The fundamental issue in Wisconsin — and states considering
similar budget cuts — is not whether government employees should
contribute more (in Wisconsin’s case, more being merely
something) to their health or pension plans — though that
is important. Rather, it is whether workers should have the right
to say no.
If passed, Wisconsin Governor Scott Walker’s emergency
budget will allow workers to opt out of joining a union and still
keep their jobs. It would allow workers to vote every year on
whether they want to keep their union. And it would take away the
unions’ ability to automatically deduct dues from workers’
paychecks. All of these threaten organized labor’s power by giving
workers more choice.
Unions allege that, if Walker’s budget bill is passed,
state employees will be subject to arbitrary disciplinary actions
and firings. Nothing could be further from the truth. If
Walker’s budget is approved, workers will still be able to join
unions if they choose, but collective bargaining will be limited to
pay only. Moreover, they will still be protected by civil service
laws that provide job security and perks beyond anything seen in
the private sector.
The majority of those benefits are mandated by Wisconsin’s
Municipal Employment Relations Act (MERA), section 230 of the
Wisconsin Code (the code) entitled “State Employee Relations,” and
other civil service laws. According to the State of Wisconsin
Office of Employment Relations, government employees will still
have:
• The right to a harassment/discrimination free
workplace.
• The right to due process (prior to being disciplined).
• Grievance/appeal rights.
• Ability to compete for positions (transfer, demote,
promote)
• Protection from discrimination in the hiring process
because of political or religious opinions or affiliations or
because of age, sex, disability, race, color, sexual orientation,
national origin or ancestry.
• After passing a probationary period, attainment of a
permanent status similar to tenure.
• Protection during times of workforce reductions by a
clear set of seniority-based rules and procedures for both layoff
and recall.
Seniority rules are particularly troubling. If the 14
missing Wisconsin Senate Democrats do not return from their
“undisclosed location,” Gov. Walker may be forced to
lay off 1,500 workers to balance the budget. The layoffs will
likely be done according to seniority, due to the state’s
last-in-first-out system, whereby newly hired employees must
be the first to be let go, regardless of performance. (This led to
Wisconsin’s Teacher of the Year being laid off last
year.)
Section 230.34
of the code clearly states, “An employee with permanent status
in class… for a continuous period of 12 months or more may be
removed, suspended without pay, discharged, reduced pay or demoted
only for just cause.” [Emphasis added]
The Wisconsin civil service code gives
government employees — including those not covered by collective
bargaining agreements — vacation and sick leave far more generous
than what’s found in the private sector. Every new employee who has
worked one to five years automatically receives 104 hours off
annually, with the vacation time increasing substantially every
five years. Those working for over 25 years get a whopping 216
hours off each year — almost five and a half weeks!
Union claims of government employees being reduced to
penury are hogwash. A reduction in state employees’ take-home pay
could be as low as
4.2 percent, according to Wisconsin State Rep. Kevin Petersen.
For a state worker making $50,000 in base pay, not including
benefits, this could be $175 a month. Given the option to not pay
mandatory union dues — Wisconsin teachers pay between
$700 and $1,000 a year — the reduction in take home pay could
be even smaller. According to the Maclver Institute, the average
teacher in Wisconsin makes $56,500 in wages and over $100,000 in
total compensation, including salary and benefits.
michigander_sandusky| 3.8.11 @ 7:35AM
The so-called Democratic Party is "pro-choice" when it comes to killing babies, but is "anti-choice" when it comes to the freedom of joining, or not joining, a union. That's all I need to know to judge that they are a bunch of immoral hypocrites.
vtwin| 3.8.11 @ 10:23AM
“The truth about Wisconsin” has nothing to do with the state’s budget deficit, employee compensation, or collective bargaining rights for Wisconsin’s public employees it is about political power. The Republican Governor of Wisconsin is going after Wisconsin’s public employees unions because these public employee unions are a source of election money for Democratic candidates.
Alan Brooks| 3.8.11 @ 10:44AM
Yes, Walker wants to be president.
But Michael Moore wants to make bad films.
Name your poison.
Bruce Berger| 3.8.11 @ 10:50AM
Vtwin, you are right. Though I am not a WI resident, I think the governor should go after the unholy alliance of the public sector unions and the Democratic Party. Why in the world should half the residents of WI (an approximation of conservatives/Republicans in the state) be forced to pay (through higher taxes, which support public employees' union dues) to support candidates they don't support (unions re-cycle some of that money to support Democrats)?
Alan Brooks| 3.8.11 @ 11:01AM
Plague upon both your crumbling houses.
vtwin| 3.8.11 @ 1:26PM
Good point, but what about the rest of us including Wisconsin residents whose money is funneled by business through the products and services we buy to Republican Candidates? Maybe public financing of elections is the answer?
Brian Mc| 3.8.11 @ 2:57PM
No one is holding a gun to your head and threatening imprisonment unless you buy a particular product.
vtwin| 3.8.11 @ 4:40PM
t iIs not as easy as boycotting a particular product. Product production involves a lot more than you appear to be aware of like miners, growing, suppliers, manufacturers, packagers, shippers, importers, distributors, wholesalers, retailers, bankers, investors…
Brian Mc| 3.8.11 @ 10:44PM
No one is holding a gun to your head and threatening imprisonment unless you buy a particular product.
kent| 3.9.11 @ 2:04PM
not yet! Give Mr. Obama time. If he is allowed to complet ethe health care program, he will be able to do exactly that. That's What Vinson indicated in his ruling. Hope you like brocolli...
kent| 3.9.11 @ 2:02PM
Then don't buy there. you have a choice. What choice do you have withteh governmetn. Is ther another one out there I don't know about. I'm sorry to be rude but what a stupid comment.
cowgirl| 3.8.11 @ 11:19AM
Vtwin:
How do you handle the workers who do not want to participate in the Union or does that even matter to you?
Alan Brooks| 3.8.11 @ 1:09PM
Make them watch Bowling For Columbine and Fahrenheit 9-11 until they heave up in two shades of vomit.
vtwin| 3.8.11 @ 1:41PM
When I graduated high school I was drafted into the Army, when I became employed my income was taxed… Why? Because in a democracy, nation or workplace, the majority decides by ballet what my obligations are to the greater community for the good of that community and if I disagree I can try to change it through the ballet or I can leave the nation or the workplace.
Bruce Berger| 3.8.11 @ 2:21PM
And that is exactly what is happening in Wisconsin. The half that is conservative is tired of making forced campaign contributions to Democrats. They are trying to change the status quo through legal processes. The Democrats hate that.
The current system is immoral and conservatives/Republicans should proudly state that they are fighting to change the system. Let the left try to defend what amounts to theft.
Brian Mc| 3.8.11 @ 2:58PM
I hate the ballet...prefer opera.
Alan Brooks| 3.8.11 @ 4:18PM
Politics is a minuet, the GOP is merely trying to cut in on the dance; you want to get your people in power.
And Walker does want to be elected president next year.
Bruce Berger| 3.8.11 @ 5:04PM
I very much doubt that you have any inside information about Walker's plans. In any event, is there anything wrong with wanting to be elected President?
Negro X| 3.8.11 @ 5:38PM
Vtroll, We are a republic,not a democracy, secondly spare us the lie about being drafted, lest I pull up one of your earlier posts which contradicts your lie.
If the democrat want campaign money perhaps they should promote ideas people actaully want instead of their habitaul leftist scams.
Kathy| 3.8.11 @ 9:37PM
Umm....I think you mean through the "ballot" -- unless you really meant "ballet" and are going to wear a pink tutu.
cowgirl| 3.9.11 @ 12:13PM
Did you sleep through the U.S. Constitution 101? Taxing was not an intention of the Founding Fathers - it came about via FDR in order to pay for WWII. If you or I want to contributed to the greater good of a community, get YOUR checkbook out and write a check.
Mitch Angoop| 3.8.11 @ 7:39PM
If the states of Wisconsin, Indiana, Ohio, and Pennsylvania can be dragged kicking and screaming out of the public employee union stranglehold, it will cost obama and his dem thugs FOUR HUNDRED MILLION DOLLARS in forced, stolen "contribution" swindled from the public employees of those four states alone for the 2012 elections. The democrats cannot afford to lose that.
It is just one more reminder of the illegitimacy of the democrats and their fellow thugs. Look up the word "CORRUPTION" in the dictionary, and you'll see the words "democratic party" with obummer's picture.
If the GOP gives up on this, they are dead, and so is America because the criminal thuggish tactics used by the democraps will, once again, be rewarded. They'll also know that, if they scream, cry, and slither out of town and blatantly break ANY LAWS THEY WISH, they'll be rewarded. If they lose this, the republicans had better just resign and disband. THE GOP WAS ELECTED TO DO JUST WHAT THEY ARE DOING! Stick with it; regardless of any rigged polls the propaganda wing published for consumption by the stupid. As a Country, we are fighting for our life against an enemy as dangerous, and as deadly, and as evil, as anything coming from the demented minds of the jihadists. Think about it.
Mike D.| 3.8.11 @ 8:02AM
Its always about power with Unions, always has been. Looks like after all the typical union bluster, threats, and intimidation tactics and the whole parade of the usual left wing media whores(jackson, sharpton, moore) they will lose this hill.
Unions are various species of dinosaurs who don't know they are going extinct one member at a time.
Michigan will never advance into the next economic era until the last of the unionists pass into history. The right to work movement will increase and competition will dictate somebodies worth not a group of socialist union thugs running a legal protection and shakedown racket protected by the shill politicians they elect. Hail to Governor Walker, thats how leaders do it.
jolizoom| 3.8.11 @ 3:47PM
Michigan, Wisconsin, what's the difference... :-P
JamesJ| 3.8.11 @ 8:05AM
Unions = Lowest Common Denominator
Owl| 3.8.11 @ 8:16AM
Can the Republicans in Wisconsin (and all other states) at least pass a law that unions will have to collect their own fees from the employees AFTER paychecks have been received? The employer, especially the government as employer, should not be obligated to collect these funds for the unions. Union members can write that check every month or every year if they want to remain in the union. Nothing like having the money in your hands and THEN giving it to the union bosses to make an employee think twice. I've always thought the same rule should apply to state and federal taxes. All wages should be paid in full and THEN the worker writes the check to the government. All workers, even low income, should have to pay a certain percentage of their income as taxes as it is the only way to have a horse in this race. As of now isn't it 40% of Americans who don't pay any taxes so how can they even begin to care how the tax money is spent?
Brian Mc| 3.8.11 @ 8:33AM
My bet is that, on top of that, the 40% you mention, Owl, are also collecting a government subsidy of one form or another. How do you think they vote? Should they be allowed to vote?
jothepro| 3.8.11 @ 8:45AM
Hey Brian Mc,
The answers to your questions are: democrats and no.
Stephanie| 3.8.11 @ 11:23AM
A BIG conflict of interest.
Larry| 3.8.11 @ 11:28AM
Let's move tax day from April 15th to say November 1st. Do away with all withholding. When people really have to pay the bill and are doing so right before the election, you'll see an incredible revolution in this country.
April 15th is not just some arbitrary day for taxes.
Sam Levi| 3.8.11 @ 12:20PM
Aren't union dues considered "pre-tax"?
If they are, just take a minute to think about the ramifications of that.
Hillel| 3.8.11 @ 8:52AM
When I was a teenager I campaigned for Adlai Stevenson. As I stood on a street corner with a can for coins,"Help guarantee Victory this Nov.."
a man told me he'd been compelled to give already by his union. They told him they'd confiscate his Union Book if he didn't pony up. I began (at that moment to) rethink my liberal assumptions.
Clint| 3.8.11 @ 8:56AM
Time for American Taxpayers to stop gettin' Shakin' Down by These Arrogant Government Union Parasite Leeches.
Larry| 3.8.11 @ 9:18AM
The problem with public sector unions is that they believe that they AND their families are entitled to live off the work of tax paying suckers. I call that slavery. Lose your shackles folks and let's get rid off ALL public unions and the ridiculous pay and benefits that they receive from US. Remember that they work for us and that the scummy politicians who provide them with your money are merely stewards of that money. They also work for US. Vote out any politician who believes that your money is there for him or her to buy union votes.
Len| 3.8.11 @ 1:29PM
Larry a better, though more difficult solution is to rewrite state constitutions so that what should be done in the free market, such as education, is taken out of the hands of government and given back to the people. This means less money in the hands of pols to use corruptly, and less power over people's lives.
There is also the natural resulting benefit of education improving as a result of competition. The consumer will be boss, and the garbage or luxuries that really are not necessary for to improve their lot in life will not be subsidized. People will be forced to be responsible for their lives and learn that bad decisions are just that, bad decisions that will not be forcibly covered for by others who have made good decisions. Government is supposed to promote public morality and forcing one group of people to provide for another group does the opposite. It makes government no longer an objective party, but an instrument that is used by one group to gain advantage against another group.
Timothy L. Pennell| 3.8.11 @ 10:49AM
Look. Why not just put an end to this whole Collective Bargaining Union/Democrat Money Laundering Scam, once and for all?
Now, before I write this down, I want you to understand that I am a Mr. Mom, with a Small Landscape Business, that I do while the kids are at School.
It is my understanding that JFK got all this started with an EXECUTIVE ORDER.
Is this still the only way this thing has been implemented? Has there been any Legislation dealing with this? Or, is it all just by a single Executive Order that's 50 Years Old?
If that's the case? Why not just have the next Republican President RESCIND IT? (Get rid of it.)
Is it just me?
Mitch Angoop| 3.8.11 @ 7:48PM
You're absolutely right. JFK started this whole mess with and Executive Order. Just think about the 2012 election if a GOP candidate campaigned on repealing that order. The dems/left/thugs would go berzerk! I guarantee some union/dem thug would take a shot at him/her. And the media would approve.
I once had a dream that we went through the tail of a comet and there was a substance in the tail that gave everybody in America common sense for one month, which happened to be November 2012. The dems got 12% of the vote in every election, state, local, and national. And obummer got ZERO electoral votes! Oh, by the way, after the election, the dems had 7 seats in the House and 2 in the senate. What a dream. Then I woke up and had to watch the GOP shoot themselves in the collective foot because they wanted to be 'liked'; and they believed reid and obummer's lies.
Kathy| 3.8.11 @ 9:39PM
The way Republicans are behaving, there will never be another Republican president again. Stop being afraid of workers having rights. Others losing things doesn't provide you with more. And Walker's bill is so damaging to the Wisconsin economy that small business owners like you will have a very hard time surviving.
Anthony| 3.8.11 @ 10:53AM
The case for public sector unions has always been one huge canard. Protected by civil service, the only purpose of the unions was to create a symbiotic relationship between the workers,vis a vie their union hacks, and their Democrat benefactors.
The only persons absent from the collective bargaining tables all these many decades were the citizens who paid the tab.
Shame on us, but better late than never.
Oldefarte| 3.8.11 @ 11:49AM
Labor unions formerly served a noble cause in protecting workers from sometimes abusive companies regarding unsafe factory equipment, length of workdays,etc; BUT ARE NO LONGER NEEDED FOR SAME. Laws have been passed [and are now on the books] that adequately protect workers health/welfare regarding these issues. Labor unions today are notheing but SUBVERSIVE POLITICAL MACHINES that brainwash/mistreat ignorant workers into joining these unions, forcably extracting exhorbatant union dues from their paychecks, and thereafter fraudently paying political kickbacks/bribes to [ususlly] Democrat candidates [who will once elected grease the palms of these unions as payback]. All labor unions are now corrupt, but at least PRIVATE businesses stand a fighting chance in combating unions, since they have intelligently capable managers/administrators that can as effectively as possible challenge their abusive behaviors. PUBLIC governments on the other hand have mostly ignorant/mentally challenged managers/administrators that either roll over compliantly to union demands or are too stupid to realize what these unions are truly doing to them. The now completely available data on the superiority of governmental pay packages and total compensations [including all benefits] to those similar in private businesses should adequately illustrate the subversive result of these governmental unions' practices. Anyone now doubting same is nothing short of STUPID!!!!!!!!!
PolishKnight| 3.8.11 @ 3:51PM
"Labor unions formerly served a noble cause in protecting workers from sometimes abusive companies regarding unsafe factory equipment, length of workdays,etc; BUT ARE NO LONGER NEEDED FOR SAME."
Sadly, a lot of these issues still continue to haunt us especially when it comes to the length of a workday. Many middle class jobs have been defined as exempt from federal and state laws for overtime pay but even if they were, the Republicans often lobby to eliminate those restrictions. Many Republican leaders also support outsourcing, amnesty for illegal immigrants, and bringing in cheap H1B's.
In addition, unions don't really care about these issues apart from their own electorate as in the case of Obamacare (where they demanded exemptions.) They've become a class and political interest that opposes workers' rights in general in order to keep taxpayer money flowing. Kind of ironic.
Perhaps it's a good time to ask the important question that rather than just cheering on Republicans and even economic conservatives that the state also require companies to deal with their workers in an ethical manner. The left gets a lot of traction with their "Republicans are for the Rich!" slogans and claims that they are the only ones who care for workers. And in some cases, they have a point. I'm sorry folks, but blue blood Harvard graduates who get 10 million a year jobs as CEO's don't deserve it. It doesn't take a genius to write mission statements and hire croneys to fill upper level positions. Really. I read corporate statements from these guys and they act as if doing just what I described entitles them to an award or something. Hilarious.
The right should address the following issues head on:
Government involvement in a welfare state, if any, for the chronically unemployed and mentally ill and the limits of such benefits and how to clearly define entitled recipients.
Workers' rights and benefits.
Effective ways to address illegal immigrant and workers AND identity theft including a national ID card. Come on folks! You don't think a social security card isn't now an ID card?
Mitch Angoop| 3.8.11 @ 7:54PM
Check out the salaries and benefits paid to the top 6 or 7 officials in any large union at random. I wonder if the teachers making their $50,000 for 9 months would be as self satisfied if they knew the heads of the NEA and the AFT were making MORE THAN $700,000 a year plus bonus and bennies. But, the teachers are the ones out there in Madison showing their students that it is okay to lie and cheat and falsify doctor's excuses while being seen on national television. How stupid do they think the taxpayers and parents are? How many ways can we spell STUPID? Ask a teacher; they know. Then ask them how to spell; "CHEAT", "LIE", "FRAUD", "FALSIFY", and any other words that show everybody what these people really are.
Steve| 3.8.11 @ 3:27PM
You sound envious.
High Point | 3.14.11 @ 12:09PM
Many things in politics are driven by envy.
K~Bob| 3.8.11 @ 6:00PM
These legislatures need to add a clause demanding repayment of all taxpayer money that was used in funding the demonstrations. Using taxpayer money to influence legislation should an impeachable offense, and should also be a high crime for anyone caught. The repayment should include a hefty penalty.
Each union needs to be billed for cleanup costs and any damage to public buildings and grounds associated with their protests.
Mitch Angoop| 3.8.11 @ 7:55PM
Add mandatory prison time and a permanent criminal record, thus making them inelegible for public office.
Kathy| 3.8.11 @ 9:40PM
BTW, that whole $7 million figure was MADE UP by Governor Walker. The capitol is just fine.
Jonah Kaplan| 3.8.11 @ 9:24PM
If this is such a moderate proposal, then why could they not sit down at discuss it for a few weeks, which is how we make laws in Wisconsin, at least until this group came along. The reason is that it is not really about money or worker rights. It is about breaking the Democratic party. You seem to be overlooking the most important fact - with dues no longer being collected, the unions lose substantial revenues, and the GOP now controls the vote outside of Madison and Milwaukee. Democracy, and competitive elections, go bye bye, and then what will happen to all of their protections? Shot to hell.
Jonah Kaplan| 3.8.11 @ 9:41PM
Please note below from a recent Wisconsin State Journal article on unions as the “pillars” of Democratic politics. This is the problem. We do not have celebrities or Wall Street tycoons to make up the difference. Once the unions go, so do competitive political campaigns in most regions of the state.
Over the last 12 years, individuals and political action committees have donated at least $117 million to Democratic and Republican state political candidates in Wisconsin, according to the Democracy Campaign, which compiles the data listed on campaign finance reports filed with the state. The amount is likely larger because the group maintains records only on contributions of $100 and up. The figures also don't include independent expenditures or spending on so-called "issue ads," which don't advocate for a particular candidate. Among Democrats, only lawyers have contributed more money to state Democrats than labor unions have, and unions more than any other group have given more disproportionately to Democrats, the data show. Unions, lawyers, wealthy people and Internet donors are the pillars of Democratic politics, said Paul Maslin, a Madison-based political strategist and pollster who polled for Tom Barrett, Walker's Democratic opponent last year. Remove unions, and Democrats have a harder time getting elected, he said. And Democrats don't rely only on union dollars. Unions are a source of campaign volunteers, engaging in everything from peer-to-peer advocacy to phone bank staffing, said Jason Sidner, political director for AFSCME Council 40, which represents 32,000 city, state, school district and private sector workers statewide other than in Milwaukee County. Democrats, Republicans and outside observers agree that a political strength of labor unions is intensity. Although corporations have always had more money to spend on politics than unions, they traditionally haven't done so, said Potter, the top lawyer for Republican Sen. John McCain's presidential campaign who also defended the campaign spending law crafted by McCain and former Democratic Sen. Russ Feingold of Middleton before the Supreme Court.
Copyright 2011 madison.com. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.
kent| 3.9.11 @ 2:15PM
interesting that this is exactly the same post as by J Kaplan earlier. Talking points anybody?
Nite| 3.8.11 @ 10:31PM
The Union protests have taught students and tax payers a valuable lesson. The teachers and Docs were willing to lie about sick leave, and the Docs wrote false sick notes. This is lies and commission of fraud. I was really disappointed in seeing Fire Fighters and Police walking the picket lines as well. I wonder if they know that the International Association of Fire Fighters is connected to the AFLCIO, who is associated to the Socialist and Communist Parties and other radicals. My Dad always said you could determine the character of a person by the company they keep. This includes the runaway Dems who refuse to do their job. I have no sympathy for any of them.
Rich Rostrom| 3.10.11 @ 11:57PM
Kent: No, it's SEO spam. Somewhere out there is a bot which grabs a random comment and reposts it with a couple of links to a sales webpage.
That page is now "linked to" by this comments page. This is supposed to improve that page's position on Google/Bing/etc searches.
patrick henry| 3.16.11 @ 2:51PM
"California- America's Yugoslavia?"
For all the trauma and agony that the good folks in Wisconsin are going through, at least they're openly working through their mess. In Kalifornia, the state's mess is still pretty much swept under the carpet, with the state's Dems desperately seeking ways to keep it under there in the vain and insane hope that somehow it'll all just magically disappear.
A March 15 article in the Los Angeles Times gave details of a report on widespread corruption in the state's Public Employee Retirement System.
My favorite statement in the article is the notation that:
"The report, citing Buenrostro's ex-wife and an unnamed girlfriend, described Buenrostro as "a puppet" of Villalobos, who the report said earned more than $50 million in placement agent fees."
The key word there is "puppet." So, if you don't live in Kalifornia you may be wondering why this might be relevant to you. Well, two things come to mind: 1) one of the "magic" solutions that the Kalifornia Dems are hoping for is a federal bailout; in other words, after you have addressed all of your own state's problems, the Dems want you to help pay for Kalifornia's as well; and 2) that key word "puppet"- beware of puppets in your own state- politicians who aren't working for the taxpayers but, rather, for someone/something else- those people are also puppets, and they aren't working for you.
Oh, by the way, nowhere in the LA Times article does it point out that all those people involved in the CalPers corruption are Democrats. "Jeez, can't sweep the publicly-released report under the carpet, but the least we can do is to avoid mentioning that the crooks are Democrats. After all, we sure don't want the people to stop electing them."
If you happen to live in one of the states that's going through trauma right now, at least you can be assured that what you're presently experiencing is as bad as it'll get- it'll only get better from here on out.
On the other hand, Kalifornia is possibly destined to become America's Yugoslavia. During the Iron Curtain years Yugoslavia was the "nicest" Soviet puppet state to live in, while the people in all the other eastern European puppet states had far more repressive societies and economies. But when the Soviet Union unraveled and the Iron Curtain fell, all those other eastern European states got back on their feet rather quickly and smoothly. In the meantime, Yugoslavia degenerated into widespread chaos and civil war, with Bill Clinton eventually stepping in with the U.S. Air Force to bomb them into submission.
Your state's climb back into solvency will have some unpleasant moments. The case of Kalifornia could be downright ugly.
Christian Louboutin | 6.23.11 @ 4:11AM
The fundamental issue in Wisconsin -- and states considering similar budget cuts -- is not whether government employees should contribute more (in Wisconsin's case, more being merely something) to their health or pension plans -- though that is important. Rather, it is whether workers should have the right to say no.
Creative Recreation | 8.11.11 @ 2:16AM
is good