The American Spectator

drudge ette obama| 4.3.09 @ 6:41AM

Sebelius' instincts are flawed insofar as she champions destruction of life rather than its promulgation. I have heard that pro-life fanatics are more likely to be men than women because men wish to control women. While this may have some appeal to women who do not wish to be controlled, the better argument is that abortion is an unnatural choice amongst animals whose instinct is to survive and expand their population. That's the instinct. Most women have this instinct: it's called maternalism. You can't say, like Pelosi, that "I personally have the instinct not to kill my own babies but don't want to force it on others." That is because our entire society, humanity, needs continuance to survive. (I fully expect disagreement from the green/population control people.) Catholicism broadens the instinct to characterize destruction of life as being an act against God because who other than God put the instinct in man because he created man.

But what separates Sebelius from your run-of-the-mill prochoicer is this determination that late term abortion must be protected at all costs. This grisly procedure which I believe is murder cannot be justified. Even common law principles support that you cannot take the life of an innocent to protect your own.

I won't, however, go down the road to accuse Sebelius of having an underlying eugenics purpose behind her abortion without limits position. That would be too evil.

Sebelius, like Peloisi, Kennedy, Biden and many others are simply cultural Catholics without the introspective ability to match their morales with a similar-belief religious denomination.

Crusader| 4.3.09 @ 8:29AM

Everyone in favor of late-term/partial-birth abortions should have to personally witness a couple.

Appleby| 4.3.09 @ 8:36AM

The day will come when she will face what she has become. I will pray for her conversion as I pray for that of King Zero -- that one day she will wake up and the evil she has done and is doing will hit her right in the face and she will be changed.

There is little more I can do, but that trick often works. We can all pray that she will reject Satan, his pomps and vanities and all his empty promises -- especially the promise that she personally will suffer no consequences for her actions.

ccc| 4.3.09 @ 10:58AM

Is refusal and obstruction of Sebelius's confirmation consistant with the republican position, under the bush administration, that the legislatures role is only to confirm candidates?

Jane| 4.3.09 @ 11:01AM

Everyone should have the right to CHOOSE what is best for them and their situations! Who are we to make these decisions? Even worse since when does a MAN even have a clue what is right for a womens body? When you MEN are faced with some of the situations us women faced with then maybe your opinion will actually be worth something! Oh and talk about killing what about you Pro Lifers bombing these abortion clinics and killing not only people who work there but people that are there for help and standing outside clinics terrorizing these same people? Until you can get your Holier then Thou attitude in check and repent your own sins then you have no right speacking about issues of this magnitude!

mike| 4.3.09 @ 11:08AM

Does anyone know if a partial birth abortion procedure is availabe on video anywhere?

Ryan| 4.3.09 @ 11:25AM

Jane,

Are all pro-life supporters bombers? Does it represent the entirety of the pro-life movement? Is it fair to label us all "bombers?"

Does "not addressing our own sins" still make abortion a proper solution?

Often I find that the "judge not" statement is more often used by the more guilty party so that they don't have to address their own issues.

What right do we have to deny life to an unborn child?

Francis Beckwith| 4.3.09 @ 11:26AM

"Everyone should have the right to CHOOSE what is best for them and their situations!"

But the question in abortion is who counts as one of the everyone. That is, if the unborn is the member of the human community, then it too is a being with intrinsic dignity whose flourishing ought not to be disrupted merely because another wants to be so. Might does not make right.

"Who are we to make these decisions? Even worse since when does a MAN even have a clue what is right for a womens body? When you MEN are faced with some of the situations us women faced with then maybe your opinion will actually be worth something!"

But if the writer had been a woman, clearly that would not have persuaded you to change your mind. So, why bring up his gender if it makes no difference in your own internal deliberations on this matter?

And besides, arguments don't have penises.

Carmalina| 4.3.09 @ 11:27AM

The left-leaning "catholic" agenda is not Catholic, even when those belonging to it, including Pelosi, Sebelius and others, claim to be Catholic and at the same time belong to these movements. The "catholic" groups that are pro-choice are artificially created, and funded, mostly by George Soros to give the impression of a splintered Catholic community. Any Catholic supporting abortion or a candidate supporting abortion is no Catholic and needs to examine their conscience.

Jim| 4.3.09 @ 11:30AM

It's so refreshing to see someone walk the walk. The Sebelius nomination is a travesty; I'm so thankful for people who stand up for what is right regardless of what others think.

Crusader| 4.3.09 @ 11:50AM

I think Jane is on to something. A decision on abortion should only be made by the parties involved, and they all have to agree on it. The parties invovled would be mother, doctor, and baby. So go ahead and wait for the baby to be born, grow up a bit, and then ask him if he would like to be killed. That would be the only fair way to ensure EVERYONE has the right to CHOOSE what's best for THEM. Right Jane?

I swear ever pro-deather always brings up the abortion clinic bombing argument like abortion clinics are being bombed on a daily basis.

According to www.prochoice.org, a pro-death website, the last murder, I mean scheduled termination, of an abortion provider was in 1998! 11 years ago. In 2007 there were (ready for this) 2 arsons at abortion clinics. Wow. It is epidemic!!!!!

Crusader| 4.3.09 @ 11:56AM

P.S. - The last "bombing," according to the pro-death site www.prochoice.org, was in 2001. It is time to get off the bombing bandwagon, prodeathers.

ncatty| 4.3.09 @ 12:30PM

If the mother's right to choose an abortion is absolute, then the father should have an absolute right to choose not to pay child support in the event the mother opts for birth. Its all on her. Logical, right?

Todd| 4.3.09 @ 1:31PM

Good point ncatty but of course they want to have it both ways like liberals always do. Can't really make a judgment on Jane but I would not be surprised if she has severe repressed guilt from having an abortion. No surprise at all that Obama would appoint an extreme pro-choicer in this position as it represents his beliefs that abortion should be allowed at any time in any situation.

Dai Alanye| 4.3.09 @ 6:24PM

I personally oppose the assassination of abortionists and the bombing of abortion clinics. But who am I to force my opinions on others? Only the assassins and bombers—along with their lawyers and co-conspirators—should have the right to decide these matters.

Tarzan| 4.3.09 @ 8:12PM

Jane,
Tarzan grammar not so good. But spelling better than yours.

Tarzan tie you down 'til my baby born. Then feed you to crocodiles.

heh, heh, heh!

Where in the crap is the desire/emotion/feeling/consideration of the father in any of this bobastic, illogical, prejudiced, immoral procedure discussion?

HUH?????

Tarzan| 4.3.09 @ 8:15PM

Tarzan flunk last spelling test.

B-O-M-B-A-S-T-I-C

Tarazan mad enough to feed Cheetah to crocodiles.

Nick| 4.3.09 @ 9:47PM

"Jane,
you ignorant slut!"- Dan Ackroyd, SNL

You want to make a moral, legitimate CHOICE?
Try keeping your legs crossed until your married.

Warrior| 4.3.09 @ 10:04PM

Jane:

I agree with your underlying premise. We should not make decisions for others and men do not have a right to tell a woman what to do with her body. However, both man and woman have to be responsible for their actions. Unless you claim divine intervention you really only have one conventional (many other) choice(s) to getting pregnant. Why can't both partners take responsibility at that time and not a life destroying decision after they have acted irresponsibly?

I'll bet you were mortified when Michael Vick's story about his treatment of dogs was made public. I'll also bet that like most good liberals I know, you felt that he should have been locked up for a lot longer than he was. Love those thought processes.

DaveinPhoenix| 4.3.09 @ 10:21PM

"Who are we to make these decisions? Even worse since when does a MAN even have a clue what is right for a womens body?"

- Women have hundreds of options available to them every day that they wake up. So, Jane, you claim women don't have a choice in getting pregnant ? Don't have a choice in living a wholesome life ? Don't have any options for birth control except the killing of a baby ? How dare you ! How dare you abstain from all responsibility in life. How dare you claim lazy and irresponsible behavior is someone else's fault. And how dare you think that we're dumb enough to accept that nonsense. Grow up. Don't force any more irresponsibility down the throats of American taxpayers by attacking our virtues. We're not the ones killing our own babies.

mike| 4.4.09 @ 12:04AM

the problem with many of the bills mentioned in the article is that they can easily be seen as pro lifers denying accsess to abortion clinics. in addition pumping more money in to pregency clinics does not work, the problem is not taking care of children, but creating a household worthy of supporting an individual to maturity. as for taxpayers having to foot the bill consider: many projects individual taxpayers do not like, but this is a country that is not based on all individuals doing as they please. further more i rather pay for one time abortin clinic procedures than massive amounts of misappropiated welfare money. finally to the comment of and i quote keeping your legs closed until you are married- tell that to the many married women in relatinships and families that would benefit from not having an extra mouth to feed, are unable to give the nessesary love and affection. last time i checked people did not make love for simply procreation, but for many reasons, so preventing a birth that would be devastating to the majority of already developed relationships, than not allowing such a pregency to occur seems like common sense. last time i checked not producing babies you can not account for was being responsible, and if it's iresponsibility you are after, why not lay seige aginst the many women undergoing fertility treatments that far exceed the safe number of implants (invetro) and in addition that there is no limit nationally set for such implants, increasing many health risks such as premature birth, while conservatives sit by and don't say boo.

Angel| 4.4.09 @ 2:18AM

Jane, thy name is moron. Do you have any idea of the harm you've done? God have mercy on your soul and the souls who feel as you do. God bless the 51 million precious innocents who have died since roe v wade. The abortion slaughter is a bloody stain on all of us; no good will come of this holocaust.

MT| 4.4.09 @ 2:23AM

Mike, you're a prime example of the stupid, selfish brutishness of so many in our country. Thomas Jefferson said it best, "People get the government they deserve." And now we have.

Country Boy| 4.4.09 @ 6:02AM

Simple question: Why do the Pro-Abortionists never talk about, ask for funding for orphanages?
Seems a solution, if the Pro-Abortionists are genuine in their arguments.

Sorry for being so obtuse.

whiterb| 4.4.09 @ 8:24AM

Moral objection to abortion is understandable, but in the political arena the matter is settled. Abortion is the will of the people. The formerly " red state " of Kansas is more proof of this reality. If a viable second party is to emerge and challenge the democrats for power and curtail their reckless and fascist reign, it must be pro life.

MT| 4.4.09 @ 12:15PM

Abortion is just one facet of the culture of death. All of us are expendable. Rapidly aging boomers don't seem to understand that they are up next. The mercy you have shown the most innocent is what you should expect as you get older, whiterb. Seems only fair to me. Reap what you sow.

MT| 4.4.09 @ 12:20PM

Country boy, infertile couples can't find a baby these days. Either young women are keeping their baby or they're aborting them. Over 1 million children are aborted every year in the U.S. In vitro is painful, expensive and not always successful--many women would rather adopt than go through this miserable procedure. Disingenious pro-aborts aren't about 'choice', they're about abortion.

Nick| 4.4.09 @ 1:05PM

"Mike,
you ignorant slut!" - Nick, today

To your comment, and I quote, "tell that to the many married women in relatinships and families that would benefit from not having an extra mouth to feed,..."; are you saying that if a mother loses her job and has extra mouths to feed she can just kill her children? Are you that sick in the head? I pray for people that are so cavalier with human life as you seem to be.

You are also ignorant about the subject of in-vitro fertilization. The Roman Catholic Church has been against it for over three decades, since before the first "test tube baby" back in 1977. Try educating yourself before you spout off on subjects you know nothing about and embarass yourself.

bill kotcher| 4.4.09 @ 3:51PM

Jane

"Everyone should have the right to CHOOSE what is best for them and their situations"

Except for men?

"Even worse since when does a MAN even have a clue what is right for a womens body"

Since advances made in medicine and science after the 1960's.

"Until you can get your Holier then Thou attitude in check and repent your own sins then you have no right speacking about issues of this magnitude!"

Jane is right, we who sin have no right to decide on this matter. All men and women sin, men and women have no right to decide on this matter.

The debate is over, once a woman is pregnant only those without sin can decide the fate of the unborn.

Thank you Jane, your use of irony and saracasm illistrates clearly that we must end abortion.

Willey| 4.4.09 @ 7:14PM

Why doesn't the baby get a choice? After all, the child has the most to lose. Selfish monsters.

HistoryWriter| 4.4.09 @ 8:23PM

No, all anti-choice people are not clinic bombers. However, they ARE insufferable busybodies who have nothing better to do with their time than annoy fellow citizens who engage in lawful activities. I wish they cared as much for the welfare of born children as they do for fetuses.

Daisies| 4.4.09 @ 10:18PM

Conservatives DO care more for the welfare of born children. While you are laying on your stupid azzes growing the government to give out welfare, we personally donate copious amounts of money to charities and work our butts off volunteering in our churches and local community organizations. Culture of Death Fascist liberals like yourself just don't have consciences. Dumbazz liberal stooge, smarten up!

Gardener| 4.4.09 @ 11:09PM

I'm curious about the basis for the antiabortion faction's vehemence. Is it because you believe that your God demands that you enable every single zygote to develop to birth; or is it because you equate the preservation and nurturing of life with love? The reason I ask is that many of your responses to those who disagree with you are extremely hateful.

I use the term "antiabortion" instead of "prolife" because most of the people I know who claim the title "prolife" are also "pro death-penalty" which does not make a lot of sense to me.

Angel| 4.5.09 @ 2:43AM

Well, Gardener, I take it you are pro-death for millions of innocent babies, but are proudly pro-life for vicious serial killers who torture their young victims. Right? Please explain your wise and wonderful reasoning. We await your counsel. Thank you so much. Hearts.

Jack| 4.5.09 @ 2:51AM

Scary stuff here. It's heartbreaking what is happening in this country. For the first time, I have truly feared the leadership in Washington.

Daisies| 4.5.09 @ 3:09AM

I fear the Liberal democrat leadership, and their legions of haters even more.

Gardener| 4.5.09 @ 9:04AM

Life is life - if someone describes themselves as "prolife" then I believe that term is an all or nothing definition.

When Jesus saved the woman from stoning, a punishment allowed by the religious laws of that time, he made two points: first, stop judging other people and second, don't kill people.

He didn't qualify either point with exceptions.

A Balrog of Morgoth| 4.5.09 @ 9:56AM

Gardener,

OK, so which is it: Do you support the right of a woman to get an abortion, or do you support the right of the state to impose the death penalty?

Michael L. Hauschild| 4.5.09 @ 11:30AM

A woman’s choice to terminate her fetus is a pivotal decision but in my opinion it should remain a right. (I tend to trust women; I know many women who have had abortions but I am not aware of any acquaintance that carried to term, relied on some bogus medical directive, and then chose to have a partial birth abortion.) I would further speculate that a woman who would acquiesce to such a procedure is as rare as the medical act itself.
My concern here is simple. I do not wish the government, sign wavers, zealots, or issue-based meddlers in my family’s personal decisions.
Those jurors in Kansas, the Supreme Court in Iowa, and many of the chastised conservative posters on this site are at least cognizant of the issue at hand.
Focus is the key. If you choose to rant, rave, and spew hate while the very democratic foundation of the nation is being destroyed, so be it; but when all those taxes come due on your house of worship, you lose your home for that same crushing tax burden, and socialized medicine can’t provide your mom’s heart surgery for six months remember what you were doing while the powers that be were at work.

Angel| 4.5.09 @ 6:01PM

So, Gardener; you're pro-life, right? Isn't abortion terrible?

Angel| 4.5.09 @ 6:04PM

Who said abortion is a right? Who decided that? You libertarians are all about money, but you're wrong--it's all about integrity. We're in trouble because we've lost our integrity.

danny| 4.5.09 @ 6:30PM

angel, you are exactly right. no more needs to be said.

Nick| 4.5.09 @ 11:48PM

Mr. Hauschild,

Where exactly does this "right" to execute an abortion come from?

Angel| 4.6.09 @ 12:02AM

Hauschild, it's not hateful to express our grief and anger over the killing of 51 million babies. It's called freedom of speech, and it's our RIGHT--unlike the phony right of abortion. It's the shallow and superficial people like you who are responsible for our country's destruction, not us. Also, I am not 'chastened', but you are a jackass.

Nick| 4.6.09 @ 1:29AM

Gardener,

So you are against self-defense for individuals and law enforcement that involves the use of deadly force, right? And are you also against U.S soldiers, sailors, airmen, and marines defending this Great Country by killing the enemy until he gives up?

Are you the hypocrite, Gardener?
Or are you just someone who comes up with lame arguments trying to make Pro-Lifer's beliefs look hypocritical? Next time, follow your asinine thoughts to their logical conclusions.

And your theology is as flawed as your ability to make a cogent argument. Christ never said, taught, nor implied "don't kill people", so there was no "point" to "qualify".

At the time (A.D. 30's), the Romans didn't allow the Jews to put people to death. That is why it says the scribes and the Pharisees asked Jesus what to do with the adulteress "...to test Him,". If He says let her go, they will accuse him of not following the law of Moses. But if He says stone her, they will go tell the Romans He promoted an unlawful execution. Either way, they would have "...something to accuse Him of.", (see Jn 8:6).

Also, in the Old Testament, Jesus allows many exceptions for taking a human life. He tells Israel it is the right of society to protect itself from certain crimes with the death penalty. Try reading Exodus, Leviticus, and Deuteronomy. Christ is the Word of God, after all. (see Jn 1:1-5)

ruth| 4.6.09 @ 1:41AM

Nick, our country is dying; and all we really can do is pray. I recognize so many Biblical prophecies, do you?

DR. Dave| 4.6.09 @ 3:44PM

Gardener,

Jesus also told the woman, "Go and sin no more."

bill kotcher| 4.6.09 @ 10:11PM

Gardner states,

"I use the term "antiabortion" instead of "prolife" because most of the people I know who claim the title "prolife" are also "pro death-penalty" which does not make a lot of sense to me. "

Its simple, the death penalty if executed quickly, fairly, and justly prevents young children from being raped and murdered. Further, "the death penalty" does not kill the criminal, the criminal essentially chooses to begin a chain of events that results in his death. Does the thorn of a Rose seek to prick you or do you get pricked attempting to steal the bud of the plant. A person who willingly chooses a life that ends thier life due to events they control is very different.

Hauschild states,

"My concern here is simple. I do not wish the government, sign wavers, zealots, or issue-based meddlers in my family’s personal decisions."

I do not understand why Hauschild family needs so many abortions. Is it not irresponsible that after one abortion the Hasuchild family needs another. Certainly the Hateschild family can understand that its irresponsible to have repeated abortions.

What about the people that are educated in science, medicine and psychology. Would hautfield demand they not "meddle" as well. What if hautfield is conducting criminal acts against his family members, should the police not "meddle".

My ex-wife allowed my daughter to cut all the hair off her favorite stuffed gorilla, many years later my daughter asked who did this and we stated, "you did". My daughters response was, "you should not of let me do this".

Abortion damages a womans body, plain and simple. It also destroys life, this is a fact. Many woman never recover physically nor emotionally. It is wrong to place that burdon of "choice" solely on the woman.

I can see how in the 1960's such a barbaric medical practice was needed. So many people were on drugs and they did not have the education or the understanding we have today. Its 2009, we have spent billions on educating woman, there will be a point in history that abortion is stopped simply because we have advanced.

Once a woman becomes the life support system for another human being its too late. I am gracious, I will give a woman 12 hours after sex to change her mind. No more. We know what causes pregnancy, its time for the human race to advance and act responsibly.

Some people will never act responsibly. That is why there is law, to lesson the effects the irresponsible have on themselves and onto others.

So why not allow everyone to act irresponsible with no consequence. Anything goes.

Society needs laws to protect themselves, even from themself.

Angel| 4.6.09 @ 11:45PM

Bill, women need more men like you--even though most won't admit it. The man-whores who encourage (pressure) women to abort their babies are more the norm--sad to say. My heartfelt kudos to you, sir.

Cookie| 4.6.09 @ 11:46PM

Conservatives need laws to protect ourselves from liberals.

Nick| 4.7.09 @ 12:25AM

Hi Ruth!

Yes, prayer and living our Christian Faith are the only things that will save this Great Country.

As far as Biblical prophecies go, I've been changing my views on that lately. I'm currently listening to, for the second time, an audio series by Dr. Scott Hahn on the Book of Revelation called "The End". If you are able, I highly recommend getting this Bible study. It will blow your mind and make most of the Bible more understandable, at least it did for me.

Dr. Hahn, if your not familiar with him Ruth, is a former Presbyterian minister who converted to Catholicism and teaches theology at Franciscan University of Steubenville. The basic premise of his study on Revelation is that most of the events described in the book were fulfilled when Jerusalem was destroyed in A.D. 70. He doesn't rule out that some prophecies can apply to every age, including our own. Human nature being fallen and unchanging after all.

Basically, according to this interpretation, the Book of Revelation was a vivid reiteration of Christ's warnings to the present generation in chapters 23 and 24 of the Gospel According to Saint Matthew. Matthew 24 is known as the "little Apocalypse". Saint John's vision was another warning to Christians, probably in the mid A.D. 60's, of the coming Roman onslaught. We know from written histories that the Christians fled Jerusalem before the Roman siege and survived.

Sorry for going on for so long! Have a Great Holy Week, Ruth. And Happy Easter to You and Your Family.

ruth| 4.7.09 @ 2:53AM

Hope you and your family have a wonderful Easter, Nick. Thanks for your kind reply.

MHC| 4.10.09 @ 11:53AM

Michael Hauschild stated: "I do not wish the government, sign wavers, zealots, or issue-based meddlers in my family’s personal decisions."

Mr. Hauschild, killing your offspring is not within the realm of 'family's personal decision.' It's murder. Andrea Yates, Susan Smith, Leatrice Brewer all learned this. The traditional civilized consensus is that government's fundamental task is to protect the weak and defenseless against the powerful and the predator. None of us are weaker or more defenseless than our preborn sisters and brothers.

RAJ| 4.10.09 @ 11:46PM

I am in opposition to the confirmation of Governor Kathleen Sebelius as the Secretary of Health and Human Services. Her little known inhuman treatment of the sick and dying inmates held in the Kansas Department of Corrections is close to being fully exposed. Detail: iscientiausa.com

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