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At Large
Why Israel Worries About a Post-Mubarak Egypt
Thirty-three years of cold peace was better than four wars over a quarter century.
No country finds itself at greater unease with the developments in Egypt than Israel, and for good reason.
It isn’t that Israel opposes the genuine democratic aspirations of the Egyptian people. If a new government in a post-Mubarak Egypt clearly stated it planned to maintain peaceful relations with the Jewish State, there would be no problem. But when Israel purportedly gave its blessing for the Egyptian military to mobilize in Sinai, you know it’s very worried. Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu called these developments a “tremendous threat.”
Let us not forget that there was a time not so long ago when Egypt was Israel’s arch enemy. In Israel’s first quarter century as a state it fought four wars with Egypt. The sight of Menachem Begin and Anwar Sadat shaking hands along with Jimmy Carter was surely as inconceivable as the fall of the Berlin Wall. Egypt would be expelled from the Arab League for its rapprochement with Israel and Sadat would pay for peace with his life. Who in 1978 could have imagined that Israel and Egypt would be at peace with each other longer than they had been adversaries?
Now I certainly don’t want to convey the impression Israel and Egypt are bosom buddies — far from it. When I visited Israel during the summer of 1988, Egypt was a frequent topic of discussion as the tenth anniversary of Begin and Sadat’s handshake was forthcoming. The consensus was, “Israel and Egypt are at peace. But it’s a cold peace.”
Over the years, the Mubarak regime has tolerated anti-Semitic sentiment as when Egyptian state television broadcast a 41-part mini-series on The Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion throughout Egypt and the Arab world in 2002. In May 2008, Farouk Hosny, who has served as Egypt’s Minister of Culture since 1987, said he “would burn Israeli books in Egyptian libraries.” These comments would later cost Hosni his opportunity to become Director-General of the United Nations Educational Scientific and Cultural Organization (UNESCO). When Hosny came up short in his bid he blamed his loss on “a group of the world’s Jews.” Earlier this month, Abdallah Al-Ash’al, a former Egyptian Deputy Foreign Minister, blamed Mossad for inciting December’s Alexandria church bombing.
Yet for all the public hostility in Egypt towards the Jewish State and Jews in general, Mubarak has steadfastly maintained peace with Israel. Indeed, the two nations have common security interests. While much of the world was busy condemning Israel for its blockade of Gaza, Egypt was also blockading the Hamas run territory. It may be a cold peace but it’s still peace.
Now there is no denying that Hosni Mubarak has governed Egypt in an autocratic, dictatorial manner and has only himself to blame for the current state of affairs. Yet for all his faults and shortcomings, Mubarak is the devil Israel (and for that matter the United States) knows. Of course, Mubarak is 82 years old and will not stay in power forever. But there is every reason to believe that if Mubarak loses his grip on power it will not bode well for Israel.
It appears that both secular and Muslim opposition forces are coalescing around Mohammed ElBaradei, the former head of the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA). In his capacity with the IAEA, ElBaradei became known for his kid glove treatment of Iran. In fact, in a joint press conference with Iran’s then Atomic Energy Agency chief Ali Akbar Salehi (who is now Foreign Minister) in October 2009, ElBaradei said, “Israel is the number one threat to the Middle East.” In April 2010, ElBaradei expressed his support for “Palestinian resistance.” This is nothing more than parlance for acts of terrorism.
Of course, there are the likes of Stephen Walt, the noted anti-Israel academic, who naturally downplays the adverse consequences of a sudden change of government in Egypt for Israel:
For starters, a post-Mubarak government is unlikely to tear up the Egyptian-Israeli peace treaty, because such a move would put it immediately at odds with the United States and Europe and bring Cairo few tangible benefits. Although ordinary Egyptians do feel strong sympathy for the Palestinians, the primary concern of those now marching in the streets is domestic affairs, not foreign policy.
I am not sure what makes Walt think a post-Mubarak Egypt,
especially one where the Muslim Brotherhood plays a role, will give
a damn about what the Obama Administration or the EU might think of
its actions any more than Iran does. Besides, what happens if a new
regime in Egypt, whether led by ElBaradei or someone else, cannot
redress the primary concerns of those now marching in the streets
any better than Mubarak? By Walt’s own admission, ordinary
Egyptians do feel strong sympathy for the Palestinians. Should a
new Egyptian government be unable to address the domestic concerns
of it populace, what card is it likely to play? Well, Muhammad
Ghannem, a leading spokesperson
for the Muslim Brotherhood in the U.K., says
the people of Egypt “should be prepared for war against
Israel.”
This, of course, would be Israel’s worst nightmare. Now some might argue that Egypt is no match for Israel militarily. But Israelis are more likely to remember the IDF being unable to defeat Hezbollah in Lebanon less than five years ago than they are to remember the triumph of the Six Day War. The prospect of another war with Egypt is complicated considerably by a regime in Iran (along with its surrogates in Syria and Lebanon) bent on Israel’s annihilation. And what if the kind of protests we’re seeing in Egypt spread to Jordan in any meaningful way? The Muslim world could very well do to Israel what it was unable to do in 1967.
About the Author
Aaron Goldstein writes from Boston, Massachusetts.
Letter to the Editor View all comments (95) | Leave a comment
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YOU SAID WHAT?| 2.2.11 @ 6:39AM
"In Israel's first quarter century as a state it fought four wars with Egypt."
Yeah, in '56 it sneak attacked Egypt, seizing the Suez Canal. In '67 it sneak attacked again..all Pearl Harbor like. Perhaps some ill will followed.
Herb| 2.2.11 @ 7:25AM
Yeah, and in '73 Egypt sneak attacked Israel.
Every suicide bombing on civilians is a sneak attack. Qasam rockets are sneak attacks.
So what's your point?
vtwin| 2.2.11 @ 10:27AM
Israel’s military is a little too busy killing Palestinian children, 1,457 Palestinian children since September 2000, to “sneak attack” Egypt again.
http://www.rememberthesechildr.....r2010.html
Ken (Old Texican)| 2.2.11 @ 10:50AM
Vtwin,
You sir are a liar. Further, you are a digrace to the human race.
Uh, what you wrote...and linked...is blood libel.
vtwin| 2.2.11 @ 11:21AM
May 9, 2010
Hamza Samar Muhanna abu-Maria, 7 months, of Beit Omar, Near Hebron, died of IDF tear gas inhalation May 7 while in her home during a demonstration.
http://www.salem-news.com/arti.....weekly.php
Never happen huh? Tell it to her mother!
VBMax| 2.2.11 @ 11:55AM
Anyone who supports the taquiya talking Muslim death cult over a free and democratic nation tells me everything I need to know.
John| 2.2.11 @ 12:51PM
The ethnic cleansing of the palestianians ( both muslims & Christians) which is still going on - see the massive expansion of settlements in the west bank, is one of the greatest crimes against humanity of 20th & 21st centuary. Mark my words those who have contributed even one dollar to this crime will stand trial in the international court of justice for their crime. As the revolution takes off against tyrants and their supporters in the ME- the Palestinian will see an end to their suffering against those who believe in using fairy tales to murde people. The day is coming soon when Jews Muslims Christians will live happily together in Palestine. Isreal must stop all it's wrongdoing and hand over those responsible for crimes against Palestinians to imternational court. If America wants to live up to its best ideals it must immediately use it's army to escort 6 million Palestinian refugees home in Israel . If it does that it has chance of lasting fteindship with all the people of ME. if it continues support the most evil tyrants In ME then it will finished in this region. America is at a cross roads it can shape its identity for a new better future for its people and those In ME. May god bless America to make the right choice. History will not wait.
W| 2.2.11 @ 1:13PM
John, another translation from the Arabic, is there some radical muslim website you cut and paste these comments?
John| 2.2.11 @ 1:44PM
W
I print only the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth. Open your eyes. I know many people have a fantatical hatred for Muslims, but what about your fellow Palestinian Christians living in the refugee camps . You should help them and not cause them further suffering. I offer a wholesome vision of all the religions in isreal/ Palestine
living together buy you guys spew only hate. May god help to change your hearts . And may god protect the palestinians & Arabs from your evil intention.
Tom| 2.2.11 @ 2:01PM
John,
Are you also for the US military escorting Jews and Christians back to lands they were thrown out of?
John| 2.2.11 @ 3:43PM
Im in favour anyone ethnically cleansed to return to their homeland -this is international law. Bur those who force people from their lands based on fairy tales that is not acceptable.
Occam's Tool| 2.2.11 @ 5:46PM
So, where do the 800,000 Jews from Arab countries forced off their land in 1948 go? And their descendants?
W| 2.2.11 @ 2:03PM
John, you did not answer the question, from what radical muslim website do you paste and copy? Or do you not consider them as radical muslim, but only the truth as you see it. I assume you are a muslim and in possession of the truth, correct?
John| 2.2.11 @ 4:00PM
I believe that international relations should be based on respect. Not on occupation or supporting tyrants. I also see that Islamic countries and America will be the best and closest allies once America withdraws all it's occupation forces in ME and stops supporting these murdering tryantsa then respect and very good relations can begin .
Ken (Old Texican)| 2.2.11 @ 6:36PM
Hey John,
How about you quit whining and man up?
You Muslims outnumber the Israelis about a thousand to one...and they whip your ass every time you try to murder them. Poor you.
Remember the Alamo, folks. Remember the Alamo!
KyMouse| 2.3.11 @ 9:55AM
"Ethnic cleansing," John?
You must be referring to the fact that Jews were forced to leave their homes in Gaza. The Nazi policy of "judenrein" is alive and well in today's Gaza and other Arab-controlled areas.
In contrast, one in five Israelis is Arab.
And a recent survey by Harvard University found that 77 percent -- almost 8 out of 10 -- of Israel's Arab citizens would rather live in the Jewish state than in any other country in the world.
Steve A| 2.2.11 @ 11:18AM
Hey vtwin,
Would a parade of gay bikers celebrating gay pride day make it further on the Gaza Strip or in Israel??
blackknights1802| 2.2.11 @ 8:14AM
Please get your facts straight. Egypt had maintained its state of belligerency with Israel after an armistice agreement was signed in 1949. Egypt collaborated with Syria and Jordan and coordinated the infiltration of Fedayeen terrorists into Israel to commit acts of sabotage and murder for six years. Then in 1956 Egyptian president Gamal Abdel Nasser nationalized the Suez Canal and blocked all Israeli shipping. Hardly a sneak attack. Egypt knew exactly what to expect. What they didn’t expect was to get their ass kicked from a part time army.
Tom| 2.2.11 @ 8:43AM
Um, maybe not so much. Egypt closed the Canal to Israeli shipping, closed the Straits of Tiran and the Gulf of Aqaba. If the attack by Israel was a sneak attack it is only because of the gross incompetence of Egyptian leaders.
In 1967 the Israeli attack was in response to Egypt evicting UN border monitors and the massing of Egyptian forces on the Israeli border. Once again this was no way a sneak attack. It was the direct response to events and the results were easily predictible. If Egypt got caught napping it wasbecause of its incompetence.
RCV| 2.2.11 @ 3:09PM
The usual distorted charges against Israel. Yes, Israel attacked first in 1967, but only after Nasser repeatedly announced that he was preparing war against Israel and began moving troops in place for that purpose. They would have been foolish to wait for the attack.
The Egyptian wise enough to see that Egypt's blood was being shed for other's folly was Anwar Sadat, who paid the ultimate price for his clear-headed vision. God rest his soul.
W| 2.2.11 @ 3:46PM
RCV, the anti-Israel charges are coming from your fellow lefty liberals such as vtwin,john, etc., the same bunch that routinely and exclusivey criticize the USA as the cause of all the world's problems. Why can't or won't American Jews, predominantly left-liberal, see the anti-Israeli and anti-Semitism of the left, and call them to account for it?
Alan Brooks| 2.2.11 @ 4:14PM
I like Israel, because of its scientific capability and treatment of women.
But it MIGHT have to be moved out of the region someday, it is heavily outnumbered; its enemies could move on it right now, but they are biding their time-- and we can see why in Egypt that is the case.
One wants to be optimistic, but only if optimism is justified; unfortunately at this time optimism is not justified. Optimism that is not justified is baseless optimism.
coal carrier| 2.2.11 @ 7:15AM
I can see the anti-Jews will be out in full force after this article. It will not be long before the Ten Horned Beast will show up.
Alan Brooks| 2.2.11 @ 4:23PM
"the Ten Horned Beast will show up."
Ten horns supposedly representing ten nations of Europe? Hal Lindsey wrote that. It sounds like white-trash eschatology, but maybe not-- we will find out soon enough. The main thing is to prevent the bloodshed inside Egypt from spreading outside. Then move on from there, hopefully.
Too bad Tim* isn't around these days, we could tell him to blame that IDF lady, Golda Meir and that Israeli Firster, Ben Gurion: even though they are dead they still control the media!
Who woulda thunk it?
Alan Brooks| 2.2.11 @ 4:28PM
Cause everbody KNOWs them thar Jews control the media, uh uh, uh uh.
Emmett Tyrrell must be a closet Jew.
And the publisher of that nashionul re-view magazine, William S. Bucklee... isn't he a Jew too?
Clint| 2.2.11 @ 5:00PM
Ha,Ha,Ha,Ha !
ObamaBoy Brooks pretends he's a friend of Israel by kneeling to The Chicago Messiah.
Alan Brooks| 2.2.11 @ 5:37PM
Clint,
You feel GUILT for having voted for Bush;
Bush made us safer in the short run, but more at risk in the long run.
It made sense what Bush did at the time, early in the last decade; it was low-hanging fruit to attack Iraq-- but now we have to deal with whomever rules Egypt post-Mubarak.
Clint| 2.2.11 @ 6:33PM
Speakin' of A Low Hanging Fruit, Brooks Is In The Building.
Apparently, Algore & Kerry woulda made ObamaBoy Brooks proud.
Occam's Tool| 2.2.11 @ 5:47PM
Tim* is Clint, Alan. Still around, damn.
Beautiful comments, RCV.
Clint| 2.2.11 @ 6:19PM
Occum is Still a Tool, double damn.
Ugly ObamaBoy comrades,Tool Job.
Ken (Old Texican)| 2.2.11 @ 6:39PM
Clint,
I always enjoy your creative "neener neener neeners".
You and Alan have gotten to be our best comic relief here.
Please, drop in often.
Clint| 2.2.11 @ 8:41PM
Kenny The Squirrel,
I observe your boring ad nauseum bloviating.
You and Alan are American Spectator's Top Attention Craving Buffoon.
Please, drop dead soon.
Thank Yewwwww Kenny The Squirrel.
PJ| 2.2.11 @ 8:17AM
It must be horrible living in Israel where it seems like every other week some country or organization wants to go to war with it. I bet the people are tired of the war mongering rhetoric. They are probably collectively thinking, "Been there, heard that, I have to get back to work. "
That said, if Israel is attacked, I am confident it will be able to successfully defend itself. The people may not remember the Six Day War & vividly remember not being able "to defeat Hezbollah in Lebanon less than five years ago", but they certainly retain in their DNA, images of the Holocaust!
Ken (Old Texican)| 2.2.11 @ 9:02AM
Israel will not be surprised again. They damn near lost their whole country and their lives along with it in the Yom Kippur war.
Today...and tomorrow...Israel knows their back is to the wall, politically and militarily.
The Labanon incursion was a limited exercise to merely strengthen their border against terrorists! Not a war at all.
They pretty much secured their (limited) objectives, though the media portrayed it as a defeat....much like the TET offensive in Viet Nam was portrayed.
This go around, the Israelis may very well be forced to go nuclear, and in a big way.
I had an opportunity to chat off the record with a retired Israeli Air Force Colonel shortly after the Yom Kippur war......fascinating!
A formation of F-4 Phantoms was sent up the Nile valley to merely drop Israeli flags on the Aswan dam. They were successful.
It was a warning....a dire warning.
Today, some 70% of the Egyptian population lives under the "sword of damocles"...(the Aswan dam)
Pull out your atlases and study a bit. If the dam were to be breached, say by a nuke...the Nile valley would become a death trap...for a huge percentage of their population...all the way to the Med.
Sadat was smart enough to realize that.
YOU SAID WHAT?| 2.2.11 @ 9:27AM
Israel's '56 attack was at the behest of England and France, who cooked up a scheme to retake the canal. They were going to "rescue" the canal from Israel..only they weren't going to leave.
My uncle was shot down over the canal in "56, in his Westland Wyvern, by AA fire. He went on to become an admiral, Royal Navy. He knew the real storyline, and told me.
My brother-in-law, Canadian 6th Signals, was peacekeeping in the Sinai, June '67. All the signalmen listened and recorded the battlefield communications. He knows what rubbish the official press concocted about the sneak attack, and so do I.
Steve A| 2.2.11 @ 9:32AM
I have a question that has been on my mind for some time. I am going to make some sweeping generalizations & I do realize that things are not quite this simple, but for the sake of argument & simplicity, here I go.
Why is it that it appears the vast majority of the American Jewish population seemingly backs Liberal / Progressive Politics?? I, for the life of me, am unable to comprehend this. Do Progressive politicians offer & proclaim a path to a more traditional, conservatice lifestyle, both morally & financially?? No. Do Progressive politicians project as stronger ally of Israel?? Quite the contrary. In my opinion,, Progressives attempt to undermine Israel at every opportunity. I do not get it. Someone please explain.
VBMax| 2.2.11 @ 10:29AM
They are progressives first and foremost, Jews not so much.
ShortNSweet| 2.2.11 @ 3:25PM
I spent 3 weeks in Israel in 2009. I think what I learned there may shed light on the answers...maybe. Israelis are A-religious. They know that we Christians came to their country to see and feel the steps of Jesus, His life and His ministry, and they see it as a way of prosperity. Our tour guide was born and raised in Jerusalem. Her grandfather is buried on the Mt. of Olives, and ironically, she came to the US to learn Christianity, so that she could be a tour guide in the Holy Land. Every single one that I met, had no religion, and the tour guide explained this to us clearly. Their moral standards are not conservative, nor are they set by the standards of the mosiac law.
They stand upon their biblical right to the "promised land", and yet have no personal connection to God or that bible which afforded them that right. Ironic!!! NEVERTHELESS, it is their land given to them by the God of heaven, and He can and will protect them until the ends of the earth,..It is God's place to judge them. God will curse them that curse His people, and bless them that bless His people. So all who would mount up against them, should clearly use both hands to hang on to their britches!
KyMouse| 2.3.11 @ 9:28AM
Ezekiel's "dry bones" vision in chapter 37, verse 8, reveals that God would bring His Jewish people back to their land some day, but their "bones" would have no "breath" in them at first -- the breath being the Holy Spirit.
God promises in verse 14 that He will "put My Spirit in you, and you shall live, and I shall place you in your own land: then you shall know that I the Lord have spoken it, and performed it..."
And the rest of the world will know it, too -- God always keeps His promises.
ShortNSweet| 2.3.11 @ 9:25PM
KyMouses...Agreed. God intended for them to be the priests of the world as the priests were in the Old Testament. They WILL be the priest, but it will probably be during the tribulation....
Occam's Tool| 2.2.11 @ 3:27PM
Because 75% of my co-religionists outside of Israel have all of the survival squills of a retarded tree squirrel.
Occam's Tool| 2.2.11 @ 3:27PM
sorry, "skills"
Old Soldier| 2.2.11 @ 4:52PM
They don't call them self-hating Jews for nothing.
BackToBasics| 2.2.11 @ 11:09PM
I have had the same question about the Jews would back Democrats when Dems are so weak on defending Israel these days. It is a mystery but on the surface level at any rate, Repubs represent more the Christian faith. As I said, on the suface it seems this way. Is there a bias against Christianity and Repubs by extension, on their part, knowingly or unknowingly? I do not know but the thought has occurred to me. Some may dismiss this out of hand and that is your right. But it is a mystery that goes to the ehart of self-perservation or suicide, depending onhow you look at it. Religious reasons also go to the heart of life, self-perservation vs. suicide etc., so I think it is a valid question. And a question that I hope I am wrong about. But few other reasons fit in with such life-and-death choices as to what politicians you entrust the help of Israels' survival to. It may be unwitting on the personal level of each individual Jew but the New Testament intimates that such problems would occur with Israel and Jews in general because they rejected Jesus as the Messiah.
KyMouse| 2.3.11 @ 9:41AM
BackToBasics, more and more Jewish people are reading the New Testament for themselves and learning about the most famous and beloved Jew who ever lived. They've included composer Felix Mendelssohn, who wrote the music for "Hark, the Herald Angels Sing"); British Prime Minister Benjamin Disraeli; astronomer William Herschel, who discovered the planet Uranus; Jay Sekulow (top guy at the American Center for Law and Justice); and the late Vera Schlamm, M.D., a pediatrician who survived the Bergen-Belsen death camp.
You can read about those "Jews for Jesus" and others at www.jewsforjesus.org.
Ken (Old Texican)| 2.2.11 @ 9:46AM
Steve A
I'll direct you to read their own words. Go to some of the Jewish org websites. It will boggle your mind.
Steve A| 2.2.11 @ 10:15AM
Ken, I did so & you are correct. I suppose it boils down to this for all true Liberals:
Liberal first, all else secondary. Liberalism trumps religion, family, tradition, anything. Any weapon can be used to further the cause. Lies, deceit, false accusations of racism, all for "the greater good." It's sick.
Maxwell| 2.2.11 @ 12:19PM
Steve A, let me be very blunt. As a minority Tribe member that clings to his guns (AR's, 45ACP and my wonderful bolt AI MKII) and Bible and life member of the NRA I can attest that most members of the Tribe identify with Liberalism and not the Jewish religion. If they got their heads out of their backside, it would be a totally different story and the story would not be Demo-rats either!! As Mike Savage has said liberalism is a mental disease. The men I ride with got me a t-shirt that states, pro life, pro gun, Christian, heterosexual, any questions? I wear it proudly.
I don't post as much as Ken (Old Texican) but I do love his comments.
YOU SAID WHAT?| 2.2.11 @ 9:51AM
Progressives don't NECESSARILY want to take the oilfields of the midddle east from their rightful owners. Israel was always meant to be America's Gibraltar; an unsinkable aircraft carrier/gas station for aggressor aircraft.
Hope that helps, Steve A.
Occam's Tool| 2.2.11 @ 3:29PM
Yeah, that's why US military aid to Israel didn't really start until, oh, say, 1970.
Steve A| 2.2.11 @ 10:00AM
If The Bushe's & Co. intended to "take the oilfields of the middle east from their rightful owners," they sure did a shabby job. I just paid almost $4.00 / gal for diesel & last time I checked we do not control the fields in Kuwait, Iraq, Saudi Arabia or any such thing. If we wanted to flex our muscle, we would OWN ALL OF THIS in about 3 days.
vtwin| 2.2.11 @ 10:43AM
Have you been in a coma for the last ten years?
Steve A| 2.2.11 @ 10:50AM
vtwin, Wow, what a zinger. Your wit never ceases to amaze.
To answer your question, no, but I wish I could get put under a spell & forget the last 2.
Hey, has Obama returned the oil we confiscated back to the rightful owners??
Ken (Old Texican)| 2.2.11 @ 10:23AM
Nah, Steve A
It would take two weeks at least. (grin)
Steve A| 2.2.11 @ 10:34AM
Yeah, I suppose you are right. Schwarzkopf is retired now.
chris haynes| 2.2.11 @ 10:32AM
Why do need Mid-Eastern oil? We have 500 years worth in Rocky Mountain shale.
Paul Kotik| 2.2.11 @ 10:46AM
I'm puzzled by Goldstein's and others' notion that 30+ years of a cold peace were better than the preceding 25 years of hot war. As long as irredentist Islamism flourishes in the Arab and Muslim worlds, any cessation of hot war is nothing but a hudna - the Koran permits Islamic rulers to agree to cessation of combat with the infidel if it confers later tactical and strategic advantage to the Muslim forces. If , after Mubarak, that net effect of the 1979 Israel-Egypt treaty is to return Egypt - this time with an American-equipped and trained military - to leadership of the jihad against an Israel bereft of the Sinai buffer, then the treayt will have been a very, very much worse alternative to the situation that preceded it. The 1979 Yom Kippur war was dreadful for Israel, and exacted a high cost. That cost, however, may well come to appear trivial in comparision to the consequences of a 21st century war with Egypt in the mix.
Ken (Old Texican)| 2.2.11 @ 10:56AM
Paul, you are correct of course. (see my post above)
The problem is that our present administration will NOT take a stand.....
Occam's Tool| 2.2.11 @ 3:30PM
'73 Yom Kippur War. Israel views any situation in which Jewish blood does not flow as preferable.
YOU SAID WHAT?| 2.2.11 @ 10:57AM
Steve A, how long to take the oilfields in '48, and what would be Russia's response?
Look up the history of the TransArabia Pipeline; note its terminus.
Steve A| 2.2.11 @ 11:07AM
You Said, I have no idea what your question is. The TransArabian Pipeline is closed for business & as far as my history goes, I am unable to recall how we invaded Saudi Arabia or Lebanon to install & control it. Perhaps you can fill in the blanks for me.
YOU SAID WHAT?| 2.2.11 @ 11:18AM
Your reply sucks. You're an anklebiter. Any more blanks to be filled?
Of course, America could seize the oilfields..not the same as working them. And there's still the little matter of decent Americans who don't want to steal them.
Steve A| 2.2.11 @ 11:27AM
You Said, You have mental problems, pal.
Apparently, you agree with me that: A) we currently show restraint by not seizing. B) we have not done so in the past. C) nobody is suggesting we do so now.
So what in the hell are you even talking about? Never mind, you are a waste of time.
Louis Jenkins| 2.2.11 @ 11:35AM
Israel hangs in the balance, awaiting what will happen in Eygpt. Unless Mubarak has a strong man in the wings, and lots of voter fraud, his cold peace will be out the window. It behoves the Muslim Brotherhood that things get stirred up, and kept stirred. If the protests continue, we may expect the military to become more proactive. The military is stronger in Eygpt than has been displayed. Regardless of outcome, the folks in Israel sleep less soundly now that they are surrounded.
YOU SAID WHAT?| 2.2.11 @ 11:36AM
What was Desert Storm, then? Who financed the TAP? Why put the terminus in Haifa?
Give your head a shake.
Steve A| 2.2.11 @ 11:53AM
Did we keep Kuwait for ourselves? We financed it (American Corporations) & all benefited as I understand it. The terminus was never in Haifa. Look it up.
Even if it was, so what? We are talking about 194freaking7. Get over it.
What are you bitching about? The USA is EVIL?? What is your point?? Seriously.
Peter McGrath| 2.2.11 @ 12:03PM
Barry's little speech on Egypt last night was chalk full of the bromides one would expect from him, including calls for recognition of "basic human rights" including freedom of assembly, speech, freedom to access information, etc.
Notably MISSING was a call for freedom of religion. Why? A call for freedom of religion is treated as an insult by Islamic "leaders" (i.e., tyrants).
Consider the recent mass murders of Coptic Christians in Egypt and elsewhere. The Pope's call for tolerance and protection of religious minorities resulted in Egypt recalling its ambasador from the Vatican!
The Muslim Brotherhood (a fascist organization that supported Hitler) advocates imposition of Sharia law throughout Egypt and, for this reason, Barack's failure to demand freedom of worship totally negated his call for preservation of any other human "rights".
There can never be peace, in Egypt or anywhere, so long as moral invertebrates like Obama continue to legitimize vicious gangsters like the Muslim Brotherhood or, for that matter, the Mahdi Party in Iraq whose leader, Al-Sadr, should have been arrested upon his return to Iraq from Iran.
Eventually, it must become the policy of the United States to seek the overthrow any government which imposes totalitarian Sharia law upon its hapless citizens.
YOU SAID WHAT?| 2.2.11 @ 12:06PM
The War Party is evil, that's my point. Israel is the War Party's sharp stick, that's my point. The War Party is determined to garrison the Middle East, that's my point. The second Iraq invasion was never contemplated until the troops were expelled from Saudi Arabia, that's my point.l
Steve A| 2.2.11 @ 12:19PM
One thing is certain. You sir, are certainly no sharp stick.
W| 2.2.11 @ 2:05PM
What is the war party? who are its members? give us specifics
Ken (Old Texican)| 2.2.11 @ 12:46PM
Hey, Steve A
Just as a fun reminder...the thing that chapped Bin laden's butt the worst, was observing American WOMEN soldiers in t-shirts...covering Saudi's arse in Desert Storm.
He has never gotten over the disgrace of it. heh.
Steve A| 2.2.11 @ 12:59PM
Ken, Good point. Yes, the mighty Saudi Warrior class being defended by Julie from Tulsa, OK in a green T caused him to lose some sleep & question his outlook a bit. smile
Old Soldier| 2.2.11 @ 5:01PM
Funny thing is that all the Saudi soldiers I met were fine with it. It's the stick-up-thier-ass religious police and know-it-alls like Bin Laden who were outraged.
Ken (Old Texican)| 2.2.11 @ 1:07PM
Steve,
I'll swear. I don't know whether to encourage you to go ahead and buy part one of my present-day saga now...or to hold you off until the final whole is completed.
Oh well, your choice. Part one is at www.texassaidno.com as an e-book.
I'm trying to complete the story under a new cover: "America Alone Said NO!"
My twenty years as a CEO working in the middle east informs both stories.
W| 2.2.11 @ 2:12PM
It seems the mere mention of Israel brings out the anti-semitic and anti-israel beliefs of the lefty liberals, such as vtwin/john,etc. They never complain about the muslim terrorists of 9/11 (it is America's fault), or the genocide in the Sudan, or the countless terrorists attacks starting with the murder of Robert Kennedy by Sirhan Sirhan. Their compassion is reserved only for the Palestinians, never for American citizesn or Israelis. This is not compassion, it is only a pose for being anti-American and anti-Israel.
Old Soldier| 2.2.11 @ 5:05PM
If Israel wqas as bad as they claim, they would have expelled the Arabs living in Gaza and the West Bank long ago (the way the Soviets displaced Poles and Germans after WWII - just herd them onto the road and out of town) - or forced Jordan to take most of Gaza back after one of their wars.
If they had done this, they would have saved themselves a lot of trouble.
Oldefarte| 2.2.11 @ 2:54PM
I believe that this situation in Egypt has been initiated and fostered by Muslim extremists intent upon a takeover of that country. Correspondingly, other Muslim dominated Middle Eastern countries are likewise having citizen uprisings/protests, which I think is all coordinated. Surprisingly, this is now all occurring after our presidential election of 11/2/08, and some authorities have indicated a philosophical connection to our current administration. If ultimately all of these countries revolt into Islamic states, and same insurrection spreads to possibly European nations containing large Muslim populations, this would become catastrophic for the world!!!!!!!!
YOU SAID WHAT?| 2.2.11 @ 2:58PM
Deflection, Steve A. Iraq became the American garrison of choice in the ME when GIJoe was shown the door in S. Arabia. Want me to believe what you believe? Show me the satellite pics of the 200,000 shock troops and 1,500 tanks Saddam had amassed on the Saudi border. That's what Bush Sr. told his royal Saudi friends..that's what got him a garrison on Saudi soil.
Occam's Tool| 2.2.11 @ 3:31PM
I get confused---is Israel the sharp stick or Iraq? And what the hell does Israel have to do with the current Islamic unrest in Tunisia and Egypt? (Answer---nothing)
Old Soldier| 2.2.11 @ 5:07PM
I'll have to check my satellite photo album. Was this before or after Desert Storm?
axbucxdu| 2.3.11 @ 1:10PM
SirEd?
GENE HAUBER| 2.2.11 @ 4:35PM
ANY SELF-RESPECTING GOVERNMENT SHOULD START TOOLING UP TO CRUSH ANY ATTACK ON ISRAEL.
I WOULD HAVE SAID THAT WE, THE USA, SHOULD START TOOLING UP......, BUT I DON'T THINK OUR GOVERNMENT HAS ANY THING BUT CONCEIT AND CLOWNISH ARROGANCE AND DISLIKE FOR ISRAEL.
MAYBE IMPEACHMENT SHOULD BE CONSIDERED VERY SERIOUSLY THESE DAYS............
LOOK AROUND. WHAT ARE WE DOING BUT ENCOURAGING OUR ENEMIES AND PISSING OFF OUR GOOD FRIENDS.
Old Soldier| 2.2.11 @ 5:09PM
I think your caps lock key is stuck.
Occam's Tool| 2.2.11 @ 5:50PM
Old Soldier---the Caps key may be stuck for Mr. Hauber, but his brain is functioning perfectly fine. Lovely comment.
GENE HAUBER| 2.2.11 @ 10:28PM
I LEAVE IT STUCK, I'M HARD OF HEARING AND VERY OBSERVANT OF YOU TO NOTICE
YOU SAID WHAT?| 2.2.11 @ 6:17PM
Old Soldier, put your helmet on. The hockey helmet, for the bus.
The point is that there never was a threat to S. Arabia from Saddam. Bush Sr. put America on a track to 9/11 with his lies to his Saudi friends; no one has seen the satellite pics 'cuz they don't exist.
Old Soldier| 2.3.11 @ 4:42PM
Damn, I wish I had known that 20 years ago during the battles of Khafji and Um Hujul (back when I was a young Marine). I guess the Iraqis wandered into Suadi Arabia for a chat.
Alan Brooks| 2.2.11 @ 6:39PM
"Tim* is Clint, Alan. Still around, damn."
It took me until just an hour ago to figure that out, because now he has toned down his 'Israel laster' remarks all the way to the max. He is crafty, not really that dumb.
BTW, didn't mean to insult you by mentioning in another AS blog that in your parallel universe Gomer Pyle might be POTUS, but I was surprised
you didn't remember that Carter was in the Navy too. A wuss CAN be in the Navy as a pilot or an engineer. SEALS? no.
No wusses in the SEALS.
Clint| 2.2.11 @ 8:48PM
Brooks,The ObamaBoy Israel Firster is upset because We Tea Party American Firsters want American Oil Companies to Drill, Baby.Drill and Marginalize Middle East Agendas & Agendists.
Ken (Old Texican)| 2.2.11 @ 6:48PM
Hey What,
Sorry, we can't fix stupid here. Try another run at kindegarten.
FREE tea| 2.2.11 @ 11:05PM
---"The U.S. has one final task before its own
long-engineered collapse is finally concluded
(THINK Nixon/MAO onward) ---and that is
to 'bring in' the recalcitrant Middle East.
After, RED China will be rolled in and 'eugenics
realism' will begin in earnest..."
-Alan Watt
Cutting Through the Matrix
(catch it online)
------Any questions gentlemen?
Old Soldier| 2.3.11 @ 4:43PM
Uh... what?
العاب بنات | 4.11.12 @ 4:11PM
Please get your facts straight. Egypt had maintained its state of belligerency with Israel after an armistice agreement was signed in 1949. Egypt collaborated with Syria and Jordan and coordinated the infiltration of Fedayeen terrorists into Israel to commit acts of sabotage and murder for six years. Then in 1956 Egyptian president Gamal Abdel Nasser nationalized the Suez Canal and blocked all Israeli shipping. Hardly a sneak attack. Egypt knew exactly what to expect. What they didn’t expect was to get their ass kicked from a part time army.