The American Spectator : Wisconsin Showdown

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Wisconsin Showdown

By Peter Ferrara on 2.23.11 @ 6:09AM

Newt Gingrich and Jeb Bush are right about state bankruptcy as one way to deal with rapacious government unions.

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The federal law would provide that a state’s bankruptcy could be triggered by a filing initiated by the state’s governor, or by the state legislature passing the plan of reorganization, which would automatically send it to the court for approval, or by the people adopting the plan of reorganization by citizen initiative, automatically sending it to the court as well.

If this were the law, Governor Walker in Wisconsin could go ahead and file his reorganization plan with a federal court, without having to wait on corrupt politicians, bought off by their government union political machines, to show up for work. Or citizens in Wisconsin, or in California, could file for an Initiative Referendum on a plan of reorganization devised by the Initiative sponsors themselves.

The Wisconsin Showdown is already spreading across the country to other states. Changing the U.S. Bankruptcy Code to allow for state bankruptcy filings would be a valuable tool to empower taxpayers nationwide to protect themselves.

What Governor Walker is doing in Wisconsin is protecting the interests of working people in the state, who are the ones who must pay the taxes for the lavish pay and benefits of public sector aristocrats, and suffer their own lost jobs and wages resulting from high taxes. Personally, I would like to see every working family making over $100,000 per year, and retiring as millionaires, whether working in the private or public sector. With the right economic policies, that is possible in America within a generation. That, indeed, is what I have devoted my entire life at this point working for. But we are going to fall farther from that goal, rather than grow closer, following the neo-socialist runaway tax, spend, deficit and debt policies advocated by shortsighted, brain dead government unions.

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About the Author

Peter Ferrara is Director of Entitlement and Budget Policy at the Heartland Institute, General Counsel of the American Civil Rights Union, Senior Fellow at the National Center for Policy Analysis, and Senior Policy Advisor on Entitlements and Budget Policy at the National Tax Limitation Foundation. He served in the White House Office of Policy Development under President Reagan, and as Associate Deputy Attorney General of the United States under President George H.W. Bush.

Letter to the Editor View all comments (126) | Leave a comment Leave a comment

Appleby| 2.23.11 @ 6:35AM

Democracy is in fact mob rule -- which is why the USA is not a democracy but a constitutional republic.

One would hope school teachers would actually know that, but I hear they are focused mainly on teaching about sex.

chuck| 2.23.11 @ 6:55AM

Perhaps that's why the parties each have their respective names. Democrats believe in mob rule, Republican in the rule of law.

vtwin| 2.23.11 @ 9:48AM

"Sixty-one percent of U.S. adults said they would oppose a law in their state taking away the collective bargaining rights of most public unions." -- Gallup Poll

With the anti-Republican Governors protests spreading from Wisconsin into Indiana and Ohio it looks like the tea bagger movement will be joining Disco as silly and short-lived phenomena.

V8| 2.23.11 @ 10:00AM

A new Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey finds that 48% of Likely U.S. Voters agree more with the Republican governor in his dispute with union workers. Thirty-eight percent (38%) agree more with the unionized public employees, while 14% are undecided.

vtwin| 2.23.11 @ 10:49AM

“Thirty-eight percent (38%) of voters think teachers, firemen and policemen should be allowed to go on strike, but 49% disagree and believe they should not have that right. Thirteen percent (13%) are not sure.” --Rasmussen Reports

The right to strike and the right to collectively bargain are two different questions.

V8| 2.23.11 @ 11:46AM

Not sure how that is the case as they usually strike because they could not reach a agreement with collective bargaining. Collective bargaining over wages/benifits is what has created this deficit to begin with.

vtwin| 2.23.11 @ 11:56AM

V8, I have to respectively disagree with your assessment that “Collective bargaining … created this [Wisconsin] deficit.” Wisconsin, like most of our States, is facing deficits because of the downturn in the economy.

cowgirl| 2.23.11 @ 12:29PM

VTWIN:
You may be right on WI deficit's issues - they are a result of a downturn on the economy. I am not versed in WI's economics right now so I will take your word for it. However the Stupid State (California) is unlike WI. I am a native Californian well-versed in the economics of the Stupid State and here they are and have nothing to do with a downturn in the economy.
California has run a budget deficit since 2005 - during an economic boom in California. California now has a budget deficit of $26 Billion dollars. Over half of California's state budget is for schools - K-12 and College/Universities. 80% of that school budget is salaries and pensions. California's public school system is ranked third in the nation in proficiency in reading, writing and math. Right below D.C. and New York. California spends over $12,000 a year per student. It is a complete failure. $40 Billion of the budget in California is due to entitlements - includin Medicad, Medicare, Welfare and support of illegal aliens. The CALPERS (State Union Workers' Union) and the CATRS (California Teachers Union) are $500 Billion in the hole and have been for over 10 years now. Union thugs and corrupt CA politicians have given the CA Taxpayer a $500 billion commitment. Taxes have been raised in California and 1,000 people (mostly taxpayers) are leaving to avoid high taxes. Business are fleeing by the hundreds to red states like Texas. The Stupid State's decline has been in motion since the present Governor Jerry Brown signed the Dill Act in 1978 allowing state workers to collective bargain. It has nothing to do with the downturn in the economy. It has to do with greed and entitlements by State Union Workers.

Impeach Don't Wait| 2.23.11 @ 9:39PM

You think California will go for the wonderful, unsustainable high-speed rail?

The children have had their fun. The adults are taking over.

blackwatch| 2.23.11 @ 11:20PM

Bravo from Placer County! You nailed it.

RAMIII| 2.23.11 @ 12:36PM

"Wisconsin, like most of our States, is facing deficits because of the downturn in the economy."

Umm, actually it is a crisis of spending too much money. The normal response is to spend less! Not so for the government who can force you to keep giving them more money -- regardless of economic factors.

But methinks that "State Bankruptcy" is a little naive. All we need to do is look at how that worked out for GM (Govmt Motors). They lost their autonomy, because the Federal Government decided for them how they should be run. And don't try that foolish talk about their loans and how they have paid them back. The fact is that President Obama intervened in their company's hiearchy and "fired" their CEO. AIG is another example.

Our great Republic is in truly dire straits. It has become oppressive because the "have nots" regarding wealth carry the political power they need to coerce the "public" at large to give them what they "need".

Al Adab| 2.23.11 @ 1:09PM

Actually this analysis is about half right. Governments almost invariably spend next years projected income this year. When revenues fall they are left short. our town bases its budget on last years net income. They take that number, actual dollars received, and budget those amounts in the current year spending. Surplus then goes to a capital improvement fund. When revenues fall the budget is easily controlled as projected dollars are not allocated.

JP| 2.23.11 @ 10:57AM

"Sixty-one percent of U.S. adults said they would oppose a law in their state taking away the collective bargaining rights of most public unions." -- Gallup Poll"

Actually a Rasmussen Poll from Monday (in Wisconsin, the only state that counts in this case) showed that 58% approved of Govenor Walker's position, and less than 20% agreed with the Dems/Unions.

And no, this is becoming a major liability for Obama and his ilk. Keep ignoring reality, and 2012 could be a political nightmare for Obama and his party.

JmsA| 2.23.11 @ 11:49AM

You're referring to a USA(Huffington Post)/Gallop poll, without mention of the sampling, i.e., democrats vs. republicans vs. independents respondents, or the way the poll questions were framed. Wisconsin's voters (the silent majority) voted for Walker and a Republican majority in their congress based on the clearly presented platform, including cutting the size of government (the loud and boorish minority). Enough said.

MikeD| 2.23.11 @ 12:44PM

VTWIN;
Please, keep posting your drivel. Every post you make goes straight to my thousands of readers who, in turn, send it on to independent voters as a clear illustration of the extreme stupidity of you lefties. You absolutely refuse to EVER let reality or facts to interfere with your rants, raves, and idiotic posts. Along with the moronic teacher who did nothing but scream "FOX LIES! FOX LIES!" over and over, prove our points with every demented breath. Keep it up; you're our BEST SPOKESMAN!

George S| 2.23.11 @ 10:04AM

Absolutely correct; that is what is missing in this discussion. The bedrock of a constitutional republic is that the people petition their government for redress of grievances, but the Wisconsin case shows us what happens when the government redresses itself. The origin of laws and policies come from the people, not government. When government employees use the power of a voting bloc to enact legislation, then individual rights go out the window. Imagine if you lived where the police outvoted the general public and petitioned the government to do away with some of the Bill of Rights protection just to facilitate their workload. The responsible legislature in a constitutional republic would reject this out of hand, however the political practicality of ignoring a sizable voting bloc may result otherwise. Yet the public employees do the equivalent -- robbing you of your private property rights simply because they have the political clout. This is why collective bargaining by government employees is not only a conflict of interest but, IMO, unconstitutional. It takes the power from the people and transfers it to government itself.

Alan Brooks| 2.23.11 @ 8:19PM

Ferrara is stealth-promoting Jeb Bush, isn't he?
Ugh. Sickening, the GOP keeps making the same mistake in hoping for a different outcome the next time around.

jothepro| 2.23.11 @ 7:15AM

Did anyone see Alan Colmes on O'reilly last night? What a smug no-nothing liberal he is. To people like him all they care about is being right in their minds and not care about the consequences of what they espouse.

Alan Brooks| 2.23.11 @ 8:22PM

you mean like Jeb Bush? why does his photo have to be in AS? can't Jeb's photo be in Antiques Magazine? or in Ancient History Digest.

l5j6| 2.23.11 @ 7:27AM

But Jeb Bush is obsessed, make that, OBSESSED with mass LATINO immigration. Therefore he should be ignored. He has a personal and fiduciary interest in mass Chicano immigration. Period.

mames| 2.23.11 @ 10:46AM

He's married to one - no objectivity.

Appleby| 2.23.11 @ 11:46AM

One reason why St. Paul thought people in positions of authority should remain unmarried. Of course, since men in positions of authority cannot keep their pants zipped, they also fall under the "better to marry than to burn" exemption, so there you are. How would you make a law that no man or woman in public office could marry?

Alan Brooks| 2.23.11 @ 9:09PM

For once you are absolutely on-target. Ban the Bush family from politics, and the younger Bush males can sleep with women as private sector oilmen and baseball team owners.

Alan Brooks| 2.23.11 @ 10:07PM

Please pay attention to me, I'm so lonely, locked in basement all day until mom comes home.

Alan Brooks| 2.23.11 @ 11:27PM

Clint, at least I had a mom- you were raised by your father the colonel. But, please, just tell me why Jeb Bush is mentioned AT ALL in the piece- why Ferrara would allow a photo of Jeb heading a piece on WI? Bush is Florida, that is what he knows.
Pleae answer that.

Clint| 2.24.11 @ 3:12AM

Brooks is seeing Clint behind every "Bush".

I got $1000.00 that says that wasn't my post Brooks.

Some Poseur punked ya again & is now laughing at you again.

Mark Shepler| 2.23.11 @ 7:34AM

"What is at stake in Wisconsin is whether public servants work for the people, or whether the people work to serve a government bureaucrat aristocracy."

This is precisely what I've been saying all along or, to paraphrase Ronald Regan in his "Time to Choose" speech, are we a nation with a government or government with a nation?

Another impression I cannot shake watching these chanting goons and thugs is that we've reached that point were the government itself, as embodied in its personnel, has become self-aware and self-conscious of its self-interest. It has started awake, like a Frankenstein monster, slipped it bonds and is now on the rampage in blind fury.

We, the people, must master and reduce the legions of "public servants" lest we become their slaves instead.

blackwatch| 2.23.11 @ 11:25PM

reminds one of the trouble in Greece.

when it comes here I'll aim to please.

BackToBasics| 2.24.11 @ 2:26AM

from your post - Another impression I cannot shake watching these chanting goons and thugs is...

I have watched a few videos of the union protesters. Maybe I have not see enough of them to be correct in my opinion here but I do not see very much passion, or maybe I could better paraphrase it as not seeing righteous indignation by the protesters.

It seems like there is no passion and because there is no cause for it and they know it.

Yes, I've seen a few angry spoiled brats in their mix. America has no shortage of those. But righteous indignation en masse, no. Many of the protesters were rather quiet and many were rather smartly dressed. After all, they can afford good clothes with the good taxpayer-supported wages they are making.

Curly Smith| 2.23.11 @ 7:41AM

This is really just a squabble between two unions. The Tax Payer Union met in November and collectively decided to decertify the Tax Payee Union. Understandably, the leadership of the Tax Payee Union is upset over losing power, prestige and prime parking spots but the larger union has spoken. It is rather sad to see the Tax Payee Union demonstrate such disdain for collective rights but it's not surprising as those were prime parking spots.

Patrick| 2.23.11 @ 7:46AM

As for the AWOL WI Democrats running away from their responsibilities, I have a suggestion. Given that they are fugitives from the law, hire a bounty hunter and drag one or two of the AWOL Demos back to WI in cuffs. Just sayin'.

Shirley| 2.24.11 @ 5:06AM

Awesome idea. Just wish someone would implement it.

figusja| 2.23.11 @ 7:47AM

I followed the article until I got to the last paragraph. All retire millionaires? Not possible. All working families make 100k a year? NOT POSSIBLE. If everyone was a millionaire then money would mean nothing. Sorry but there will always be poor and rich.

I wish it were so but it is reality. That is why socialism does not work. If the harder workers have to give to the not so hard workers to make everything even then the Harder workers will slow down to not expend all that energy to be wasted.

I know for a fact it is that way in the Navy. The harder you work the more work you get. The more you do the more collateral duties you receive.

Some people actually many people live in a fantasy land since the 60's and it is coming to a head very soon. (BOHICA or FUBAR) Those in the military will know what these acronyms mean. God Bless

Indiana Alex| 2.23.11 @ 10:00AM

Not so fast. Everyone could retire a millionare in today's dollars, meaning indexed for inflation and not monetized.

It would take a massive transfer of wealth from government to individuals, but if many of the economicly bankrupt programs of liberals (i.e. social security and medicare) were privitized, with individuals allowed to keep thier own property, everyone WHO WORKS would retire "rich".

Of course this is the liberals worst nightmare. With nobody dependent on government, they would be gone.

Impeach Don't Wait| 2.23.11 @ 9:48PM

"The harder you work the more work you get. The more you do the more collateral duties you receive."

Sounds like my job.

Stephanie| 2.23.11 @ 8:14AM

I saw an article this morning that that beast Trumka is in contact with the White House on a daily basis. I guess he's getting his marching orders from the community-organizer-in-chief and I bet the DOJ is trying to come up with some "law" to make that nasty Republican governor see things the unions way.

Mimi| 2.23.11 @ 8:16AM

Peter Ferrara....WOW !! You just solved the problem of Wisconsin! Brilliant!...you simplified as swift as an eraser. Recall the wayward Senators..Bingo! Then threaten the unions with bankruptsy and stand their carcass in front of a JUDGE with a FAT ERASER and tell them what left-overs they will get!
Thanks for telling us about a way out of this MESS....You sure know how to solve PROBLEMS.
Message to Whitehouse...Get TRUMKA on the phone..." We might have a BIG PROBLEM "

Timothy L. Pennell| 2.23.11 @ 9:19AM

You don't like Peter's idea? I'll give you mine.
FIRE THEM ALL. Reagan fired ALL of the Air Traffic Controllers and the world didn't end.
You don't like that? Then just FIRE as many as you can.
And, ya know what, Mimi? That WILL solve the problem.

Mimi| 2.23.11 @ 9:38AM

Tim...Loved Peters plan...He always gives us HOPE...Did you take it the opposit of how I meant it? There should be NO unions for Public workers!

Ken (Old Texican)| 2.23.11 @ 8:22AM

Peter,
thank you. In so many words, you reminded us that in the US, bankruptcy is in fact a hyphenated word... "bankruptcy-protection"... a means of starting over after a personal catastrophy... without going to debtor's prison.

Bob K.| 2.23.11 @ 8:25AM

Walker is doing a pretty good job now!

As for Jeb Bush and Newt; they should start their own "Think Tank" and publicize their ideas from there instead of looking for someone to shill them and their presidential ambitions on a variety of political blogs and TV news shows.

MikeD| 2.23.11 @ 12:51PM

Newt lost me forever when he played cozy with algore and admitted that glo-bull warming might be real. (It is NOT.) Every member of the Bush family, including Laura, lost me when they started listening to mama and let their liberalism show. Mama Bush is an unrepenitant liberal, and she collected the gonads from each adult male who decided to run for office. George the 1st, George the 2nd, now Jeb, are all ball-less eunichs who have lost any respect I ever had for them. I worked incredibly hard to get them elected, and I regretted it since the first day of GW's second term. That was the day he handed mama his spheroids.

BackToBasics| 2.24.11 @ 2:01AM

Yes, so much for the supposed brilliance of Gingrich when he joined Gore on that one. He's overrated, just like Rove was. I never trusted Rove and am glad he seems to have mostly dropped out of the picture after attacking Christine McDonnell when she won the Repub primary in Deleaware in 2010. He showed his true colors that day.

BackToBasics| 2.24.11 @ 1:57AM

Walker's looking pretty tough. Good to see. I sure hope he prevails. Already, I think I am seeing that I could support him for a presidential run, but I doubt he's even considering it.

Jeb Bush will never get my vote. I'll write in a vote like I did in 2008. Obam is terrible but he is slowly waking up the right and I exepcted as much when I didn't vote for McCain in 2008.

It would surprise me if a Dem election official crossed off my write in vote on the ballots we used in 2008 in our state, initialed the crossed-out vote and wrote in Obam's name. But they can do the same for a Repub vote too so it would not change my doing a write-in again if Bush should ever get the nomination. Like many others here, I'm through with RINOs.

BackToBasics| 2.24.11 @ 2:05AM

typo - It"" wouldn't"" surprise me if a Dem elction official....

Donna| 2.23.11 @ 8:40AM

Very strategic and tactical plan you outlined for states wishing to achieve voter goals. It’s nice to know as a voter (Georgia) there are ways through this mess that will keep integrity at the forefront of action.
Thank you, you’re very smart and just gave me a reason to be optimistic in very troubled times.

terrie| 2.23.11 @ 6:08PM

From a WI res. Gov Walker is doing the right thing for our state. I disagree with the proposal to allow states to declare bankruptcy. The state sends reps to the US Congress. Congress approves the judges. The judges approve the states bailouts? We're back to another conflict of interest here. If a state can declare bankruptcy, they should immediately be required to pull all US Congressmen/Senators out of DC and they cannot send any federal reps back until they are free of all financial obligations. I can see California doing bankruptcy repeatedly, at all other tax-payers expense simply because there is no reason not to.

Timothy L. Pennell| 2.23.11 @ 9:05AM

I'm sorry, but, what did the LEFT'S one true God - LBJ - have to say about UNIONIZING Public Employees? We are seeing what he was talking about, right before our eyes. If even the GOD OF LIBERALISM was against these Unions, then they must be BAD.
Think about it. The Department Of EDUCATION says that 2/3 of the Eight Grade STUDENTS of all these TEACHERS in the MOB in Madison, cannot READ at an 8th Grade Level. Obama's Dept. Of Education.
They can't teach them to READ, and they think that it's all right to LIE and Call In SICK. They Shut Down the Schools. And they bring the KIDS to the Protest.
I say, LAY OFF the ones that you planned to lay off, and then Lay Off 100 more.
And find a way to JAIL these Democrat Senator's, the second they step foot back in Wisconsin.
WE WON! Remember?

Timothy L. Pennell| 2.23.11 @ 9:15AM

I'm sorry. In all my DISGUST at what has become of my Country since the Marxist Muslim Coke Head has taken power, I got FDR and LBJ, mixed up.
Our Country is being DESTROYED on purpose, by a Man with NO TIES to this Country.
Born to a Muslim Marxist and an Atheist Communist. Raised in FOREIGN LANDS. Attending Muslim Schools. Learning to HATE the JEWS. Being taught DEATH TO AMERICA. Praying to a God of BLOOD and DEATH and MISERY.
I wrote two years ago, that this man would preside over a world on FIRE. That this "WEAK HORSE" would be the GREEN LIGHT, for EVIL to make it's move.
I cut lawns for a living, and I SAW THIS COMING!
Mark my words. It's only just begun.
SIC SEMPER TYRANNUS!

vtwin| 2.23.11 @ 9:52AM

“I cut lawns for a living.” Thanks for that insight it explains a lot.

dc| 2.23.11 @ 10:01AM

Wow, great rebuttal. Please advise, are there any other small businesses or types of work that you, our self-styled ruling elite, judge to be beneath you, and thus, those persons in such occupations simply not entitled to discuss facts or express opinions in public?
You useless, prickless little totalitarian...your "insight" consists of whining when the people's elected representatives are doing the jobs they were sent to Wisconsin, Indiana, Ohio to do. Your side lost, the people of these states won, and if you'd like the take the fight "hot" instead of work legally and electorally through the system, you'll not only lose worse, you'll be dead, ground up for animal feed by those who cut lawns for a living. Be thankful we're not quite there (yet), instead of snarkily bitching when you petty totalitarians get an electoral smackdown.

V8| 2.23.11 @ 10:05AM

Ahh, typical liberal thinking. You equate his job with his intelligence and his logic. You didn't refute his facts, just attack him because he is willing to do physical labor. Something I am sure, you are not familiar with.

vtwin| 2.23.11 @ 11:22AM

“You [vtwin] equate his job with his intelligence and his logic” –V8

Yes, I do my tomato juice drinking friend but my insight wasn’t into to his “intelligence [or] his logic” but rather his behavior on the job. You see the man that does my landscape maintenance when not running one of his noise contraptions listen to right wing-nut radio. And, I’ve noticed over the years that people listen to this garbage all day are well… less informed.

jothepro| 2.23.11 @ 11:27AM

If you don't like what he listens to then fire his ass. That would be the liberal thing to do.

vtwin| 2.23.11 @ 12:04PM

As a liberal when we say live and let live we mean live and let live.

Steve A| 2.23.11 @ 1:48PM

Liberals are fine with live & let live as long as they get to live with one hand in someone elses pocket.

vtwin| 2.23.11 @ 2:03PM

"Taxes are the price we pay for civilization." -- Oliver Wendell Holmes, Jr.

Clint| 2.23.11 @ 4:18PM

Ronald Reagan:
“Governments don't reduce deficits by raising taxes on the people; governments reduce deficits by controlling spending and stimulating new wealth.”

vtwin| 2.23.11 @ 4:29PM

“Governments don't reduce deficits by raising taxes on the people; governments reduce deficits by controlling spending and stimulating new wealth.” –Clint quoting Ronald Reagan

Clint, Reagan more than tripled the national debt.

Clint| 2.24.11 @ 3:25AM

The latest posting from the Treasury Department shows the National Debt has increased over $2 trillion since President Obama took office.

The debt now stands at $12.6 trillion. On the day Mr. Obama took office it was $10.6 trillion.

> Ronald Reagan’s First Term – $656 billion increase

> Ronald Reagan’s Second Term – $1.036 trillion increase

terrie| 2.23.11 @ 6:15PM

Huh? Vtwin you just insulted a man who makes a living (not on the taxpayers back) because of his chosen profession. You claim you allow "live and let live" yet you discriminate against people based on whether they are a landscaper? I can only be led to believe you also base your opinion of peoples ability to dance or play ball based on their skin tone. If they like NASCAR, they must be from the south eh? And only the really 'smart' people are white and went to Ivy league schools? And you libs have the balls to call conservatives prejudiced. Geez

blackwatch| 2.23.11 @ 11:32PM

live and let live--unless its an unborn little girl and you don't want to be bothered with her--just get the "doctor" to murder her quick.

Live and let live---what fucking douche bag liberal thing to say.

Al Adab| 2.23.11 @ 11:35AM

Don't be so condescending vtwin. Have you ever read Eric Hoffer? He was just a longshoreman/laborer. Don't judge a book by its' cover.
And gang, "Don't feed the trools"

V8| 2.23.11 @ 11:50AM

Once again your logic is flawed my Kool-aid drinking friend. You are again calling someone that does manual labor ignorant under the liberal polite term of "Less Informed". Perhaps those that work with their hands and earn their money with their sweat are simply more conservative than you. Just because they are informed with views you dislike does not make them "Less informed", just informed with a different view.

vtwin| 2.23.11 @ 12:00PM

Again, it's wing-nut radio not the his job.

ncatty| 2.23.11 @ 4:52PM

Nice try, but the mask slipped with the put-down of the guy who does your lawn.

JmsA| 2.23.11 @ 11:53AM

Less informed than say someone like you, who not too long ago claimed that Medicare and Social Security projections were actually business statements not projections based on actuarial, that is statistical analysis though the government links you provided were actually titled "Actuarial Publications." Is that the kind of less informed you're talking about?

MikeD| 2.23.11 @ 1:00PM

JMSA,
Remember that our little troll vtwin sits at home all day listening to lawn mowers. That tells us that he doesn't work for a living. He's probably some lazy teenager who's supported by mommie; or some incompetent moron who'e too stupid to get a paying job. Or, maybe he's in jail and he's angry because some other inmate behaved well enough to get a radio and wants to be informed. At least he's entertaining. No real human could be that consistently stupid and not sprout leaves and flowers.

(Since I know he'll come back with some really sharp riposte, to pre-empt him, I'll admit I'm a gainfully self employed individual who is ceertainly old enough to retire, but I keep working so I can continue to support morons like vtwin in the manner they've become accustomed to. They're not expensive; just a little 'weed 'n feed' and they're good to go.

Sid Vicious| 2.23.11 @ 12:21PM

So! Because your gardener behaves in this way on the job, you automatically assume Timothy does as well merely because of his political views?

You say you can't help but "notice" the lumpenproletariat tend to share a taste for what you call "garbage"? Gosh, those sure are keen powers of observation, far beyond those of mortal men! Why not start saving Metropolis right this very minute, Superman?

There's a name for people like you:

Bigot.

Maybe even worse than Archie Bunker himself.

Timothy L. Pennell| 2.23.11 @ 12:55PM

I wanna tell ya. I really appreciate all of you who had my back, but it's not really necessary. He's nothing. He's a Cliche'. A caricature of the self appointed Liberal Elite. You notice he doesn't tell us what HE does. That's because he probably works in some Poofy Coffee Shop, serving Crepes and Pecans to get the money for a new Che T-Shirt, and have his little Goatee braided with beads.
I'm an AIR FORCE VET. I'm a Married, Father of two boys, with MY OWN BUSINESS. I've got an I.Q. of 148. And I LOVE what I do. I CHOOSE it.
It's people like vtwin, who look in the mirror and see NOTHING look back at them. A LOSER with no accomplishments. Nothing to show that he even exists. So he lashes out. Calls people names. He seeks to build himself up, by PRETENDING that he has worth.
But his own words give him away.
So, thanks again. But I never really needed it. He's NOTHING.
And he knows it.

Commoner| 2.23.11 @ 2:49PM

Ok, vtwin said something offensive, but let's not overeact here. This is starting to look like a HuffPo string.

Anthony| 2.23.11 @ 10:06AM

The days of reckoning are finally here. No longer can hack pols keep kicking the can down the road and hope the dodo doesn't hit the fan on their watch. That's why Obozo and the union thugs are all in on this one. This is the final battle!!!
"The People" have been the only ones not at the bargaining table these many decades when contract after contract ran past the private sector's ability to pay. And the pols kept taxing to feed the beast and their political lives.
We are partially responsible for this as well, after all, we kept electing these whores, but for the most part, times were good and we just shook our heads and mused to ourselves and warned that today would finally come, and it has.
When the collapse came, it came quickly, as historical events such as these are wont to do.
Washington is the last battle ground. The hacks there have only been saved from what is happening amoung the states because they have the printing presses. But the presses now just print worthless paper.
I keep thinking about W's tepid attempt at S.S. reform and remembering Pelosi and Reid marching and standing at the FDR memorial as they demagoged reform to its death.
But Nov. 2010 came, and the long awaited assault is on!!
The final memorial in Washington to leftist Democrats who created this mess, these many decades, will not be as pretty as FDR's. There won't be one for the RINOs who helped create this mess.
Yes Obozo, WE are indeed the one's we've been waiting for!!!! at long last!!!

BackToBasics| 2.24.11 @ 2:35AM

from your post - "The hacks there have only been saved from what is happening amoung the states because they have the printing presses. But the presses now just print worthless paper."

But WHEN the dollar loses its' reserve currency status things will slide downhill for our economy even moreso and in a hurry. That'll make Obam a happy man in the short run.

fallgold| 2.23.11 @ 10:16AM

Regarding the missing senators, I like the idea of just declaring their seats vacant. That should get their attention. Try it.

Bob| 2.23.11 @ 10:34AM

I support a Bush/Chavez ticket. Hugo or Caesar it doesn't matter.

vtwin| 2.23.11 @ 10:39AM

“State and local government workers are mobbing the capitol in Wisconsin because newly elected Governor Scott Walker's bill to close the state's $3.6 billion budget deficit would require them to pay 5.8% of their pension costs, and 12.6% of their health insurance costs.”

Wrong, government workers and their unions have already accepted the Governors’ wage concessions. Wisconsinians are protesting Governor Scott Walker plans to deny State and local government workers their right to collectively organize and to collectively bargain as members of a union.

No, because the Democratic Party has traditionally supported middle/working class Americans and because unions have traditionally supported Democratic candidates running for public office this Republican Governor is trying to destroy unions which will result in further erosion of the middle class.

George S| 2.23.11 @ 10:51AM

What 'middle class' private sector job does one get paid 80 grand a year plus -- plus -- unlimited medical insurance coverage worth over 24 grand a year and a lifetime pension at 75% of all that? And have the summers off. The only one that comes close is auto workers in the UAW. But when GM couldn't confiscate property taxes to pay retirees, they were on the brink of bankruptcy. Enter Obama to take over GM just to save the pensions.

If you really want to stop the erosion of the middle class, you could start by having property taxes terminate when you start collecting social security. Sound good to you?

JP| 2.23.11 @ 11:05AM

"..Wrong, government workers and their unions have already accepted the Governors’ wage concessions..."

No they did not. A few Democrats in the House and State Senate did, but the Dems as a whole refused to back even Walker's modest concessions. Nice try at spin.

If the truant Dems persist and get thier way, over 6000 Wisconsin state employees (the number will surely go up over time) will be terminated. Walker's plan keeps everyone's job and doesn't reduce thier salaries. We aren't talking furloughs, but permanent reductions in force (or "rifts" as we used to call them).

Tell me, who do you think will get the blame?

vtwin| 2.23.11 @ 11:46AM

“In Wisconsin, union leaders have agreed to GOP Gov. Scott Walker's proposal to increase contributions to their health and retirement plans to help close a projected $3.6 billion budget hole over the 2011-13 budget cycle. The move would cut the take-home pay of many union workers by about 7 percent.” – SF Chronicle

“The unions will accept all of the fiscal aspects of Walker's bill: Henceforth members will pay 5.8 percent of their salary toward their pensions and 12.6 percent of their health-care premiums, up substantially in both areas. All they ask in return is that Walker and the legislature not gut their collective bargaining rights” –Washington Post

STOP WATCHING FOX “NEWS!”

V8| 2.23.11 @ 11:55AM

Once again. Collective bargaining is part of how they got the wage/benifits they have now. If you do not limit that then you are not fixing the problem, simply kicking the can down the road. Private Union collective bargaining is a different matter since they can run the business out of business. Not so with a Public Union as the state never goes out of business, they simply raise the taxes. If a public sector employee (or what used to be known as a civil servant) does not like what the state pays they can always try the private sector.

And really, your going to disparage fox news but link to a liberal rag like the SF chronicle??

vtwin| 2.23.11 @ 12:28PM

V8 our argument between to be:

V8, believes teacher are overpaid the result of collective barging and this is the primary cause of the deficit in Wisconsin.

vtwin: believes teacher are underpaid and the case of the deficit in Wisconsin is primarily the result of economic downturn.

V8, do you “cut lawns for a living to?”

V8| 2.23.11 @ 12:34PM

Actually I am retired military, work for a fortune 500 company and deal with goverment officials all the time. I cut lawns for recreation as the noise drowns out liberal whiners and I enjoy working with my hands. And please tell me how $80,000 a year plus benifits is underpaid?

vtwin| 2.23.11 @ 1:29PM

Thanks for your service.

The salaries and benefits of four Wisconsin Teachers each with a minimum of 4 years of collage:

Lechleiter-Luke $54,928 in salary and $32,213 in benefits

Brad Lutes: $49,412 in salary and $27,987 in benefits and his wife
Heather Lutes makes $50,240 with $9,413 in benefits

Chris Fons; $58,976 in salary with $25,646 in benefits

http://dailycaller.com/2011/02.....etting-on/

You don’t need to explain your occupation it was meant as a good natured joke.

jothepro| 2.23.11 @ 12:39PM

vtwin,
YEA,WATCH CNN YOU DUMB ASS

Bydand76| 2.23.11 @ 12:50PM

Hey Vtwin idiot.

For starters, know what you are talking about before you open your mouth and reaffirm to everyone just exactly how big of a moron you really are.

The Unions have NOT agreed to the cuts in the pay and benefits. The politician Flee Bagger (right back at ya pal!!) Democrats have said that the Unions would agree to it, not that they have.

Secondly, Govenor Walker has said that the CBA would only be limited to wages and that is it. Not that the CBA is going to be taken away completly

So coming from somone who actually lives in Wisconsin maybe you should shut your ignorant little mouth and go back to watching Ed suckface Shultzy and Rachael Madcow.

The unions have lost and since the Democrats are continuing to be a no show Mary they really do not have a leg to stand on.

Since you are so worried about the middle class why don't you come up here and pay my property taxes since you are so concerned about it.

I would really like to hear what you do for work V twin. Since you like to make fun of people. Why dont you tell everyoone what you do?

PRO LIBERTATE!

jothepro| 2.23.11 @ 11:35AM

Public sector unions should be destroyed. They bargain the peoples money away through higher taxes which in turn causes less people to be able to afford to run businesses which in turn causes less people to be able to work in the private sector which in turn causes government to raise more money through taxation which.....................

JmsA| 2.23.11 @ 11:55AM

Hey nitwit, did you hear? Two thirds of Wisconsin's 8th graders can't read. I guess those teachers who claim they're doing it for the children aren't doing that much, wouldn't you say?

Ghastlyone| 2.23.11 @ 2:47PM

Please give an example of how the Democratic Party has traditionally supported middle/working class Americans. It's ok, take your time on this one. Since you don't know history very well, you can use Obama and the current crop of leftist fucksticks running the country as an example.

And please explain for all of us Vtwin exactly "why" tax payer funded public sector employees need a union?

terrie| 2.23.11 @ 6:19PM

WRONG Vtwin. The Dem senators fled the state like felons before the issue even came up. It was only when the thugs realized the public thinks they are morons that they 'agreed' to the concessions. Hell, there's never even been any discussion with them about the matter, so there's nothing they can "agree" to. The Democrat party supports those who support it, not the "middle/working class". And FYI you dolt, 87% of the private sector "middle/working class" are NOT members of a union. To the dems, in WI, us folks can all go to hell, I guess.

martin j smith| 2.23.11 @ 10:41AM

vtwin-troll--are we in an economic crisis or not ? If you say yes( this is the right answer btw ) then how can you justify offering salaries and goodies to Government workers that taxpers cannot afford ?
Ig that Gallop poll asked the question: Do you know who is paying for the salaries and goodies for the teaches of Wisconsinsay, I wonder how many would you the answer ( the correct asnwer is YOU THE TAX PAYER )that is if the person questioned has a job. And if they do not and are unemployment --guess what--their tax dollars are still being used to pay these salaries and goodies--then how do you feel about them apples ?
When it is clear that it is taxpayer who is footing the bill and one looks at the behavior of these goons-you would not get the Gallop result.

Now that we see how much the Government Unions care about our nations economic plight I have to say they scare me
And considering firemen,police and TSA employees unionized--those responsible for our security-now it scares me because i would not trust them--whose side are they on ?

vtwin| 2.23.11 @ 1:49PM

“Are we in an economic crisis or not?”
Yes, my point to V8.

“This is the right answer btw.”

Damn, I got it right!!!!!

“Then how can you justify offering salaries and goodies to Government workers that taxpayers cannot afford?”

You don’t you bargain with the union; ask for cuts or face layoffs.

DEIN| 2.23.11 @ 10:48AM

vtwit-Explain to us regular folks what"cutting lawns"should mean to "us".I know several people in the lawn business who are real businessmen and women ,and have quite lucrative incomes.Tell me ,what kind of "job" must a person have to be able to receive consideration from you to express an opinion.By the way ,I'm a union retiree[private sector] and I agree that there are very few,if any at all,needs for public sector unions.I hope I qualify for your listening consideration.

Yosemeti Sam| 2.23.11 @ 10:56AM

Allegory:

Planet of the Apes:

Cornelius: [reading from the sacred scrolls of the apes] Beware the beast Man, for he is the Devil's pawn. Alone among God's primates, he kills for sport or lust or greed. Yea, he will murder his brother to possess his brother's land. Let him not breed in great numbers, for he will make a desert of his home and yours. Shun him; drive him back into his jungle lair, for he is the harbinger of death.

Yo, Unions - get thee behind US.

Al Adab| 2.23.11 @ 11:37AM

Nice one Sam, it proves that indeed there is a quote for every contingency.

martin j smith| 2.23.11 @ 11:00AM

Another thing related to my post above: It is time to take the class warfare matter and throw it back into the union and Democrat Socialists face especially when it comes to the " middle class" --no vtwin--the issue is power pure and simple. When --the purpose of collective bargaining really in the case of Government Unions is to squeeze the taxpayer and most of them are not the soc called "rich". For it is the average voter who pays.
I am not buying your line for a number of reasons: if things were so straight forward then why did the Socialists run away ? If there job is to advocate for the Government Unions let them put their arguments to the public and let the voters in the end decide. Lets have an open debate about the role and function of Government Unions.
The fact that we are in an economic crisis in my view brings out the true nature of the Union of Government and Unions. Is it not the case that when unions do not like what they get they go on strike ? I have seen transit strikes and sanitation strikes and teacher strikes. No I am not buying the line of the Union is making "concessions". If that were the case then with the Socialists in their proper house of whatever it is in Wisconsin--they could talk to the average voter of that state, make their case and let the public decide who they support. By avoiding that role the Socialists are showing a different side--they are playing games and I strongly suspect the voters for the most part do not buy it !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

JP| 2.23.11 @ 11:07AM

Nice plan. Try implementing it. Congress as it is now constituted would turn a sensible plan like that into one monstorous boondoggle that in the end will shaft everyone but the unions and the Dems.

borninsocal| 2.23.11 @ 2:50PM

Exactly. Look what happened with the bankruptcies of GM and Chrysler. Obama got involved and the judges ignored the law and did Obama's bidding. All the bond holders got hosed. That is why state bankruptcy is incredibly stupid. It opens a legal door where Socialist Democrat political crooks will rush in and screw over the taxpayer with the help of the judges they appointed through the years.

Rmm| 2.23.11 @ 11:09AM

As a dues paying union member myself, is it too much to ask that these folks in Wisconsin chip in toward their own retirement and health plan ? We certainly do. They are acting like spoiled babies. Wah-Wah! Thru their union reps who negotiated these squishy deals, their snouts have been in the public trough long enough.

StarbucksDave| 2.23.11 @ 11:14AM

The Wisconsin impass is easily solved. One Republican needs to publicly switch parties and become a Democrat. Now the quorum problem is taken care and the bill can be passed with bipartisan support.

Bobertp| 2.23.11 @ 12:30PM

Not to nitpick, but the quorum issue is about the total number of senators present. Their part affiliation is irrelevant. If the Assembly had 20 Republicans they would have the necessary quorum.

Bobertp| 2.23.11 @ 12:39PM

Excuse me. The "Senate" needs 20 to have a quorum. Wisconsin's Assembly is analogous to the House of Representatives. Also, the Assembly has no such quorum rule. Perhaps the Senate needs to revise their rules a bit.

Dave| 2.23.11 @ 2:40PM

As I understand it, the rule is that AT LEAST ONE member from the opposition party must be present in order to vote on this particular type of legislation. Not the same thing as body count.

Bobertp| 2.27.11 @ 3:42PM

From Wisconsin Senate Rule 15: "A majority of the membership presently serving must be present to constitute a quorum"; so we're talking about the number of members, not who is present from each party. This pertains to normal business. For fiscal bills however (which this vote is) the rules state that "3/5 quorum of members elected required". Again, no mention of party affiliation. The Wisonsin Senate consists of 33 members, so the 3/5 quorum would be 20 members.

Anthony| 2.23.11 @ 11:41AM

The trolls are whistling past the grave yard because they refuse to see.
Things are not going to go well for "The One" and the left on this one. It's too late and the money is ALL gone. Yet our Ivy League wonderkind Marxist demagogue insists on his two front war, where he and his labor pals are squeezing more and more from the private sector, while at the same time, Obozo is shutting down much of the private sector, which means no hope of increased ecomomic activity to staunch the bleeding.
Add to this our disastrous foreign policy and our weakness abroad.
The man with his Kenyan father's dreams has indeed come to destroy. He just didn't count on our fighting back.

martin j smith| 2.23.11 @ 11:57AM

Trumka visits the White House 2-3x per week--calls daily and talks to ? Obama--Obama states he supports the Unions. The Unions supported Obama in the 08 election etc.
So, why if I am not a Democrat should I support an organization--a Union that invariably supports a Political Party that is against my interests ?
Thus there is a conflict of interest between
citizens and Union and Government. Union and Government become one and the same. That is why I agree that Unions in Government Service should not be permitted. Conflict of interest between the Union and citizens.

Pat| 2.23.11 @ 12:04PM

States are currently destitute or are rapidly going broke paying off their government unions with yearly increases in wages, bennies and pension funding. The unions response – “So what?” – if you, the State, don’t have the money, then get our money from the taxpayers. In Wisconsin, Indiana and Ohio, the GOP is “at war” with the unions according to the media. Across the country, in state after state, the treasury is desperately scraping the peanut butter jar for the last teaspoon of tax money but the media carefully avoids asking its readers “how did things ever come to this?”.

From the voters’ viewpoint, their newly elected “fiscally conservative” governors and legislators are suggesting a suicidal banzai charge directly into the teeth of the government employees’ lines – our public servants and brave defenders of the status quo – employees who are loading their guns with canister shot and waiting the command to fire. The voters’ previously elected Democratic legislators are sneaking off into the sheltering jungle, frightened of both their angry constituents and their angry public service unions.

America, what a country! Our elected employees are a constant source of disappointment – irresponsible with our money, cowardly when it comes to putting their careers on the line, greedy, self-absorbed and unprincipled. They’ve become experts at pushing our governmental organizations right to the edge of the cliff and then gallantly offering to save us frustrated taxpayers from toppling off. From our perspective, distant in time and place, the French Revolution was an ugly, horrifying period, filled with violence and emotional excess – but maybe we’re beginning to understand how the average Frenchman viewed his arrogant rulers after being told: “Let them eat cake”.

Oldefarte| 2.23.11 @ 12:09PM

Peter, your editorial is OUTSTANDING, BRILLIANT, CONCISE, THOROUGH, ACCURATE, AND TRUE! Thank you, sir for writing same. I would only mildly disagree with your statements regarding the supposed investment banks being a PROBLEM in this issue [granted some are, but not all]. If these [and by inference, ALL BANKS] are attacked thus, a financial crisis could result, which could domino into a national bankruptcy/collapse!!!!!!!!!!!!

Big Jim| 2.23.11 @ 2:01PM

Bankruptcy is not the answer. That just lets the politicians off the hook. We need a law that bans any federal bailouts of the states. Then they'll be forced to do what Gov. Walker is doing right now, ie. reduce or eliminate the public sector union's power.

Turn Your Backs| 2.23.11 @ 2:04PM

Unions are 100% to blame for our economic situation. Not the Billions we give to numerous countries in foreign aid or the general public voting on, and approving, bill after bill, year after year. Its Unions! Cancel the witch hunt, we've found the witch.

Bank Ruptures| 2.23.11 @ 2:25PM

De jure always plays catch up with de facto.

America had de jure slavery, in the old South, and freedom in the North, for African Americans. We fought a civil war that fortuitously enabled Lincoln to free the slaves, and produce de jure freedom for all.

Still, Jim Crow saw to it that, de facto, the South remained semi-slavery-like, until the civil rights movement in the 1960’s. Ever since, de facto has bled into de jure.

In 2011 America, bankruptcy is DE FACTO, for the federal government and many states, and we are finally seeing the law recognizing this. Hello DE JURE!

So, what the author writes about allowing states to LEGALLY go bankrupt only recognizes the actual situation wrt our financial condition.

One way or another, demography rules.

Actually, it is quite amazing that BANKRUPTCY in political AND economic terms is sweeping the globe.

What else can one say about the Middle East, especially, except that it is morally and otherwise bankrupt?

Any group of people, from the smallest local band of “brothers and sisters”, to the biggest nation state, ALWAYS gets the government they deserve. If a critically large enough percentage of them don’t like the status quo, they can put their bodies on the line, and it’s do or die time---hello revolution!

Well, clarity is crystallizing everywhere, as the truth spreads via the ubiquitous media so cheaply available.

Here’s one simple fact that’s all one needs to predict the future of Egypt, and most probably all changing countries with populations made up of Muslims---

91% of the women in the land of the pharaohs have suffered, DE JURE, genital mutilation!

Projecting forward from that GROSS congruence of de jure and de facto must lead to a near term future of the rule of Islamic demography.

Teach your children well, as the old hippy refrain went.

And, there’s definitely one thing Islam does WELL---“teach” their children.

We all know that a huge percentage of Islamic populations are very young, so---

Watch the WELL-TAUGHT children, as they assume their demographic RULE!

weissrw| 2.23.11 @ 9:08PM

Territorial Status? As set out in the article the idea of states undergoing bankruptcy reorganizations seems to make sense in terms of protecting creditors in order of priority. Yet it lacks a sense of overall justice. What about knocking bankrupt states back to territorial status until they get their finances back in order? How nice it would be to send a bunch of Senators and Representatives home from DC?

Nite| 2.23.11 @ 9:16PM

Republicans and Gov. Walker need to play hardball. The cowardly Dems think that the rent a-mobs will intimidate and prevent the state's business from being carried out. The Dems need to be shown that there is a consequence for their actions of not doing their jobs.

Impeach Don't Wait| 2.23.11 @ 9:20PM

"Federal, state, or even local governments cannot be driven out of business."

Ummm. Look again. Well, not driven out of business, just driven to bankruptcy?

The children have had their fun. The adults are taking over.

DaveS| 2.23.11 @ 10:09PM

On what principle of governance do the fleeing elected Democrats base their emigration to Illinois?

blackwatch| 2.23.11 @ 11:42PM

obama, trumpka, WI dim Senate--hope you are enjoying your "Bay of Pigs" moment!

Marc Jeric| 2.24.11 @ 12:02AM

There is an immutable law regarding unions: given time every union will fall into the hands of either the Mafia or the communists (same thing in the effect produced). Private industry had a remedy before bankruptcy - outsourcing; government employees unions are not subject to that remedy. Therefore we are left with only two choices: 1) states should declare bankruptcy and wipe out all union contracts forever; or 2) states should sue the unions under RICO laws as being criminal conspiracies against the people.

Vic| 2.24.11 @ 1:11AM

Collective bargaining rights for giverment employees=the ability to steal from the taxpayer via confiscated money peddled to corrupt politicians by the union mafia.

You will capitulate and pay up or we will show our ass right out in public. How well will business be then? We will call you nasty names and lie about what you say. We may even hurt people and break things. You have been warned!

Jack in Wi.| 2.24.11 @ 6:35AM

The people here are in a vast majority in support of our governor. He is conducting himself like a real gentleman.

Roy| 2.24.11 @ 12:59PM

"the annual cost of family health coverage is $26,844"

$26,844!! Isn't that, by itself, enough to show the destructiveness of the union? Normal people's health care costs less than half that.

Of course, this health plan is bought from...THE UNION! Anybody see a conflict of interest there?

ONTIME| 2.24.11 @ 3:23PM

In a Constitutional Republic which I support to the hilt, this government union represents everything I abhore, my military stint in Nam was specifically aimed at whacking as many communist as i could get in my sights and now, here in my own country, the basterds are be are marching in my streets, being paid by my tax money that is used to buy them more politicians and being paid more than those in the private sector who oppose their very being.

Communist are proven failures world wide and this power grab by this bunch of unworthy sluggs who want to tell us they are just like everyone else had better take a good look at where they are. We are not going to allow this nonsense to go on, we are not going become a third world country like they want where the elites rule the roost, the czars and commisars are on their way out and so is that idiot who isn't qualified to shine shoes in the White House... so long Deemers, America Rising.

S&WM;&P| 2.24.11 @ 5:18PM

I was told the other day that the least number of teacher protesters showed up in Madtown, WI on President's Day--Monday. Let's see, that would have been a natural day for teachers to show up and demonstrate as they had a day off! But no, they turn out in big numbers on the days they were to be in a classroom teaching. Just about right for a public servant I'd say. Never miss a day off.

S&WM;&P| 2.24.11 @ 5:22PM

Also, did you read or hear of the attempt to phone "punk" our Gov. Walker? Can't "punk" and honest man! Way to go Scott! That's why I voted for you! What you say in public is what you state in private.

Reebok | 8.11.11 @ 2:55AM

is good