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Special Report
Leo Gerard and the Chicago Thugs
Is Obama appointee the link between the Obama campaign and the Obama SuperPAC?
(Page 4 of 7)
The agreement includes wage increases, bonuses, an increase in guaranteed pay to 40 hours a week from the current 32, worker involvement, major pension improvements, an organizing neutrality clause that prevents creation of runaway non-union subsidiaries, phase-out of a two-tier wage system, and continuation of current restrictions on the contracting out of work.
“This contract meets and in some cases exceeds our industry pattern, and serves the best interests of both our members and the company,” said David Foster, Director of USWA District 11 and chief negotiator for the union.
“We are especially gratified that we have achieved the neutrality clause that guarantees card check recognition at any new facilities in which the company has a 40 percent interest,” Foster added. “That will prevent the kind of duplicity that LTV Steel committed against its workers in building a non-union plant in Alabama.”
GST also will guarantee, under certain conditions, card-check recognition at any plants in which it holds a 15-40 percent interest.
The agreement runs until Oct. 1, 2002. There will be a limited economic reopener on June 1, 2000, with binding arbitration if no settlement is achieved.
GST is the country’s largest producer of grinding media.
SOURCE United Steelworkers of America
Now.
On May 14th of this year, as Governor Romney began to secure the GOP nomination and the Bain Capital/GST issue gained steam, our friends at National Review Online ran this item on the Romney/Bain/GST Steel issue by Katrina Trinko. Trinko’s story about what we now know to be the first ad featuring Soptic — which did not accuse Romney of killing his wife (that came later in the SuperPAC ad from Burton) was read by a one-time GST Steel worker, who wrote the following, which is posted by NRO as an update to Trinko’s story:
I nearly choked on my Cheerios when I read that GST employees were blaming Bain for their downfall. I worked at GST Steel in Kansas City for four months in 1997 immediately after leaving the Navy.
Why only four months? Quickly after I started, I surprised to learn that several of my fellow USW Local 13-represented employees, mostly millwrights and electricians, we’re making between $100-130k. This was mainly due union-mandated overtime which, at least on a few occasions, consisted of the employees bringing in sleeping bags and pillows and sleeping in the shop. It would be hard for any company to stay competitive while paying double-time union wages to get their beauty sleep, but that’s not the half of it. The union employees obviously didn’t think they had it easy enough, so they went on strike in March of ‘97. The plant shut down for a couple of weeks until it re-started under the operation of management and non-union workers. The strike lasted a couple more months. I had a family to support, so I couldn’t afford to wait. I took another (non-union) job with another company. They shuttered the plant for good a few years later.
That’s Bain’s fault? Just classic.
Still later that day of May 14, Trinko had persisted, contacting the anonymous steel worker by phone. In a short post titled “Union Life at GST Steel,” Trinko wrote:
I talked this afternoon with the reader who had worked at GST Steel in 1997 and e-mailed about the conditions there. This person, who wishes to remain anonymous, elaborated a little more on the working conditions at the plant, saying that thanks to the union structure, there was little incentive to be productive. For instance, while some workers were required to file a report daily regarding certain productivity issues, they waited until the end of the day (when it was too late to fix things) to file the report instead of earlier, because they saw no reason to bother doing it at the most effective time. And he said for some of the employees — including those racking up $100,000 to $130,000 salaries — large chunks of the day were just spent waiting for something to fix or do, with up to 80 percent of day spent not working.
And those are the hours they weren’t sleeping and getting over time. During those overtime hours, when they brought sleeping bags, there was once a problem which required a couple of them to be woken up. Our reader thought the gig was up, once their sleeping had become known, but as it ended up, a supervisor was written up and that was it: The sleeping on the job continued as before.
About the Author
Jeffrey Lord is a former Reagan White House political director and author. He writes from Pennsylvania at jlpa1@aol.com.
Letter to the Editor View all comments (203) | Leave a comment
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Jack in Wi| 8.16.12 @ 6:35AM
Everyone knows the Obama machine is going to run a rough dirty Chicago style campaign. How Romney will counter it, how he runs his campaign, and what positive message for the future he puts out will decide if he will get the votes he needs to win. Right now I think he has a long way to go, but may be moving in the right direction.
TLP| 8.16.12 @ 7:53AM
"If you look at the Steel Copanies that went under at the time, ALL OF THEM were Unionized."
If you look at all the Car Companies that are in Trouble in this Country, ALL OF THEM are Unionized.
If you look at the Towns, Cities, States and COUNTRIES in the Western World, that are Bankrupt, ALL OF THEM are going down because of UNIONS.
This isn't a Rubics Cube we're dealing with, here.
It's as Classic an Example of OCCAMS RAZOR as you're ever gonna get. This, and the Obvious Collusion between The Most Corrupt Administration in this Country's History, and the Scumbag Factories, that are - The Unions.
And, none of this could be happening, if we had a PRESS and a MEDIA that was Unbiased, and NOT Running Cover, for One Man, and One Political Party.
We have not seen its like, since Walter Duranty performed Literary Fellatio, over the "Antics" of everyone's Favourite "Uncle Joe" Stalin, for which he was given a Pulitzer Prize.
They covered up Forced Starvations, Gulags, Work Camps, and Genocide, all in the name of their self destructive Political Dogma.
What's the Destruction of One Country - (This Ciuntry) - compared to that?
Purp| 8.16.12 @ 4:31PM
The rich, elected and connected have brain-washed you pretty well - vote against your own kind ('cause you ain't never gonna be one of them ... you will always be "those people" to the Romneys of the world) ... idiot.
Doctor Right| 8.16.12 @ 4:40PM
I'm voting FOR my kind:
Upper middle-class, heterosexual white guys.
You l'il self-interest voters have been having your fun...
NOW it's our turn.
Bye-Bye, Barackie-Boy!
Purp| 8.16.12 @ 9:36PM
Funny - I AM self-interested?
"I'm voting FOR my kind:
Upper middle-class, heterosexual white guys." - you don't even see the hypocrisy there?
Moreover, you aren't in the 1%, but you are voting for their policies. Like I said, he's brainwashed and so are you.
Maybe one day you will wake up and realize you are an FDR New Dealer and didn't even know it.
Occam's Tool| 8.17.12 @ 1:03PM
Purp: I thought you were a rich guy who was a high executive for a Furtune 50 Company. I guess not.
Me, I'm a physician who grosses $340 K a year roughly in a rural area. As I have no malpractice, office, medical records, or office staff expenses, that makes me a wellpaid shrink---of course, I work 12 days out of every 14 with 8 of them on 24 hour call, but that's the rural physician life.
So, my view is that I want to keep as much of my income as possible since I worked very hard for it and I only take home 57-60% of it as a max anyway.
And that's how a guy in the top 1-2% thinks about taxes. I work VERY hard for the money, and am constantly tired. My job is very essential and responsible (I STAY out of the news deliberately, and I have been in the middle of a nasty international newsstory and gone unnoticed because I am damn good at my job---I was the psychiatrist for the Alabama Chain Gang in the 1990s, and no one died of a suicide in that group).
It would be nice if you understood that limited government in economic issues is a good thing, purp. Want to know what governmental entity has the largest number of millionaires per capita? Hong Kong.
I agree with TLP completely, on this as so much else.
TinaB| 8.17.12 @ 4:20PM
OT, I respect you a great deal, and Timmy too. You both express yourselves very differently, but you both make me think a lot, laugh a lot, and even say, "hell yes!" and pound my fist on my desk.
And I believe there is more stress in a psychologically strenuous job than in a physically strenuous one. My Dad, who helped put the men on the moon, needed hours of rest at night.
It's taken me 11 months to recover from teaching 13 to 16 year olds math in a Central Florida middle school that has become 85% minority and 98% free or reduced lunch. Which only means a higher stress level for the one trying to love em and teach em math. I am almost back to my former healthy self.
The Lord bless you as you labor for your family and Him.
TLP| 8.18.12 @ 5:00PM
Thank You, Tina.
That means a lot to me.
TLP| 8.16.12 @ 9:19PM
My "Kind" is someone who believes in the American Dream, that is to GET UP every morning, and GO TO WORK, to better my situation, and, if I'm good enough at what I do, become a member of the 1%.
Unlike you, who wishes nothing more than to stand in long lines, at a Government Store, to get a shot at buying something from its Empty Shelves.
Good Luck with that.
Purp| 8.16.12 @ 9:49PM
Hey, Pal, you don't have a lock on the American Dream. All Americans share that, and you CANNOT keep it for yourself. The problem is all kinds of Americans GET UP and GO TO WORK, but they don't vote against those that try to help them have an economy to work in, opportunities to work for and a country worth living in.
Anyone who throws everything to the whim of the Market doesn't seriously care about their community, their neighbors or anyone but themselves. Unfortunately for you, by voting for those that have made you believe they are on YOUR side by taking away from lazy, drug addicted and useless bums, while they are really raiding the middle and working classes to give to the rich and powerful, you are cutting your own throat. I have no love of socialism, government by fiat or any other government centric economy - but I also don't believe in a Corporate Takeover of the government for sale to the highest bidder. What I do believe is Capitalism modulated by the oversight of government and government of, for and by the people (where everyone can vote and heaven and earth is moved to allow them their vote) - not a government by, of and for the corporate or billionaire crowd.
Limited government is not the right characterization - government responsive to the people is a better description. For in this modern world, the limited government begets a third-rate country. That's why Republicans will never created a limited government. They want power.
Occam's Tool| 8.17.12 @ 1:04PM
But the clown you support, purp, DOES believe in government control of the economy.
TLP| 8.17.12 @ 9:16PM
All Americans DON'T share that dream.
We have 4th, 5th, and 6th Generation Welfare Families, in The Black Community. Black Families who don't even know anybody who's ever had a Job.
So, please, stop with the Stupidity.
The Democrat Party has ENSLAVED THESE PEOPLE, for their own gain, and everybody knows it, except them.
Thanks to the unending supply of Poverty Pimps, on your side of the aisle.
Pecos Pete| 8.16.12 @ 6:45AM
Mr. Lord, once again you provide facts. The media will ignore your facts. The trolls will claim your facts are false, else they will simply ignore facts ... as usual.
Union wages and the federal income tax on corporations are the reason for moving manufacturing to other countries. Simple solutions: Reduce income taxes on corporations and, horrors, eliminate public unions and appoint non partisan (be there any?) to the NRLB.
Von Mises Jr| 8.16.12 @ 8:02AM
The good thing, Pecos Pete is that only stupid people watch the MSM anymore. But we can learn a few other lessons from this story by Jeffrey Lord about liberals and socialism.
- The reason Joe Sofdic didn't get another job after GST filed bankruptcy is that he was like the domesticated animals that if returned to nature cannot feed themselves. He was probably worth $40K a year and was paid three times that. No one else in their right minds would even pay him $50K.
- Socialism always resorts to protectionism. The Obama regime is all in for unions since they are the champions of protectionism that is the payment for union votes. Once government resorts to Etatism (socialism or interventionism); we cannot compete in global free markets. So their benefactors in government must raise trade tariffs on imports. Whether you buy domestic (due to the wages and benefits) or buy imported goods with tariffs; the economy and consumers get screwed.
- Even with the protectionism, eventually the industries fail. When prices rise dramatically, demand drops precipitously. If the steel in your auto production process skyrockets, people hold on to their old car longer. If there are substitutes for the product, people buy more of the substitute and less of the artificially overpriced goods.
Bottom line is that central planning, government intervention and protectionism hurts everyone involved and often sets off trade wars. Mises and Rothbard argue that these policies led to both World Wars.
vtwin| 8.16.12 @ 12:35PM
You bet, better to let Romney, Bain, and the other f**k the country it’s all about me investors sell off America’s manufacturing and technology to the Chinese.
CJW| 8.16.12 @ 1:33PM
Another purp-like statement.
Too late, vtwin, Bubba gave away all our technology to the Chinese.
Von Mises Jr| 8.16.12 @ 1:34PM
I recommend remedial English classes and perhaps you might then aspire to a livelihood above being a troll.
Purp| 8.16.12 @ 2:21PM
I don't know how VT feels, but you guys really think calling people "Trolls" means anything? All it means to me is that you don't agree with me on anything. And, that's okay.
You use the term like "Socialist" - as if that has any bearing on Modern US Policy.
You need new material, it's very tired and boring, kinda like you.
Von Mises Jr| 8.16.12 @ 3:10PM
Burp!
Doctor Right| 8.16.12 @ 4:30PM
Was that you kissing Adnerson Cooper's boyfriend?
Purp| 8.16.12 @ 4:32PM
Yes, so? What do you kiss?
Occam's Tool| 8.17.12 @ 1:07PM
I kiss my wife and kids, purp. And I DOUBT that you know more about weird lifestyles than I do. I'm an UCLA trained psychiatrist.
But as you get older, that crap appeals much less, and a calmer life appeals much more. I'm sorry that you have no sense of balance.
Bob James| 8.16.12 @ 10:20PM
"Etatism." Ha! I love it! And I intend to steal it, with your permission, Jr.
As to protectionism, Gerard's United Steel Workers sign on as "petitioners" in damned near every antidumping or countervailing duty case involving steel. I work in this field, and I'm not aware of a single union even nearly as active as USW in actively supporting anti-fair trade petitions. Which, of course, requires them to collude with management, since they won't have standing without the companies themselves.
I've been dealing with this lizard Gerard for years, never knowing just how malignant he is. I mistook him for a low-rent gangland thug. I had no idea this freakin' communist had literally stood at the barricades in Seattle (my home town). I was rooting for a police riot a la Daley's Chicago PD when this first happened.
Thank you, Mr. Lord, for opening this reader's eyes.
loulou| 8.16.12 @ 10:55AM
If the unions don't wither on the vine and die then they must be busted. Pronto.
vtwin| 8.16.12 @ 12:47PM
Another boring diatribe from Jeffrey and yes the media and the trolls will simply ignore.
Drunken Sailor| 8.16.12 @ 12:59PM
Then please ignore and go away. The adults are talking now.
Purp| 8.16.12 @ 2:22PM
That's a laugh - you couldn't debate your way out of paper bag!
Drunken Sailor| 8.16.12 @ 2:35PM
Man, I must really get under your skin.
Troll
Von Mises Jr| 8.16.12 @ 3:14PM
You mean "Jefferson." That was his other name in addition to Purpleguy and who knows how many others.
He admitted on the weekend that he used to be a despicable propagandist with multiple names but now with the new administration at TAS he is an only a despicable propagandist with one name. I don't even believe that.
Drunken Sailor| 8.16.12 @ 3:34PM
I agree. And he isn't very good at the propaganda either. Pretty transparent.
Purp| 8.16.12 @ 4:36PM
Oh, you are good at what again, Drunkie?
Drunken Sailor| 8.16.12 @ 5:34PM
Irritating you apparently and any time I get to irritate a liberal is a good day.
Purp| 8.16.12 @ 4:36PM
Never admitted any such thing. But in your world, facts don't matter, right? Only twisted theories to make the outcome the way you like.
Purp| 8.16.12 @ 4:34PM
I do bother you .. .or you wouldn't keep bothering with me, right? Troll is such an endearing name. It's quaint, like a little doll that little girls stroke. Is that what you want? Everyone that calls anyone a Troll wants to stroke something? i get it now. Thanks! Get started ... a little to the left please.
Occam's Tool| 8.17.12 @ 1:08PM
DS: well, I think you are fantastic, sir.
Gallup has Romney ahead, now. Poop is running scared.
Doctor Right| 8.16.12 @ 4:31PM
Purp,
the closet is calling; they want you back!
Purp| 8.16.12 @ 4:34PM
Im out now ... you should try it.
Bob James| 8.16.12 @ 10:24PM
I'm new here, but I'm wondering why the locals insist on feeding these trolls. I suppose it's fun to whack them like pinatas, but, my goodness, their collective IQ couldn't warm an old-fashioned earth-destroying incandescent light-bulb.
Actually, it's a sign of your (your being TAS readers') intellectual integrity that you are willing to engage these useful idiots, stooges, and paid provocateurs. Please keep up the good work, but if you're able, I gently ask you keep the profanity to a minimum - there are ladies present!
Occam's Tool| 8.17.12 @ 1:11PM
We will try, Bob, but it's hard not to thwack them with what they deserve.
Personally, while I don't agree with Romney's record on some things, he KNOWS we have to keep taxes down. He KNOWS we need to establish America's strength again, and he KNOWS that small business owners are the backbone of America.
These are good things.
Kitty | 8.16.12 @ 7:12AM
More info on Gerard:
Leo Gerard, the Radical USW President Who Bought the Presidency
http://www.independentsentinel.....residency/
Doctor Right| 8.16.12 @ 7:37AM
Great article.
But honestly, it's time to stop pondering what Team Obama is up to, and who's running their dirty operation. They are who they are...
It's time for our side to hit them back hard, and with equal ferocity. The American people want Obama defeated, but they also want him cut down to size, metaphorically speaking.
Where's Lee Atwater when we need him?
Kitty | 8.16.12 @ 7:53AM
I've been longing for Atwater, too! The Left hated him and then they emulated him.
DTOM| 8.16.12 @ 9:52AM
Kitty;
He's resting in the Good Lord's hand, looking down at us hoping that we'll do what he would have done.
Time for to get busy, children!
DTOM
Purp| 8.16.12 @ 2:24PM
Not so fast ... fully 48% of the population supports the President. And less than that support Mitt the Twit.
Lee Atwater - I think his name is Axelrod now.
Doctor Right| 8.16.12 @ 4:32PM
WHERE do you get these fantasy numbers????
Purp| 8.16.12 @ 4:44PM
http://www.realclearpolitics.c.....-1171.html
Basically, here. If you just stick with Rasmussen numbers you are skewed toward Romney. A compilation of many polls is closer to reality.
CJW| 8.16.12 @ 5:09PM
Obamaboy
As usual you are wrong. Real Clear averages all the polls. Rasmussen is the most accurate.
Purp| 8.16.12 @ 9:50PM
Can't you read - average of all the polls is a better view of reality. Rasmussen wishes they were soooo accurate. They are not.
CJW| 8.16.12 @ 11:06PM
Obamaboy
You really are stupid.
It depends what polls go into the average, and there are many bad polls, such as registered voters v. likely voters, and those weighted to brain dead Dems like you.
I don't expect you to understand this. But, Obama understands and that is why he is desperate with his attacks, and why you regurgitate the DebbeWS emails here.
Getting desperate, idiot boy.
Occam's Tool| 8.17.12 @ 1:12PM
Awesome as usual, Dr. R. Have a great weekend!
sickofit5| 8.16.12 @ 10:34AM
What a great article. Not just for the information provided but also from the standpoint that there are writers like Lord that actually investigate. Unfortunately, for the common ordinary citizen that would read this article they would never fully understand the profound implications of what Lord has revealed. What unions did to the steel industry is what they have done to every industry in this country. With that said, the GM story is still unfolding and without more financial aid, it will probably fail.
Pecos Pete| 8.16.12 @ 6:14PM
Sick: GM will NOT probably fail ... it is failing and will be in bankruptcy again by 2015.
sickofit5| 8.16.12 @ 10:44AM
Wow, just read Kitty's link to Gerrard article in the sentinel. Another communist working for the administration. His connection to OWS is pretty dirty. Not to jump to conclusions but I would say that if he didn't start it he certainly facilitated it. It will take years to rid our govt. of these anarchist. Where's J. Edgar when you need him.
Kwan| 8.16.12 @ 10:53AM
This Joe Soptic nonsense is more of the leftwing propaganda that not only is Romney a Scrooge-like villain, but free enterprise/capitalism itself is the problem as it produces an unequal distribution of wealth. Obama and friends would remedy this by nationalizing the economy and implementing a Soviet-style Command Economy. The benevolent central government would then equally distribute all profits to the adoring citizenry and we'd all live happily ever after.
Purp| 8.16.12 @ 2:49PM
Why doesn't he release his tax returns if he is St. Romney?
Kwan| 8.16.12 @ 3:08PM
There's no need to fear, UnderPurp is here.
When criminals in this world appear,
And break the laws that they should fear,
And frighten all who see or hear,
The cry goes up both far and near for
UnderPurp,
UnderPurp,
UnderPurp,
UnderPurp.
Speed of lightning, roar of thunder,
Fighting all who rob or plunder
UnderPurp, UnderPurp.
Drunken Sailor| 8.16.12 @ 3:35PM
Well Done!
Purp| 8.16.12 @ 9:51PM
Wow - I didn't call Romney a crook -but if you think so, it must be true.
BobNY| 8.16.12 @ 3:18PM
Why doesn't Obama release HIS records? Romney has released 2 years of tax returns, how many more do you need? Will Pelosi and Reid release theirs?
CJW| 8.16.12 @ 3:41PM
Obama will not release his college application which would show if he applied as a foreigner to get in. Forget his grades, we know they are in the Biden range otherwise he would have released them.
Purp| 8.16.12 @ 9:54PM
Romney's tax records will give us an idea how he views tax policy that can affect us all.
What does a college application or grades tell us we don't already know about Obama? That's just dissembling about useless information.
Bob James| 8.16.12 @ 10:32PM
They go to his honesty, his integrity, which I realize are as foreign to you as an MRI machine is to an aborigine. Even you know this. How come we know John Kerry's academic history? And G.W. Bush's? Gee, perp, if he has nothing to hide, why doesn't he release them? Hell, he can use his own team to have them unsealed, as he did in all his previous slimy despicable elections.
Arrgh. I responded to a troll. Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa.
But not The One (PBUH).
CJW| 8.16.12 @ 11:03PM
Obamaboy
Romney said he pays the capital gains tax and with his 3 million in charitable contributions, his effective tax rate is about 14%. The Dems controlled the presidency and congress for two years and did not touch the cap gains tax. Waste of time to explain it to an unemployed idiot like you, but this is not meant for you, just responding to your stupidity.
Since you have no job except as paid $10 hour troll here, then the capital gains tax does not affect you, and given your stupidity, it will never affect you.
His college app will show what nationality he claimed as a citizen, moron. Why hide it?
You are truly an idiot, not even worth the $10 per hour.
Occam's Tool| 8.17.12 @ 1:14PM
Given that he was touted as the "smartest President ever," it would tell us a lot. In addition, a President's life is historical information. We have a historical marker in Chicago where Bama first groped the Wookie, why not have his grades?
Purp| 8.16.12 @ 9:53PM
Presidential Candidates release their tax records to engender trust with the American people. Romney doens't give a s**t about Americans. He just wants that WIN.
Obama did release 8 years of his tax records in 2008. Pelosi and Reid don't need to - they aren't running to be President of all of us.
Doctor Right| 8.16.12 @ 4:33PM
Why should he?
Where's Obama's transcripts from Columbia? The ones that say "Foreign Student"??
Jack London| 8.16.12 @ 12:01PM
I see Romney got his start-up capital for Bain from Central American drug runners and mass murderers. It's no wonder he's so full of dirty tricks. Well done for the Dems for finally growing a spine and fighting back.
Drunken Sailor| 8.16.12 @ 1:00PM
Link please.
Jack London| 8.16.12 @ 1:28PM
Are you incapable of using Google? You won't read it anyway as it's in the HuffPo.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/.....10133.html
JP| 8.16.12 @ 1:34PM
And Obama launched his political career in the liviing room of a convicted terrorist (Bill Ayers).
And since when is the HuffPo a legitimate source for anything? Might as well use Mad Magazine.
CJW| 8.16.12 @ 1:46PM
JP
You insult MAD, did you mean Newsweek?
Purp| 8.16.12 @ 2:54PM
Oh, but you don't like Bill Ayers (who does), but you're okay with Death Squads, right?
CJW| 8.16.12 @ 3:18PM
Obamaboy
Obama started his political career at Ayers' house, and sat in Wright's hate filled, anti american, anti semitic so called church for 20 years.
You sick brain dead lefties are desperate, to try to link Mitt with a death squads. You are beyond stupid and idiotic, you are sick.
So this is your assingment today, talk about death squads.
Still won't talk about Michele getting a $350,000 per year job courtesy of Obama requesting an earmark for her employer? A job that was eliminated in 2009.
Still won't talk about Rezko paying for Obama's house?
Doctor Right| 8.16.12 @ 4:34PM
Death squads!
BWAH-HAH-HAH-HAH!!!!!!
What's another word for "desperate"?
O-B-A-M-A.
TinaB| 8.16.12 @ 6:26PM
Very good, JP. Short and sweet. And right as rain.
CJW| 8.16.12 @ 1:39PM
Another purp-like statement from the loony left. Wow, the Huff-Po, a real journal.
Collection of innuendo, hearsay, and conjecture, similar to linking Bubba to the drug trade and murders in Arkansas.
Jack London| 8.16.12 @ 3:30PM
I suppose for your next dirty trick you'll be elevating Reagan and Col North to sainthood for their muderous campaign in Nicaragua. Let me ask - do you think it's completely beyond possibility that Romney was unaware of the true source of his funds?
Drunken Sailor| 8.16.12 @ 3:37PM
Well if you think he was unaware of it why do you try to smear him with it? Dishonest and despicable.
CJW| 8.16.12 @ 3:38PM
Jackie, you and purpie in the same basement with DebbieWS? Dirty tricks, you are desperate, trying to talk about death squads. You are a sick joke.
Americans,unlike you, have elevated Reagan to sainthood. Col. North, unlike, you is a patriot who served his country in Vietnam.
Maybe you can explain how Michele got her $350,000 per year job when Obama requested a million dollar earmark for her employer?
Maybe you can explain how and why Rezko paid for Obama's house?
Maybe you can explain HarryReid's land deals?
Nice try, sick idiot.
Jack London| 8.16.12 @ 4:13PM
So on the record then - all the people we helped to kill in Nicaragua are worth nothing compared with the sainted Col North. It's no wonder people in other countries think we have many sick racist sickos - it's true!
Nick| 8.16.12 @ 4:46PM
The only mass-murderers in Nicaragua were your buddies, the commie Sandinistas, Jack'o.
Thanks to Ronaldus Magnus, Admiral Poindexter, and Colonel North, the Nicaraguan people finally enjoyed freedom and peace, when the commie Sandinistas were booted from power, He Who Defiles Small Animals.
DRed| 8.16.12 @ 5:06PM
So you think Bishop Romero was murdered by commie Sandinistas?
DRed| 8.16.12 @ 5:09PM
Or was that in a different country? I get our US supported right wing paramilitary movements confused in central America.
Nick| 8.16.12 @ 5:20PM
Bishop Romero was El Salvadoran, not Nicaraguan, and assassinated in San Salvador, Einstein.
Also, we don't know who killed him. Since commies really enjoy killing Catholic clergy, it probably was the Soviet backed terrorists who killed Bishop Romero, DRed.
DRed| 8.16.12 @ 5:30PM
Ah. See Nick-this is what I get for not double checking with wikipedia. Romero had been denouncing the military for abusing the poor. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out who wanted him dead.
As for Nicaragua, that was a nasty war. It's indisputable that the Contras were mass murdering torturers. So were the Sandinistas.
Nick| 8.16.12 @ 5:44PM
You shouldn't be relying on wiki for history, anyway, DRed. But, I've told you this before.
Bishop Romero was denouncing the killing on both sides, so, who killed him is anybody's guess. It was the Soviet propaganda machine that pushed the "right-wing death squad" story in the aftermath of the assassination.
"It's indisputable that the Contras were mass murdering torturers."
Uhh....I dispute it. The Sandinistas were Soviet/Cuban backed murderous thugs. The Contras were freedom fighters.
DRed| 8.16.12 @ 6:24PM
Yes, the Sandinistas were murderous thugs. That doesn't mean the Contras weren't also murderous thugs.
Nick| 8.16.12 @ 7:21PM
Is that what I wrote, DRed? No, it isn't. That's why it's called a straw man argument. It's fairly easy to tear down an argument made of straw, i.e., that was never made.
I didn't state that the Contras were freedom fighters because the Sadinistas were murderous thugs. I stated that the Contras were freedom fighters because they fought for freedom against the Soviet/Cuban backed Sadinistas. They didn't want to become another satellite of the Warsaw Pact.
By the way, you are aware that all groups who were fighting the Sadinistas and called themselves "Contras," were not all united, aren't you?
DRed| 8.16.12 @ 7:42PM
Yes, I am. It's still widely documented that the Contras committed a host of crimes. You disputed that because they were freedom fighters. It's an irrelevant objection.
Nick| 8.16.12 @ 7:52PM
"It's still widely documented that the Contras committed a host of crimes."
Let me guess? In wiki, right?
I disputed it because the Contras didn't want to be under the Soviet jackboot. I don't know what you liberals call that, DRed, but, I call it fighting for freedom.
DRed| 8.16.12 @ 8:00PM
If you murder a 5 year old girl and rape her mother as part of your struggle against the communist jackboot, you are still a child murdering rapist.
Nick| 8.16.12 @ 10:18PM
And who did that, DRed? Names, dates, and source, please.
It's easy to hurl unsubstantiated accusations when you've been spoon-fed commie propaganda all your life.
TinaB| 8.17.12 @ 7:44AM
And I suppose the American Revolutionary Army were murderous thugs as they killed, or should i say murdered, the bloody Loyalists and Brits in the 1700s ? Oh you lobbies are so much fun, it's murder when you say it is, bot not when you say it isn't.
I lived through the Nam Era, and I never thought killing Communists, yes even in their own country, when they are hooked up to the Soviet machinery and machinations and killing those who disagree, as murder. The returning Vets being called murderers and baby killers was abhorrent to me then. And you Lefties are abhorrent to me now.
According to my Dad, Polish born but with Red, White and Blue blood running in his veins, the
Commies were more to be feared than anyone. I still believe they are rotten, with the Terrorist Islamicists right along side.
The fact that they are now being linked in their violent attempts to overtake the free world makes me all the more determined to float the turds in Washington right down the Potomac and out to Hell or wherever they're destined to end up.
Jack London| 8.16.12 @ 5:39PM
Don't worry Nazi Nick - Somoza and then the Contras killed plenty of people including Christian relief workers and an American engineer. As for Romero, as an enemy of the junta I expect that yes - his own side killed him and not the junta. That would made sense in your Nazi historical revisionism. You must think people are even more stupid than you.
Nick| 8.16.12 @ 7:38PM
Somoza had nothing to do with the Contras, He Who Has Badger Breath.
All you are doing is repeating the lies of Phil Donahue, Noam Chomski, & Amy Usama bin Goodman. As I've already stated, it is your commie buddies, Jack'o, who spent the 20th century killing Catholic clerics & religious. And enjoyed it.
And, I know that there is no one more stupid than an Useful Idiot.
CJW| 8.16.12 @ 4:51PM
What record? You are deluded.
The people we" helped kill" were the commies, remember? Like in Korea, Vietnam, Grenada,the reason for NATO, and stationing troops in Europe. Let me guess, you supported the sandinistas and you were a sandalista, right?
You probably vacation in Cuba and love Hugo Chavez.
Hugo endorsed Obama. Lech Walesa, a patriot, endorsed Romney. Bibi pretty much endorsed Romney.
Must bother you, right?
Jack London| 8.16.12 @ 5:21PM
You're a sick Nazi CJW. There's nothing you like more than funding dictators to torture people to death. You must be a leading cheerleader for Assad in Syria right now.
CJW| 8.16.12 @ 5:40PM
Wow, can't answer so you revert to the lefty rant of calling everybody a Nazi.
Nazis were like you, atheists and lefty totalitarian socialists. National Socialists Party, remember dimwit?
As for Assad, you girl Hillary was his supporter, remember? I think all Muslim and Commie dictators are scum, like you. But you like the commie dictatoras, right, admit it.
So you believe only nazis opposed the commies in Korea, Vietnam, and Europe? That must be news to the military that served, and the Democrats, like LBJ, Hubert Humphrey,JFK, and Truman that got us into Korea, Vietnam, Cuba, and created the bi-partisan Cold War doctrine of containment.
Let me guess, you believe Bill Ayers and Rev Wright.
You are as stupid as purpie, and sicker.
Jack London| 8.16.12 @ 6:04PM
Well I'll say that our foreign policy has supported murderous dictators and interventions that have killed millions of people - by both GOP and Dem presidents, nothing new there. The point is I'm consistent in defending human rights and democracy – I condemn Obama for drone attacks in Afghanistan. You though support the overthrow or stifling of democracy as in Iran (at time of the Shah), Chile, Nicaragua and many more because they are left wing. That's Nazi poison - and don't soil yourself by pretending the Nazis were left wing. That's like denying the Holocaust.
Nick| 8.16.12 @ 6:17PM
Just more commie agitprop from a typical Useful Idiot brainwashed by the Soviet version of "history," I'm afraid.
Are you one of those sleeper agents the Ruskies planted here, like in Telofon, Jack'o?
CJW| 8.16.12 @ 6:25PM
Commie Dred,
Your commie friends killed over one hundred million people during the last century. So stick your holier that thou attitude, hypocrite left wing loon. We opposed them. You do not like that.
What you call democracy were commie revolutionaries trying to get power. Only left wing loons like you believe that is democracy. You do support Castro and Hugo, right? You thought Castro was bringing democracy to Cuba, right?
The Nazi party was a socialist totalitarian party, just what you like. You don't like, but facts are facts.
You are denying your political heritage, the murder of over one hundred million, and the Holocaust, both by political idealogies of controlling the people, which is what you support.
Jack London| 8.16.12 @ 6:43PM
Chavez is democratically elected. So is Hollande in France and Morales in Bolivia, and others in Latin America. Thankfully our days of removing left wing leaders by force seems to be over.
And you're in state of ignorance if you think that democratic socialism has anything to do with Soviet or Chinese style communism, or with Nazism. You'd fail a high school class with that degree of stupidity. You should be embarrassed for yourself.
CJW| 8.16.12 @ 7:05PM
Commie Dred,
That you can't answer any facts shows what an idiot your are. Wake up. The evil empire fell. Chavez is a commie thug like Castro, idiot. I would fail a high school or college test taught by left wing loons like you because I would not regurgitate your nonsense.
You cannotcontradict any of the facts, and do not dey that you are a commie.
You are a hopeless useful idiot, wake up.
Jack London| 8.16.12 @ 7:18PM
Are you aware that Chavez is democratically elected? If not, you should do some reading up on this. Seriously - it could save you further embarrassment.
CJW| 8.16.12 @ 8:37PM
So you like Hugo, a commie thug, who endorsed Obama?
CJW| 8.16.12 @ 7:09PM
Jackie/commie dred
Your and commie dred spout the same left wing drivel. I meant to put your name with dred since the reply to both of you is the same.
Useful idiots.
DRed| 8.16.12 @ 7:03PM
Communism was a terrible ideology based on lies and mass murder. I'm not sure what commie revolutionaries you think I support, or why you think I support them, but I also get the sense that you are deeply stupid. So don't bother apologizing-I'm not offended.
CJW| 8.16.12 @ 7:12PM
You are not offended because it is true. You and Jackie post the same left wing drivel.
DRed| 8.16.12 @ 7:19PM
I could learn an enormous about about writing drivel from you, my friend.
Bob James| 8.16.12 @ 10:41PM
Good Lord above, this is laughable. "Millions"?? Who might they have been? "Democracy in Iran?" Have you been paying attention for the past thirty-three years? You should be embarrassed. But you're a communist stooge and, thus, incapable of shame.
TinaB| 8.17.12 @ 7:50AM
Oh my God, you are full out crazy. How can you say you defend democracy? Do you read nothing but fairy tales? BHO is anti freedom and Democracy. He wants the govt to run everything. Do you call that freedom? You dumb s--t.
Occam's Tool| 8.17.12 @ 1:19PM
The Nazis WERE left wing.
Or, maybe you think having government centers for raising Aryan children is a Right Wing idea?
As for the Holocaust and denial, I'm Jewish, you aren't, shut up about the Holocaust. I don't see you writing about helping Israel prevent a second one; quite the opposite.
Occam's Tool| 8.17.12 @ 1:16PM
Yes, Ollie is worth more than they are, just as it is worth nuking Afghanistan, Iran and Iraq to save the life of one American Soldier, Sailor, Airman, or Marine.
You want to see sick racist sickos, check out the Maori of New Zealand.
Drunken Sailor| 8.16.12 @ 1:51PM
Well you'r half right. I refuse to waste my time with HuffPo.
Dimitry_Aleksandrovich| 8.16.12 @ 12:52PM
A skilled laborer (i.e. a millwright or electrician) making $100-$130k per year in the late 90's does not sound unreasonable to me. This is typical of todays Republican Party..."the corporate whores" who will take a story about Bain Capital profiting over the closing of a Kansas City steelmill and the "corporate whores" of todays GOP will find a way to spin it and blame the union.
I'm a family man, a social conservative and a union member. I am disgusted at the GOP attacks leveled at union members and public employees in this country. We are labeled "union thugs" and called greedy for seeking a fair wage and health and pension benefits for our families when the thieves on Wall Street are raking in more than ever. The transfer of wealth is not going from the top down its going from the bottom up. We are becoming a third world country with the investment class at the top and the hourly wage earners at the bottom. America needs unions more than ever in this day and age.
Albert Constantine Jr.| 8.16.12 @ 1:35PM
"I am disgusted at the GOP attacks leveled at union members and public employees in this country. We are labeled "union thugs" and called greedy for seeking a fair wage and health and pension benefits for our families when the thieves on Wall Street are raking in more than ever. "
Do you find it ironic that on the one hand, you bemoan the use of the label "union thugs", yet do not hesitate to call those on Wall Street "thieves"?
Purp| 8.16.12 @ 2:58PM
I don't - Union members are honorable men, working hard for their living. Just because your Right Wing PuppetMasters tell you to say "Thugs" you dutifully march in lockstep like so many little Fascists, raising your hand and yelling "Heil!". Heil Mittler!
On the other hand Wall Street lives off of other people's misery. They make a buck buying low and selling high, screwing both sides and keeping what they can extract from both. So thieves, yea, they don't make anything but reap huge, huge payoffs for their manipulations. That, while the rest of us suffer. Yeah, thieves.
CJW| 8.16.12 @ 3:58PM
Obamaboy
Union members are honorable Americans who will not vote for Obama because he killed Teamsters jobs with the drilling and pipeline ban, and killed coal jobs, added 6 trillion in debt, increased unemployment to 10% forcing many into bankrupty and foreclosure, and tanked the economy, and bows to every dictator.
Romney will do as well as Reagan with private employer union members.
You are a fraud. You love China and said we can learn from China, a country that bans labor unions and civil rights.
Have you ever been a member of a union? Troll Local 1? Idiot.
Purp| 8.16.12 @ 10:04PM
What I said Stupidillo was that there are things we could learn from China - you wouldn't have firearms without China. You wouldn't have paper without China. You wouldn't have books without China. But I'm sure YOU know AAAALLLL about that, huh puppyboy?
Reagan added public employees, signed a stimulus bill, raised taxes(6times) and the national debt (18 times) ceiling multiple times.
But Romney is DEFINITELY, UNEQUIVOCALLY, NOT Ronald Reagan. Sorry Ronnie, CJW is stupid. Ignore the troll.
CJW| 8.16.12 @ 10:52PM
Obamaboy
You did not say that, idiot. You had one day to come up with this lame excuse.
Idiot.
CJW| 8.16.12 @ 11:16PM
Obamaboy
Capitalizing too many words, purpie, getting upset? Admit you are stupid, and move on. You are making less sense than usual.
You really are an idiot. But please stay. You are a fine example of the brain dead lefties, and provide laughs here.
Butch| 8.16.12 @ 4:10PM
" . . . honorable men, workinng hard for their living." Musta been tough carrying those sleeping bags to sleep on your $120K "living" job, all right. The one with the hard job was the supervisor who got written up for waking one of them up because something needed to be done. Did you even read the article before you started firing?
DRed| 8.16.12 @ 4:38PM
I don't understand why conservatives get so angry at the thought of a blue collar working man making a good salary. Is it just jealousy? Class snobbery?
And to Albert's question, what else would you call someone who steals money?
CJW| 8.16.12 @ 4:53PM
Dred
I would call him a lefty Democrat, like Obama taking 800 billion from Medicare to fund his pet project.
Butch| 8.16.12 @ 4:56PM
Because it is legalized thievery. These slugs sleep in sleeping bags on the job for jacked-up wages that rightfully belong to the owners/stockholders. Only their Wagner Act 1930s exemption from antitrust laws allow this.
DRed| 8.16.12 @ 5:04PM
So you want working class people to make less money-that's your recipe for prosperity?
CJW| 8.16.12 @ 5:13PM
Who or what is "working class" Dred? Define it.
What union were you a member?
George S| 8.16.12 @ 5:12PM
The reason we get angry is there are many people who would be willing to work at a, say, car factory for a salary and benefits package at a much lower compensation than what the UAW member gets. And the biggest reason that unions command these wages and benefits is federal labor laws.
The reason for those laws is to make labor scarce. Unions then become the monopoly of labor supply and are able to accomplish that only by government edict that prohibits Right To Work. (Labor unions are the only legal private sector monopolies allowed by law). So when I look to open a factory or build a skyscraper, I will go to jail if I reach a private agreement with the labor force that is willing to work for me.
That's why we get angry -- because the cost of labor drives us out of business as China and India open the factories that used to make the goods that Americans once made and prospered from.
Jack London| 8.16.12 @ 5:26PM
If you believe in free markets you'd believe in the free movement of labor. So let the Mexicans in.
George S| 8.16.12 @ 5:34PM
Mexicans or Martians -- as long as they obey U.S. immigration laws, I say the more the merrier.
Jack London| 8.16.12 @ 6:06PM
So open borders then. That's not the usual line. You people usually want to build a big fence. I hope you're ready for the tent cities.
DRed| 8.16.12 @ 5:40PM
Do you have any idea what workers in a Chinese factory get paid? Something like 200 bucks a month. We can't compete with China on the basis of wages, unions or no unions.
George S| 8.16.12 @ 5:52PM
DRed, I agree completely. We can go a long way in closing that gap but it would be a political suicide mission. There are many people who make a lot of money with our trade imbalance, mainly legal, labor and environmental concerns. This is where the political class gets its campaign cash from (the little guy throws out his solicitation to contribute to the DNC or RNC).
If we can scale back some environmental and labor regulations that make the production of factory goods more expensive, we can compete with the Chinese. But at a price. More pollution and less safer working conditions. However, those were the norm from 1890 to WWII when we were buzzing with production, resulting in the greatest immigration to our shores.
We made a choice: higher wages, safer conditions and minimal pollution.
So its is like a twist on the old riddle:
Higher Wages. Low Pollution. Cheaper Domestic Goods. Pick any two.
Jack London| 8.16.12 @ 6:13PM
What do you think is a living wage in the US? And what do you think driving down wages for the masses and racking them up more for the CEOs does for our society?
George S| 8.16.12 @ 6:40PM
Jack, it's very simple: lower regulatory costs on businesses results in lower wages which results in HIGHER living wages. Think about it.
(Here's a hint: your grandfather's wage would be considered poverty today but in his day he was able to support a family without grandmother working, without food stamps, without Medicare, without social security. How did they ever do it?)
Jack London| 8.16.12 @ 6:45PM
So - what regulation would you cut on businesses? let's have it - I keep asking this and get no answers. It's just a religious mantra otherwise, like Romney's refusal to say what tax breaks he would eliminate.
CJW| 8.16.12 @ 11:19PM
CommieJack
What is a living wage?
How much per hour?
Why didn't Obama and the Dem Congress pass it when they controlled government for two years, and why hasn't Obama proposed a bill for a living wage?
Nick| 8.16.12 @ 7:45PM
Living wage is a marxist term, Jack'o.
CJW| 8.16.12 @ 6:28PM
Commie Dred,
Your soulmate purpie likes China and said we can learn from China. If China was free and allowed labor unions then the workers would be paid more. But you commies always know best, you eliminate opposition including free labor unions.
Purp| 8.16.12 @ 10:05PM
What nonsense.
Doctor Right| 8.16.12 @ 4:36PM
Fascists are the Leftwing, not the Right.
You don't understand history or politics very well, do you?
And if Wall Street is so evil, WHY did they give so much to Obow-ma in 2008?
HMMMMMMMMMM, idiot-girl?
Purp| 8.16.12 @ 10:00PM
Hitler and Franco would disagree with you. But you know OH SO MUCH more than the original fascists, don't you?
Albert Constantine Jr.| 8.16.12 @ 5:31PM
Purp, my question was to Dmitry about his use of labels. I would not have asked it of you, as you have shown yourself incapable of discerning the irony recurrent in so much of what you write and advocate.
Dimitry_Aleksandrovich| 8.16.12 @ 7:52PM
They are thieves because the only loyalty they have is to the profit margin and if their decisions result in the closure of factories and steel mills in the United States and the destruction of entire communities who's economies were dependent upon those industries then what else should I call them?...They are definitely not the job creators that the GOP would make them out to be. The GOP candidate who labeled them "vulture capitalists" was right on the money.
Dimitry_Aleksandrovich| 8.16.12 @ 8:03PM
If they are not "thieves" then what are they? I am certainly not a thug. I don't carry out beatings or intimidation in the course of union business. As for the Wall Street gang they profit off of closing steel mills in Kansas City and factories in Youngstown destroying entire communities of their economic base. They have the politicias in their pocket and then when working class people try to use the power of collective bargaining to have a voice in the process they label us "thugs". These are thieves. They are worse than the Carnegies and the Rockefeller's because at least those men created jobs for Americans and helped build America. What have the Romney's of the world done except dismantle the industrial nation that the industrialists of the late 19th and early 20th century helped build.
Albert Constantine Jr.| 8.17.12 @ 11:30AM
There are thieves on Wall Street as there are thugs in unions. My point is that you seem to object that all members of unions are called thugs (and don't believe that the label appropriately applies to you and many, if not most, others), but show no hesitation in labeling everyone on Wall Street a thief.
Dimitry_Aleksandrovich| 8.18.12 @ 5:05AM
Your point is understood however there's a big difference between small players on Wall Street and big players who fix the game. Most individual investors are undoubtedly not thieves, but those who fix the game so they can profit off of the closure and offshoring of American industry most certainly are thieves and quite possibly traitors.
JP| 8.16.12 @ 1:38PM
Kansas City Steel was a loser. It was losing money before they bought it, and lost money afterwards. Bain, did the steel mill a favor; otherwise it would have closed its doors before the sale.
Perhaps it closed because electricians and millwrights were making more than doctors. Where I live the average electrician earns $65,000 and a journeyman millwright $58,000
Purp| 8.16.12 @ 3:01PM
That's Bull. The money BAIN extracts from any company they buy hastens the end for the company, and the workers are thrown on the mercy of the marketplace and the GOVERNMENT is left to pick up the Unemployment, Pension support and Food Stamps.
Yeah, BAIN is REAL good for America. Sucking the blood out of her. Just what RomBot plans to do to US if he gets elected.
Drunken Sailor| 8.16.12 @ 3:42PM
"Hastens the end"? I don't think Staples, or "The Sports Authority" would agree.
Purp| 8.16.12 @ 9:58PM
GST Steel, Dain, Ampad and dozens more would beg to disagree. How the h**l you think they made so much money? Staples and SA took off after Romney and BAIN were long gone. But they got their money, whether the companies survive or not. THAT's the point - they didn't buy the companies to save them, but to milk them and if they made it, fine, if not, who cares? That's NOT creating jobs. That's sucking until you stop and leaving the corpse to fend for itself. Kind of like what Bush/Cheney did to America. You really want Round 2.
Doctor Right| 8.16.12 @ 4:38PM
LOL!!!
The Parrot squawks again!!!
Bain! Bain! SQRAWKKK!!!!!
You're such a fool!
In Chicago today they commemorated the place where Barackie-Boy and Mooch-elle had their first kiss...
It was at a Baskin-Robbins...a company that was REVIVED by BAIN Capital.
Now please, Mr. Barista...more foam in my latte!
Butch| 8.16.12 @ 5:02PM
Aww, poor guys, "at the mercy of the marketplace." You mean like the employers they are stealing from? By the way, it's the employers who are picking up the unemployment. And me being forced to pick up any "pension support" is outrageous. And if they had lived responsibly, like many millions of others, they would need those food stamps and shouldn't get them.
Dimitry_Aleksandrovich| 8.16.12 @ 8:20PM
Of course you think that way because such things have never happened to you and if they did and you had a wife and three kids and a mortgage, car payment and the monthly bills then you would be demanding penion support as well especially if you were 15 years in or so. You would be demanding unemployment benefits and food stamps too. Of course you would.
Occam's Tool| 8.17.12 @ 1:32PM
Wife, two kids (one with special medical needs), two cars, one mortgage, union member. My 403(b) has no matching, my pension will be somewhere between 34-42% of 80% of my top 5 years salary when I retire at age 66, (I plan to go on to 72) and my health benefits cease when I retire unless I buy insurance. My pension is paid for 50% by me, 50% by the state. My 403 (B) is paid for 100% by me, no matching.
I'm sorry we Jews have screwed you Russians once again, Dmitry.
Occam's Tool| 8.17.12 @ 1:34PM
If I go on to age 72, it will be 42.5%, but the absolute max income that the 42.5% can be derived from is set by law, and I exceed it every year due to my incredibly intense schedule. That explains the somewhat confusing wording.
Dimitry_Aleksandrovich| 8.18.12 @ 4:59AM
I have nothing against Jews Occam and all though I am Russian Orthodox being Chrismated with a Russian name I am not Slavic (or at least not to my knowledge by blood). I have been to the former Soviet Union many times and my wife was born there. I am 100% American so much so that my father's bloodlines are completely hazy and my mother's mother was raised by Irish nuns in an orphanage in the Midwest.
Dimitry_Aleksandrovich| 8.16.12 @ 8:16PM
They most likely bought it with the full intention of closing it. It happends all the time especially if Bain had holdings in a competing steel firm. As for the electricians nd millrights making 100-130k. It makes sense with overtime and I don't believe the story about the sleeping bags. That sounds like b.s. to me. Mr. Lord's column spoke of union mandated overtime, but I've never heard of a union mandating overtime to a country. At refineries here in the Bay Area employers mandate that their employees work overtime and that's time and a half for anything between 8 and 12 and double time after twelve. I don't know what overtime laws are in Missouri but its entirely concievable for an electrican or millwright at a steel mill to work 12 to 16 hours a day which would explain them making 100k to 130k.
Jack London| 8.16.12 @ 3:20PM
"We are labeled "union thugs" and called greedy for seeking a fair wage and health and pension benefits for our families when the thieves on Wall Street are raking in more than ever."
Well said, but most people on this site want a society run in exactly that way. It matters not to them that our most prosperous times were characterised by good labor representation, higher taxes on the well off and far less inequality.
Drunken Sailor| 8.16.12 @ 3:48PM
Define fair wage and health and pension benifits.
Unions rarely have to pay much into their pensions or health care plans. Is it to much to ask them to pay a respectable portion? Why should the company shoulder the lions sharefor the employee's health care?
Unions protect their members based on seniority, not on work performance. You can have someone that may have started off a good worker, but once they felt safe, slacked off. Yet when the company has to do lay off's he gets to stay and the better performing workers may get let go due to lack of seniority.
Please explain how that is fair?
Unions promise much, but they cannot garuntee anything. Try keeping a business running if no profits are being made. Most business learned a long time ago that you get more productivity out of your employees if their needs are met and you keep a open honest dialogue with them. The need for Unions is rapidly becoming like the dinosaurs. Extinct.
Jack London| 8.16.12 @ 4:04PM
You know I think Biden had it just right - if you could people like you would make it unlawful for anyone to organize at work or withdraw their labor. Thankfully we still have our basic freedoms.
Butch| 8.16.12 @ 4:17PM
You don't need to be "organized" in order to withdraw your labor. You can do it any ole time you want to. You need to be organized to withdraw your labor and prevent someone else from replacing you. Darn right I'd make it illegal, by repealing the Wagner Act, which exempted unions from antitrust law. They are no different than OPEC.
George S| 8.16.12 @ 5:17PM
No No No... we do not want to make it unlawful to organize or have labor withdrawn. All we want is not to make it illegal to replace those who strike or hold out with other Americans who are willing to work and be happy to get less than union scale.
If two people reach an agreement -- here's the wage offer, I accept the wage -- why should that be illegal?
Drunken Sailor| 8.16.12 @ 5:41PM
You obviously missed the whole point. And have never been in a management position.
Dimitry_Aleksandrovich| 8.16.12 @ 8:44PM
A fair wage should be defined as a wage that will cover the basic living expenses of a worker and their family. Health benefits should mean full coverage with a reasonable copay. A pension is a pension is a pension. It should be at least 75% or more of the workers top pay at the time of retirement and I don't really care whether it is controlled by the union or the company as long as it is paid for by the company. My company contributes $500 a month on my behalf to the pension fund. If wages and benefits must be renegotiated because the company finds itself in hard times then that must be done. It's better the company survives and workers keep their jobs than the company go out of business. Seniority is something that I believe is still very important because it provides job security. If there is no seniority system in place then the company will get rid of most of their higher paid workers for new workers who make half the wage or less. Sometimes unions are complicit in this process with our local Electricians union being notorious for calling apprentices to worksites and not calling journeymen who they'd have to pay a higher wage.
Nick| 8.16.12 @ 10:26PM
"It should be at least 75% or more of the workers top pay at the time of retirement and I don't really care whether it is controlled by the union or the company as long as it is paid for by the company."
Then start you own company, Mr. Aleksandrovich. That way you can pay your employees whatever you want.
You have no right to dictate how much other companies pay their employees, or, if they even provide for a pension. So, butt out.
Dimitry_Aleksandrovich| 8.17.12 @ 11:15AM
B.S. I make the company money so I have every right Nick. I'm a family man. My family's got to eat and I have every goddamn right and you better believe it.
Albert Constantine Jr.| 8.17.12 @ 11:34AM
"My family's got to eat and I have every goddamn right and you better believe it."
Careful, Dimitry, I'm afraid I must caution you that your language is beginning to show some thug-like characteristics.
Dimitry_Aleksandrovich| 8.18.12 @ 5:19AM
Nobody gives it to you Al...if you want or need a piece of the pie to make sure your family is taken care of then you have to demand it and when your demands are refused and no reasonable compromises are reached then you have to take it. That's how life is. That's how politics is. My economic reality is that I'm dependent upon a wage and benefits to take care of my family. Shouldn't I have a voice in the process? Shouldn't I have a seat at the table? I always try to make money for my employer and I do make money for them, but I am grateful that there is a union I belong to that negotiates on my behalf.
Occam's Tool| 8.17.12 @ 1:36PM
No. You have the right to what your work makes the company. I doubt that's much given it is you. But at least your Russkie is coming forth, Socialist.
Dimitry_Aleksandrovich| 8.18.12 @ 5:15AM
Once again I am only Russian by way of my religion and the name I took at Chrismation. I defend Russia and Serbia for the same reasons you defend Israel. I am not a socialist. A trade unionist most definitely, but I am not calling for the nationalisation of major American industries.
Nick| 8.17.12 @ 5:53PM
Please refrain from using the Lord's name in vain, Mr. Aleksandrovich.
And, NO, you have absolutely no right to dictate anything to your employer. People start businesses by putting THEIR assets at risk and taking ALL the responsibility.
You, as a paid "slave," take no risk and hardly any responsibility. Again, start your own business and see how easy it is.
Just because your family has to eat, doesn't mean I, or any other employer, owes you a living.
Dimitry_Aleksandrovich| 8.18.12 @ 5:26AM
I am not a Serf Nick. My employer makes money off the fruits of my labor. They need me and I need them so its best to come to the table and work things out. Otherwise we will go back to being the property of our employers and the American dream will be dead. Everything our grandfather's fought and bled for over the last 100 years will be gone. You'll be working 70-100 hours a week or more trying to make ends meet. Wall Street loves Red China and why? Because Red China gives their workers a bunk, a bed of rice and a dollar a day while the corporations reap in the profits. Is that what you want for America Nick?
Nick| 8.18.12 @ 11:31AM
"I am not a Serf Nick."
I never said that you were, Mr. Aleksandrovich. Straw man.
"They need me and I need them so its best to come to the table and work things out."
That should happen when you get hired, shouldn't it? When you go to the interview, you put forward your attributes, you ask questions about what the job entails, you find out about the pay & benefits, etc.
When you are offered the job, a contract is made. You agree to give up your time & labor in exchange for the employer's money. And, maybe some other benefits which have value. Nobody forces you to accept that deal. You are free to leave whenever you like, if you are not happy with situation.
"Everything our grandfather's fought and bled for over the last 100 years will be gone."
Good!
"You'll be working 70-100 hours a week or more trying to make ends meet."
Umm, that is average for a small business owner. More, in the first few years of the business, as the owner struggles to get established & stay in the black.
It is obvious that you have no idea what it takes to run a business. Just as most liberal politicians don't have a clue. You sound like Nancy Pelosi, not Jim Demint.
"Is that what you want for America Nick?"
I want a FREE market & FREE competition for America.
TinaB| 8.17.12 @ 8:08AM
Interesting, Dimitry, that in your last sentence you use the pronoun "they" and it's antecedent is the Unions. You do so correctly. They is the new Capitalist Coporation, and like the banks once did, they call the shots in this country, or at least they used to. And you little union members keep the new fat cats happy with your dues whoever is paying them. You can't even see that.
I left the teachers union as soon as I knew they were totally corrupt. I joined no union and 15 years later retired. I don't thank them for my income, my benefits or my raises. I earned every cent. With my blood sweat and many tears.
And now that John Taylor Gatto has taught me the REAL foundations of American education, unlike Debbie Mitchell at UCF who taught me the sanitized version, I see the Big Picture.
To DRed, Purp and JackL, I dare you to watch the whole set of
"The Ultimate History Lesson" interview, July 2011' with a great mind and an unpolitical hero, John Taylor Gatto. you Tube link:
http://www.youtube.com/results.....rbDE7xy5Wg
Or just type the title into you tube and learn. Notes and references and all. From the website, Tragedy and Hope, as well. Happy learning. Lefties I dare you to listen to it all, and come back with your pathetic generations old drivel.
Occam's Tool| 8.17.12 @ 1:25PM
My retirement pension that I will get after 20 years working for the State of Minnesota will be 33% of 80% or less of my salary that I made working for the State. That's fine with me, as IT IS SUSTAINABLE, and I knew it going in. 80% of the top salary is not sustainable. Good to see what type of Conservative you are, Dmitri.
Dimitry_Aleksandrovich| 8.18.12 @ 4:47AM
What is 33% of 80%. It sounds to me like you're getting the short end of the stick. The only reason people work for the state is the benefits. I worked for the state of California in the past and made 17 an hour working rotating 12 hour shifts with no overtime unless I worked over 12 in a day or more than my scheduled hours for the week.
I'm not a G.O.P. conservative for sure. I'm blue collar, 100% working class union member and a family man. On social issues I'm conservative on economic issues I'm a nationalist who believes that our economic policies both foreign and domestic should benefit ALL AMERICANS not just those at the top of the food chain. That will never happen though unless working class Americans set aside their differences and unite to demand a piece of the pie. Then the establishment will have no choice but to come to the table and cut a deal with us.
Nick| 8.18.12 @ 11:58AM
"I'm not a G.O.P. conservative for sure."
What is a "G.O.P. conservative," Mr. Aleksandrovich?
One is a political party. The other is a set of principles and beliefs. Or, a movement. The GOP has liberal, conservative, and libertarian members. It's good that you are a social conservative, but, economic freedom is what this country was founded upon.
The union movement in this country has always been marxist and antithetical to freedom and free markets.
"That will never happen though unless working class Americans set aside their differences and unite to demand a piece of the pie."
Again, if you want a piece of the pie, start your own business. That way you can be the boss.
Did you put your property at risk for any of the companies for which you've worked? No?
Then you have absolutely NO say in the operation of the company.
Why is this so hard for you to understand?
Nick| 8.20.12 @ 12:17AM
Mr. Aleksandrovich?
Yoo-hoo?
Where'd you go?
CJW| 8.16.12 @ 4:54PM
Jackie
What union were you a member?
Dimitry_Aleksandrovich| 8.16.12 @ 8:30PM
They don't understand that big government is being replaced by big business and they're not going to be any freer because of it. If anything they will find sooner than later that they owe their soul to the company store. Government needs to regulate Wall Street and enact trade policies that keep American industry in the United States and allow American workers to freely engage in collective bargaining for the sake of their families. No union man wants to break the back of the company because his livelihood depends on the company turning a profit.
TinaB| 8.17.12 @ 7:54AM
That was to Jack, 6:04.
Occam's Tool| 8.17.12 @ 1:22PM
If the free labor market wants to pay a millwright or an electrician $100-$130 K a year, that's fine with me, Dmitri. But to have it forced out of people is problematic. And many governmental union leaders are thugs.
Investment, properly done, requires quite a bit of brains.
Dimitry_Aleksandrovich| 8.18.12 @ 4:55AM
They don't make a $100-$130k base salary. We're talking with overtime and many times employers (not unions) mandate that their employees work overtime especially in manufacturing. That's the private sector as for government union leaders many times they cannot demand a salary for government workers. Our pay was determined by elected officials when I worked for the state of California and now there are mandatory furlough days where state of California workers have to take days off without pay.
John Navratil| 8.18.12 @ 5:30PM
Dimitry_Aleksandrovich,
I've read your posts with interest. The one question I have is why would anyone hire you in the first place? It seems you think that once you have employment it is your right and duty to extract as much capital as you can from the business. I do that too, but I am never hired. I'm a sole proprietor of my own contract software business. When the deal doesn't match both my client's and my requirement, it is terminated. I'm the most fired man on earth, I feed my family and I don't pay union dues.
Your game is in play all over the economy but most obviously in the teachers and public service unions. Where will you live when California is only affordable by the rich and the welfare recipients? Will welfare be good enough for you?
Dimitry_Aleksandrovich| 8.19.12 @ 2:40AM
I have loyalty to my company because my company is loyal to its contract with its workers. It's that simple. I want to see my company thrive and everyday I go to work I try my best to take care of my company's customers which brings in more profit for the company and job security for me. I'm not public sector anymore. I work for a company with public contracts but I don't work on that side of it. I work with tourists. The side I work on has no government subsidies.
FiddlerBob| 8.16.12 @ 12:54PM
Let's not forget another liberal attack on the steel industry. Every time they raise the CAFE standards for miles per gallon the auto industry has to reduce the amount of steel that they can put in their cars. Reducing the weight is the cheapest way to increase the mileage (since the evil oil industry won't release the magical 1,000 miles per gallon carburetors or micro nuclear fusion reactors).
Anyway, this obviously reduces the demand worldwide for steel. And as an added liberal bonus, it increases the highway death toll because the folks are now wrapped in plastic or fiberglass instead of US STEEL.
Pecos Pete| 8.16.12 @ 6:19PM
Fiddler: Damn good point!
Dimitry_Aleksandrovich| 8.16.12 @ 8:46PM
Believe it or not the new span of the San Francisco Oakland Bay Bridge was constructed of 100% Red Chinese steel and even assembled there then brought over by ship. The state of California is a f%cking disgrace. No loyalty whatsoever.
Marie| 8.16.12 @ 1:26PM
Puts Obama's mini-rampage about Citizens United in his address to the congress in perspective, doesn't it? Very interesting. We all KNOW Obama is violating the law, now we just have to sue him to get the connections.
Nick| 8.16.12 @ 2:18PM
Poor, poor democrats. They're having a terrible summer.
I almost feel sorry for them. Almost.
First, they lost the Gov. Walker re-call.
Then, O'Biden said that we're in a depression.
Then, Bubba "The Rapist" Clinton came out against raising taxes by letting the "Bush Tax-Cuts" expire.
Holder the Crook became the first A.G. to be found in contempt of Congress.
O'Bama then said that business owners "didn't build" their companies.
After two mass-shootings, democrats have said nothing about gun-control, because they are afraid of the NRA.
O'Bama's campaign is suing to keep military members in Ohio from having 3 extra days to vote.
They lost the Chick-Fil-A kerfuffle with a huge backlash.
San Fran Nan Pelosi finally admitted that she hears voices in her head.
O'Bama's regime is gutting the work requirement from Welfare Reform.
And, O'Biden the Racist, falsely claims that Romney/Ryan want to bring back slavery.
This might explain why some lefty nut tried to shoot-up the offices of the Family Research Council yesterday. The democrats are loosing it.
CJW| 8.16.12 @ 2:28PM
Nick
Also the shooter at the FRC is a liberal activist.
Butch| 8.16.12 @ 4:30PM
Corrrect-0. We finally have a manifestly politicized shooting, clear left on clear right. Where's RCV?
Nick| 8.16.12 @ 4:37PM
Yeah, W, I saw that the punk had a bunch of Chick-fil-A sandwiches with him. He was obviously spurred on to commit this act of terrorism by the Southern Poverty Law Center, which called the Family Research Council a "hate-group."
I also forgot to mention how President You Didn't Build That's campaign unashamedly lied and accused Romney of killing a woman who died from cancer.
Man, did they get ripped for that one!
CJW| 8.16.12 @ 4:58PM
Nick
Stopped at a Chick-fil-A yesterday. Place was crowded. A diversity of people. Young, middle age, old, white, and black. The staff is very friendly. Spicey chicken meal is great.
The shooter at FRC obviously believes Obama and the lefties' rhetoric about the War on Women and other lefty nonsense.
Nick| 8.16.12 @ 5:26PM
We only have one Chick-fil-A in the whole Detroit area, W. Luckily, it's not that far from where I live. The next time I'm in the area, I plan on stopping by.
And, yes, I am shocked, SHOCKED! I tell you, that a lefty kook would go on a shooting-spree. O'Bama must tell his sycophantic supporters to tone down their rhetoric, shouldn't he?
West Houston| 8.16.12 @ 8:42PM
Has anyone else noticed that is you put a black cowboy at on Gerard, stick a cigar in his mouth, add a little goatee and a bolo tie, he's a dead ringer for Kinky Friedman?
I swear!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kinky_Friedman
West Houston| 8.16.12 @ 9:00PM
Has anyone out there seen them in the same romm together?
Albert Constantine Jr.| 8.17.12 @ 12:28PM
I was thinking it was more like David Axelrod's younger brother, but I can see a bit of that Kinky Friedman resemblance.
TinaB| 8.17.12 @ 8:19AM
I want to give a mini spelling lesson. There are two verbs, lose and loose. The first, with one o, hase a hard s sound, like a z does. The second, with two o's, oo, has a soft s, like a soft c in the word truce. In fact the very difficult english language has some crazy rules. Loose sounds like truce. Lose sounds like news. Pity they're not spelled like they sound, que nos? Just trying to help here.
I love some of you who do this, you don't know me but I know you. Your writings spur me on and give me hope for this wonderful USA, so I want to help you with your language nuances. Class dismissed.
Nick| 8.18.12 @ 11:41AM
Thanks for the lesson, TinaB.
Just poor proof-reading on my part. I mess-up the two all the time, and forget to check.
John Navratil| 8.18.12 @ 6:54PM
As somoene wohse figners wrok fsater tahn his brian, I take graet rfuge in the privlege of beign undresttod.
Nick| 8.20.12 @ 12:15AM
Ha-ha!
My only excuse is that I went to publik skool, Mr. Navratil.