don't you think?
At least in this case, one of the Founders actually explained the intention.
How's the "Corporations are person" supported again?
CJW| 9.6.12 @ 6:01PM
Purp
You are a lying dimwit. If you really had a business, you would know that corporations are formed under state laws, and that a corporation is considered a legal person or entity by IRS and the law. For example, you would sue the corporation and not the shareholders. That is one of the main reasons to incorporate, to create a legal person responsible for the actions of the business.
Also, in most states, a corporation, because it is considered a legal person, must be represented in court by a lawyer, except in limited circumstances, because only an attorney can represent a person in court.
You display your ignorance with each post. Any business person would understand the meaning of a corporation as a person, idiot.
Purp| 9.6.12 @ 7:32PM
You do know that a Corporation is considered a person with legal rights because of the UNITED STATES SUPREME COURT decision in 1888?
You see the Supreme Court is a Branch of the FEDERAL government, and they made that ruling. Federal, not State ruling. Get it now?
Your ignorance knows no bounds... sad.
CJW| 9.6.12 @ 8:03PM
It is in every state law, idiot. Corporations exist by state law.
Purpie, the street lawyer.
Oldefarte| 9.6.12 @ 10:52PM
What a moron you are. A "government-created entity, a corporation" What a DA. You're so far up Barry's ars your head pops out of his navel with the wording YOU DIDN'T BUILD THIS engraved on your eyeballs!!!!!!!!!!
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 4:37PM
Nice straw man argument. I never said his letter was a legal document, simply the interpretation of a Founding Father.
Purp never said that "Separation of Church and State" was in the U. S. Constitution either.
My point was that "God" isn't in there either.
Purp| 9.6.12 @ 4:18PM
Sure - Since the American Revolution was against a King who was Head of State and Head of the Church, and the Founders saw what mixing the 2 did to a country, they wanted it separate. No government intervention with religion and vice versa. The words they used:
"Congress shall make no law respecting the establishment of religion ..." comes from the Bill of Rights, the First Amendment of the US Constitution. Thomas Jefferson further explained this was to mean the Separation of Church and State. And, so it has been interpreted over the centuries.
Moreover, this is the text from the letter written by Thomas Jefferson explaining the "Wall":
""I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should 'make no law respecting an establishment of religion, prohibiting the free exercise thereof,' thus building a WALL of separation between church and State."
TLP| 9.6.12 @ 4:33PM
The letter that Jefferson wrote to the Danbury Baptists, was in response to a letter sent by them, expressing their concerns that the State would set up a State Religion, not their own.
Remember, at the beginning of this country, States had State Religions.
Thus, The Establishment Clause.
His letter was an Admonishment to THE GOVERNMENT.
Not to the Churches.
Those are the FACTS.
Idiot.
Purp| 9.6.12 @ 4:34PM
They had concerns that the State would set up a State Religion - wonder why they were concerned and how does a WALL answer their concerns? Hmmmm?
You answered your own question and you don't know it. Interesting
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 4:46PM
All TLP can do is call people "idiots," because he has no argument of value.
TLP| 9.6.12 @ 7:43PM
I calls them as I sees them, Idiot.
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 7:53PM
An intelligent person walks into a room full of people and assumes everybody is as smart as them. A mentally challenged person walks into that room and is convinced he's surrounded by idiots.
Oldefarte| 9.6.12 @ 10:49PM
A DUMBARS walks into a voting booth on 11/4/08 and votes for domestic terrorists!!!!!!
AmericanCynic| 9.7.12 @ 1:02PM
Look, I'm not a fan of John McCain either, but there's no reason why you should call him a "domestic terrorist," Oldefrak! ;)
Purp| 9.6.12 @ 4:29PM
Needed more space - but referring to the note below about the WALL - It is meant to keep government from founding or interfering with religion, but also for religion to stay OUT of government.
"The Establishment Clause of the First Amendment states that the Federal Government will not Establish a State Religion, such as some European Countries had at the time. It should be noted that at the time of the writing of the First Amendment that various States had dominate Churches, such as Connecticut had the Congregationalist, Massachusetts had the Puritans, & Virginia had the Baptist. The people did not want the Federal government to impose any one Religion or Denomination on all the States; each State preferred to have the freedom to choose a religion that the people preferred. "
So you cannot put one religion over another either. Christianity, altho the major religion in this country, is NOT the only one to be recognized, according the freedoms the Founders dictate.
Its 2-way - That is what a WALL does, now doesn't it?
That was easy, anything else?
TLP| 9.6.12 @ 4:37PM
It had NOTHING TO DO with the Church staying out of Government.
The IRS does that, Dumbass.
Unless, of course, you're a Black Church. Then Eric Holder will meet with you, to tell you how you can GET AROUND those restrictions.
Why are you so Fcking Stupid?
Seriously, why are you so Fcking Stupid?
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 4:38PM
Why are you so offensive?
TLP| 9.6.12 @ 7:43PM
Because you're an ASSHOLE.
Okay?
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 7:55PM
Once again...
TWO WRONGS MAKE A RIGHT-WING ARGUMENT!
lol!!!
Tom Kyba| 9.6.12 @ 10:49PM
Why are you LOL complaining LOL when angry responses LOL are exactly what you LOL desire LOL? You are coming across LOL as a little piece of LOL snot. Why the LOL do you Upper Class Twits of the Year always come here LOL and get all smarmy?
P.S. Purp really really likes you. LOL!
AmericanCynic| 9.7.12 @ 1:07PM
LOL!
Purp| 9.6.12 @ 4:39PM
Absolutely it does. We had a revolution against a King that was Head of State AND Head of Church - the Founders, mostly not religious I might add, did not want either to have control of the other. Period.
Why are so oblivious to what they prescribed for our safety?
Oldefarte| 9.6.12 @ 10:38PM
Shove Barney's "WALL" where the sun don't shine!!!!!!!!!!
JP| 9.6.12 @ 11:21AM
Mmmm... but the Democrats opened their convention on Friday with a 2 hour long Islamic Jumah prayer. It appears that the Dems do believe in God; they call him Allah.
Harry the Horrible| 9.6.12 @ 1:37PM
Neah. "Jumah" is the Friday prayer. Essentially, they'll be closing with it.
Purp| 9.6.12 @ 4:35PM
And Yahweh, and the Almighty and God - what's your point? Dont' you?
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 4:48PM
They opened the Convention on Tuesday with a Rabbi, what's your point "Freedom of SOME religions?"
Tom Kyba| 9.6.12 @ 10:51PM
It didn't meet with your approval? LOL!
AmericanCynic| 9.7.12 @ 1:06PM
You make no sense, Tom. JP above was bitching about an Islamic prayer opening the convention (with some added BS about it being a 2 hour event) on Friday. My point above is that they've had Catholic, Protestant and Jewish prayers.
I realize you're a conservtive, but try to keep up.
;)
jothepro| 9.6.12 @ 11:44AM
Which part of what Purp-ass.
Purp| 9.6.12 @ 7:34PM
If you can read, you can see how oblivious right-wing world is on what the phrase actually means.
Oldefarte| 9.6.12 @ 10:36PM
Yeah, let all get down and dirty with those HO, HO, HOS wanting their three grand for dildos etc and becoming speaking sluts for the DNC, right? Shame the high priest of the fig community [who once ran a male prostitution out of his taxpayer-funded apartment] is exiting Bean Town with his tail between his legs!!!!!
Tom Kyba| 9.6.12 @ 10:51PM
Perhaps if you used the term right wing a few more times, we'd get your point.
JD| 9.6.12 @ 12:14PM
In addition to the fact that what Purp cites is not in the Constitution, he demands a violation of the Establishment Clause with his demand that government endorse atheism, which is a religion.
His people will always claim that atheism is an absence of religion, not a religion, which suggests that the Establishment Clause mandates atheism. It certainly doesn't. Moreover, I have never met an atheist who has been able to define the word "religion" using a definition that isn't dishonest and slanderous, yet fits their absurd criteria of defining atheism as non-religion and all other beliefs as "religion".
"Religion" has become the atheists' equivalent of Christians' "heathen" or Muslims' "infidel". It's just a pejorative they use for non-believers. Unfortunately, by adopting a pejorative that happens to be nominally used in the Constitution, they advance the lie that the Constitution mandates their beliefs, which is the exact opposite of what the founders wanted it to do.
Purp| 9.6.12 @ 4:37PM
I never said a thing about atheism - which is the absence of religious belief, in case you don't know.
The Constitution demands that Religion and Government (the State) remain separate but equal. With a WALL between them. Both ways.
That is all.
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 4:52PM
No it doesn't, Burp.
You would know this if you didn't blindly follow liars like the Foodstamp President and Debbie Blabbermouth Putz.
Did you hear her continuing lies, yesterday? Even CNN couldn't believe how blatantly she lies!
Anderson Cooper said that you democrats live in an alternate universe. Ha-ha!
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 4:56PM
No, Cooper was specifically talking about the idea that the amended platform was not contentious.
Purp| 9.6.12 @ 5:05PM
Smack him down AC ... he's so full of himself all the time ... but with little actual reason to be.
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 5:07PM
Yeah, Blabbermouth-Putz was lying about that, too, AC.
Like she lied about what she said about the Israeli ambassador to the U.S.
Like the Foodstamp President lied about keeping that GM plant in Janesville, WI, open.
Like the O'Bama regime keeps lying about trying to GUT the work requirements out of welfare reform.
And STEALING $716 TRILLION from MediScare.
And accusing Mitt Romney of killing a steelworker's wife. And, then, lying about knowing the steelworker.
How pathetic the democrat party truly is.
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 5:23PM
(SIGH)
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 5:46PM
Yes, that's all you liberal democrats have: Hot air.
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 6:14PM
Exactly. It's methane from all the crap shoved down our throats from Righty-Too-Tighties like you!
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 6:28PM
That's brilliant, AC.
From where do you steal your material? Your local grammar school?
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 7:33PM
I'm a professional comic, Nick-head, my material is stolen from everywhere.
LOL!
Purp| 9.6.12 @ 7:35PM
Who cares? You're losing and will lose in November and the sore losers can go back in their man caves.
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 8:30PM
Too bad you two can't defend all the lies spewed at the democrat convention, huh?
Oldefarte| 9.6.12 @ 10:47PM
The excrement mistake of 11/4/08 will be wiped clean with the ballots of 11/6/12!!!!!!!!!!!
Tom Kyba| 9.6.12 @ 10:53PM
That's a good one.
Oldefarte| 9.6.12 @ 10:25PM
Yes, rumor has it that the BLACK JESUS will substitute IN GOD WE TRUST for LEAN FORWARD.....THE FRANKS ARE HERE!!!!!
AmericanCynic| 9.7.12 @ 1:10PM
Why is it that the only people who refer to Obama as a religious figure or messiah are Righty-Not-So-Brighties like you?
Oldefarte| 9.6.12 @ 10:22PM
If "God can take care of himself" then why did the BLACK JESUS have to pull in the ARKANSAS FORNICATOR last night to ramp up the STUPIDS for him???????????
Who Knows?| 9.6.12 @ 11:54AM
God continues to arise---and be heard.
Hear me, feel me, touch me.
ME.
LindaF | 9.6.12 @ 12:36PM
For Obama and his ilk, the E pluribus unum means:
Out of many WRONG thoughts, we will enforce the ONE RIGHT (or WRIGHT) thoughts.
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 2:57PM
Funny you should mention "E pluribus unum" (out of many, one) it was the de facto motto of the U.S., adopted in 1782. That is, until Religious Righties changed it to "In God we trust" in 1956.
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 4:00PM
Why would Christians in the 1950s want to change something that our Founding Father's established? Is it because they "hated America?" LOL@OneSidedJingoism!
Oldefarte| 9.6.12 @ 10:31PM
Wait I thought the fathers promoted homosexual marriage. Wonder where that BS about "HONOR THEY FATHER AND THEY MOTHER" possibly came from......excrement!!!!!!!!
AmericanCynic| 9.7.12 @ 1:13PM
Are you confusing the bible with the U.S. Constitution again? OldeF**k, you do realize that Jesus wasn't one of the signers of the Declaration, right?
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 1:47PM
When Romney was confronted about some of the harsh views that were voted into the Republican Platform, he basically said it wasn't his view, but there's nothing he could do about it. When President Obama was confronted about some omissions in the Democratic Platform (i.e. "God
and "Jerusalem as the capital of Israel"), he demanded that the party delegates change it. They did. That's REAL leadership and it makes this entire argument moot.
Purp| 9.6.12 @ 4:40PM
Excellent Point. Wish I'd thought of it.
Tom Kyba| 9.6.12 @ 10:56PM
"Purpy and AC sitting in a tree..." etc.
AmericanCynic| 9.7.12 @ 1:16PM
Tom, liberals don't see being called gay as an insult, that's only in the hater/homophobic world you wallow in.
When you call a straight liberal "gay," it's just one of many incorrect observations you seem to have.
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 5:51PM
"That's REAL leadership and it makes this entire argument moot."
Not to pro-Israel voters, it doesn't, AC.
Nor, to the extreme marxists/atheists that make-up the majority of the democrat party.
WAY TO GO democrats!
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 6:16PM
Pro-Israel?
Why do you hate America, Nick?
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 6:25PM
That is known as a non sequitur, AC.
You can look that up, too, wiki historian.
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 8:00PM
Nope, that is known as Tea-Party logic, look that up in the "Christian Nation" manifesto you're obviously working on.
If I had said I was pro-any other country than America (or Israel), you know that's what would have been hurled at me. Goose/Gander
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 8:28PM
WRONG!, again, AC.
It does not follow that if one is pro-Israel, they "hate America." In fact, it's exactly the opposite.
There are pro-Israeli democrats, ya' know?
Except now, thanks to the Foodstamp President & Debbie Blabbermouth-Putz, many of them will be voting Republican in November.
WAY TO GO, democrats!
AmericanCynic| 9.7.12 @ 1:19PM
Thank you, Nick.
I was actually mocking the conservative position of questioning people's patriotism or love for America just because they support another country.
Yes, there are plenty of pro-Israel members in both parties...including me.
;)
Tom Kyba| 9.6.12 @ 10:55PM
And here I thought you were something other than a two-bit shill. Too bad. LOL!
Seek| 9.6.12 @ 2:50PM
The idea that the DNC's omission of the word "God" from its platform constitutes a de facto hostility toward religion is quite a leap of assumption. The Constitution, for that matter, makes no mention of God either (don't waste your eloquence on me about Article 7 either). Political parties are not churches.
To infer that the Democratic party is "atheist" because its platform isn't overtly religious is like saying that because its platform makes no reference to cats, it is waging a "war" on cats. George Neumayr should brush up on his logic.
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 2:51PM
Great point, Seek.
TLP| 9.6.12 @ 4:39PM
How about all of the BOOING, when they wanted to put GOD back in?
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 4:53PM
Are you upset that Democrats have more than one opinion? Or are all Republicans extreme bible-thumpers who think doctors who perform abortions should be shot on sight? Don't you understand that there are Muslim, Buddhist, Hindi, Sikhs and Atheist Americans too?
TLP| 9.6.12 @ 7:45PM
They all worship GOD, Dumbass?
So, WTF are you talking about?
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 8:02PM
You might want to re-think that comment.
Oldefarte| 9.6.12 @ 10:45PM
"Muslim"? What like in Mohammed Atta and the POTUS?????
Tom Kyba| 9.6.12 @ 10:58PM
And now you want it both ways. Cluck cluck. LOL!
AmericanCynic| 9.7.12 @ 1:21PM
Sheep.
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 4:46PM
"The Constitution, for that matter, makes no mention of God either (don't waste your eloquence on me about Article 7 either). "
The Constitution of the United States of America does mention God, when it states the date that the delegates signed the document: "Done in Convention by the Unanimous Consent of the States present the Seventeenth Day of September in the Year of our Lord one thousand seven hundred and Eighty seven [...]."
What do you mean by "Article 7" and "political parties," by the way?
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 5:00PM
Nick,
That's a date and a holy-roller stretch of an argument! LOL!
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 5:17PM
No, AC, it is accurate.
As opposed to: "The Constitution, for that matter, makes no mention of God either [...]."
Which is the secularist/atheist stretch of an argument.
Sorry. Try again.
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 5:26PM
We'll both have to stand by our opinions then. The difference is that a Constitutional Scholar would just laugh at yours.
Have a great day!
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 5:44PM
Mine is NOT an opinion, AC. Can't you read?
Is English your second language?
"In the Year of our Lord" is a direct reference to Jesus Christ, Whom Christians worship as God. End of story.
All you secularists have to do is stop making this ridiculous statement.
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 6:02PM
OK, if you want to be a brasshole who takes refuge in an argument based on semantics, you are completely and utterly WRONG! The word "God" spelled G-O-D is ABSOLUTELY NOT IN THE U.S. CONSTITUTION. Happy now, Nick-head?
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 6:22PM
"All TLP can do is call people 'idiots,' because he has no argument of value."
- AmericanCynic @ 4:46PM
To quote Christ, "Physician, heal thyself."
(To a Christian, Christ is God, remember? Most of the Founding Fathers were devout Christians, dope.)
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 7:39PM
B.S., most were Deists! Also, many were followers of John Locke and other writers from the Age of Enlightenment (the guys that brought us the concept of "Unalienable Rights"). They were some heavy thinking dudes, imho! They would also be unwelcome in today's GOP. ;)
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 7:59PM
More marxist revisionist history, AC. They were Christians.
Jefferson did fall for much of the garbage from the so-called "age of enlightenment." (Which was anything but. Just study "The Terror," a.k.a. the French Revolution.)
You're a walking, talking cliche of an OWS, marxist, Useful Idiot, AC.
TLP| 9.6.12 @ 7:46PM
Thank You, Nick.
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 7:55PM
No problem, Mr. Pennell.
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 8:05PM
I can't believe you just implied that the concept of "Unalienable Rights" is garbage!
You two are quite a pair!
LOL!
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 8:14PM
The concept of unalienable rights comes from the Bible and God's Natural Law, AC.
Guess you've never read Grotius or de Vattel, huh?
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 8:07PM
Sorry, didn't realize you guys were the only ones ALLOWED to use a constant barrage of ad hominem attacks.
Nick| 9.6.12 @ 8:15PM
You started it, AC.
AmericanCynic| 9.7.12 @ 1:24PM
Of course you think that.
(rolls eyes with the realization that he's dealing with a child)
Oldefarte| 9.6.12 @ 10:43PM
The NATURAL LAW is the basis for MAN'S LAW, moron!!!!!!!!!
AmericanCynic| 9.7.12 @ 1:46PM
It's bad enough that you feel a need to thrust your god into a bigger role in the creation of America, but when you try to re-write 17th century intellectualism that thrived to escape religious doctrine manipulation...it's kine of laughable. Deist were the closest thing to the Atheism of their time...a stepping stone. The term "Natural Law" comes from those intellectuals NOT the bible!
Nick, de Vattel was absolutely an enlightenment writer and he used the concept of the Christian god to make a case for creating societies that were free from tyrants...or for setting an example of grace. Many atheists throughout history have employed an "if you can't beat 'em, join 'em" approach and found a way to use other people's belief to further their intellectual ideas.
Hugo Grotius, however, pre-dated the Age of Enlightenment by about 100 years and was still shackled to Christianity.
Nick| 9.7.12 @ 4:02PM
BZZZZZZZ! WRONG! Yet, again, AC.
Get that from wiki, did ya'?
"The term 'Natural Law' comes from those intellectuals NOT the bible!"
I didn't claim that the "term" came from the Bible. Can't you read plain English?
And, apparently, in addition to being unfamiliar with de Vattel & Grotius, you haven't read anything by a little known Saint named Thomas Aquinas, huh?
It is from St. Thomas that we get the Christian notion of God's Natural Law. (Which is mentioned in the Declaration of Independence, by the way.)
You have much to learn, Grasshopper.
bison cookie| 9.6.12 @ 5:33PM
WHAT THE MEDIA WILL NEVER TELL YOU ABOUT OBAMA – PART 1
Obama’s policies, pals, performance and the people who surround him tell the tale of who he is and where he is taking America. We can feel the disastrous results and although some people chalk it up to Obama’s inexperience, incompetence or say that he is just in over his head, if people knew … [Read More...]
AmericanCynic| 9.6.12 @ 6:04PM
Dude, when you want to cut-n-paste somebody else's writing, don't forget click the "read more" tab first.
LOL@LazyHaters!
Stan Redmond| 9.6.12 @ 9:09PM
Government can do exactly what Obama wants. North Korea is the number one example of everyone belonging to the government under the cair of the dear leaders. Juche makes sure everyone is fairly treated and equal. Fairness and equality for all!!! FORWARD!!!
Carroll | 9.6.12 @ 11:54PM
Thornberry's take on our local Tampa Bay Times's gushing coverage of the DNC. They love everything in sight at Charlotte.