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Sports Arena
Football Does a Body Good
Nannyism doesn’t.
Should consenting adults be allowed to play football?
Prior to a debate on the subject at New York University earlier this month, 53 percent of the audience opposed a ban on college football (and just 16 percent supported). Following the debate, 53 percent of the audience supported a ban.
That dramatic opinion shift comes in the wake of several decleaters to the game’s reputation.
In March, the NFL came down hard on the New Orleans Saints, whose bounty program offered financial incentives to defenders for injuring opposing players. More than 1,500 players have joined lawsuits against the league for not informing them of the dangers of the game. The suicide of Junior Seau, whose extremely long and violent NFL career unleashed not unreasonable speculation that so many jarring hits may have unmoored the beloved linebacker’s mental circuits, has hurt the league worse in every way imaginable than the Saints or the suits.
”American football is dying,” John Kass writes in the Chicago Tribune. “It’s about time.” He thinks parents will forbid their children from playing, thus starving the NFL of fans and participants. For parents who shuttle their kids to Pop Warner practices, he advises: “So why not make it simple and just give the kids packs of cigarettes instead?”
There’s strong evidence, not speculation, that cigarettes cause cancer. There’s no evidence, just speculation, that football caused Junior Seau to kill himself. Writers making connections between the self-administered demises of two retired stars (Seau and Dave Duerson) and the gridiron might as well ponder the pitfalls of their own profession. Do the unhappy endings of Ernest Hemingway, Hunter Thompson, and Arthur Koestler demonstrate a link between scribbling and suicide?
Journalists have parlayed a few tragic anecdotes among tens of thousands of retired professional athletes into a national anti-football frenzy — in a football-crazed country, no less. But statistics, experience, and observation strongly suggests that the people playing football are healthier than those watching it — and even those refusing to watch.
A government study commissioned by the NFL Players Association found that athletes in the league lived longer than their male counterparts in American society. The study looked at 3,439 men who played for five years or longer in the league between 1959 and 1993 and discovered 334 deaths. Had the results mirrored statistical norms among American men, the researchers would have found 625 deaths. It turns out that professional football players have lower rates of cancer and heart disease.
Who would have guessed that there are health benefits to all that running, jumping, pushing, and pulling?
The number of football deaths at all levels has fallen dramatically over the last half century. Present hysteria aside, rule changes and advances in equipment have made it a safer game. During the second half of the 1960s, brain-injury deaths averaged more than 20 per year for football players. That figure is now less than five per year in a sport played by millions.
Perhaps four deaths annually, and an uncountable number of concussions, is an unacceptable price for what amounts to an amusement. Former American Spectator writer Malcolm Gladwell said as much in that NYU debate by wondering aloud about the ethics of watching a game in which contestants risk life and limb. But every year about 40 Americans die skiing, about 800 die bicycling, and about 3,500 die swimming.
Are those dangerous activities permissible because they haven’t captured voyeurs the way the NFL has?
Like football, there are benefits to skiing, cycling, and swimming. There aren’t figures on how many lives those activities extend and enhance. But sensible people know that skiing, cycling, and swimming are on the whole good for you.
So is football.
When I played in high school, I spent five to six days a week working out in the weight room and sprinting on the track in anticipation of the season. I strangely ran with weighed-down tires roped to my waist, broad-jumped my way up stadium bleachers, and imbibed powder-based concoctions that the vitamin store insisted were healthy but that my palate insisted were not. All that trouble resulted in a touchdown reception, a fumble recovery, and a few special teams tackles. I spent most of my senior year on the sidelines rather than on the field.
About the Author
Daniel J. Flynn is the author of Blue Collar Intellectuals: When the Enlightened and the Everyman Elevated America. He blogs at www.flynnfiles.com.
Letter to the Editor View all comments (151) | Leave a comment
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Clint| 5.18.12 @ 6:21AM
The Chickification Of America's Men & Their Lives.
numbatdog| 5.18.12 @ 7:02AM
Right Clint. It's really quite simple.
As American men are becoming comfortable with their PC role of defanged metrosexuals (with a daily routine of plucking, moisturizing, body hair shaving and extended grooming), they are becoming uncomfortable with old fashioned rough male activities such as hunting and football.
Not a problem. The nanny state will soon legislate away another cornerstone of American life.
Bob Grant| 5.18.12 @ 10:05AM
A broken clock is right twice a day.
Clint| 5.18.12 @ 4:31PM
Grant's Mitten's Broken Kuku Kitty Clock.
Bobby G. | 5.18.12 @ 3:02PM
No surprise here. The National Association of Sillies has (gradually) managed to de-ball most every American sport that had a majority of males participating. Count on it that this collection thongs will eventually call for the total ban on football. Or at least at the pee wee, junior and high school levels. Following that, poking their pinkie in the eye of the NFL ought to be ... cake.
Even if they DO manage to semi-restict the sport, all that American kids and young adults will probably be left with are the occasional Sunday afternoons of giggles and tee-hees at the Greater Hollywood F-g Football Tournament.
Too over the top? Sorry, kids. It is what it is.
Darin| 5.18.12 @ 6:36AM
As in everything else, the liberal definition of freedom is restricted to things approved by THEM. This applies to politics, religion, diet, lifestyle, and now sports.
To rational, thinking, intelligent people, the liberal application of freedom is better known as slavery. But liberals are too intolerant to let you express this observation.
Appleby| 5.18.12 @ 6:46AM
The idea seems to be to force people to do things they hate and forbid them from doing things that they love. Thus, people who prefer to sit on the dock and sip lemonade must be forced to exercise, and people who love sports must be forced to sit on the dock...
I recommend that when Nanny starts to whine, that we just turn to her and say firmly, "NO." And then we go back to what we were doing. Locally where a lot of kids play soccer, because their parents are unreconstructed foreigners from countries where soccer is a religion, there is a Nanny Move to force the kids to wear helmets and other protective gear which will slow them down and interfere with the flow of the game. Hockey has already demonstrated that the more "safety equipment" you pile on Junior, the more violent he becomes, as he now wrongly believes that he and his friends are protected against injury. The rate of severe, career-ending concussions has risen dramatically since Nanny forced all players to wear helmets, for only one example. Likewise in NA$CAR -- since the Nannies have turned the cars into armor-plated missiles, the number of huge flying accidents has risen dramatically as drivers believe now that they can roll the car seventeen times and bounce it higher than the infield fence and still walk away unscathed.
There is no likelihood that college football will ever be escorted into history, and as long as that avenue for those whose brains lag behind their brawn remains, Pro Ball will survive.
Just tell Nanny to hush and go tend to her knitting.
Moe Blotz| 5.18.12 @ 8:20AM
The safety improvements in NASCAR are a direct result of that governing body moving swiftly to implement changes because of the deaths of two drivers named Petty and Earnhardt. The cars are smaller, run faster, and easier to roll than the full size "stock" cars from forty years ago. When the NASCAR drivers bang into each other now, the damn vehicles shed parts and sheet metal whereas the race cars based on stock vehicles carried on. The window safety net, Hanniford device, and custom fitted seat have saved more than one driver a trip to the morgue. Nanny your arse.
2Anglico| 5.18.12 @ 8:45AM
So Moe, there will never be another NASCAR death?
How, EXACTLY does the NFL compare to NASCAR?
I read where NASCAR attendance is way down, there just couldn't be any relation to rule changes now could there?
Personally, I've stopped watching the NFL due to rule changes that have already been implemented by people who never played the game, like the commissioner.
You worry about you, leave US alone.
Appleby| 5.18.12 @ 12:06PM
My point is that the cars are so "safe" now, that the drivers feel justified in taking far more dangerous actions than they used to take when cars were "dangerous" and people were frequently killed.
This includes Danican't who got away scot free after ramming another driver into the wall at Darlington.
Paul Kotik| 5.20.12 @ 10:35PM
That's why it's now BORING.
My evening commute on I-95 in the Miami area is far more interesting.
Frank Drackman| 5.18.12 @ 7:18AM
I date the beginning of Americas decline to 1973.
Nope, not America's Ignominous withdrawal from Vietnam, not Watergate, A-rab Oil Embargo, not even the adoption of the DH, but.................
TEE-BALL,
Which I missed by 2 years, and you should have seen our 10 year old faces when we saw the Fresh-Meat-8-yr-olds(For Clint & Jack) swinging pathetically at stationary balls(Clint&Jack; again) instead of cowering from 30mph brushback pitches like WE had to do.
I remember getting drilled in the ribs just for having the temerity to stand in the front of the box(I love the front of the box)
Yeah, my Mom didn't play around.
Worst year was the final year of playing on the smaller little league diamond with its 45 foot pitching distance, that made 60 mph fastballs look like Nolan Ryan in his prime.
Crimminy, kids don't even play REAL baseball anymore, the kind with a broom handle(Jack & Clint) and a battered duck taped ball, with a dead cat for home plate..
Its all "Traveling Teams" and part of the tears I wept at the birth of my daughters was all the time I WOULDN'T have to spend chanting HEYBATTAHEYBATTAHEYBATTAHEYBATTA at little league games.
OK, so I make lewd remarks about her Softball/Volleyball/Tennis Opponents, someone's gotta be "That Guy" in the Crowd..
Frank
Albert Constantine Jr.| 5.18.12 @ 8:33AM
Doctor;
At your daughter's softball games, does the batting team chant "Rolling, Rolling, the Pitcher's Going Bowling" when the pitcher bounces one in front of the plate?
Frank Drackman| 5.18.12 @ 9:10AM
Nah, I tried singing the "Theme to Rawhide" once when a particularly portly catcher would walk out to the mound, but nobody got it...
Frank
Albert Constantine Jr.| 5.18.12 @ 10:33AM
"All the things I'm missin'
like vittles, love and kissin'
will be waitin' at the end of the line"
Given the large presence of women who bat from the other side of the plate in adult softball, perhaps they thought it had more than one meaning.
Frank Drackman| 5.18.12 @ 10:51AM
Not to be a nit-picker but............
I think the correct lyrics are;
"good" vittles,
at the end of my "ride" not, line
Frank "putting the "Ass" in Ass-Burgers, Drackman
Albert Constantine Jr.| 5.18.12 @ 9:04PM
Your recollection is likely more accurate.
Clint| 5.18.12 @ 10:02AM
Uh Oh !
Frankie The Fag Is In The Building.
Call Bibi.
Frank Drackman| 5.18.12 @ 10:06AM
Clint, do you eat your Mother out with that mouth???
Frank
PS-go ahead, say you eat MY mother out..I've got a come-back that'll slap the dried cum off your porn-stash...
Clint| 5.18.12 @ 10:15AM
Frankie Wears A Mustache To Hide The Stretch Marks From Eatin' At Bibi's Salami Stand.
I Played College Baseball And We'd Spit Chew On Little Bush League Shuck & Jive Trash Talkin' Wuzz Wimps Like You, Bibi's Towel Boy, Frankie The Fag.
Frank Drackman| 5.18.12 @ 11:00AM
Sucking Cock causes Stretch Marks?
Guess you would know....
Frank
Clint| 5.18.12 @ 4:33PM
Yeah, You Bragged About Your Bibi Stretch Marks, Frankie Sugar Pockets.
chuck| 5.18.12 @ 10:07AM
Clintie, I bet your mommy makes you wear a helmet when you ride your tricycle.
Clint| 5.18.12 @ 10:19AM
That's A Lie Chuckie The Wuzz,
I Don't Even Wear A Helmet When I Ride My MC.
Occam's Tool| 5.18.12 @ 10:31AM
Yeah, Clint, the TBIs do add up....
Clint| 5.18.12 @ 4:36PM
We Heard You Gave Bibi A Serious TBI To His Lower Head, Occam's Lips.
Occam's Tool| 5.18.12 @ 5:12PM
Ahh, you think your BRAIN is located there. Well, from the way you think and write, maybe it is. My best guess before was self fertilizing 302 brain celled nematode. I may be more correct than I thought...
Clint| 5.18.12 @ 8:05PM
Your Brain Is Located In Bibi's Crotch,
That's Obvious, From The Way You Act, Israel Firster Bibi Cabana Boy,Tool Job.
I Don't Have To Guess That You're A Bottom Of The Barrel, Loser, Government Hire Self-Help Sorry-Assed Excuse For A Shrink, Who Pushes Pills On Poor Snook Mental Patients.
Bob Grant| 5.18.12 @ 7:52PM
Clint,
Why do play the gay insult card so often? My 30-second pop psychology diagnosis says you are projecting.
Some Freudian Mumbo Jumbo.
Any licensed shrinks in the house to back me up?
Clint| 5.18.12 @ 8:07PM
Uh Oh !
I Pushed Little Bobby's Gay Button.
I Didn't Know,You Were A Little Light In Your Loafers, Bobby.
Call Mittens.
Bob Grant| 5.18.12 @ 10:32AM
Why does Pee Wee Herman come to mind when I picture you on a bike?
Gray suit, white shoes, and red bow tie much?
chuck| 5.18.12 @ 11:39AM
Yep, and like Pee Wee, he's giving guys shots in the back of the head at the movies.
Bob Grant| 5.18.12 @ 12:27PM
Heh,
Actually, while at the "movies", Clint has his own concussion issues. Like the constant banging of his head against the backs of seats.
I wonder if he can sue Moe's Spank House Emporium?
Clint| 5.18.12 @ 8:09PM
Actually, Mittens Gets Head From His Kitten, Little Bobby.
Clint| 5.18.12 @ 4:53PM
He Heard Chuckie Takes Bibi's Shots Somewhere Else.
Oldefarte| 5.18.12 @ 12:44PM
And in a theatre watching etc porno movies also!!!!
Clint| 5.18.12 @ 4:56PM
Deliverance Banjo Pickin' Inbred, Fart Bottom, Stars In Porn Movies With His Brother, Down At The River.
Clint| 5.18.12 @ 4:50PM
Mittens' Kitten Grant Gettin' Ready For A Biking Date With Mittens.
http://www.grimmemennesker.dk/.....ap-man.jpg
Drunken Sailor| 5.18.12 @ 3:48PM
Now Chuck, why should Clint take his helmut off when he gets off the short bus just to ride his tricycle?
Clint| 5.18.12 @ 4:59PM
The Bartender Makes Drunken Swabbie Wear A Seat Belt & A Helmet When He's On His Bar Stool.
Bob Grant| 5.18.12 @ 7:32PM
Hey Clint, speaking of bar stools, do you still turn it upside down so you and 3 of your closest friends can sit down while y'all sip appletinis?
Clint| 5.18.12 @ 8:12PM
Bobby Has Bar Stools. That's Why The Bartender Makes Bobby Wear Adult Pampers Before He Let's Him In The Bar.
Bob Grant| 5.19.12 @ 2:00PM
...adult pampers or your face...
Clint| 5.20.12 @ 9:41AM
Mittens Sits On Little Bobby's Face.
Clint's "Dad"| 5.18.12 @ 2:24PM
Ain't me. Took all those tests, DNA, blood, Ain't me.
Clint| 5.18.12 @ 5:02PM
Dr.Reich's Mama," I Couldn't Have Caught It Form Occam's Tool Or Micky's Mouse,They Roll The Other Way. "
Occam's Tool| 5.18.12 @ 5:14PM
That's not what the Playboy Playmate said, Clint. Or the Swimsuit model. Thanks for playing, though.
Clint| 5.18.12 @ 8:16PM
The Playboy Playmates Told Us Tool Job Was Hef's Cabana Boy, Before He Became Bibi's.
Jim| 5.18.12 @ 4:45PM
Frank, that was awesome - I must have married your mom - our boy got hit during football practice, and mom yelled, "That's what you get for not paying attention!" That got a thumbs up from the coach, and the boy has paid attention ever since.
Dead cat - hilarious!
old white guy| 5.18.12 @ 7:34AM
i used to pitch when i was a kid. i can still remember seeing stars when i put one over the plate that was hit back at me so hard i did not have time to get my glove up. i was hit right in the face under my nose. i kept playing. where will the men come from if current and future generations are afraid of any injury. marines, army, airforce and navy. where will the men come from?
chuck| 5.18.12 @ 8:08AM
I used to pitch too. Still remember drilling some kid in the back with a fastball, and making him cry.
I also got hit in the face with a ball my older brother hit straight at the mound. You suck it up, grab the ball, and go after the next batter. "THERE'S NO CRYING IN BASEBALL!"
I still have the scar from a hockey stick under my eye. Being a kid meant cuts, bruises, scraps, and broken bones. Broken bones and a cast were the best, especially if it was your dominant arm. Got you out of a lot of school work. "Sorry teach, I can't write too well." Got you lots of attention from the girls.
Now they want to ban football, and men are getting their parts cut off to become women. Think there's a connection?
Bob Grant| 5.18.12 @ 8:44AM
Come on. Football jumped the shark when it implemented pink onto uniforms for breast cancer awareness month.
And yes, I'm very supportive of breast cancer awareness..
Albert Constantine Jr.| 5.18.12 @ 8:59AM
I pitched for a year, and I was good for five innings in a six inning game. The sign for the coaches that I was tired and to pull me for a reliever was when I would start hitting the batters.
I never remember the other kids crying (as I didn't when I took a line drive in the mouth and chipped my tooth); they seemed happy to take their base. Maybe my fastball wasn't that fast after all.
Frank Drackman| 5.18.12 @ 9:03AM
Chuck, did you pitch in the Malmstrom AFB Little League circa 1974?
I remember this one guy, I think his name was Travis, or Brett, only kid in 6th grade with a mustache, probably cause he should have been in 9th grade.
Lefthanded like me, and when he'd throw sidearm I swear it looked like he was pitching from the first base dugout.
Even considered batting right handed, anyway,
for a whole week he said he was gonna drill me in the back, "I'm gonna get you Drackman!" he'd shout, and there weren't no support groups, encounter sessions or therapists, just a sleezy coach who made "Wooderson" in "Dazed in Confused" look like Vince Lombardi.
"He's just tryin to get in your Head Man," said the Coach when I asked if I could ride the pine...
Then Saturday came, and he drilled me in the back.
And I didn't cry, cause I knew my Mom would do that whole "Great Santini" basketball-on-the-forehead thang, which really sucks when its done with a baseball.
Brought my OPS up to a whole...
Oh I don't know, we didn't know what OPS was in 1974...
Frank
Occam's Tool| 5.18.12 @ 10:33AM
Frank: made my day! (as usual)
Mom did the Great Santini? Oh that sucks, man.
Drunken Sailor| 5.18.12 @ 3:51PM
Damn good thing you weren't into bowling. That "Great Santini" move would have curbed your style.
Occam's Tool| 5.18.12 @ 5:14PM
Chuck:
In a word, yes.
nathan| 5.18.12 @ 7:37AM
The author asks, "Should consenting adults be allowed to play football?" The emphasis here is "consenting adults." How far is he and the rest of you prepared to go with that question given that James Madison in the First Amendment and his writings including the Federalist Papers made it abundantly unambiguously clear that this country is not a theocracy. So let's ask some more questions along these lines.
1: Should CONSENTING ADULTS be allowed to engage in prostitution? Why not? Assumin NO COERCIAN regarding the woman, we take it for granted she owns her body and has all rights to it, why not?
2: Should CONSENTING ADULTS be allowed to consume drugs other than alcohol? (Yes alcohol is a drug, VERY addictive, look at the death toll on the highways from improper consumption.) As long as they harm no one but themselves (at which point they should maybe get life sentences which arguably drunk drivers who cross center lines and kill families of four should get now?) should these CONSENTING ADULTS be allowed to consume their drug of choice, not just the socially acceptable one?
3: Should CONSENTING ADULTS of the same sex be allowed to have their relationship given the imprimature of the state? Again, Madison made it clear this isn't a theocracy, he refused to go there. So in a secular society what OTHER things should CONSENTING ADULTS be allowed to do where other people's rights are not directly impacted?
And honestly since the writer opened the piece with that question, I throw this out for the class for discussion. Have at it. But again, I urge the answers be within the bounds of the Constitution as the Founders, especially Madison understood it.
Have at it.
2Anglico| 5.18.12 @ 8:56AM
The Founders made it clear that the Federal government should be limited but the states had authority to regulate ALL those things you mention that you like to engage in. So, according to the Constitution, you are free to move to a state that will let you engage in your vices. Californication comes to mind.
"The powers delegated by the proposed Constitution to the federal government are few and defined. Those which are to remain in the State governments are numerous and indefinite."
-- James Madison, Federal No. 45, January 26, 1788
Class dismissed.
The Big E| 5.18.12 @ 9:37AM
"Should CONSENTING ADULTS be allowed to engage in prostitution?"
Anyone who thinks the majority of prostitues "consent" to do what they do is ignorant of the reality of prostitution.
"Should CONSENTING ADULTS be allowed to consume drugs other than alcohol?"
Considering the number of drug addicts I know and have represented over the last 16 years who struggle everyday to tell their "drug of choice" no and can't, then I would say "no," because those people are not really "consenting" either. I also would say the answer is "no" considering that the people whose lives they destroy on the way, the lives of their spouses and children for example, or those whom they victimize in order to get that drug of choice, generally aren't consenting either. Spend 16 years in criminal court. See the incredibly high correlation between drug use and violent crime, between drug use and property crime, and then talk to me about who is "consenting" to what.
"Should CONSENTING ADULTS of the same sex be allowed to have their relationship given the imprimature of the state?"
A marriage contract is not just between the people who are parties to it, it is also a contract made with society since society is obligated to recognize the marital status, and society clearly does not consent, considering that the issue has been put to a vote 32 times, and the answer has been "no" every time.
Here's a clue - life in a civilized society is not just about the individual and the immediate gratification of the individual's selfish desires. It's also about the impact that gratification has on others.
For every person who can snort a little coke from time to time and not have a problem with it, there are twenty (at least) who break into homes and businesses to steal to support their habit. Should we make it legal for the twenty to use a drug which drives them to victimize others so the one can use the same drug without fear of arrest? Or should we expect the one to give up a habit he enjoys in an effort to prevent the destructive actions of the twenty?
Occam's Tool| 5.18.12 @ 10:40AM
The Big E----here's another fun fact for you (I agree with you completely, incidentally)---American Journal of Psychiatry November 8, 2011 e-published before print: Methamphetamine abuse is the abuse condition most associated with a later diagnosis of schizophrenia---hazard ratio 9.37. But number 2, with a hazard ratio of 8.16, was cannabis---higher than alcohol or cocaine.
You and I have to clean the crap up that the legalizers want to throw at us. I suspect you are as busy as I am, if not busier. Have a great weekend, sir. (The hazard ratio is the risk ratio weighted over the entire study, as opposed to a point risk ratio)
The Big E| 5.18.12 @ 12:27PM
I remember hearing about that study, but I haven't read it.
I'm not surprised, though. I'm a lawyer, not a mental health pro, so my experience is purely anecdotal, but I suspect that we are just beginning to scratch the surface when it comes to the long term impact of cannabis use, especially cannibis use initiated in the teens or early twenties.
nathan| 5.18.12 @ 3:13PM
Take your comments on coke. We tolerate how many deaths due to drunk driving per year? 6-10,000? So why do we allow that drug, whose destructiveness is certainly up there with all these other drugs, and then say to users of marijuana, no YOU can't have your drug of choice? That doesn't make sense. Also you know full well that legalize these drugs like coke, the cost comes down, and the violence (the break ins etc) come down too. The coorelation between drugs and violent crime is ther primarily because those drugs are illegal, alcohol is not. Make alcohol illegal again, and the coorelation would be the same. Punish the abuse, not the use. And free up jail space for real criminals not just casual users.
On prostitution cite the studies. In Nevada, cite credible studies where the women in those legal brothels, a significant minority even are forced into doing it. We're not talking economic compulsion. If people need money for a roof over their heads, they might even gasp become a bureucrat. (I know, some people will do anything for a buck. LOL) We're talking people who literally have some form of gun put to their heads, do this or you won't see your daughter type gun.
You said the issue of same sex marriage has been put to vote 32 times and the answer has been "no" every time. If we conclude that these unions fall under the "unalienable rights doctrine" then the votes are irrelevant. I'm honestly not sure they do to tell you the truth. But the votes by themselves tell us nothing since this is not a democracy.
But I appreciate the comments and discussion. Rights, especially in a secular society, especially when you have a country government ultimately by the unalienable rights doctrine, can be controversial sometimes. So thanks for the discussion.
The Big E| 5.18.12 @ 4:31PM
"Also you know full well that legalize these drugs like coke, the cost comes down, and the violence (the break ins etc) come down too. "
Dead wrong. You yourself cited the damage alcohol does, and yet it is legal. Has it's legalization put a stop to the thousands of deaths every year to drunk driving? Has its legalization put a stop to the number drunken brawls, or the number of drunks who beat up their wives and kids?
And as for prostitution, are you claiming that legalizing protitution would suddenly do away with forced prostitution? Human trafficking for sexual purposes? Trafficking in children for sexual purposes?
And as for your same sex marriage issue, I thought you were talking about CONSENTING adults? As I said, marriage is not just a contract between the people getting married, it is also a contract with society, the members of which must then recognize the marriage, and yet you say their consent of those who must recognize the marriage does not matter? That they can be FORCED to consent?
So much for consenting adults.
Understand, I'm not saying that homosexuality should necessarily be illegal, though I think a strong argument could be made that it should. But gay "marriage" is a different issue altogether specifically because it necessarily involves people other than the consenting adults in the bedroom.
Occam's Tool| 5.18.12 @ 5:17PM
Nathan: the damage that cocaine and methamphetamine do RARELY have to do with burglaries---they are domestic violence issues and suicide attempts.
MJ and meth are FAR more likely than alcohol to induce psychosis. Also, Alcohol can be used in moderation. Meth cannot, and MJ can cause psychosis in surprisingly small doses.
richard ryan| 5.18.12 @ 7:55AM
I played football from grade school through college, and I generally agree with the tone of the article. Nannyism in this country makes me sick, and football is an all-american sport that lets boys be boys. Few points though.
1. Advances in equipment have not always been a good thing. Better helmets and pads have allowed more violent collisions without obvious injury. This rapid deceleration of the brain may not cause a concussion every time, but it can damage the brain over time. There have been 20 or so brain samples examined among former NFL players with dementia/depression/suicide. Over half of them had a pathology similar to Alzheimer's but with a unique protein accumulation. This is thought to result from thousands of these "shear" injuries to brain cells from repetitive bumps.
2. If there is a good chance this repetitive trauma is damaging brain cells in adults, we don't know how it affects the growing brain of a 9 year old.
We all decide what risks to take as adults, but perhaps full contact football is not the best game for little boys. The hitting and tackling style of today's game is much different than a generation or 2 ago. It used to be more of a shoulder first, wrap the legs game. Now it's head to head, and for my child the risk and uncertainty is not worth it.
Ted| 5.18.12 @ 9:43AM
You hit the proverbial nail on the proverbial head. The advances in equipment have allowed players to think they will be protected from most injuries, especially to the head. If we want to make football safer, we should use less equipment rather than more.
Bob Grant| 5.18.12 @ 10:23AM
Here's the rub:
The "advances" in equipment that allow parties to THINK they will be protected from injuries have encouraged coaches to teach players to use their head to tackle players is the fatal flaw.
Class action lawsuits will follow.
So many legal questions, so little time.
* Did coaches institutionalize the technique of using the head as a tackling mechanism because of their belief that "advanced" helmet technology was sufficiently safe?
* How widespread are "bounties"?
* Did the helmet manufacturers over sell the safety aspects of their products?
* How long have Football officials known about this problem and when did they share this information with the players and the public? What additional preventative steps were taken and when?
....
I truly believe the concussion issue is a Black Swan event for the Football Industry and will have a massive impact on the participation, quality, and economics of the sport.
It will be interesting to see how this plays out.
Rick| 5.18.12 @ 10:14AM
I can't confirm this, but I grew up in a small town close to Penn State University. When I played ball back in high school, we were always told (as linemen) that if we didn't start blocking with our heads up, the coaches would have us remove our helmets and carry on, like they did at Penn State during camp. Again, can't say for certain, but I can say that practicing without certain pieces of equipment does have its merits. How are you going to block (or rush the quarterback) if you don't have a helmet? Exactly as you should... head-up, hands-in-front, rip/swim technique, form-tackling, etc.
Pads are meant to protect, not to assist. Per your comment, Rich, about little kids, it's just a failure in coaching. If a kid sees a James Harrison hit on TV and tries to mimic it, he runs a lap. If a kid goes head hunting, he's done for the day, and you talk to his parents/guardians. The point is that it's so vital to teach the game right to kids when they're that age. "Adaptations" of the game should be practiced sparingly and only in the interests of learning.
Jim| 5.18.12 @ 4:52PM
Then teach him how to tackle and be tackled correctly. There is another response besides not letting him play.
Bob Grant| 5.18.12 @ 8:29AM
I grew up playing countless pickup football games, played briefly in middle school (formerly known as high school), and have been a fan of football close to 40 years. I have no dog in this fight, however, and couldn't care less if football should be banned or not but I believe it will be forever changed because of the mounting evidence that head collisions, regardless of severity, negatively affects the brain.
The science, evidence, and just plain common sense is too much to overlook.
To make matters worse for the Football Industry, the technique of using the head as a battering ram, coached to players the past 30+ years, has created the "smoking gun" that class action lawyers dream about. This false belief that improved helmet technology would protect the brain and thus justifying introducing a whole new technique for tackling opposing players using the head was the fatal flaw. The mounting evidence collected from the first crop of players who were coached this technique is, you must admit, troubling at minimum.
One thing for sure is the Football Industry will be forced to drastically change the nature of the game to protect players but this will create dilemma:
How does one change the game in such a way as to prevent it from being further unwatchable to the sports fan? The increased stoppages in play over the past decade make watching the sport tedious at best. Will fans tolerate even more stoppages in play and radical rule changes to ensure player safety?
Will the fear of lawsuits or congressional action further degrade the quality of the sport to the extent that it's unwatchable?
In addition, is Football Inc, with it's massive associated infrastructure (i.e. billion dollar stadiums and multi-million dollar practice facilities) TOO BIG TO FAIL?
Is it so GIGANTIC that it CAN'T go away without severe negative consequences to the local cities and communities that will be forced to pick up the tab on the cost of these infrastructures if it does?
JimH| 5.18.12 @ 8:47AM
Informed, consenting adults, by all means let them do as they will. The question really is more about children. All sports involve some risk. Every year you hear sad stories of a few boys killed in Little League. Death here is usually the result being hit in the chest by the ball in such a way that the heart stops. There is evidence that soccer can lead to brain damage. I think because the kids do not know how to properly head the ball. Don’t ask about hockey; though I guess its better now with helmets and full masks. I saw somewhere that cheer leaders have a higher accident rate than the sports teams they cheer on. Life has risks. Any normal healthy kid will do things which are dangerous. Organized sports at least allows for a controlled environment and adult oversight. The adults need to make sure that proper equipment is used and fitted and used in the proper way. The kids need to be taught proper techniques, such as in football. You wrap up on your tackles and don’t lead with your head. Maybe football should return to some version of the old leather helmet to minimize the temptation to use it as a weapon.
MikeBee| 5.18.12 @ 9:11AM
JimH,
You hit it! I agree with Coach Lou Holtz that today's helmet should be trashed, and we should return to the leather helmet of old. Back then, players didn't lead tackles with their heads, as they knew it would hurt. You tackled with your shoulder, and by wrapping the legs up. That's a more effective way to tackle, anyway.
Also, I've noticed that a lot of players who use today's helmets don't try to keep their heads from slamming into the ground. They think that they are safe with the helmets. But, as Richard Ryan points out above, some of the worst injuries are those which creep up perniciously, and are not noticed right away. Football players should learn Lesson One in Judo: how to fall down. Judo experts know that they are going to fall or be thrown; better learn how to fall safely. A Judo expert always falls with his head moving in the opposite direction from the ground, never to come into contact with it.
cuban pete| 5.18.12 @ 9:28AM
I have said this before. Years ago George Connor, the Notre Dame All American, said the face mask was the worst idea ever because it encouraged players to put their head where it did not belong.
Also, I read that there are a significant amount of head injuries, particularly with female playes, in soccer due to the "header". So is soccer next?
Let's just remove all the risk from life.
Bob Grant| 5.18.12 @ 11:08AM
Soccer head injuries and football head injuries are apples and oranges.
There's no expectation of safety when attempting a header in soccer. It's buyer beware. In addition, per the rules of soccer, a player is not only penalized for endangering other players, they are penalized for placing themselves in danger, e.g. if a player lowers his head to make a play on the ball while another player uses their foot.
In football, there's in implicit expectation of safety while wearing a helmet which encourages players to make plays they wouldn't otherwise sans a helmet.
cuban pete| 5.18.12 @ 11:57AM
Well if there is no expectation of safety and it is part of the game we should either make headers illegal or ban soccer.
gearjammer| 5.18.12 @ 3:55PM
They know how to fall-be 10 dead every Sunday if they did not. Try and watch an NFL game from the side line. Not easy-I have twice. In those few seconds when it all converges-a bit frightning. I played through college at a decent level. Still if 18 I'd being busting my rear to play. By the way, the guys I played with are by a huge margin in great shape, look younger than years, etc.
The Big E| 5.18.12 @ 9:49AM
"Any normal healthy kid will do things which are dangerous. Organized sports at least allows for a controlled environment and adult oversight."
Bingo. If there are no organized sports in which channel the risk-taking impulses of youth, where will those impulses be channelled?
It is instinctive to take risks when young, to probe the boundaries of your abilities, to learn what you can and cannot do. Remove the opportunity to take risks from kids and what do you get - a bunch of helpless slobs who are not capable of reaching their potential because they were never given the opportunity to find out what that potential is.
Bear in mind that organized sports of all sorts, especially team sports, does much more than develop a person physically. The ability to lead, the discipline to stick to a difficult task until it is completed, the ability to work as part of a team - all of these are the product of athletics in youth.
Look at the problems facing the youth of today and tell me they would not benefit from learning the lessons I described above.
Albert Constantine Jr.| 5.18.12 @ 8:52AM
I recall some decades ago training with the Thai Marine Corps. Our Marines played a soccer duel against the Thais, that ended diplomatically in tie. After, we decided to have an exhibition of American Football.
The Guns Platoon of our Artillery Battery was matched against our Headquarters Platoon. For the first quarter, after a good game of smash mouth football without pads, we offered our Thai counterparts an opportunity to participate on both sides of their competition. They just smiled and politely declined, having seen enough of the game to conclude that for some things, they were more suited to be spectators.
Though neither are my games, I will posit that countries that play American football or rugby are more likely to be stalwart allies than those who play nothing rougher than soccer. This is not to suggest that soccer countries don’t have tough armed forces (The Republic of Korea’s Marines are a very hard group, for one), but in a place where people don’t learn how to take hard hits and keep on playing, one must learn to develop resolve in other venues, which might be less universally available.
Von Mises Jr| 5.18.12 @ 9:39AM
The liberals are just upset since good Marines like you, and a Honorable Mention High School Linebacker like me present a threat to their candy A$$E$.
Their metrosexual sons are probably getting beat up on the way home from school and they want to legislate away aggressive behavior.
The Big E| 5.18.12 @ 9:57AM
Ergo, the war against "bullies?"
By the way, not to get too awfully far off subject, for I represented two juvenile's this week for truancy - both claimed they didn't go to school because they were being "bullied." Both were using that claim as an excuse, as neither were, in reality, the victims of anything other than self-imposed laziness. I represent a third kid on an assault charge. In the officer's report it recited that the young man had been the target of racial epithets from a particular group of kids, but had not reported it to school administrators. The officer learned of this, not from my client by the way, but from the kid he's accused of assaulting. My client decided to take measures into his own hands. He accepted a challenge from one of his tormentors, met him behind the weight room at school, and beat him to a bloody stump. When I asked him why he hadn't reported the racial taunt directed at him, he said, "I don't need someone else to fight my battles for me."
chuck| 5.18.12 @ 10:04AM
Good for him! Hope he gets off. Same thing happened to my son. Grabbed a football player by his neck, yacked him out of his desk, and let him know that he wasn't taking any crap from him.
Von Mises Jr| 5.18.12 @ 10:39AM
My son was about the youngest kid in his grade. A kid a grade ahead who lived in the neighborhood had another kid my son's age afraid to ride the school bus home.
I taught my son basic self-defense, and when the bully came after him, the bully wound up pinned on his back. The kid never bothered my son again.
Occam's Tool| 5.18.12 @ 5:20PM
And then the little swine charged him with assault!
In my day, when you got your ass handed to you in a fair fight where you challenged someone else and the guy took you up on it, you kept your mouth shut and took your lumps like a man.
chuck| 5.18.12 @ 9:59AM
You need to amend your last sentence to "getting beat up by girls on the way home from school".
Damned pussy-boys!
Le Cracquere| 5.18.12 @ 11:34AM
I don't disagree with the thrust of the article, but are you saying it'd be okay if the other side's kids WERE getting beaten up?
Von Mises Jr| 5.18.12 @ 11:59AM
Like the 20 black youths that put two white people in the hospital that the MSM won't report?
Crawler| 5.18.12 @ 8:59AM
I played grade school and high school football. My kids played in school, too. It was their decision, not mine. I didn’t push or encourage them to play, nor did I try to dissuade them from playing. Again, it was their choice and I supported whatever decision they made.
Free Americans have been playing unorganized and organized contact sports for years. Yes, some get hurt seriously, but most don’t. Just like Mr. Flynn points out, more people die each year from skiing, bicycling and swimming than football.
Blaming the game of football for deaths and injuries is no different than blaming guns for criminal gun-related deaths in my opinion. (As an aside, does anyone care to guess how many Americans die annually participating in skeet shooting and trap shooting sports?)
Yes, the “pursification” of American is alive and well in this country, but free Americans neither want nor need a bunch of “idealistic wusses” telling us which sports we can or cannot play.
If these wusses thought playing checkers was somehow bad for our health, they’d want every black and red checker in America confiscated. Enough is enough; screw ‘em...
Great article, Mr. Flynn.
Shadow| 5.18.12 @ 9:09AM
If we all sit on our couches waiting for a government check there is little danger in being killed or hurt by something that gives us pleasure. Think of all the highway deaths of children and adults that will not occur. I don't know who will fund all those government checks while we all sit, but liberals seems to have that worked out without logic too. All the litigation attorneys will starve if we do, so they may have to lobby for legislation against couch makers.
As for me, I choose to live life with its opportunities and rewards. I hope I'm going to be allowed to do that until the thing that gets us all in the end comes.
Frank Drackman| 5.18.12 @ 9:15AM
I know its anecdotal, but my 9th grade coach taught us to tackle head first, aiming for the Solar Plexus, or Kidneys, "Piss Bags" he called em.
"Who gives a Shi* if they throw a flag, dude'll think twice next time he goes in the flat"...
Thankfully for my Cervical Spine, we moved to Alabama, where there wasnt a place for 130 lb defensive backs...
Frank
Gr0w1er601| 5.18.12 @ 9:34AM
I watched part of a coed softball game last night. Couldn't figure out the 'rules' for this game- two dudes hit it out of the park- and promptly got called out!! The pitcher threw what I think was called an illegal pitch- and the base runner was advanced one base, with the batter taking first!! WTF- no wonder the U.S. is faltering economically, spiritually, and ESPECIALLY competitively. They're having any concept of winning drummed out of them.
MikeBee| 5.18.12 @ 9:35AM
The wussification of Football and other sports represents a victory of the liberal women of California. I grew up there. Whenever we men were watching sports, especially Football, the women would declare, loudly and derisively, that Football (or whatever competitive sport we were watching) was such a vicious, dangerous, sport and should be outlawed. "It's so competitive!" The only exception to their derisive comments would be Soccer. (It sure is good to live in Michigan, now, where many of the women are more enthusiastic football fans than some men.)
In California, the women are very liberal, and Liberals LOVE everything Europe. So, they push for Soccer as the mainstay sport in the U.S. I'd be willing to bet that old soccer players have mental problems just as bad as old football players, due to "heading" the ball constantly during their careers. Nevertheless, liberal women in California love soccer.
Ever wonder what happened to boxing? The sport of Pugilism, very popular in Britain, used to be popular in America. But we've been convinced that Boxing is so primitive, so Neanderthal, so hurtful and harmful (do I hear liberal California women, again?).
Actually, there is often no better way for two young boys to solve a dispute than a good boxing match, following the rules under the guidance of a good referee. Regardless of who wins, both boys leave the bout with a better regard for each other, often becoming friends after the match. Even if the bout is extremely one sided, the stronger kid leaves the match with a new respect for the courage of the weaker kid to stand up to him, rather than cede the match. He may even stop bullying that weaker kid, and become his friend after the bout.
No, we men should insist on bringing back Boxing and Football, and keeping Soccer on the sidelines. Don't let the Liberals bully us with their European desires.
Bob Grant| 5.18.12 @ 12:20PM
Where did you get the idea that soccer "is a liberal sport"?
This is a tired-old cliche with no merits whatsoever.
cuban pete| 5.18.12 @ 2:07PM
It has some merit. Youth soccer in America, at least around my area, Chicago, has a strong liberal odor to it. In many leagues there is no score kept, everyone has to play in every game so youngsters' self esteem is not injured.
When I was nine years old, I had to try out for Little League. If you weren't selected too bad.
I was lucky I made it but many of my friends did not. So they learned how to fail and come back.
My first game ever at nine years old I was up to bat with two outs and the bases loaded in the bottom of the sixth. I was fanned by a twelve year old pitcher. That was 57 years ago. It did not kill me and I went on to play sports through college where I had some success and some failure. I'm glad I was exposed to reality at a young age.
Bob Grant| 5.18.12 @ 4:01PM
I played all sports as a youth and don't remember those rules.
In my soccer team if you weren't good enough, you didn't play or were simply cut.
I wouldn't trash the entire sport just because a couple of liberals pussified it in your local area.
cuban pete| 5.18.12 @ 8:45PM
I don't believe I " trashed an entire sport".
MikeBee| 5.18.12 @ 2:58PM
Bob,
Those same California liberals who would descry the viciousness of Football and Boxing would quickly follow with the fact that they liked Soccer, and that they believed that in Soccer, "which the Europeans play," (they would always add) no one gets hurt, and the men are in better shape, according to them.
Bob Grant| 5.18.12 @ 3:54PM
I would say soccer players are in much better shape than most other professional athletes...and better athletes for that matter.
*They possess better-honed skill sets
*It's the most team-oriented sport out there, i.e. they are only as good as their weakest link
* Although not as physical as football or hockey, it's more so than baseball. Similar to basketball
....
Soccer gets a bad rap because the powers that be (Football Inc) make it so and because most soccer player are of average size and build. There's no "gladiator" factor. Just average Joe's who happen to be great athletes and have skills only a select few possess can can be acquired by anyone with the desire. Physical attributes, for the most part, are not a limiting factor.
There is nothing more exciting than a good professional association football - er soccer - match.
Don't take my word for it, there's the UEFA (Union of European Football Association) Champions League Championship game tomorrow at 2 eastern between Chelsea and Bayern Munich.
This game is typically the most watched annual sporting event in the World. You might want to watch it and give it a fair viewing. It might change your mind about QUALITY football - er- soccer.
Bob Grant| 5.18.12 @ 4:03PM
On FOX Network
Skippy| 5.18.12 @ 5:46PM
God love you Bob(hat tip Joe Biden), but I gotta agree with Ann Coulter about watching soccer. Zzzzz...
Of course others might feel the same way about playing harp in a blues band, but everybody needs a hobby.
If you like soccer, play soccer.
As a non-athlete I know lots of folks; none of them Orthopedic surgeons.
That's a difference between us.
MikeBee| 5.21.12 @ 2:52PM
Bob,
My father was raised in pre-WWII China. He and his brothers played soccer, not football, growing up. My dad liked to watch soccer on TV. I agree with Skippy: ZZZZzzzzzz. Soccer is a lot like Hockey. Low scoring game, very boring, unless a fight breaks out. Viewers of both games spend a lot of time thinking or saying, "Oh! Almost!"
I don't have anything against the sport. The players are, generally, in better shape than football players. But, Football is far more exciting to watch. And, I love the way it turns Liberals off.....
gearjammer| 5.18.12 @ 3:58PM
Obama will outlaw football in his 5th term.
The Big E| 5.18.12 @ 10:02AM
I think the best evidence for the idea that the improvement of helmets has led to the increase in head injuries can be found in other violent sports, such as rugby or Australian rules football, where no helmets are worn at all, and yet the games do not end with corpses strewn about the field.
Papa G| 5.18.12 @ 1:50PM
The comments regarding the evolution of the helmet and changes in tackling technique are on the mark in my opinion.
After taking up rugby in college (stopped playing football in high school) and playing for almost 20 years, you survived that sport by proper tackling (use your shoulder, wrap the legs). American football players who took up rugby needed to change their style quickly or injure themselves (and opponent due to improper form that violated laws of the game . . . penalty awarded for high tackle or not wrapping up the ball carrier).
football coaches need to stop coaching and players need to stop using the helmet as a weapon and realize proper form is better for the player and the game.
gearjammer| 5.18.12 @ 4:02PM
I think tackling an NFL running back is a slightly different proposition that wrapping the legs of some guy in short shorts.
The Big E| 5.18.12 @ 4:34PM
Remember Earl Campbell? I don't remember very many tackles of Earl Campbell that did not involve wrapping his legs. I remember seeing a lot of tacklers bounce off him though when they didn't wrap his legs.
gearjammer| 5.18.12 @ 9:35PM
He was gangtackled. He has walking problems today. Being wrapped rugby style did not do the damage
JohnnyB | 5.18.12 @ 10:32PM
What you're both overlooking is that in football, speed is the overarching skill necessary to excel at the game. One could be the best tackler in the world and never play a down because of the lack of speed necessary to get into a position to make a tackle.
gearjammer| 5.19.12 @ 9:26AM
You gotta be fast enough, but the best DLS and LBS do not have best times at combine. Beyond speed is toughness. You'll see great fast athletes in the Olympics but few would last very long i NFL combat, Maybe the eightlifters and wrestlers-hardly speed merchants-and some sprinters could cross over to DB or Wide Rec but in the end ya gotta be tough.
80grrrip| 5.18.12 @ 10:11AM
Not long ago I heard a conversation at work among several younger guys talking about their sports injuries and how much they were bothered by them. The injuries were all callouses and sore fingers from playing video games and I have never heard a more pathetic group of whiners. Pretty soon all we're going to be allowed to play is the Microsoft football simulator.
Alej| 5.18.12 @ 10:13AM
Junior Seau wore a football helmet and shot himself. Absolute, no question, cause-and-effect.
If you are a fan of the fallacious "post hoc, ergo propter hoc" BS. . . "after this, therefore because of this."
The author did mention that athletes tend to live longer. And as far as the wussification of American manhood re contact sports, all should remember Lord Wellington's famous observation that
"England's battles were won on the playing fields at Eton,"
where young Brits played rough and beat the crap out of each other, and there were no substitutions allowed during the violent games.
Darwin knew.
gearjammer| 5.18.12 @ 4:04PM
A shrink once told me a guy shoots himself in the head for anger and self hate. In the heart means a broken heart-like a dear John thing.
Skippy| 5.18.12 @ 5:56PM
O.C.: your thoughts on this assertion, based on your experience?
Truncheon| 5.18.12 @ 11:00AM
I do not find spectator sports entertaining to watch. I am self-assured and confident, and don't need to compensate for any bruised ego through vicarious gratification, as one might surmise the author does.
That being said, *liberal* efforts to ban, impede, or outlaw such sports are self-evidently ludicrous. If you can make a bunch of money in physical sports and there is a market for it, that's a good thing.
There is always a danger for the sports fanatic, however, to project his own emotional needs onto others. The person who requires no vicarious affirmation is quite probably healthier, in the main, then the person who does.
Truncheon| 5.18.12 @ 11:03AM
One might consider the differences in personal effort and application, between the video gamer playing his game, and the sports spectator passively gazing....
florian| 5.18.12 @ 11:37AM
What I don't understand is this: people are coming down hard on football while not saying anything about boxing. A boxer goes into the ring with the intent of knocking his opponent's brains out, of doing as much damage as possible.
Kingofthenet| 5.18.12 @ 11:43AM
We are learning how these small concussions can have a BIG impact both on the field and with IED'S in War Zones. I LOVE football and see no reason why head injuries need to be a required part of it.
Mike Daly | 5.18.12 @ 12:03PM
Kingofthenet - are we learning, or are we making assumptions about what the information is actually telling us? Overreaching has been a common reaction to "scientific" analyses of stories like this.
Kingofthenet| 5.18.12 @ 12:15PM
Well most of the NFL complaints are from guys who played under the old rules. The new ones seem to be working alright.
Ed| 5.18.12 @ 12:22PM
The problem with football injuries is that players are a lot bigger than they used to be. Just look at Jim Brown, Alex Karras, and Dick Butkus in old movies and TV shows. They were large men in their era, but they weren’t that much larger than their fellow actors. (Dick Butkus is about the same height as Angela Lansbury!)
Bigger, heavier players pack more kinetic energy, so it is no surprise that modern players have shorter careers. It is not a reason to ban the sport, but modern NFL players have legitimate concerns about pension issues and contract terms.
Occam's Tool| 5.18.12 @ 5:32PM
Dick Butkus was 6'3", 245 pounds in his playing days for Da Bears. Even in high school, he was a fearsome bastard.
When he was a freshman in high school, he was pounding the shit out of a 5'8" 150 pound varsity senior running back on the other team. The coach finally chewed out that running back, asking him why the freshman was outplaying him. The running back looked at his coach and said: "you're welcome to put on the pads and try him out yourself, coach."
The running back was my dad.
Angela Lansbury was 5 feet 8 inches tall, by the way---Butkus towered over her, but it is THE MOVIES. Alan Ladd was a pipsqueak made to look taller.
However, modern players, especially linemen, are monstrously huge. That is a good point. But Butkus in his prime would still destroy people today, as Ernie Banks would still hit shots---some men are just great.
cuban pete| 5.18.12 @ 8:52PM
I went to Fenger. Vocational was our big rival. I just missed playing against your dad and Butkus by a few years.
When he was at Illinois Butkus worked out at Fernwood Park in the summer. I never saw an individual push himself like he did.
That was before weight training, which was viewed as bad for you because it made you "muscle bound."
gearjammer| 5.18.12 @ 9:41PM
Jim Brown was six two and 235. That is big even by todays standard. And he was fast and had moves.
JohnnyB | 5.18.12 @ 10:29PM
Agree with you 100%. A solution would be to again to require that most players play both offense and defense, which would have the effect of reducing the size of the linemen and linebackers, who could not sustain their efforts for a whole game.
Oldefarte| 5.18.12 @ 12:53PM
I'm somehow reminded by this editorial of the story about Paul Horning [?] of the Green Bay Packers stating something to the effect of WHEN [COACH] VINCE LOMBARDI WALKED INTO A MEETING ROOM [WITH THE PACKER PLAYERS] AND YELLED 'SIT DOWN', NOT ONE OF THEM WOULD TURN AROUND TO SEE IF THERE WAS A CHAIR BEHIND THEM! Lombardi was a tough coach, his Packers were a great team, and FOOTBALL DOES EVERYBODY GOOD!!!!!!!!!!
Abe| 5.18.12 @ 1:04PM
I think you meant John Kass, not Leon Kass, as the attribution for the "American football is dying" quote. Though I do wonder Leon Kass's thoughts on the situation.
Petronius| 5.18.12 @ 1:23PM
Football , boxing, soccer, doesn't matter. The target is any kind of competition. The liberals can't stand the fact that all life on earth is based on that. They want insulation from it. Explains everything, like the NFL; the 99% against the top 1%. Having failed to win any prizes, the 99% demand the free for all end for good and all resources be confiscated and redistributed so that nobody loses.
The Big E| 5.18.12 @ 2:35PM
You make a curious point, Petronius. Liberals do appear to hate all kinds of competition because losing is bad for "self-esteem," yet those same liberals bristle when it is suggested that life on earth originated and developed through any means other than Darwinian evolution - which is almost entirely about competition.
gearjammer| 5.18.12 @ 4:12PM
They wanna ban anything a man can outperform a woman at. You want see a female nose guard till an NFL guy does a sex change and then he still has to have the testosterone levels. Is it possible ? First transgendered NFL guy. Medi would swoon-he'd be rich rich rich, sooooooooooooooo famous. TO is broke has alimony problems-maybe ?
Ron| 5.18.12 @ 1:28PM
I am proud of my 16 year old son playing football. It has given him more self-discipline in his life (two practices a day until school starts, and then one a day until school ends), two safety camps, that are mandatory before a trip to Gold Beach Football Camp in Oregon (where he gets to learn to be a safe, and smart player.) He also gets to go outside of Alaska to play against teams, and has to maintain a C average in all of his high school classes to qualify to play. He also raises money to play by promoting the team by selling banners to local businesses. Not to mention he went from a 5' 5" Freshman JV player to a 5' 8" 126 pound soon to be Junior on Varsity. So he has learned that hard work and perseverance pays off. Seems like good life lessons to me. He also runs track in the spring and cross country as soon as football season ends. Not a thing wrong with football adding to the life lessons my wife and I teach him.
Derek Leaberry| 5.18.12 @ 1:51PM
It may be filled up with athletic uncivilized vulgarians you wouldn't want your daughters to date but football isn't dying. There's too much money in it. Television relies on it. Tens of millions of Americans receive vicarious pleasure watching football on fall and winter weekends. The beer- if that is what you call the swill Anheuser-Busch and Miller make-industry would not stand for the death of football.
Football players know what they're getting into. If you don't enjoy violence, football is the wrong sport for you. For football players to act surprised that their noggins get cracked occasionally makes about as much sense as a Medieval knight acting surprised that he gets knocked on the helmet by swords, axes and pikes.
A DVD of my children is "The Deadliest Catch" which concerns the crab fishermen of the Bering Sea. Commercial crab fishing off Alaska is a dangerous profession with little glory. The pay can be very good but it is not up to NFL standards. Every year some of these men die making their living. We don't grieve for them because they are anonymous to all but family and friends. The only reason why the recent deaths of former professional football players makes the news is that once upon a time these men made news when they were young. The footballers performed their jobs on TV and the crabbers did not. They deserve no more notice than the crabber.
Tired Taxpayer PRM| 5.18.12 @ 2:46PM
The problem I have with all sports in schools but especially football is that my tax dollars are used to support a farm system for the NFL. I know that SOME colleges make money on their football programs but most don't and no HS football programs are money makers.
I have to pay taxes so a tiny portion of 1% of the HS and college football players can go on to the NFL and make millions? No thank you.
Bob Grant| 5.18.12 @ 7:20PM
If you like that, how about paying for a stadium you might never visit?
Ellis| 5.18.12 @ 10:07PM
Why should I have to pay taxes for some tiny portion of high school students to go forth and become successful at any endeavor?
gearjammer| 5.18.12 @ 4:08PM
You idiot. Millions have played high school sports and no further and it is among their most enjoyable and meaingful experiences. It is more then a farm system.
Drunken Sailor| 5.18.12 @ 4:14PM
We are overthinking this. Pro football has safety/health risk. They come with great rewards ($). If you don't want the risk, don't play. It's that simple.
Never could wrap my head around grown mean getting paid big $ to play a game we played as kids for free. Then again, I guess the same goes for hollwood. People getting paid to pretend they are something they are not.
gearjammer| 5.18.12 @ 9:43PM
Blame the advertisers-they think the affluent target audience cant use a remote.
cicero| 5.18.12 @ 8:59PM
The rewards of high school and college sports are many, and not confined to the professional ranks. What man among us that played the games can deny the sheer joy of the conflict, inpact, and pain that was realized? This was not confined to the actual event, or the age when played. The torn meniscus, the broken collar bone, the sprained ankle all come back in our senior years to remind us of the fun we had, and character that was built. We were given the benefit to relish and appreciate, as those who did not play the games, the benefits we gained, and the affirmation of our impending manhood we acquired as a result. We tend, now, to equate the games of boyhood with the monetary gain of the professional ranks. The real benefit was the right of passage that the competition with and against our peers gave us. Without that, the acquisition of manhood is much more difficult. Who can deny the bloody nose survived, the bully confronted, the touchdown almost made, the bloop single against the best pitcher ever seen?
The requirements for a boy to become aa man is very much different that those needed for a girl to become a woman. If we don't get off of this sillyness that boys are no different than girls, and women are the same as men, we will lose out civilization.
Death is inevitable. It comes to all men born on this earth, sometimes soon or late (credit McCauley). To try to legislate longevity is not only folly, but silly. We will eventually pass laws to make life completely safe, only to fall to a superior culture that values bravery, risk, honor and valor. None of those are safe.
Sorry this is so late. Good night all.
.
Albert Constantine Jr.| 5.18.12 @ 11:28PM
Or in the alternative, then, to summarize, life, once established at the age of three or so (Singer), will remain protected from all injury and danger until it is too expensive to keep you alive because of medical costs (death panels).
Ellis| 5.18.12 @ 10:04PM
I have to admit I must have missed something. Who in the world thinks football at any level is "dying" in America. Is this really some topic of discussion amongst out of touch leftists somewhere? Last I checked football is hugely popular.
JohnnyB | 5.18.12 @ 10:25PM
What's caused the sudden aversion to football is that lawyers suddenly smell a buck so they're peddling this crap to influence future jurors. They're the ones pushing the argument that the game is too dangerous. Statistics show that cheerleaders suffer more injuries than the player. As far as the ex pros who presently are suing the NFL go, the idea that they were unaware of the dangers is simply ludicrous. Much like smokers who claimed that they were defrauded by the tobacco companies, their arguments ring hollow. I played football at a D-1 school in the 70's and would play today if I could. The game gave me a work ethic and an appreciation for team work that no video game can duplicate.
Wawa| 5.18.12 @ 11:53PM
Football?
Sounds like "Rugby for sissies".
gearjammer| 5.19.12 @ 9:31AM
If Rugby starts to pay some real money alot of NFL guys who did not make a team or retired will be enjoying a nice career.
POST American| 5.19.12 @ 12:54AM
---Had the bad fortune recently of
finding ourselves in a local bar that used
to be a place for good coversation and
mingling. ------NO MORE!
----3! ---massive sports TV screens
over the bar, and in corners of the room.
REPEAT, this was --NOT-- a 'sports' bar.
The one jerk we attempted to back and
forth with, a guy who must have been in
his sixties, crying ----literally ----crying!
about some years ago 'perfect' game he
----watched.
SURE! --get out and PLAY sports!
As for watching them? ---well, it is,
in --every-- sense of the word
-------------------RECTUM WORSHIP.
"We'll have sports to occupy and
drain away the energies of the men,
---and dramas for the women.
This will be the formula for a syatem
of 'psy---ant'-ific control, and RULE
by X--spurts."
-H G Wells
Novelist
Predictive Programmer
Fabian front op
Globalist
EUGENIST
-----PSYCHPATH-----
This is --the 11th hour.
Albert Constantine Jr.| 5.20.12 @ 8:48PM
Of course, if he was talking about the perfect game pitched on Father's Day, 1964, you missed the opportunity to bring it back to a political discussion. The winning pitcher that day was Jim Bunning, who went on to become US Senator from Kentucky, and was replaced after he retired by Rand Paul.
See how easy that was?
somnolence| 5.19.12 @ 10:48AM
Even to this day, at age 58, my favorite exercise on a beautiful sunny day is to take a football to the state park, find isolated ground, and see how many times I can slam my instep into the pigskin for punts of 40-50 yards in the air. I can punt and chase it down at least 150 times. It sure alleviates a lot of stress, I can tell you that.
somnolence| 5.19.12 @ 1:25PM
Yeah. "Preacherman says it's the end of time"...........Hank Williams Jr. A lot of Cinderellas still fall for the eleventh hour jive, but not me. I'll take obliteration rather than try to cope with nuclear winter, thank you, and would probably stand still in the blast being vaporized. So keep harping on about your "eleventh hour", which was a good tune by Al Hibbler long ago.
Albert Constantine Jr.| 5.20.12 @ 8:51PM
I preferred his version of "Unchained Melody", though I like HW Jr.'s "A Country Boy Can Survive" as well.
WGMOW| 5.19.12 @ 5:54PM
Bob Grant| "Come on. Football jumped the shark when it implemented pink onto uniforms for breast cancer awareness month. And yes, I'm very supportive of breast cancer awareness.."
You're dead on about sports (not just football) jumping the sharkwith all that pink crap. But you may want to think again about breast cancer "awareness." Is there anyone on the planet who can hear and see who DOESN'T know about breast cancer? We get bombarded with BCA shit almost daily; facts are trumped up to make it look much more common that it actually is, and women talk about their tits endlessly. However, think about this: Does the NFL wear blue in September for Prostate Cancer Awareness month? Did you even know that there is a prostate cancer month? Do you wear a blue wrist band or ribbon for prostate cancer? Did you know that funding for prostate cancer is less than half that of breast cancer, even though rates for prostate cancer are the same as for breast cancer? Did you ever see the chrome and glass palace that houses the Susan G. Komen Foundation? Did you know that there are an awful lot of highly paid executives that make a bundle by "raising awareness" for breast cancer?
It's time for right thinking men - and the women that love and support those men - to say to the NFL, MLB, NBA, etc, to take their breast cancer awareness and SHOVE IT, and tell the advertisers the same thing.
And before you label me some crazy misogynist, my moniker means "Woman Going Her Own Way." And my own way means supporting mens' right.
Albert Constantine Jr.| 5.20.12 @ 8:54PM
Traditionally, MLB does its Prostate Cancer Awareness events in June, culminating on Father's Day.
Ironically, I've never heard of anyone describing an event on Breast Cancer Awareness in a strip club, where I think it would make good business sense.
Jimmy J| 5.22.12 @ 1:12AM
You hit the nail on the head. This is about pansies wanting to raise their children to be pansies and not wanting anything manly out there to make them feel bad about being a pansie.
It is also about using the power of the government to control the actions of people they disagree with.