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At Large
Seeking a Pact With the Devil
The Taliban sure knows how to gain the upper hand — especially during an Obama reelection campaign.
Perhaps the most intriguing aspect of the recently announced opening of a Taliban office in Doha, Qatar, is that it never could have happened if there hadn’t been an agreement with Pakistan’s Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI) directorate. The Taliban tied the announcement of its new office specifically to talks with the United States and its allies. ISI controls the Afghan Taliban’s existence in Pakistan and therefore the Pakistanis must now be back in full operational liaison with the U.S. It would appear that the breakdown in intelligence relations after the accidental killing by NATO air attacks of 24 Pakistan soldiers has now been “evolved.”
Something else that seems to have been overtaken by events is the highly controversial report that five major Taliban leaders would be released from their detention in Guantanamo as the price for peace talks with the Taliban. This release undoubtedly will be part of the negotiations that supposedly will happen through the opening of the new office in Doha. In fact, the terms of the negotiations have already been laid out.
The real issue is the future objective of the American side. The Taliban’s motivation is clear and steadfast. It is prepared to fight on indefinitely to remove foreign influence in the governance of Afghanistan. The Americans are pulling out in two years if the Obama-designated timetable is adhered to, but no one seems to know what Washington expects after that.
It has been written by some observers that the U.S. State Department is behind the push to negotiate, while the Pentagon and CIA want to keep the pressure on by fighting “until the last U.S. soldier leaves Afghanistan.” (Ahmed Rashid, Financial Times, 12/5/11.) This surprisingly simplistic analysis by a veteran writer shows the type of confusion that has been sown by an Obama administration that repeatedly leaks information that it believes aids its reelection prospects.
It had become accepted that Washington always could rely on President Hamid Karzai to say or do something that would be counter to American interests or at the very least be an impediment to current diplomatic or political initiatives He fooled them on the establishment of the Taliban office in Qatar by taking only one day to issue a public statement approving the office opening and beginning direct peace talks. In any case, Karzai — if he stays alive — always will have to be part of a peace settlement, whether as president or as simply one of the leading tribal personalities of the Pashtun. If the argument against Karzai is that he runs a corrupt government, someone is going to have to figure out some way to govern Afghanistan without payoffs to tribal leaders and local warlords. It hasn’t happened yet.
Among the issues involved in negotiating with the Taliban is that there are several components to the system of command established under Mullah Mohammad Omar’s leadership. According to a declassified SECRET State Dept. cable: “The Taliban have created four major institutional structures that technically maintain the ability to weigh in on policy issues and policy implementation.” These four shura with various counseling roles have existed since the late '90s. Although the relative influence of these councils has changed, Mullah Omar seems only to have grown in stature and power.
That there is to be established a Taliban representative office in Qatar actually is less important than the fact that Mullah Omar himself would have had to approve the action. This makes far more serious the officially stated willingness on the part of the Taliban to hold negotiations with the U.S. and its allies. Equally important, however, is the total lack of reference to the current Afghan government, which presumably is to have no formal part in the discussions.
There are many sensitive aspects of Afghan political affairs with which the American negotiators have to deal. While the U.S. and its allies still have to handle Hamid Karzai with great care, clearly Mullah Omar wants to have nothing to do with the Afghan president. The ISI of Pakistan undoubtedly will maintain their usual close contact with Mullah Omar and the principals in the Taliban leadership. To add to the difficult factors at play in any negotiation with Mullah Omar’s representatives, the reality is that the Haqqani amalgam of forces is always capable on either a political or military basis of choosing a path of self-interest as it has in the past.
The Taliban has not been militarily defeated even though it may have suffered tactical reverses and may have been weakened by the loss of key field leadership cadre. But it senses — or rather Mullah Omar senses — that President Obama’s reelection campaign is a propitious time for talking with the Americans already bent on beginning withdrawal of their military from Afghanistan in two years. Once again the Taliban has gained the initiative.
About the Author
George H. Wittman writes a weekly column on international affairs for The American Spectator online. He was the founding chairman of the National Institute for Public Policy.
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albert constantine jr.| 1.13.12 @ 7:25AM
Washington (AP) As the New Year dawns in the Capital of a nation at war, thoughts are drawn to the upcoming November election. As pundits claim President Roosevelt is considering an unprecedented fourth term, the ongoing hostilities around the world continue to distract from the administration’s domestic agenda.
Meanwhile, reports from Lisbon are that Germany’s Nazi Party has opened an office in Lisbon, and negotiations may soon be under way to bring peace to the war torn continent of Europe once again.
“The Nazis are not our enemy, per se”, Vice President Henry Wallace has been quoted as saying. “They didn’t bomb Pearl Harbor. What would be so wrong with finding a way to stop the slaughter now going on in Italy, and free our resources for the fight against the real enemy-the unequal distribution of wealth in the world”.
Reports have surfaced that Secretary of State Cordell Hull may be travelling to the British prison where Rudolph Hess is being held, in order to study the peace plan he was said to have authored and parachuted into Britain to deliver at the time of his capture.
Critics of the plan say that such an end to hostilities will leave America very vulnerable on the international stage, and reveal that we are an unreliable ally. Supporters claim it will virtually guarantee a November election victory for FDR.
Timothy L. Pennell| 1.13.12 @ 8:25AM
I think it was Procter and Gamble who said: "History is like the instructions on the back of the Shampoo Bottle. Wet Hair. Wash. Rinse. Repeat.
And what are we doing right now?
We're dismantling our Military, just like we have after every Military Conflict that we've ever been in.
And, what will be the end result of that?
Why, what it's always been, silly. We will be UNPREPARED, when Evil, once again, rears it's ugly head, and goes On The March. Millions will Die.
No big deal.
albert constantine jr| 1.13.12 @ 8:31AM
Yes, the ultimate history joke was on Santayana: those who remember history are doomed to repeat it, as well.
Alan Brooks| 1.13.12 @ 10:34PM
"We will be UNPREPARED, when Evil..."
The Confederacy (or as PostAmerican might write, the Counterfeitacy) was the most Evil enemy in America, regardless of it being a secessionary entity-- it was still an Enemy whatever it was.
Mr. Pennell:
first the Confederate monuments are demolished, THEN we discuss Jihad. And for good measure, tear down Union monuments as well; it was a long long time ago, almost 150 years. Criticize insurgents?
Start at home.
You are wasting your time trying to whip up the emotion of 9/12/'01-- it wont even play in Peoria anymore.
fckewe| 1.17.12 @ 8:50AM
Actually. Obama is UPGRADING the armor and gunpowder of the dinosaur strategies favored by the McCain and the others with vast and deep contractor relationships, for new era weapons tactics. Drones do very well and have proven themselves reliable and doubly effective as a cheaper (than a 100 dead marines 10 times a month) method of eliminating specific targets.
Shock an AWE failed to do more than get GWB a ride in a fighter jet. it's been thousands of days and thousands of bodies since that foolishness and Obama is making sure as few mother's as possible will have to bury their children early.
In the NEW military, a soldier with a laptop and WIFI will be able to strike a secret nuclear base in the mountains of the middle east while drinking a beer and getting a blowjob on a Carribean beach.
I am so sorry that PROGRESS and RED party dogma are so divergent in their agenda's.
fckewe| 1.17.12 @ 9:07AM
But then again, RED party members don't LIKE blowjobs on the beach. ~Smirks~ They just like them in airport men's rooms.
Jack in Wi.| 1.13.12 @ 9:24AM
The Taliban is going to rule Afganistan and there is no sense in prolonging the agony. The sooner we are out of there the better. It was nonsense to go in there to nation build anyhow. It should have always been about gettting Bin Laden and getting out.
KennesawJack| 1.13.12 @ 9:57AM
A lucid, logical beginning to the day from Jack from Wi. Are you off your meds? Rarely do you post anything I even remotely agree with but, in this instance, I can't disagree with you.
Timothy L. Pennell| 1.13.12 @ 11:57AM
Comments like that, from Jackass in Wi., are like Haley's Comet. You wanna make sure you get to see them, when they happen, cause you may not get that chance, again, in your lifetime.
One from Clint?
Those happen every time the Continents all come together, to form one Big Continent.
Alan Brooks| 1.13.12 @ 10:36PM
"The Taliban is going to rule Afganistan and there is no sense in prolonging the agony. The sooner we are out of there the better. It was nonsense to go in there to nation build anyhow. It should have always been about gettting Bin Laden and getting out."
Jack, you were right and I was wrong. Nation building is going nowhere, fast- is there any doubt of that any more?
Alan Brooks| 1.13.12 @ 10:42PM
"A lucid, logical beginning to the day from Jack from Wi. Are you off your meds? Rarely do you post anything I even remotely agree with but, in this instance, I can't disagree with you."
Jack was right and we were wrong- I for one ought to have known better than to trust anything named Bush- other than Bush Baked Beans.
Nation building is going nowhere, fast.
fckewe| 1.17.12 @ 8:59AM
Ditto.
Timothy L. Pennell| 1.13.12 @ 7:53AM
I don't know where to begin.
We have a Commander In Chief, who began his Political Career in the Living Room of two people who Blew Up Recruiting Offices, and Bombed the Pentagon.
We have a Commander In Chief whom, I will guarantee, was for the Elimination of the ROTC on Campus, and the Militarys' Exclusion from any kind of "Career Fair" type activities there, as well.
He's a Leftist. By definition, he despises the U.S. Military. All of his life has been spent with America Hating, Leftists. He has been immersed in the Dogma of the Far Left. The Hatred of this Country. The Hatred of its' Liberties, and its' Freedoms. The Hatred for its' Founding Fathers, and its' Economic System. The Hatred of its' belief in the Individual, and of its' Judeo-Christian foundation.
But, nowhere is the Lefts' Hatred of this Country more intense, than it's Hatred for its' Armed Forces. They are obsessed with a Hatred for the one Institution that keeps us free. The one Thing, that keeps EVIL from striking out, with impunity. From toppling every Free Nation, in the world.
It's in his DNA: Mommy, Daddy, Grandma, Grandpa, Mentor #1, Mentor #2, and a Wife, who's hated this Country all of her Adult Life.
"We are the ones we've been waiting for."
(And the crowd goes wild.)
Unfortunately, he wasn't talking to US. He was talking to THEM.
We don't have any Jobs, because of THEM. We WON'T have any Jobs, because of THEM. We can't Drill for our own Energy Resources, because of THEM. We can't Fish or Farm, because of THEM. We can't Burn Coal, or Mine Metals, from the Earth, because of THEM.
The Gulf Coast was SHUT DOWN, because of them. New York is on the outside, looking in, as her Neighbors reap the Jobs, and the Income, from the Fracking of Shale, because of THEM. Companies may no longer move their Operations, from one State to another, because of THEM. High Tech Jobs need to be filled by Foreign Workers, because Our Kids have spent their Educational Years, learning the importance of Diversity, and Feelings. Learning about Condoms and Lesbianism. The Joys of Homosexuality and Anal Sex. They learn that WE are the source of everything that is Wrong, in the world, and they learn how to Go out in to the Streets, and void their Bowels, on the nearest Police Car.
They don't learn, what they need to learn, to get the High Paying Jobs that Ubie (From India) is getting.
Because of THEM.
Which brings us to Them's Leader.
He has accomplished much, in his 3 years. He holds the Record, for every Bad Economic Indicator there is. Unemployment. (The REAL NUMBERS. Not the made up ones that that Liberal WHORE - Solas - pulls out of her Ass) Foreclosures. Bank Failures. Bankruptcies. Homelessness. Suicides.
He holds the Record for the Most Americans on Food Stamps. The Most Americans living AT, or BELOW, the Poverty Line. He holds the Record for the Worst Housing Market since they started keeping Records.
He's got the Record for Consecutive Deficits over a TRILLION. He's got the Record for more DEBT, than all of his predecessors, COMBINED. He holds the Record for the most Credit Rating DOWNGRADES, in our History.
HE does.
HIM.
THEM.
Not bad, for 3 years. But, as you know. A Far Left Ideologue, with a God Complex's work, is never done. He's got the INSIDE job, done. Now, it's time for The Outside.
He was BORN a Muslim, and he was raised in the Muslim Schools and Mosques, of Indonesia. He knows "Death To America". He knows "Death To Israel". He knows that "The Muslim Call To Prayer, is the most beautiful sound in the world".
He knew, that by throwing Mubarak under the Bus, that the Muslim Brotherhood would assume Control. He knew, that by Killing Khaddafi, the Islamists would walk right in. He knew, that by Leaving Iraq, completely, the Country would destabilize, overnight, and Iran would swoop in for the remains. He also knows, that ASSAD must stay in Power, to complete the Encirclement of Israel.
All that's left, is to Bug Out of Afghanistan. GUT the Military, and sit back and watch, as his Muslim Brothers, lay waste to Israel, the rest of Africa, and then turn their gaze to Europe.
Why WOULDN'T he make a Deal with the Devil?
He's one of them.
Melvin| 1.13.12 @ 10:06AM
You know at least once a day, I ask myself, "How in the hell, did we let this happen?"
I spent twenty years of my adult life in an organization that prided itself on defending what this Country stands or stood for?
Now I see my fellow Marines urinating on dead Taliban corpses.
I see politicians from here and Afghanistan stealing suitcases of taxpayer funded cash into their personal accounts and still look at us with a straight eye and tell us, "Oh, we're exempt from the law."
I see the Supreme Court hand one private citizens property over to another calling this good for the community.
I see Mexican Nationals draped in a Flag of Mexico urinating on my flag during a Mexican holiday Cinco Demayo created by a California beer distributorship.
I see the President of the United States bowing to a king that supports a radical form of Islam, that demands our destruction.
I have more behind me than I have ahead of me, and I'm just plain dog tired. Thinking back on all this. Maybe we deserve to be conquered and destroyed.
An odd aspect to all this, 2 to 2 -1/2 % of the population is advocating this County's demise, and the other 80% are watching the Kardashians.
KennesawJack| 1.13.12 @ 10:27AM
Your last sentence answers completely answers the question in your first sentence.
KennesawJack| 1.13.12 @ 10:30AM
I apologize for the terrible sentence structure above. Should say, "Your last sentence answers completely the question in your first sentence." I think I'm having difficulty dealing with the emotional stress of actually agreeing with a statement made by Jack from Wi.
Brian Mc| 1.13.12 @ 11:05AM
But for the math, well said! And, once again Timothy gives me much to ponder over the weekend.
Alan Brooks| 1.14.12 @ 7:31PM
"We have a Commander In Chief, who began his Political Career in the Living Room of two people who Blew Up Recruiting Offices"
It was proper to blow up recruiting offices, as conscription was ongoing at the time. Selective Service ought to be shuttered and all records destroyed.
fckewe| 1.17.12 @ 9:01AM
"It's in his DNA: Mommy, Daddy, Grandma, Grandpa, Mentor #1, Mentor #2, and a Wife, who's hated this Country all of her Adult Life." Thanks for admitting your koolaid racism. Thanks for wasting space.
fckewe| 1.17.12 @ 9:04AM
IF any ofthis were true, why didn't he just Command the Troops to come home! Let Bin Laden live. Does Social Services KNOW you are polluting and abusing your children by spouting this drivel?
How long have you been impotent? Waving guns in the air will NEVER do you as much good as a bottle of Viagara stuffed up your butt!
Intelligent Design| 1.13.12 @ 8:12AM
We also have the State Department holding "formal" but "limited" discussions with the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt, and I understand that State thinks it may be able to enlist the "help" of the MB in negotiating with the Taliban regarding Afghanistan. This is like negotiating with Hitler, and hiring Himmler to represent the United States.
Here is a quote from the Muslim Brotherhood Strategic Memorandum on North American Affairs: "The Ikhwan (the Muslim Brotherhood) must understand that their work in America is a kind of grand Jihad in eliminating and destroying Western civilization from within and sabotaging its miserable house by their hands and the hands of believers so that it is eliminated and Allah's religion is made victorious over all other religions."
Nothing could be more hostile to religious freedom, secular law, and our Constitution, including the Bill of Rights. The Muslim Brotherhood is a subversive organization operating in the U.S. via mosques, campus groups, and fake charities. It also supports terrorism, and the Director of the FBI informed a Congressional Committee of that fact a year ago.
For example, Hamas, which is allied with the Palestinian Authority, is an extension of the Muslim Brotherhood.
Obama and Hillary Clinton are not just ignorant fools. They are treacherous.
fckewe| 1.17.12 @ 9:14AM
SO, when you were a kid, did you ever fight over toys with your siblings? Did your Mommy and Daddy make you share them and play together? or did you just kill them?
World order is no more complicated than two kids and a bag of Legos. If I knew I had a Brother like YOU, I'd be as paranoid as YOU are about the 'Brotherhood" . Do you REALLY think a few towelheads can destroy what Khruschev could not? LMAO!!!! You are confusing rhetoric with reality (which is a RED party requirement no doubt) What is going to fail in America is people like you, who think that saying it and doing it are the same thing. Understanding the diference between the two is easier SAID than DONE.
ncatty| 1.13.12 @ 10:24AM
Our government deplores in the strongest terms the act of urinating on Taliban corpses, noting that desecration of corpses offends Islamic law. But killing these guys is not offensive and does not offend Islamic sensibilities? Am I the only one who sees the illogic here?
Intelligent Design| 1.13.12 @ 11:39AM
The main issue is that our soldiers were wasting time. They should have been busy killing more Taliban.
Con Chef (NB) | 1.13.12 @ 11:41AM
BINGO! And not hampered by ROE that has lead to more deaths than at any time under Bush.
fckewe| 1.17.12 @ 9:15AM
ROE? = what?
Anthony| 1.13.12 @ 2:24PM
Oh the outrage, oh the inhumanity!!!
Wait for the firestorm on this one from the left and the MSM.
Soon, Obozo will take a swipe at Bush on this, with the MSM in tow, blaming Bush's reckless war for these actions.
But actions do have consequences, perhaps if the Taliban fought like professional soldiers, in uniform and part of an official government miltary, and not hiding behind woman and children in civilian clothing, our military would not react with such distain to these 7th century fanatics, but rather, would afford them the respect of a fellow soldiers.
Just remember, when the MSM have their collective vapors condemning these actions from the cushy confines of their homes or studio; put yourselves in the shoes of a 20+ kid who was just shot at by these fanatics.
All they want is to get home to their wives and kids and not die in a country that has no appreciation for their sacrifices on behalf of this rock pile of a country.
nathan| 1.13.12 @ 11:15AM
Can any of you name the current objective for Afghanistan? Why are we there, what are doing? Defeat the Taliban? For what purpose? According to Panetta himself Al Queda is largely finished. So why stay? And besides even on 911 Al Queda never numbered more than 1,000 and probably around 500. However spectacular the attack was, which exceeded the expectations of OBL, was it not more than a little questionable to commit the entire military resources of the country in a "war" against a group the size of what was for all intents and puposes a what battalion sized unit when perhaps treating them as criminals (murdering 3,000 people is a crime is it not?) and just viewing it as a police action might have been more rational and less costly?
The British asked years ago, are we not winning battles in Afghanistan we shouldn't be fighting in the first place? Good question. Time to withdraw, and quit putting more names on the wall.
Oh by the way. Saint George and Saint Dick, the hero of all you "conservatives" out here, the ones you think "saved" the country, declared war on terror didn't they? Said they would not tolerate acts of terror anywhere in the world right? Well in Tehran the other day, a motorcycle came up beside a car carrying a civilian scientist and attached a bomb to the car blowing that civilian to pieces. That folks is an act of terror. Are any of you now calling for the perpetrators to be brought to justice? Ummm didn't think so.
Understand something. The person in that car is guilty of no crime? I mean bring him to New York, put him on trial, and what would you charge him with? Name a capital offense that he was guilty of? He had as Jefferson said, "unalienable rights" which can be forfeited but not taken without as Madison wrote "due process". For all of you, and I suspect that means most of you here, who support the murder of this man, name the capital offense he's guilty of, that you could take him into court, try him on, find him guilty of, and put him on death row for. I can't think of one.
Tom Paine (you all know him?) said to preseve our liberties we must defend the rights of those we hate. He had rights. Who will rise to the defense of those rights and others like him?
And please we don't KNOW if they have a nuke or not. Go back and CAREFULLY read the the inspectors report. It doesn't say they are building weapons. And likewise we don't know precisely what their president said. Did he say they would simply disappear from history or did he say he would that for them? How well do any of YOU speak Persian? All the more because of the uncertainty here the scientist and others like him would never be found guilty, beyond reasonable doubt, of a capital offense. So are you prepared to call for the arrest of the perpetrators? And if this turns out to be state sponsored, sanctions against the state?
Con Chef (NB) | 1.13.12 @ 11:39AM
Oh, yes. We should weep for the death of someone working on the nuke program of a country sworn to our destruction. Boo-freaking-hoo.
Its called unconventional warfare. Look it up.
Con Chef (NB) | 1.13.12 @ 11:40AM
"All the more because of the uncertainty here the scientist and others like him would never be found guilty, beyond reasonable doubt, of a capital offense."
NOW HEAR THIS:
From now on, all intel & covert activities shall have to follow the precedents for civilian law.
Seriously, what are you smoking?
nathan| 1.13.12 @ 12:29PM
Sir, blowing up a civilian, with a bomb, is by definition an act of terror. The previous president declared war on "terror" did he not? The scientist was again a civilian, charged with no crime guilty of no crime. (You didn't name one.) You can't be sure, none of you can be, what he was working on. The presumption of innocence here anyone? Or are we just going to go around killing people based on "information"? Do those values we have and talk about mean anything or not? Do individual rights mean anything or not? Do PRINCIPLES mean anything or not? The person on that motorcycle was by definition a "terrorist". Are you all saying that "terrorism" is fine when the sainted Israelis do it? I'm just looking for clarification here. The Israelis after all elected a terrorist (Begin) as prime minister. That bother anyone? Didn't think so.
How much hypocrysy are you willing to live with here?
We talk about American exceptionalism. What's "exceptional" about supporting this? How "situational" do you want your ethics and values to be?
We know terror has value. Why do you think the Jews blew up the King David Hotel in 1948? They laid a commemorative plaque at the site in 2008 (Bibi was in attendance) in honor of the two Irgun members killed in the explosion. The British who saw over a hundred civilians killed in the attack were outraged. Albert Einstein condemned the attack. Is it only "terror" when the other guy does it to you?
We can rationalize misbehavior all we want. We can talk about "good intentions" all we desire. But you know what, actions are all that matter. Is blowing up a civilian scientist consistent with being "the one true democracy in the Middle East?" Is that the values such a country is supposed to put forth? Is showing a total disregard for individual rights consistent with "democracy"? At what point as you continue to let those bad actions associated with those "good intentions" do you turn into the bad guys you're going up against? When does that line get crossed? "By their works we shall know them." Not the talk, the actions. Not the look how noble we are. Look at the actions folks . . . .
Acting good is so very hard. Doing what the bad guys do is all too easy. Standing by those principles is really a pain in the ass, finding a way to win without violating those principles is tough. Blowing up cars is the easy way out.
Con Chef (NB) | 1.13.12 @ 12:32PM
Show me the proof it was us, junior.
Con Chef (NB) | 1.13.12 @ 12:52PM
Want to know the crime:
"We should weep for the death of someone working on the nuke program of a country sworn to our destruction."
See, I posted in my very first post. This is how the sub rosa world of intel works. How many people do you think the CIA lost to the KGB in the Cold War & vice versa? How many spooks, for any nation, die carrying out such missions? Not that there are any hard numbers, but the number of stars on the memorial wall at Langley with no name, date, or location listed in the register FOR those stars. What do you think those people were doing? Did they get lost a la Amilia Earhart style?
"The presumption of innocence here anyone? Or are we just going to go around killing people based on "information"?
Not in the intel world. Never has been, never will be. The analysts analyize. IF the intel is actionable, then action is taken. Its not like governments commit assets like that willy nilly just based on ONE source.
"We can rationalize misbehavior all we want. We can talk about "good intentions" all we desire. But you know what, actions are all that matter. Is blowing up a civilian scientist consistent with being "the one true democracy in the Middle East?" Is that the values such a country is supposed to put forth? Is showing a total disregard for individual rights consistent with "democracy"? At what point as you continue to let those bad actions associated with those "good intentions" do you turn into the bad guys you're going up against? When does that line get crossed? "
Its called taking action in their national interest. Throughout its entire existence, official or otherwise, that country's neighbors have been sworn to its destruction & that of its people. To the last child. Those 2 countries have been at war for quite some time.
As for our support of them, why SHOULDN'T we? Considering Iran is the state sponsor of Hezbollah, who is flying people to Venezuela on a weekly basis & infiltrating them up through Mexico posing as illegals. I suppose the Hezbos, Quds Force operators & IRG guys are all just there to take in the sights of Caracas, then migrate north to Mexico, hoping to convert to Catholicism, run to America & open a taquiera, right?
You have a lot to learn about covert & intelligence operations.
"We sleep safe in our beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do us harm." -George Orwell
KennesawJack| 1.13.12 @ 1:02PM
Uh,oh! Is this Clint or Jack in disguise? It all goes back to the evil Israel. Frankly, Nathan, I prefer the "situational" ethics of Israel. If the "situation" is either I kill my enemy or he's going to kill me, it's time to lock and load. Blowing the guy up is entirely consistent with the responsibility of a government to protect its people. Tell me, was JFK wrong to threaten Cuba with attack if the Russian missiles weren't removed? After all, they hadn't fired any of them yet. Do you honestly believe if we had "acted good" they would have, too? Edmund Burke, whom I admire greatly, said a few things that are particular germaine to this discussion. "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing" and "There is a time when forebearance ceases to be a virtue". Both quotes are eminently applicable to your pollyanish objections.
ncatty| 1.13.12 @ 12:07PM
Israel did it, direct your comments to them.
KennesawJack| 1.13.12 @ 1:06PM
Yeah! and good on 'em.
KennesawJack| 1.13.12 @ 12:46PM
Nathan, the reason we got involved in Afghanistan is because the Taliban harbored, aided, and abetted Al Qaida. The message being sent is clear, do not give aid and comfort to those seeking to harm the U. S. or your ass is going to be grass and our military is going to be the lawnmower. As to the nuclear scientist, your reasoning would extend, then, to a scientist, employed by government in the development of biological weapons capable of destroying millions. Just because the government pays you to help develop a weapon of mass destruction doesn't make you a bad boy as long as you, personally don't use it? Nonsense, and you know it. As to his "rights". Your arguement is fallacious. If the Iranians did indeed have the unalienable rights Jefferson alluded to, we wouldn't be having this confrontation with them. An Iran with the same unalienable rights for its citizens as Americans, you know life, LIBERTY (that means freedom of speech, assembly, press and religion, etc.) wouldn't be saddled with the Islamist maniacs currently in power. He has no rights in his own country. They made the rules, we're just playing by them. And by the way, when would it ever be questionable to commit the entire military might of the U. S. in response to the slaugher of 3,000 innocent people in our homeland?
Alan Brooks| 1.14.12 @ 7:25PM
Nathan,
they don't really know what they are doing in Ashcanistan. They haven't known what to do since the Berlin Wall fell.
They are waiting for Reagan's ghost to guide them.
Con Chef (NB) | 1.13.12 @ 11:37AM
I think our Marines have the right idea as to how to "negotiate" with the Talibanos. Kill them, then piss on them. Simple & effective. Maybe wrap the corpses in bacon next time?
Herb| 1.13.12 @ 5:07PM
I think a lot of talking heads have jumped to conclusions over Urinegate. Is the footage bogus? We don't know. Or maybe they should serve a few deployments with our soldiers and Marines in Afghanistan and experience the savagery of a savage people before they start OMG-ing and oh-mying.
Anyway, saluting Taliban corpses in this fashion is both fitting and a practical use of something you have to void anyway. Using bacon to affront Mohammedan sensitivities is just a waste of good infidelicious food.
cicero| 1.13.12 @ 5:49PM
The marines only peed on a few dead terrorists, for crying out loud. It isn't like they cut the heads off of uniformed soldiers who were captured; or murdered innocent women, children and old men who happened to be on the way to school, maoque, or market. The marines should have stuffed their mouths with bacon, cut off their gonads, and then cut thheir heards off and fed them to the dogs. Maybe then these maniacs would start having trouble recruiting young twits to do their bidding.
As far as negotiating with the Taliban, I seem to remenber s news piece from about a year ago when the first negotiation session was had. Seems like the Taliban negotiator assasinated the negotiator for the Karzia government. Hmmm, what is wrong with this picture? Does anybody with an ounce of sense think this is good faith bargaining?
The Taliban harbored AlKaida. We threw the Taliban out of their nest in about 2 weeks. We destroyed Bin Ladens play pen. At that point, we should have been gone. If the tribal chiefs didn't want the Taliban back, they were perfectly capable of keeping them out. If they came back and reestablished the succesors of Bin Laden, we could have stuffed them again in short order. This insane idea that we can establish Jeffersonian democracy in tribal societies just because we want to shows a total lack of historical analysis, to say nothing of reality.
Con Chef (NB) | 1.14.12 @ 1:57PM
Score another for my fellow optimate!
Con Chef (NB) | 1.14.12 @ 1:59PM
We've got it all wrong, folks. Those Marines were only peeing on the Talibanis to put out the fire cause by Marine tracers zipping through their bodies! It was merely a simple military, battlefield solution to a fire.
shipley130| 1.14.12 @ 5:46PM
A legitimate Taliban office not too far from the US Naval 5th Fleet. Breeeelliant.
Richard Baker| 1.16.12 @ 8:17AM
Just finished "The Wars of Afghanistan" by Ambassador Peter tomsen whose beat was that country. He "credits" the mess there on the Pakistani ISI and Zia ul Haq's wanting a greater Pakistan. The book is enlightening as to how the ISI has played the game next door. I suggest one and all read it. I found a copy at my local library.
Richard Baker| 1.16.12 @ 8:18AM
That should be Tomsen, not tomsen.
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