The American Spectator : The Case Against Howard Zinn

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The Case Against Howard Zinn

By Robert Stacy McCain on 8.2.10 @ 6:08AM

FBI files show Stalinist past of the "people's history" author.

Howard Zinn was teaching a class, but he wasn't yet a professor and his classroom wasn't at a university. It was late 1951, and the students who gathered for Zinn's lessons in Brooklyn were his fellow members of the Communist Party USA.

One of Zinn's comrades described him as "a person with some authority" within the local CPUSA section and said that Zinn's class was on "basic Marxism," the theme being "that the basic teachings of Marx and Lenin were sound and should be adhered to by those present."

That description, furnished to the Federal Bureau of Investigation by a former Communist in 1957, is included in more than 400 pages of Zinn's FBI file made public last week.

The FBI files demonstrate beyond reasonable doubt that Zinn -- author of A People's History of the United States, widely used as a textbook or supplement in many of our nation's high schools and universities -- was a card-carrying Communist at a time when the Soviet Union was America's most dreaded enemy.

File No. 100-360217 was begun in March 1949 in response to an order from FBI director J. Edgar Hoover to Edward Scheidt, special agent in charge of the Bureau's New York office. Zinn's name had previously surfaced in connection with other FBI investigations of Communist Party activities, but a new report from an unnamed agent marked Zinn as a subject of special interest.

In 1948, an FBI confidential informant had spoken to Zinn at a protest in front of the White House and reported that, during the course of their conversation, "Zinn indicated that he is a member of the Communist Party and that he attends Party meetings five nights a week in Brooklyn." Zinn, who was then a 26-year-old Army Air Force veteran attending New York University, expressed to the informant his support for Henry Wallace's third-party "Progressive" presidential campaign, "indicating that the Communist Party was 100% behind this Movement," according to the FBI file.

Additional investigation showed that Zinn was active in several Communist-dominated "front groups," and that in 1947 Zinn was a delegate to a conference of the Joint Anti-Fascist Refugee Committee, which had been designated a subversive organization by the Attorney General pursuant to a 1947 executive order of President Truman. Furthermore, according to another informant, Zinn's Brooklyn address "appeared on a list of addressograph stencils at Communist Party Headquarters" in New York.

In response to this report, Hoover directed the New York office to develop a "Security Index" file on Zinn. Scheidt was "requested to conduct further investigation in an effort to obtain additional information concerning this subject's membership in the Communist Party or concerning his activities in behalf of the party," Hoover wrote on March 30, 1949. "Particular emphasis should be placed on obtaining admissible evidence."

Continuing investigation determined that in 1946, Zinn's wife had solicited petition signatures for the New York Communist Party, and that Zinn and his wife had both joined the International Workers Order, another designated subversive group. An FBI informant had reported in 1948 that "Howie Zinn was believed to be one of a group of individuals selected from the 6th [Assembly District], Kings County Communist Party as a fraternal delegate to the New York State Convention of the Communist Party."

No further agency action followed until November 1953, when two agents from the New York FBI office interviewed Zinn as part of the bureau's Security Informant Program and filed a detailed report: "Zinn stated that he was not now or was he ever a member of the [Communist Party]. He acknowledged that perhaps his activities in the past had opened him to charges that he was associated with the CP as a member; however, he was not…. He stated that he was a liberal and perhaps some people would consider him to be a 'leftist.'… According to Zinn, he was not ashamed of his past activities and did not believe that he or his activities constituted a threat to the security of this country or our government."

Zinn's denial of Communist Party membership during this interview (which the agents duly reported as having been conducted "between Fifth and Sixth Streets and Avenue D" in Manhattan) is problematic. Multiple informants had already identified Zinn as a CPUSA member, and he was involved in several different Communist front groups, as well as Communist-infiltrated groups such as the American Veterans Committee and the American Peace Mobilization. His address was reportedly on the mailing list at the party's headquarters, and he had helped lead a 1948 protest against the so-called Nixon-Mundt Bill which, eventually incorporated into the McCarran Act, required members of the Communist Party to register with the attorney general.

A few weeks later, in February 1954, FBI agents again interviewed Zinn, informing him that they "were giving him an opportunity to further discuss his former activity with certain subversive organizations." Whereas previously Zinn had flatly denied attending the New York Communist Party convention, in the second interview "he could not recall" attending, nor could he recall attending the 1947 Joint Anti-Fascist Refugee Committee conference. More to the point, Zinn "stated that under no circumstances would he testify or furnish information concerning the political opinions of others."

Zinn's non-cooperation duly noted, his FBI file remained fairly dormant for three years, as he completed his Ph.D. at Columbia University. But a report from the New York office in June 1957, in response to an inquiry from the bureau's Atlanta office (Zinn was then teaching at Atlanta's Spelman College), contained details indicating that Zinn's earlier denials were false.

The FBI's unnamed informant had joined the CPUSA in 1948 and remained a member for five years. The party was divided into "sections" and "branches" and the informant told the FBI that he had been transferred to the party's section in the Williamsburg neighborhood of Brooklyn in 1949.

"At that time, Howard Zinn was already a member of that section," the informant said in 1957, according to the report by FBI Special Agent Edward P. Grigalus. "Informant stated it was his impression that Zinn was not a new member, but had been in the CP for some time.… Informant stated he attended numerous section meetings with the subject between about 1949 and about the summer of 1953.… The meetings were held either at the section headquarters or at the home of one of the members. Informant recalled that some meetings were held at [Zinn's] home or at the home of one George Kirshner on Lafayette Street in Brooklyn."

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About the Author

Robert Stacy McCain is co-author (with Lynn Vincent) of Donkey Cons: Sex, Crime, and Corruption in the Democratic Party (Nelson Current). He blogs at The Other McCain.

Letter to the Editor View all comments (133) | Leave a comment

Howard| 8.2.10 @ 7:00AM

I'm a little confused about the article. I think that Zinn became more dangerous in later years with the popularity of his "Peoples History". This piece of leftist crap is widely taught in high schools throughout the country. This book presents a parallel universe where the USSR looks good and USA is a fascist state. We know that is a bunch of crap, but impressionable teens do not. I would have been pleased if he were chief of the US Communist Party, if he never wrote that book.

MicroGlyphics| 8.2.10 @ 1:07PM

I would suggest you are more than a little confused in general. You have clearly never read the "People's History of the United States." It is a history of the US not of the USSR.

Chairman Nobomba| 8.2.10 @ 2:17PM

Your leftists are all alike: yeah, it's a history of US, but written by an ingrate commie like Zinn who hated this country and adored all commie dictatorship countries. No one is more confused than you useful idoits.

gypsy| 8.2.10 @ 9:57PM

"The Peoples History" my ass: Howard Zinn doesn't represent the people, he only stands for himself and his wretched dog vomit "utopia". ALL socialism is evil, whether its "scientific" socialism, National Socialism, or just plain old Ben and Jerry's vanilla socialism. It is nothing but hate filled ranting against freedom and free people.

aware| 8.2.10 @ 7:00PM

Leftist revisionism. And designed as such by a Communist. That is the truth.

Howard| 8.3.10 @ 3:58PM

Perhaps you were reading a Russian language version. Here is a recap of Chapter 16 of the book:

Chapter 16, "A People's War?", covers World War II, opposition to the war, and the effects of the war on the people. Zinn, a veteran of the war himself, notes that "it was the most popular war the US ever fought,"[7] but states that this support may have been manufactured through the institutions of American society. He cites various instances of opposition to fighting (in some cases greater than those during WWI) as proof. Zinn also argues against the US's stated intentions to fight racism in Europe, as it was not fighting against systematic racism in the US such as the Jim Crow laws (leading to opposition to the war from African-Americans). Another argument made by Zinn is that the atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki were not necessary, as the US government had already known that the Japanese were considering surrender beforehand. Other subjects from WWII covered include Japanese American internment and the bombing of Dresden. The chapter continues into the Cold War. Here, Zinn reveals how the US government used the Cold War to increase control over the American people (for instance, eliminating such radical elements as the Communist Party) and at the same time create a state of permanent war, which allowed for the creation of the modern military-industrial complex. Zinn believes this was possible because both conservatives and liberals willingly worked together in often-hysterical anti-Communism. Also covered is the US's involvement in the Greek Civil War, the Korean War, Julius and Ethel Rosenberg, and the Marshall Plan.

In Response to the Confused| 8.3.10 @ 12:48AM

Please refute a single sourced fact included in the "People's History" with a primary source and then maybe I'll agree that Zinn's work is a piece of "leftist crap." Until then, I think you should stick to your own parallel universe.

Howard| 8.3.10 @ 4:00PM

I'll send you a copy for May Day. Take your blinders off.

In Response to the Confused| 8.5.10 @ 3:01AM

I'll be looking forward to it, that is if you can provide anything with merit. Or better yet, why don't you reply on this public forum...something to the effect of:

Howard Zinn stated "...."(source); but he was wrong because "...."(your source)

I hope you're creative because you won't find anything factual to reply with...if you do, I promise to take my blinders off

In Response to the Confused| 8.24.10 @ 5:34AM

@ Howard: It's been a while..couldn't find anything could you? I'll consider the matter closed - you people are all alike, quick to yell "commie" and point fingers, yet disappear when someone asks for anything more substantial...

Catherine| 10.7.10 @ 9:37AM

Zinn does not have footnotes or any primary sources listed in his book, only a sparse bibliography. Reading the book was painful - I was researching online every other page and looking up PRIMARY sources. There are outright lies, but it is mostly a book of conjecture and opinion on a misleading jumble of quotes and dates.

BMar| 8.4.10 @ 5:48PM

My girlfriend's father gave me a copy of "The People's History" for my 25th birthday. I was so excited to read it because I thought it would be the truth. I was astounded and laughing out loud. By the end of the book i was simply reading to get a good laugh at the moronic teachings of Howard Zinn. Needless to say I lost a lot of respect for my girlfriend's father.

Armen Melikian| 9.6.10 @ 11:19PM

Communism is an economic ideology and has nothing to do with nationality. You can be the best American and the best communist at the same time. Denying this right is indeed fascism.

Denis Mueller| 8.2.10 @ 7:36AM

Howard was a graduate student when he taught the class. The FBI information is filled with huge mistake. Zinn never had a sister. Yet the FBI says this info came from a credible source that they had used. I made a film about Howard and may I remind you people that he risked his life in WWII when he could have opted out. He fought against Jim Crow as other veterans did in the vet organization he blonged to. Hoover called anyone a communist who fought against Jim Crow laws. Buckley on the other hand called for the south to resist Brown vs, the Board. None of you risked your life like Zinn did especially the writer of this article.

alert1201| 8.2.10 @ 8:19AM

If he did serve in WWII it seems to not have affected his view of his country. In his history he makes no mention of the Normandy invasion (even fails to reference Gettysburg) but gives pages to the My Lai massacre and the bombing of Baghdad civilians in the first Iraq war.

He was a man who hated his country. Since you did a movie on him maybe you can verify this quote:
“I was a radical, believing that something fundamental was wrong with this country…something rotten at the root.”

Yea, sounds like an outstanding American to me.

Jacobite| 8.2.10 @ 2:45PM

America was never Howard Zinn's country. America is where un-hyphenated Americans live.

So what?| 8.5.10 @ 3:09AM

so to be an outstanding American you have to believe the country is perfect? as for his historic references, he's made it clear that he wanted to throw light upon events that are often ignored, so what's wrong if he gives pages to a massacre that most people haven't heard of? and what's wrong if he tells us that civilians were bombed in Iraq? If you have problems reading factual accounts, keep your sources restricted to the television news

Tom| 8.2.10 @ 8:20AM

Denis,
Is your contention Zinn was never a member of the CPUSA? I am unclear 0f your overall point. The fact he fought in WWII and protested Jim Crow laws hardly precludes membership in the CPUSA.
As far as whether anyone reading this article risked his or her life like Zinn did is both impossible to know and meaningless to the discussion on whether he was a CPUSA member.
Tom

Bydand76| 8.2.10 @ 10:03AM

" None of you risked your life like Zinn did especially the writer of this article."

You can go to hell Mr Mueller!

I served 3 tours overseas in the Infantry for my country!
2 in Iraq and 1 in Afghanistan!

Don't bother thanking me because I did not do it for the likes of you or people of your ilk! You say you dont love this country but you certainly enjoy the freedoms and liberties it affords you!

Well, you can take your pathetic little communist arse and get the hell out if you hate it so much!

No one is stopping you!

I really hope you meet a Vet like me ( hopefully a Ranger) and spout that garbage off to them. I would take great pleasure in the knowledge of having a soldiers fist rearrange your worthless, pathetic, douche-bag face!

You deserve nothing less!

Pro Libertate!

Adam| 8.2.10 @ 7:56PM

Irony of the day:

You know what you call the rule by military thugs such as yourself? Fascism.

You know what you call the democracy of all--(in the work place as well as the polling place)? Socialism.

Now, Mr. Army Ranger. Proceed to "beat my brains in." What does that make you?

HanniBarca| 8.2.10 @ 8:50PM

Adam, your comment to Bydand76 was dumb: no one wants to beat your brains in because there would be too much infected matter spraying all over the place. Instead, you leftist punk mutants are going to be bitch slapped by reality, especially when your "revolution" begins to eat the "useful idiots" that you all are.

Bydand76| 8.3.10 @ 7:33AM

Adam,

You clearly do not have the intelligence to comprehend any sort of discussion relevant to the topic on this thread.

For starters, how you managed to extrapolate that I am a proponent of "rule by military thugs" is beyond me? I can only assume that you wrote this nonsense while drinking copius amounts of kool-aid!

As to your second comment Mr. Adam. You are an idiot. Socialism is Socialism regardless of how you want to pretty it up. It is a disease that warrants a quick and sterile removal. Study some history there tough guy!

I, Mr Adam am nothing more than a man who cares about his country and its people. I firmly beleive in the Constitution and stand ready to defend it principles to the death!
I am a proud member of her warrior class and will not hesitate to defend YOUR rights as a citizen of this country, REGARDLESS!

YOU tell ME what that makes me?

Pro Libertate!

JmsA| 8.2.10 @ 10:59PM

Bydand76,

Thank you for your service.

Bydand76| 8.3.10 @ 8:29PM

Thank you Sir/Ma'am

God Bless You!

Pro Libertate!

godbless| 8.5.10 @ 3:20AM

Bydand76, I salute you for your courageous service fighting evil Iraqis and Afghans. And for your quick response to the socialist idiot, Adam. Kids in this country need to see that this great nation is fighting for democracy all over the world. Be it a communist or a muslim rule country - those people should be thankful that the American Military is crusading for Democracy!

NoCAGal| 8.3.10 @ 9:40PM

Bydand76 - I'll place my bet on you! Adam's arrogance is indigestible!

Big Leo| 8.2.10 @ 11:09AM

I certainly risked my life for my country and have the disability pension to prove it. Zinn was a Communist. He was a supporter of the evil little murderers I was sent to eliminate and provided aid and comfort to them while they were giving me my disability pension. I'm only sorry he was allowed to live as long as he did.

crookedwren| 8.2.10 @ 11:18AM

Whittaker Chambers really LIKED Alger Hiss, and Chambers loathed having to rat on him in order to expose the true threat to Freedom: Communism.

As Chambers knew, because he had been a Communist, COMMUNISM IS EVIL.

Zinn may have served in the military, but his Communist beliefs, his teaching of them, and his using his position to write a history of America that was indoctrinational in nature are -- in Chambers' views -- ACTS, criminal acts against the United States and its Constitution.

As a country, we've got to understand that Marxism didn't get crushed under the rubble of the Berlin Wall. Communism isn't dead.

That's something Chambers was a Witness to -- and the Battle that he foresaw is HERE. NOW.

Wake up, America, and stir yourselves, lest Liberty be completely lost for ages and ages to come.

warren leming| 8.2.10 @ 12:12PM

bravo denis,
oh the commies are coming
they come to sin
just like that naughty howard zinn
in a place like this
where rush limbaugh and fox news are considered
patriotic
you know you've landed mongst the idiotic

JS| 8.2.10 @ 1:41PM

Your last name is fitting, but you forgot the second M - you are a lemming.

Peter Pan| 8.2.10 @ 2:23PM

Are you saying Howard Zinn was an honorable war vet unlike just about all of the right-wing's so-called heroes like Dick Cheney, Rush Limbaugh, and the author of this article? Funny, how extremists around this website advocate government surveillance of citizens, except for gun-hoarding doctor killers.

Don't ask no tell| 8.2.10 @ 2:28PM

Denis Mueller, do you have a real job or you are a gov worker? Surely you are a dem. Would you like to live in the People's repub of China. Even the commie Chinese gov'mt is dropping the "People" label, it sounds bad.

ACynic | 8.2.10 @ 8:20PM

Let's be very clear as to why communists, like Zinn, would have fought in WWII.
Subsequent to the Hitler-Stalin Pact, Stalin ORDERED that the CPUSA agitate to keep the USA out of the war. This they did with many demonstrations in NYC. Only AFTER Hitler invaded Russia in May 1940, did Stalin order the CPUSA to begin agitating for the USA to enter the war against the Nazis.
If Hitler had never attacked Russia, Stalin would have maintained his stance that the CPUSA agitate to keep the USA out of the war. You can bet that your fellow Nazi /commie bolshevik SOB Zinn, NEVER would have joined up.
By the way, Stalin exterminated more Russians than were killed by Hitler's invading armies. And by the way, Hitler was a SOCIALIST, just like your good pal Zinn and Stalin and Kim Jong and all your other heros.

of course he served in ww2| 8.2.10 @ 8:24PM

it was a chance to kill nazis....the war in europe was at its root a war between nazis and communists....

i dont know but my guess is he wasnt killing japs....he was fighting for mother russia....

correct me if im wrong

Stop wasting your time| 8.5.10 @ 3:37AM

Mueller, I felt the urge to comment on the article as well...that is, until I read the author's bio. If you read it as well, you'll realise that this forum is certainly not the place to write anything informed or in the least bit intelligent without being called a "traitor" or "commie"...seems like the red scare propaganda still hasn't cooled down in the red states!

Mueller, Mueller, Mueller| 8.2.10 @ 8:03AM

Ferris Mueller. Skipping (brain) school again.

Deborah D| 8.2.10 @ 8:16AM

Haters of America teaching our children to hate America too. Not surprising Zinn went to Columbia (Obama did too) -- that's where the Communists holed up in the U.S. during the Nazi purge and set up their Frankfurt School. I'm sure that thinking still flourishes there.

Brigitte| 8.2.10 @ 8:21AM

Zinn's "history" book should not be used to teach American history. However, it could be taught to our kids as a good example of leftist propaganda to help them distinguish truth from fiction.

Doctor Right| 8.2.10 @ 8:35AM

Howard Zinn was a Communist??

REALLY???

(shock! outrage! indignation!)

What's most incredible about these types of stories (as Anne Coulter brilliantly exposed in "TREASON") is not so much that certain individuals were Communists, but how PERVASIVE that philosophy has entrenched itself in academic and government circles with absolute immunity.

Rather than continue to be criticized as a right-wing wacko, Joe McCarthy should be on the $10 bill, and have a national holiday. The left hated McCarthy because he was onto them, and because he was affective. One shudders to think what might have happened had men like McCarthy and Hoover not been around to raise a ruckus about how deeply Communist agents had infiltrated the federal government and society at large.

Denis Mueller| 8.2.10 @ 8:56AM

He was a bombardier and two of his best friends died in the war. Zinn did bombing missions over Europe on B-17’s. The causality rate was very high. They were close to fifty percent. These are facts. You can have your opinions but not your own facts. The FBI information is so bad that it is laughable. He had no sister although the FBI contends he did. The CP and other organizations (leftist) were the only organizations that fought against Jim Crows laws. This too is a fact. During the time period that one of the informants said that Dr. Zinn was going to meetings everyday he was getting his Ph.D. He took classes at night and meetings were at night. I guess he was in two places at once. I agree with basically everything Zinn says about America, and by the way, he loved our country, I do not.

Eric Cartman| 8.2.10 @ 9:07AM

Oh, look everybody! A card carrying Democrat! Probably works in the Obama administration at DHS. Should be easy to hunt down and take care of after " The Day" ;-)

edwin lownsley| 8.2.10 @ 12:19PM

hey man we be waitin for the day
so be a smarty
go and join the nazi party
wait; you are already in it
seig heil der fuhrer kommt nach dich
sie haben lange zeit gewartet

Eric Cartman| 8.2.10 @ 3:11PM

WOW! The NAZI shpil again? LOL Is that all you ass clowns on the Left have left? And "the Producers" gag line? Your car is running out of gas, boys. You're gunna lose and lose big. No one, and I mean no one but Liberal aholes from the East, care anymore what you say - get ready to kiss your Lefty dreams buh bye!

Dan Hirsch| 8.2.10 @ 7:46PM

Everyone! Everyone!

We have made a grievous, horrendous error. Denis Mueller is a VERY IMPORTANT FILM MAKER.

Lookee HERE:
http://firstrunfeatures.com/ellismueller.html

I think since we have all been too disrespectful of Filmaker Muller's great wisdom.

Maybe we should take up a collection and buy him a one way ticket to Canada or France.

So exactly how much capitalist profit have you made peddling hate America, pro communist movies to your fellow travelers? No wonder you're so angry at any callking Zinn the duped communist that he was.

Genius, when the Stalinists and Maoists took over, you were the first ones they went after because your kind of true believer holds to the naive notion that the whole idea is making life better for the 'workers,' not personal power and self-aggrandizement.

What a dope! What a sucker!

No, I didn't just call you names; I pointed out your errors and then identified your behavior as naive, simplistic, and gullible.

Please, be true to yourself; just leave.

Dan Hirsch| 8.2.10 @ 8:20PM

OKAY. Maybe Denis, you are not quite as important a film maker as I first thought.

Apparently your big movie with the more comely than cerebral Matt Damon narrating only grossed $120,250 in just 250 days, playing in as many as 4 theaters at once.

I guess failure would be an understandable cause for a deep hatred of capitalism. Except, you fell in love with Howard Zinn's politics 18 years earlier.

Good riddance.

Dan Hirsch| 8.2.10 @ 9:26AM

Denis;

Then why don't you just behave selfishly. Treat yourself better. Leave this awful country. You'll be happier and we'll be happier.

Show some spine, walk your talk. Or are you reluctant to leave all the niceties that our capitalist freedom provides?

Well, what are you going to do? Man up!! Just leave, if that's what you believe. Get outta here, beat it, deadbeat!

Hundreds of thousands have given their lives for this country and you don't like it. Then git!

Denis Mueller| 8.2.10 @ 9:34AM

I prefer to stay and fight people like yourself who have turned this country into a semi-police state. Why don't you leave? You do not believe in democracy. I do. Track me down. Be careful what you say!

Linda Peterson| 8.2.10 @ 9:45AM

Denis,

This country is NOT a democracy (communist propaganda that is taught by Marx). America is a REPRESENTATIVE REPUBLIC! If you love this country so much, I think you better at least learn a little more about it.

MicroGlyphics| 8.2.10 @ 1:11PM

Hi Linda,

Point on. Whilst the United States (not America) is a Constitutional Representative Republic, it remains to be seem who is being represented. Arguably, corporations are give priority over We the People. :-(

Squee| 8.16.10 @ 2:54AM

Ok, so are you arguing against all the posters talking about how important it is to fight for democracy over-seas... and at the same time saying that thinking America is a democracy is communist propaganda taught by Marx? Do you know the history of the term "Republic" or are you just playing semantic games? The idea was that the Republicans (not just in America) were setting up a system of government that would be the best form of democracy possible. A Representative Republic ...which btw, "republic" just means "a state in which the supreme power rests in the body of citizens entitled to vote and is exercised by representatives chosen directly or indirectly by them. " is a redundant phrase and it isn't a term that is mutually-exclusive with democracy: "government by the people; a form of government in which the supreme power is vested in the people and exercised directly by them or by their elected agents under a free electoral system.".

The point here is that our fore-fathers believed that the best democracy was a Republic. Now here's my riddle for you... why is it called the "Republic of China"? lol - just jokes, I know you don't take your rhetoric THAT seriously.

Dan Hirsch| 8.2.10 @ 9:53AM

Dear Denis;

Logic is obviously beyond you.

You say you hate this country. I say you should leave it, then you say: no, I should leave it.

Why fight to save what you hate?

How can you possibly say what I believe in? You know nothing of me. But about you, we all know these things:

You say you believe in democracy, then issue a veiled threat to suggesting that I track you down, then warn me to be careful what I say????

This just seconds after you write that I believe in a "semi-police state."

You are too much a dunce to be taken seriously.

I can only laugh at your confusion and obtuseness. Too bad for you!

edwin lownsley| 8.2.10 @ 12:14PM

love it or leave it people
have historical roots in germany
that was an old nazi slogan
seig heil baby

Bydand76| 8.2.10 @ 10:10AM

You are an idiot!

Do us all a favor and move to Cuba, or drive your stupid arse off a cliff please!

Pro Libertate!

Doctor Right| 8.2.10 @ 10:54AM

Dennis Mueller:

We're coming.

You'll be leaving sooner than you think.

Don't forget to pack.

Eric Cartman| 8.2.10 @ 3:03PM

Oooooooooo! We have to be careful what we say! Ooooooooooo The Commies are warning us! Oooooooooooo! Scary stuff, kids! What a putz.

Look, you weasely little Commie Boy, we took ya down before, and we're going to do it again. Boo!

And how do you know I didn't mean really take care of you? Like bring you a bowl of soup, lay a blanket across those fragile legs, roll you over to the cliff you like to watch the sen set from while the surf pounds the jagged rocks below. (Now, did I set that darn break on poor old Denis' wheelchair? Oh well, it will be okay, I'm sure).

Le Cracquere| 8.2.10 @ 9:34AM

Sounds as if the man had an honorable war record--so did Marshal Pétain. As with the good maréchal, the trenchant question is whether the man's post-war perfidy sufficed to overwhelm his undoubted prior service to country. I'm saying "oui" on both counts.

crookedwren| 8.2.10 @ 11:31AM

Some things I learned about Communists from both Chambers and the ones I knew who were protesting the Vietnam War ---

Communists refuse to be honest and tell the truth to most people who know them. They never openly admit to being a Communist. They hide it, lie about it, pretend to be patriotic Democrats.

Communists only reveal their true agenda and loyalty (which is NEVER primarily to the US) when they believe they have a sympathetic ear of a fellow traveler or a possible new recruit.

Communists lie. They also will murder if they are ordered by people "above" them to do so. They will even murder "friends." Read Whittaker Chambers book if you don't believe me.

If you don't love our country, might I suggest finding another?

Richard| 8.2.10 @ 11:36AM

Oh yes, the commies fought against Hitler but only after Hitler invaded the USSR. Before then they were great buddies and the American commies followed the USSR line to the person.

Tim*| 8.2.10 @ 11:36AM

We lost 406,000 Americans in WWII, Leftist Apologist Broad.

Like Benedict Arnold , Howard Zinn gets no Free Pass .

Shove Off !

John K| 8.2.10 @ 1:41PM

Are you saying that the fact Zinn was in the USAAF in WWII means he wasn't also a Communist fellow traveller? Do you understand the meaning of the term "non sequiteur"?

Bruce Berger| 8.2.10 @ 3:44PM

Denis,
I love this country. It must be a pretty lousy existence to wake up every day and dislike your country. I hope for your sake that you can one day recognize that the U.S., while imperfect, is the greatest country on this planet, and probably the greatest country in the history of the world.

JimE| 8.2.10 @ 6:38PM

Please show us your film. A great piece of Americana shouldn't be locked away. When will you be moving to North Korea? Please produce the film coward.

Ellis Wyatt| 8.2.10 @ 9:44AM

His book is simply another anti-American pamphlet that has no merit when actually compared to historical facts. It is quite a childish read to begin with. The problem people like Zinn, and other anti-Americans that attempt to diminish the greatness and goodness of America, will always have is that they cannot dispute history. They can try and rewrite it or frame it out of context, but history will always prevail and America will always come away unscathed.

The fact that Zinn was a communist should surprise nobody. This book could have been written by any communist propagandist and, like communism itself, fails to stand up to reality.

Any teacher that would make their students read this crap is likely not intelligent enough to be teaching in the first place and reason even more why parents should exert more control at home over what their children are actually learning.

If you are looking for a better, more worthy read try A History of the American People. I believe the author is Paul Johnson.

hardcard| 8.2.10 @ 10:10AM

next time you attend a movie of m.damon,b.affleck,s.penn. m.scorcese,l.decaprio,and their fellow travlers you are contributing to anti-American scum.

Seek| 8.2.10 @ 11:57AM

Martin Scorsese is no "Leftist." I've seen his supposedly "anti-American" films -- all of them. He is simply one of the greatest filmmakers ever. Apparently, your film criticism is as challenged as your spelling.

martin j smith| 8.2.10 @ 10:15AM

Howard Zinn and other Left people should on their own make clear their true political affiliations. But of course the wont. Just as in the case of BHO. On the LEFT they talk the Alinsky talk of making themselves seem like "normal "Americans--but they are in fact from someplace else. They are in a way foreign FDR did not hate America--he had ideas that many disagree with on the economy but he did not hate this country. The current crop Zinn included do hate this country. And, I believe that they are beholden to foreign political organizations and voters should made aware of what they are,what they stand for and how money they are contributing to American Politcal campaigns. Thyat is only fair--transparency don't you know !!!!!!!!!!!!!

TURK| 8.2.10 @ 10:25AM

Mueller
Could it be(assuming his bombing service) he hated germans the way he has always hated Americans. Was he indignant that the blood thirsty german dictator double crossed his pal the blood thirsty russian dictator? Lyndon Johnson and McNamara yielded to the leftist scum who General Giap credited with the Communist "victory" in Viet Nam. Despite the cards you of cpusa hold with the media and academia, you have lost. The American people will never join your traitorist gaggle in it's efforts to yield our sovereignty to the scum at the UN.

Larry in Iowa| 8.2.10 @ 10:35AM

I'm curious, did Zinn's enthusiasm for fighting Nazi's begin before or after June 22nd 1941? The Communist Party USA followed Stalin's orders and opposed helping the Brits. or fighting his fellow murderous totalitarian. until that day when the panzers rolled into the Soviet Union. Soon after the Communists were suddenly aflame with patriotic zeal to fight the Nazis. I wonder where Howard was?

George True| 8.2.10 @ 10:50AM

First of all, it is highly unbecoming of the level of discussion here at American Spectator to make ad hominum attacks against those who express a different opinion. Mr Mueller certainly erred in saying that no one here made the sacrifice that Zinn made, as obviously at least a few who comment here did serve in combat. I am sure he wishes he had said FEW of you made the same sacrifice. In any case, it is not appropriate to call him names or suggest that someone shoudl rearrange his face. That is what the leftists do. Let us not emulate them.

Moving on, it has always puzzled me to see a distinguished war veteran become a leftist (it does seem to be a relatively rare occurrence). Almost everybody will recognize George McGovern as one of the most hardcore leftists of the Vietnam war era. And yet, he was a decorated B-24 bomber pilot in WWII with a very distinguished record of amazing flying skills and always completing the mission.

I am sure the horror of war combined with fighting in a war that appears not to have victory as its goal has a lot to do with it. But for someone to become a full blown leftist over it means they have thrown out the baby with the bathwater. Channeling their angst over lives needlessly lost in a war fought for reasons other than victory would logically lead someone to become a libertarian, or if taken to an extreme even an anarchist. But to become a leftist over it? They can only have taken a wrong turn somewhere in their mind. Leftism in all its forms has murdered somewhere between 160 to 200 million peole over the last 87 years, caused cataclysmic theft of property and savings for many hundreds of millions more, and is an ever-present existential threat to the life, liberty, and happiness of everyone on planet earth. Thus, it has always been a mystery to me how someone disillusioned over the waging of what they believe to be an unjust war by a Western nation could think that leftism is somehow the answer.

DRed| 8.2.10 @ 11:45AM

Leftism is pretty vague. How would you define it? You seem to be tarring with a pretty broad brush.

George True| 8.2.10 @ 12:35PM

The leftism I was referring to would include communism and fascism in particular, and totalitarianism in general (I would include Islamic regimes in this category).

Less murderous forms of leftism such as European socialism, and the current socialist regime and ruling class in Washington to my way of thinking are also highly evil, because they always lead eventually to the subjugation of individual liberties to the will of the state. In other words, left unchecked, socialism always leads to communism, which has as its foremost characteristic the ruthless suppression of any and all who are seen as a potential threat to the state ideology.

DRed| 8.2.10 @ 1:25PM

At that point the term becomes meaningless. I don't think there's anything particularly ideological about totalitarianism, at least in the sense that a totalitarian government would be exclusively leftist or rightist.

'Less murderous' forms of european socialism would be non-murderous democratic socialism? The last time I looked at Scandinavia I didn't see any bloodthirsty totatalitarians. (The Swedes, for example, voted the socialists out of power fairly recently)

And I'm not sure how you'd call the current regime socialist, unless you're using a ridiculously broad definition. Socialists don't bail out capitalist investment banks, do they?

Dai Alanye| 8.2.10 @ 11:30AM

The question is not whether Zinn was heroic but which country he was being heroic for--the US or the USSR.

For that matter, being a hero, though generally admirable, is not by itself a sign of virtue. After all, Hitler was a hero in the First World War.

martin j smith| 8.2.10 @ 11:45AM

Mr Rue or false as the case may be let me point out a few things. This web site and other permit within reaonsable grounds discourse that you might not like in terms your taste. And that is fine--go take a hike. But we want to protect our feedom to express ourselves in our way--not your way. Oh and by the way I wonder how the "good boys and girls" at netroots,Daily Kos and other sites react to your effort to correct their behavior.
I cannot tell you the number of times I have heard in one ,media modality or another of the murder,killing or assination of GWB. Mr True were you there ? So, sorry bubn this mild stuff and as they say if you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen!!!!!!!!!!!!

And one other thing, The Left Socialist that have lael Democrat Party under the leadership of BHO have shown themselves to be an anti-american regime. THis president I can say without fear on contradiction is the worst President of my time--at that starts with FDR and the only present ( well maybe Jimmy Carter is a contender ) to be horrendously Anti-American. He may be the elected president, but at this time he has no mandate at all from the voters for his program ,policies and ideology . He is running the government ( regime ) like a foreign dictator . The voter are speaking in November will speak.
Having served in the military deserves credit, but no gaurentee of adulation. What a person does in his or her life service counts as well. Howard Zinn, thank you for your service, now fin some more appropriate country to reside in like Paris,France for example. But not here--thank youy and good nite.

DRed| 8.2.10 @ 11:53AM

Howard Zinn is dead, so you don't have to worry about him being American anymore.

George True| 8.2.10 @ 12:54PM

Martin J Smith: So by way of reply, you mock my name. Very funny, and original (NOT!). How about if I refer to you as Mr Jones, wouldn't that be funny, too? Not really, would it?

Many here will recognize me as a long time poster at AS who is not shy about vehemently denouncing all things leftist. And I can understand why a three-time combat vet would take great umbrage over Mr Mueller's mistaken assertion that, "none of you has made the same sacrifice" as Mr Zinn. But it is still a bit over the top to suggest that someone rearrange his face. I cringed when I read that because that is the type of vitriol that characterizes the left. Let us not be like them.

I can certainly take the heat with the best of them, my friend. But it is better to shred the arguments of leftist apologists with the razor sharp sword of logic and from the unassailable fortress of truth. And especially in a public forum such as this, let us avoid appearing like the violence-prone types that the left in their grand delusions imagine us to be (when in reality it is they who are the purveyors of violence against those expressing a different opinion).

Finally, if you read further down in my previous comment, I explicitly stated that even a decorated war hero who subsequently became a leftist has obviously made a wrong turn somewhere in his mind. So in lecturing to me about the evils of FDR and BHO you are only preaching to the choir.

Bydand76| 8.2.10 @ 2:30PM

Mr. True,
Respectfully Sir, I apologize to you if I made you cringe or uncomfortable with my comments directed towards Mr. Mueller. I know you to be a patriot and agree with you in your opinions However, with that being said. I stand by what I said.

I was trying to say that I doubt Mr Mueller has the stones to say that garbage in the presence of someone such as myself.

I have no problem with Mr. Mueller expressing his opinion on whatever topic is at hand and truth be told I will defend his right to do so with my life.
But I do not, and will not, stand for people like Mr Mueller gettting a free pass. Sometimes there has to be consequences for your actions AND for your words.

People like Mr Mueller should be dealt with harshly and I do not apologize for treating him as such. If his sensibilities were offended because I told him that, well then to bad for him.

I highly doubt you or I would be afforded the same respect you are attempting to convey on Mr Mueller.

I took on Oath to defend the Constitution against all enemies both foreign and domestic, Sir.
I take that Oath very seriously Mr. True, and I consider people like Mr Mueller and all of the other scumbag leftists to be just that.
Enemies of the Constitution!
Their actions speak for themselves.

Again, I respectfully apologize to you if this bothers you but that is where I stand.

I would suggest to you that Mr. Mueller probably does not care either way and no amount of shredding his argument with the razor sharp sword of logic he would STILL believe the way he does.

"Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable."
John F. Kennedy

Pro Libertate!

George True| 8.2.10 @ 2:43PM

Well said, sir, and I respect your opinion as well.

Denis Mueller| 8.2.10 @ 11:58AM

Wow! Threats and hate prove my point about the right wing being undemocratic. You guys cannot take any differing opinions. The FBI CoIntelpro program was filled with lies. Again it is just historic record. I show the film to my students and while some may disagree they are impressed with Zinn. See my film The FBI's War on Black America that should shake you up a bit. Your Tories and we are in the Thomas Paine tradition. By the way Zinn joined the service after the attack on Pearl Harbor.
Sounds like a patriot to me!

George True| 8.2.10 @ 1:19PM

So just because one or two posters here made caustic comments about your point of view, you denounce the entire "right" as being threatening, hate filled, undemocratic, and unable to abide differing opinions? I think not, sir.

I remember back in the Vietnam war era, there were still a few on the antiwar/Democrat/left side of things who used to say, "I may disagree with what you have to say, but I will defend with my life your right to say it". Tragically, that sentiment among the left died out a long time ago. It was gradually replaced with the current view that anyone who disagrees with the left can only do so because they are stupid/uneducated/selfish/racist/warmongering/hateful, etc. It never enters the mind of a committed leftist that all kinds of people who are kind, generous, educated, reasonable, and magnanimous might disagree for some very good, enlightened, and benevolent reasons.

The fact that I, someone who thinks all forms of leftism to be ill-advised at best and downright evil at worst, stuck up for your right to express an opinion, should tell you something. And that type of attitude is the prevailing one among the vast majority of the right.

Denis Mueller| 8.2.10 @ 1:55PM

George your OK!

Tom| 8.2.10 @ 2:13PM

Denis,
Was Zinn a member of the CPUSA or not?
Tom

Tim*| 8.2.10 @ 2:42PM

Sounds more like Benedict Arnold .

NAh , Historical Revisionist Broad , We're Tea Party Rebels and You're The King's Tory.

Go sell your crap sandwiches to gullible Public Indoctrination Camp Students .

Goldentoadster| 8.2.10 @ 12:07PM

This will only enhance Zinn's reputation among liberals. They are mealy-mouthed cowards and they know it, so they guiltily admire Communists for avowing the open hatred of the U.S. which they dare not. They're like sissies who worship bikers.

Mike H| 8.2.10 @ 12:09PM

Zinn was quite open with his reasons for enlisting during WW2”:

“There was a need to defeat the monstrosity of fascism. It was that belief that drove me to enlist in the Air Force and fly bombing missions over Europe.”

Note that it had nothing to do with the Japanese sneak attack on Pearl Harbor, the defense of the United States, or Japanese imperial ambition. It was all couched in the language of the CPUSA and Popular Front’s talking points about “fighting fascism”.

alert1201| 8.2.10 @ 12:48PM

Yes, the only thing a communist hates more then a capitalist is a fascist.

DRed| 8.2.10 @ 1:28PM

I thought Obama was a communist and a fascist. Are you saying that wouldn't make any sense?

Larry In Iowa| 8.2.10 @ 2:35PM

Communism and Fascism are rivals, not opposites. In the early part of the last century that was widely known and even celebrated by the "Progressives" in America and Europe. They work the same and have the same effect on those unfortunate enough to live under their influence. Members of Mussolini's Fascists and the Italian Communists routinely went from one group to another. Fascism only became unpopular with the left once Mussolini invaded Ethiopia. Communists, in Europe and the US had no problem with Hitler until he invaded the Soviet Union. At that point they followed Stalin's orders and become anti Fascists. That was also the point when the Progressives finally abandoned Fascism and started working to paint it as a right wing, rather than a Progressive, movement.

In reality they are as alike as two piglets suckling off the same sow. They may consider themselves opposites, but in reality they are interchangeable rivals both trying to suck at the same teat.

Robert Pinkerton| 8.2.10 @ 7:19PM

"Yes, the only thing a communist hates more then a capitalist is a fascist."

And this is because the two are, rather than antinomies, competitors. One sees the same poison, totalitarianism in service to the "perfection" of mankind (Possibly the most poisonous falsehood that human intellect can produce.), but in different packaging, marginally different formulation, and different advertising aimed at different segments of the market for totalitarian control.

Leave the troll alone| 8.2.10 @ 12:09PM

Denis Mueller.
Ferris Bueller.

Ha ha---not. Troll getting paid too much. Markos not getting money's worth.

Leave troll alone----troll leaves. We the better for it.
Agreed!!

Radegunda| 8.2.10 @ 12:12PM

Isn't it funny how, suddenly, a leftist (Mueller) cites military service as a sign of good character. Leftists usually can't find anything good to say about a soldier. They even try to prevent soldiers--risking their lives in war zones-- from voting in our elections.

Denis Mueller| 8.2.10 @ 1:06PM

Why do you assume I dislike veterans? I am friends with the VVAW and made a film about them. I admire them, especially ones like Zinn and McGovern, who came back appalled by the nature of war. How come you guys do not. You are the ones who question motives for bravery. Give them credit for service. Howard also fought with SNCC to end the Jim Crow system. I assume your against the days of Jim Crow?

Tom| 8.2.10 @ 2:16PM

Denis,
Whether Mr. Zinn fought bravely in WWII, battled Jim Crow laws in the South, or helped old ladies cross the street in not really material to the subject of this article. Was Zinn or was he not ever a member of the CPUSA?
Tom

Tim*| 8.2.10 @ 2:54PM

You seem to have a problem with veterans , who while grasping the horrors of war , appreciate what we did in WWII and elsewhere to step on Murdering Dictators.

Zinn helps step on Fascists and then throws in with the Authoritarian System that gave us the likes of Joe Stalin .

You're an argument against yourself and Zinn .

Mike H| 8.2.10 @ 12:15PM

Talking points, I might add, that only became widely disseminated by the Popular Front after the German invasion of Soviet occupied Poland on June 22nd 1941.

Seems that guy like Zinn weren’t too keen on fighting fascism when the Soviets and Germans were allies.

MicroGlyphics| 8.2.10 @ 1:15PM

Howard Zinn did not realise the errors of his ways until near the end of his service to this misguided country. He spent his remaining days repenting.

Nat Trayger| 8.2.10 @ 12:18PM

The question I would ask is whether Zinn would have volunteered if the Soviets had attacked Pearl Harbor instead of the Japanese. Whenever I discuss people like Zinn and other pro communists like the Hollywood Ten I always substitute Nazi for Communist. Watch the look on the faces of those who seem to have a double set of books when it comes to human rights and mass murder. Watch as they try to explain how their heroes defended the party of Stalin and Mao, Pol Pot, etc while condemning the party of Hitler, Mussolini et al. People like Matt Damon and others have a double set of books when it comes to the Communist oppressors and their defenders vs the Nazi ones. Both systems have a similar record of atrocities and mass murder. Try it next time you argue with one of these people.

Ken (Old Texican)| 8.2.10 @ 12:24PM

Case Closed!
The Lord God has passed judgement upon Mr. Zinn.

Done Deal!

Denis Mueller| 8.2.10 @ 1:09PM

How do you know what god thinks? Do you have an email for god.

John Navratil| 8.2.10 @ 1:17PM

What idiocy! He didn't say what the judgement was now did he? Just the judgement day had passed.

MicroGlyphics| 8.2.10 @ 1:13PM

So, what's your point? By that logic, I presume you god has also passed judgment on George Washington and Ronald Reagan.

DRed| 8.2.10 @ 1:16PM

I guess everyone who dies is an evil leftist.

JS| 8.2.10 @ 2:23PM

You just don't get it. God passes judgement on all of us when we come before His Son. Judgement is neither good nor bad, positiver or negative. It is an action that can be positive or detrimental.

Here is an earthly example that you might, with a little work, be able to understand. If a judge pronounces you innocent, he still passes judgement on you - it is just a favorable judgement for you.

Can we please get some understanding of the English language here?

Squee| 8.2.10 @ 3:00PM

Not to mention that there are a variety of "judgments": Value Judgments (Whites are better than Blacks, Ford is better than Chevy, Communists are Evil), Jurisdiction (Court Decisions by Judge or Jury) Judgments, and then there is the notion of God's Judgments... which has a different place in various Abrahamic religions: The Judgment of the Soul (and its effect on the afterlife), God's Law (open for interpretation by Jews, Muslims, Catholics, Protestants, etc.), Sin, etc. It is beyond the English language... it is Latin and Hebrew too.

Then on the other hand there is Discernment (a cat is not a dog, George Bush is male, Frogs have a spine). The "supreme judgment" of God is theologically supposed to be Discernment but the religions that are supposed to have understood this metaphysical discernment often develop Value Judgments based on this. This isn't always true... some Christians will see their place as a follower of this discernment and a teacher of it, rather than somehow believing they "know" the infinitesimal logos applied to our souls that only a god could know and coming up with value judgments (moral condemnation) of those who "live in sin", are of this or that political persuasion, or are of this or that race of people (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_aspects_of_Nazism#Nazism_and_Christianity), etc.

Squee| 8.2.10 @ 2:18PM

Why hasn't anyone noted Zinn's admission to being a Left Anarchist? I don't know whether Zinn was ever part of the Communist Party and really, I wouldn't be too surprised since it seems like his politics had developed from his mistakes in life... and the support of State-Communism is a huge mistake a lot of Lefties made. I would assume the real point to make is that he died an anarchist, rejecting the State Communism he may or may not have knowingly supported. Considering A Peoples History came out much later than the time period in his life you are all discussing, it is maybe a bit of an error to think it is "a communist history of the united states". It is definitely a history of social struggle and it is a book that is more concerned with anarchist ideals of popular struggle than Party politics (especially authoritarian communist politics). He is a anti-authoritarian/anti-capitalist, like Chomsky, who support reforms of the State to protect human liberties (not capital liberties), but who ultimately want a society based on an egalitarian or participatory economy (not State-planned like the commies) and a non-representational democratic politic.

Anyway - the point is that there are huge differences between Socialists, Communists, Left-Anarchists, Libertarian Capitalists, Mutualists, and Republican Statists (Democrats, Republicans, Green Party, etc.). Capitalists supported Stalin at times, Hitler at others, and vice-versa; Chinese Communists are State-Capitalists (the State is the sole owner and controller of societies wealth) whose bureaucrats profit from capitalist industry; Libertarian Party "libertarians" support Capitalism and the Capitalist State (a State that is big enough to defend the ownership of Capital); Anarchists have rejected both Capitalism and the State since the 1800's and support the direct ownership and control of property by those who use it (workers... rather than private investors or governments). If you can twist that into totalitarianism, you are definitely working with a very different set of definitions than most people who study political ideology or economics.

DRed| 8.2.10 @ 2:27PM

Amen

John II| 8.2.10 @ 11:06PM

"Amen"? THAT can't be right. Don't you mean, "Whaaaaatt!!????!?!?"

Squee| 8.16.10 @ 2:00AM

What are you questioning? Are you completely and utterly unfamiliar with the position Anarchists have taken historically and take currently AGAINST the Party (communist or capitalist)? Or are you just totally unaware that Zinn's later life consisted of organizing with Anarchists - not Communists?

How much more does one need to explain this? The anarchists in the USA formed the IWW and were on the front lines of our struggle to win the 8 hour work day, the anarchists exiled to Russia during their revolution were thoroughly disgusted with the authoritarianism of Lenin (Emma Goldman and Alexander Berkman, to name just two), the anarchists in the Ukraine literally formed an army (the White Army lead by Nester Mahkno) to fight both the Fascists AND the Bolsheviks, the Russian anarchists during the revolution were slaughtered by the Bolsheviks for fighting against them (see Kronstadt Rebellion, the movement for the Free Soviets, etc.), the Anarchists in the Spanish Civil War formed militias to fight against Franco's army and were stabbed in the back by Russian backed Communists, etc. The pattern is somewhat "Anarchists get used by Communists" - but that is half of the story. The whole story is that Anarchists wind up being on the front lines fighting against Fascists, Communists, and Nazis - sometimes mistakenly believing that they can trust Communists to fight against Fascists - but since the early 20th century's bloodshed, anarchists are probably enemy number 1 for the Communists. And Socialists will do anything to kill off anarchists.

you may have arguments against Anarchists... but at least get your facts straight.

david| 8.12.11 @ 1:37AM

Holy crap! A complete argument! I have been looking for a counter to Howard Zinn (I like his work and tend to agree, that is what worries me). Hopefully I find it. I like to know that I am getting facts, regardless of where they come from.

Sardonikus| 8.2.10 @ 3:43PM

Come November, the progressive boil on the backside of America is going to receive the lancing it so richly deserves. The indignant howls of Mueller, Matt Damon, and the rest of Zinn's willing ideological catamites will be music to my ears.

PS. Don't lose any further sleep from your pseudoorgasmic tingles for martyrdom. Martyrs are remembered - mediocrities are forgotten.

crookedwren| 8.2.10 @ 3:44PM

Part of the difficulty of parsing the anarchists is that they are often "used" as tools by Communists and fascists. In the fall of 2007, I believe, there was a reunion of the SDS at Loyola University. A good bit of footage had been posted online. Anarchists, particularly young anarchists, were to be encouraged by the Communists. Why? I suspect the typical reason. They can be useful in causing stresses in the capitalist/free market world of this Republic.

What did Zinn hope to accomplish by his work? What did Zinn accomplish? How many students have closed their minds to the conservative view of capitalism, the free market system, the Judeo-Christian traditions that abound in our Founding documents? How many students have seen the strengths in these systems as a result of his influence?

I'm not the final arbiter of Zinn's work and life. But I do know that we are all free --- thus far --- to share in this conversation. (I'm grateful for that liberty.)

As for people who went to war and are still patriots, loyal to the United States, I am grateful for them as well. In my experience, limited admittedly, I have found that condemning the US as an imperialist oppressor is too often the first response of someone who has been indoctrinated by Marxists, fellow travelers, and those who are being used by Marxists.

Squee| 8.16.10 @ 2:28AM

Marx is a bastard. Anarchists *do* get coopted by Communists, especially scum like the ISO (present communist group in the USA). But currently, Anarchists are doing their best to not only expose ISO front groups and ban them from any anarchist event (see Freedom Summer 2010 controversy)... but actually attack present-day Socialists and Communists way more than "patriots" do.

Zinn, the Anarchist, hoped to write a History of social struggles that aren't usually mentioned in typical highschool and college texts on US History. His goal was to go through the history of the United States and demonstrate that without these grass-roots struggles, many of our cherished rights and privileges would not have come into existence. Ironically, most Anarchists don't like Zinn (or Chomsky) very much because they are "too liberal". For example, Zinn advocates grass-roots struggles to pass into law civil rights and other such liberal goals. Most Anarchists see this as simply Liberalism. But Zinn was not a Socialist or Communist when he wrote A People's History. Hey may have been a wishy-washy Liberal Anarchist willing to make so many concessions that his anarchist ideals were nothing more than a nice thought for him.

Finally, you are overestimating the impact of Zinn's work on students and other people. For young people, we've grown up a witness to and a subject of extreme manipulation by corporations, psychiatrists, and religious institutions that we have recognized for they're hypocritical decisions. You don't need Howard Zinn to see people like Ted Haggard or Catholic pedophiles and get a bat taste in your mouth about religious institutions. You don't need any progressives or Marxists to be pissed off that you can't find a job or take out a loan and every administration you've seen in office (Bush, Clinton, Bush, Obama) has failed to represent your interests as a young, working American. You don't need any academics to see the crumbling of the Tech Bubble, the Housing Bubble, and other tragic economic events to loose faith in what we learn in school should have never happened again with "the New Deal". As young people, we are growing up in a United States that simply is not the same United States that gave people pride in "free markets" and all the other stuff that goes with it. We graduate college with huge debts that we can't pay off, without jobs that we spent years testing, training, and specializing in to maximize our potentials. Millions of other daily experiences for us are what are causing us to loose "faith" in some of the systems Americans before us have chosen.

But that doesn't make us "anti-American", it doesn't mean we "hate our country". It means that we want to make our country the best it can be and if that means calling out the flaws we see in certain systems, then that is what we are going to do.

I have been molested by a Priest
I have had my wages stolen, jobs taken away, right-wing thugs try to kill me in the streets - and I mean KILL ME (for looking too jewish),
I have been maced by police officers without being charged for anything (not being CHARGED... ie - for no reason)
I have been belittled by Marxist idiots who want dictatorships
I have been exploited by Capitalists with 50hr work weeks without any wage, on pure commission just so I can try to get working people to buy supplementary insurance that they didn't need
I have worked since I was 15 and gone to college since 17 making something of myself

That ain't America to me! That is some Evil stuff that no Zinn or Progressive politician con is going to make me forget.

Nick| 8.2.10 @ 3:57PM

Mr. Mueller,

The fact that a man served in the U.S. military in no way indicates that they will be a man of good character the rest of his life.

Lee Harvey Oswald, Charles Whitman, and James Earl Ray were all veterans. The military is a microcosm of society at large. Good people serve side by side with evil-doers. Perhaps if you had served, you would know this.

It is a straw man to bring up Zinn's military service. He was a traitor to his country and served as a Stalin stooge. His "Commie History of the United States" is only useful as an example of bad leftist propaganda.

Did you state that you are a teacher of students?
With your misspellings and grammatical errors, it is no wonder America is so far behind other nations in education rankings.

Larry in Iowa| 8.3.10 @ 12:10AM

Like the hero of Saratoga, a certain Benedict Arnold. I guess the lefties should be working to rehabilitate him as well. Hey, if it's good enough for Zinn.....

Smitty| 8.2.10 @ 6:22PM

I read "A People's History of the United States" on the recommendation of a friend. Dreadful crap, anti-history, pure agit-prop and badly written, full of turgid prose . No one could have doubts about Zinn's Marxism after an even cursory reading. That the book is still used in high schools and colleges says much about the politics of the educators. That a few Hollywood imbeciles have embraced it means nothing.

Still it made old Howard a bundle of capitalist cash.

Denis Mueller| 8.2.10 @ 6:41PM

The prose is wonderful you just have no brains. Plus you guys have no respect for anyone who disagrees. I started this today to see if you on the right can be human. You can't. Zinn is a very decent man who was a way better person than any of you could dream to be. Matt Daman is way smarter, Harvard grad, while he was acting, than smitty you could ever hope to be. Bye

Dan Hirsch| 8.2.10 @ 7:58PM

Denis, Denis, Denis;

You are the one lacking brains. Please give a single example of successful communist or socialist rule that lasted more than two or three generations. You cannot. Your only response is to accuse others of the brainlessness that you display so heroically, so brazenly.

And then you complain that your opposites have nothing but insults. You need to learn the difference between a window and a mirror.

John II| 8.2.10 @ 11:27PM

Well, since I'm in the education racket, intimately familiar with the smugness of Prof. Mueller's musings, I know this is hopeless, but here goes:

My dear Denis,

If you really and truly think that Harvard grads are smart, here's a reading assignment for you, a book written in the early seventies: "Leftism: from de Sade to Marx to Hitler and Marcuse," by a truly smart HUMAN named Erik von Kuehnelt-Leddihn. It was followed up about 20 years later with "Leftism Revisited," a kind of update.

If you're really, really, really HUMAN (unlike myself and other ex-lefties), you'll find some leisure time to buy those two books and read them. And then read at least a few of the books those two books lead you to.

That is, IF you're really, really HUMAN. Myself, I'm just a gerbil, but I depend on your good example.

Squee| 8.16.10 @ 2:37AM

If De Sade and Hitler are Leftists - then what in the hell is an Extreme Rightist? Is Ayn Rand a Leftist too? I may just have to read this masterpiece.

Tom| 8.3.10 @ 7:46AM

Denis,
I ignored your repeated use of your when you meant you're, I understand in informal internet posting grammar sometimes slips. I am guilty of it myself. However, you are not entitled to just create facts out of thin air. Mr. Damon did not graduate Harvard.

"The prose is wonderful you just have no brains. Plus you guys have no respect for anyone who disagrees."
Can you see the irony? You lambast 'you guys' for having no respect for anyone who disagrees directly after calling the previous poster brainless for having an opinion that differs from yours regarding the quality of Zinn's prose.

And one more time, a simple question, was Zinn a member of the CPUSA or not?

Nevermind| 8.2.10 @ 7:25PM

I'm surprised about all these comments. I'm not American but wished to be so just to be proud of Zinn actions as an authentic American

America Rules| 8.2.10 @ 8:24PM

Love America or die, liberals!! Speak American or get out, and don't come back with your foreign ideas!

J. Edgar Hoover should have been elected president for life!!

DonJuan| 8.3.10 @ 10:55PM

J. Edgar Hoover was a closet homo, with a penchant for young men. Roy Cohn died of AIDS. these are the so called "men" defending America from the communist threat. I have no problem with that, but let's be real about this. They lived in an intolerant period of American history, perhaps they were diverting attention away from their own activities. I think that the countries that have presidents for life are known as, uhhhhh........fascist?

kingsmill| 8.2.10 @ 8:36PM

After the Nazi-Soviet pact the CPUSA and the COMINTERN urged it's adherents to serve in the U.S. military.

A communist serving in the American military during WWII was helping to defend the Soviet Fatherland.

Zinn was a selective pacifist: he was willing to wage war to protect the Soviet Union, otherwise he favored all wars against the USA.

Zinn was a hateful ideologue.

bluecollarbytes| 8.2.10 @ 10:03PM

The American, Communist-Appreciation Society never died, collapsed or went away when the Russia's Soviet Union sputtered out. And it now denies that THAT was real communism, as it was intended to be run. And now some are 'admitting' that Hugo Chavez's revolution must not be operating as it should since folks there can't even locate the rotting food Chavez now controls. Surely there are some traitors lurking around that are tampering with the purity of his endless revolution.

Communism and socialism appeals to the worst in humans, promising guaranteed minimums of meager handouts in exchange for complete subservience to the Party agenda (like an Obamagenda for instance). The aim here is to fit oneself into the mandated system, ideologue loyalists receiving the special favors as govt decides to grant them. In the U.S. we still value individual initiative, striving, hard work and excellence, which helps to produce creative thinking, individualism, wealth, jobs, and opportunities galore. We work for ourselves and families, not the dreams of any self-appointed czar-master. And our society benefits as individuals do their best to advance. This is the American way.

Squee| 8.16.10 @ 1:51AM

Which is why Zinn died AN ANARCHIST. Get off this stupid straw-man rant about his civil rights era affiliations. The guy has denounced Socialists and Communists just as much as any Republican. The same thing happened with Murray Bookchin - guy had bad feelings about the war, was first attracted to the Communist Party, then vehemently denounced them as an anarchist.

smitty| 8.2.10 @ 10:08PM

Denis,

Thanks for the kind words, coming from you they
mean a lot.

Reading Zinn's "prose" was like wading through a river of molasses. The only thing worse was his spoken word, how can a man who defended every thug from Stalin to Chavez be considered decent?

Matt Damon only proves that a Harvard graduate can be as gullible and ideologicially obtuse as any movie maker. Too, the value of a Harvard education had decline of late.

Keep in touch.

sullivan| 8.18.10 @ 7:59PM

Why is it considered unpatriotic to question openly the actions of your/my/our government, particularly the actions that your/my/our government seeks to keep under wraps?

That used to just be called journalism.

Dissent is not unpatriotic. It is an essential component of a representative democracy, and of a government of, by and for the people.

Howard Zinn was an American and a Communist. Despite your conditioning to the contrary, those two are not nor should be mutually exclusive. He was a credentialed historian who chose to report on the unflattering events and hijinks that occasionally ensued from our government's actions. In my opinion he did us all a great service in doing so.

Alternative viewpoints need to be considered and digested until you can arrive at your own version of the truth rather than blindly following the state approved version in Goebbelsesque textbooks.

James Duthie| 9.10.10 @ 1:10AM

Reading through the comments what I find most interesting is that many of the people that choose to denounce Howard Zinn, denounce, and then go on to make comments, along the lines of "If you don't love the real America, then get out", Such and such should be president for life", he couldn't love really love America (buy which I take it they meant the USA), or be a real American because he wasn't born here."

Dont the writers of such comments realize your promoting the very things you state your denouncing? What ever happened to freedom of expression? Should anyone who questions wars past or present wether a veteran or not be denounced. Can anyone who has seen, experienced war and the large scale taking of life really argue for it??

I am writing this from Afghanistan, were I have discussed the writings of H.Z. and along with many others, from both right and left, main stream and alternate. Does our reading or investigating subjects for ourselves make us any less patriotic or deserving of the title "a good American"?

Michael| 9.19.10 @ 12:40PM

The comments on this page illustrate why we need a Tea Party. People may disagree with Howard Zinn's politics, but to also disagree with his exposure of state-led violence, manipulation of the economy and suppression of constitutional liberties puts you all further to the authoritarian side than Zinn. To stand against history that reveals the problems of a strong central state -- whether that is intentional or not -- shows how effective the right and left are at getting people to shut up and go with the program. I don't agree with Zinn's politics but find his writings support much different conclusions about the proper role of the United States government. And I think every one who questions government power is a true patriot.

James| 10.6.10 @ 3:20PM

Socialists and Communists have no context. Ideology, by definition, ignores circumstance and complexity. Reading Zinn, I was appreciative of some of the information, but it can not be seriously taken as a composium of American History. It is a history of American Socialism, and Zinn himself admits in "People's" that socialists never accounted for more than 20% of the population. But he does write it as a mass movement. There are lies in the book and there are also half-truths. Much is left out and more is exaggerated. But socialists will always be socialists. It is their religion, they will never let it go.

David| 8.12.11 @ 1:31AM

The FBI had an extreme bias in going after Zinn. His focus on the FBI for lack of investigative intensity regarding crimes against minorities is well known. Our wars against Communism have produced so many dead, American and otherwise, and is in no way an argument for the Democratic process. Your arguments are strictly ad hominem and provide little rebuttal to the implied arguments of Zinn's teachings. If you want to refute his ideas, do so. Your methodology of argument is not a logical one, and only the weak minded will find any solace in your drivel.