If it is meant to attract church-goers, is there any hope for their aesthetic soul?
(Page 3 of 4)
br>
You are my all in all.
br>
Seeking You as a precious jewel,
br>
Lord to give up I’d be a fool,
br>
You are my all in all.
/em>
p>
em>Jesus, Lamb of God — worthy is Your name.
br>
Jesus, Lamb of God — worthy is Your name.
/em>
/p>
p>
em>Taking my sin, my cross, my shame,
br>
Rising again, I bless Your name,
br>
You are my all in all.
br>
When I fall down, You pick me up,
I play modern rock music for a living, but a large chunk of my
music education was in sacred music and classical piano. I've
seen both sides, and many who take this view forget that there
were just as many lousy hymns written as there are lousy 'pop'
worship songs. It's a straw man argument to choose a weaker
worship song to pick on. And it's a fallacious assumption to
claim that all modern churches use contemporary music 'just to
get people in the doors'. There are many reasons churches include
modern worship music in their services, and many legitimate ones
they do no sing all hymns.
...In that last sentence I meant to type 'There are many reasons
churches include modern worship music in their services, and many
legitimate reasons for which they choose not to exclusively sing
hymns'.
(Nice comment Jonathan!) I also find it interesting simply to ask
"how many people are listening to classical music today?" The
number is miniscule. How many Christians are still reading only
the KJV? They are the minority.
So why do we still insist on singing music and repeating words
that for the most part have nothing in common with our world
today?
David says multiple times in the Psalms "SING A NEW
SONG!!!!!!!!!"
I find that most folks who don't appreciate modern worship never
understood Biblical Worship to begin with.
I am reading Mr. Henry's post for the second time, nearly a year
after the first, and I can' help but notice how uncharitable and
mean his words sound in describing what he must consider a
typical praise song. His phrases -"means really nothing" ...
"triteness follows upn triteness"..."almost literally gag-making"
-are totally subjective, and it seems he cannot find enough
pejoratives to convey his disdain. I would venture he cannot find
anything scripturally wrong with this song. In fact, I could
support most of the lines with scripture. Earlier he states that
he hates praise music. Well is it the praise or the music? When
the hymn writer enjoins us to"worship the king" and then we do,
are you saying, "stop, stop, that's not how I meant for you to do
it!" BTW at my church last year we spent more maintaining our
pipe organ than on our entire worship budget.
Just a couple more comments, as it was getting into the wee hours
during my previous post. "All in All" is by no means one of my
favorite songs. I find the lines "taking my cross, my sin, my
shame, rising again, I bless Your name" to be grammatically
confusing - who is doing the taking and rising- Jesus, or the
songwriter? This is an objective criticism. Mr. Henry offers none
of that. And Jonathan, your point that there are plenty of bad
(musically, theologically, and -yes- trite) hymns could easily be
proved by a casual perusal of most hymnals. Perhaps Mr. Henry's
observations about apostate churches appreciating the hymns is
not such a paradox at all - they love them for their refinement,
not their content. And in fact, many denominations have actually
changed the words to better fit their liberation theolgy.
My final point is that Mr. Henry tips his hand in his comment
that "real Christianity" consists of "Churches devoted to
rigorous, difficult theology," as if an intellectual life is all
there is to the Christian faith. Sounds a little like Gnosticism.
James writes "Pure religion and undefiled before God and the
Father is this, to visit the fatherless and widows in their
affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world." Of
course you need to be devoted to rigorous theology to keep
yourself unspotted from the world, but "real Christianity" is not
simply an intellectual pursuit. And you run the risk of having
your lampstand removed.(Revelation 2:2-5.)
We need to set aside statistics on how many Americans listen to
classical music versus pop music, for that reduces worship to
marketing the gospel. We need to avoid doubting one another's
salvation just because one of us expresses a commitment to an
intellectually rigorous faith. We need to seek in the scriptures
how God wants to be worshiped. There is much to say here, but
surely it is important that the psalms are beautiful poetry. Most
praise music, by contrast, is clumsy adolescent poetry set to
melodies, harmonies, and instrumentation borrowed from
advertising jingles. Is praise music the best we can offer to
God? I fear that instead we evangelicals are once again absorbing
and regurgitating the surrounding American culture that we so
badly need to stand against.
I feel like you fail to realize that most modern teenagers have
a hard enough time staying true to the word of God without songs
that a good majority of us can't stand. If we are bored to tears
during worship and aren't focused than what's the point of worship
at all. The music should be appropriate to maintain the
congregations attention so that they actually hear the message
instead of spacing out.
Jack, thank you for your comments and keeping the thread alive.
Since some of your comments seem to be in response to my post
(and some to paul's) I'll just say that I totally agree that we
should look to scripture to see how God wants to be worshipped. I
seem to be the only one here who has quoted or referenced
scripture either to support or refute, so let me just say that
not only scripture but our Lord Himself says that "God is a
Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and
in truth" (John 4:24) I don't find a verse that says "Thou shalt
not worship me with clumsy adolescent poetry "- interesting that
Lawrence Henry used that term, too - or "thou shalt not borrow
instrumentation from pop culture." Using an electric guitar or
synthesizer or drums is no more caving to "the world" than is
publishing "Christianity Today" as a "magazine" or producing
feature films, as did the Billy Graham organization back in the
70's.
Also, it wasn't me who questioned anyone's salvation, but Mr.
Henry did by stating that "real Christiantiy" consisted of
devotion to "rigorous, difficult theology," inferring that
anything else was not "real" Christianity. I in fact affrimed the
neccesity of such theological integrity, but pointed out from
scripture that our faith is more than just that one aspect.
It seems both you and Mr. Henry think "praise music" is just a
marketing ploy. But if the songs are theologically sound and
those who enjoy them are praising the attributes and character of
the God of the Bible, is there some scriptural reason to deny
them a form that helps them connect with that God?
I'm a worship leader. My mix consists largely of modern praise
and worship music, but I throw a number of the classic hymns and
gospel songs in, although I'll usually rock them out again.
Different songs for different people and different times -- God
loves all of us equally, but that doesn't mean we're all the
same!
Great article and I agree wholeheartedly. Praise music is just
another symptom of the dumbing down of America. Trite, shallow
& easy to sing crap -- religious pablum for the moronic
masses.
Kudo\'s to the webmaster for running a great site!
Bobby Williston| 12.30.09 @ 11:55AM
Amen, brother! Over the years I’ve just become very much averse
to the whole “anti-traditionalist” movement in the contemporary
evangelical church. This movement is most entrenched in the
evangelical megachurches. Here are some of the trappings of this
movement that I so despise:
1. Eschewing of traditional hymns (beautiful, classic hymns I
might add) played by traditional instruments (piano, organ,
possibly horns and strings) in favor of rock-style,
guitar-and-drums dominated “worship music” This (goofy, in my
opinion) music features abstract, sometimes downright weird
lyrics.
2. Church buildings that abandon the traditional design and
furniture of steeples, stained glass windows, and upholstered
pews, in favor of more trendy architecture that looks more like a
shopping center than a church. Additionally, the buildings look a
lot more like a shopping mall than a church on the inside, too. A
staple of the contemporary anti-traditionalist mega-church is the
coffee shop and café, as well as the “student” area, which
features all kinds of diversions for youth, from video games to
pool and ping pong to basketball and even rock-climbing walls.
3. The leadership, including the “worship team” and the pastors,
eschewing the traditional suit and tie and conservative grooming
in favor of “hip” and “trendy” clothing and hairstyles. Their
style of dress and hairstyles are now so ubiquitous among them
that they are laughable. Such obvious attempts to try to sell
themselves to those whom they perceive would be hostile to the
traditional trappings of church. They’re like the clueless
undercover cop who tries to pass himself off as a member of the
criminal element he’s trying to infiltrate. What are some of the
hallmarks of their style? One is the “bedhead” haircut. You won’t
go to any contemporary megachurch without seeing at least two
guys onstage with a bedhead. Another is the goatee. And no shirts
tucked in. Those three are the essentials. And it’s not at all
uncommon to see males with earrings.
4. The complete lack of any dress code among the congregation.
Jeans and t-shirts and sweatshirts are not at all uncommon, and
in the summer months it’s quite common to see people wearing
shorts and open-toed shoes.
The way I see it they’ve become the very thing that they
criticize as to the traditional church setting. They have
themselves established their own brand of what is the orthodox
church setting and what is not. To the staunch traditionalists,
anything but a suit and tie and traditional hymns is
unacceptable; if you stray from that, you’re being irreverent.
And to them, anything but hip and trendy clothes and grooming and
“worship music” is unacceptable; if you stray from this, it shows
you’re focused on the wrong things. I believe these
anti-traditionalists will be just as condemning of a person who
comes to church in a suit and tie with a conservative haircut as
a traditionalist would be of someone who comes to church dressed
like them.
The early church sang a hymn after the preaching of the word and
the early christians sang before being killed..In 2ndTimothy,
there is a song the early christians sang...I realize we call
praise music worship, but worship is as it is in Romans, ridding
oneself of all that does not pease God..to offer oneself a living
sacrifice unto God...When this happens, a christian will know
from spending time in God's Word what is acceptable to
God...There is NEVER TO BE ANY ARGUMENT OVER MUSIC...it is not
what is important..what is important is to become a disciple that
will ead others to the Lord..not to music but to the Lord...There
isso much jealousy, greed and strife over the music and not to
mention the industry of it...take time to be holy for the Lord
thy God is holy and in His presence we come humbly and in
reverrence...the time is so short and this world waxws worse...I
recently read and was shocked over Ray Boltz..are you praying for
him..please put what is more important first..
All of these posts are valid. We are all so different, and there
is not a 'standard' that most would or could follow. I've played
music since the early sixties. After years of Rock, Blues, Country,
Community Choirs, Praise and Worship, and even Mexican bands, I
prefer music that is not the norm. I like folk music from Eastern
Europe, Russian Orthodox Liturgical, Old Irish, Civil War,
Appalachian Mountain Music, and the list continues to grow. Praise
music means something to those who like it, and can be annoying and
nauseating to those who don't, like any other music. I think we
assign too much value to form. I came to Christ after watching
"Jesus Christ Superstar," I used to sing 'new songs' out of
Scripture with my guitar. I've gone through many changes in my
life, and my musical tastes have changed just as much. I don't
listen to Praise music anymore, which does not mean that I am not a
committed Christian. I don't listen to it because I don't care for
it generally, with a few exceptions. Find what you like and commit
to it, and don't get wrapped up in what you can't change.
Jonathan Kuehling | 1.2.09 @ 3:03AM
I play modern rock music for a living, but a large chunk of my music education was in sacred music and classical piano. I've seen both sides, and many who take this view forget that there were just as many lousy hymns written as there are lousy 'pop' worship songs. It's a straw man argument to choose a weaker worship song to pick on. And it's a fallacious assumption to claim that all modern churches use contemporary music 'just to get people in the doors'. There are many reasons churches include modern worship music in their services, and many legitimate ones they do no sing all hymns.
Jonathan Kuehling | 1.2.09 @ 3:07AM
...In that last sentence I meant to type 'There are many reasons churches include modern worship music in their services, and many legitimate reasons for which they choose not to exclusively sing hymns'.
paul cummings | 5.13.09 @ 3:20PM
(Nice comment Jonathan!) I also find it interesting simply to ask "how many people are listening to classical music today?" The number is miniscule. How many Christians are still reading only the KJV? They are the minority.
So why do we still insist on singing music and repeating words that for the most part have nothing in common with our world today?
David says multiple times in the Psalms "SING A NEW SONG!!!!!!!!!"
I find that most folks who don't appreciate modern worship never understood Biblical Worship to begin with.
Dan Adams| 5.16.09 @ 3:10AM
I am reading Mr. Henry's post for the second time, nearly a year after the first, and I can' help but notice how uncharitable and mean his words sound in describing what he must consider a typical praise song. His phrases -"means really nothing" ... "triteness follows upn triteness"..."almost literally gag-making" -are totally subjective, and it seems he cannot find enough pejoratives to convey his disdain. I would venture he cannot find anything scripturally wrong with this song. In fact, I could support most of the lines with scripture. Earlier he states that he hates praise music. Well is it the praise or the music? When the hymn writer enjoins us to"worship the king" and then we do, are you saying, "stop, stop, that's not how I meant for you to do it!" BTW at my church last year we spent more maintaining our pipe organ than on our entire worship budget.
Dan Adams| 5.16.09 @ 2:14PM
Just a couple more comments, as it was getting into the wee hours during my previous post. "All in All" is by no means one of my favorite songs. I find the lines "taking my cross, my sin, my shame, rising again, I bless Your name" to be grammatically confusing - who is doing the taking and rising- Jesus, or the songwriter? This is an objective criticism. Mr. Henry offers none of that. And Jonathan, your point that there are plenty of bad (musically, theologically, and -yes- trite) hymns could easily be proved by a casual perusal of most hymnals. Perhaps Mr. Henry's observations about apostate churches appreciating the hymns is not such a paradox at all - they love them for their refinement, not their content. And in fact, many denominations have actually changed the words to better fit their liberation theolgy.
My final point is that Mr. Henry tips his hand in his comment that "real Christianity" consists of "Churches devoted to rigorous, difficult theology," as if an intellectual life is all there is to the Christian faith. Sounds a little like Gnosticism. James writes "Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, to visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world." Of course you need to be devoted to rigorous theology to keep yourself unspotted from the world, but "real Christianity" is not simply an intellectual pursuit. And you run the risk of having your lampstand removed.(Revelation 2:2-5.)
paul cummings | 5.21.09 @ 9:25AM
AMEN DAN!
Jack| 6.10.09 @ 7:06AM
We need to set aside statistics on how many Americans listen to classical music versus pop music, for that reduces worship to marketing the gospel. We need to avoid doubting one another's salvation just because one of us expresses a commitment to an intellectually rigorous faith. We need to seek in the scriptures how God wants to be worshiped. There is much to say here, but surely it is important that the psalms are beautiful poetry. Most praise music, by contrast, is clumsy adolescent poetry set to melodies, harmonies, and instrumentation borrowed from advertising jingles. Is praise music the best we can offer to God? I fear that instead we evangelicals are once again absorbing and regurgitating the surrounding American culture that we so badly need to stand against.
Hi I'm paul| 11.23.10 @ 12:02AM
I feel like you fail to realize that most modern teenagers have a hard enough time staying true to the word of God without songs that a good majority of us can't stand. If we are bored to tears during worship and aren't focused than what's the point of worship at all. The music should be appropriate to maintain the congregations attention so that they actually hear the message instead of spacing out.
Dan Adams| 6.10.09 @ 8:31PM
Jack, thank you for your comments and keeping the thread alive. Since some of your comments seem to be in response to my post (and some to paul's) I'll just say that I totally agree that we should look to scripture to see how God wants to be worshipped. I seem to be the only one here who has quoted or referenced scripture either to support or refute, so let me just say that not only scripture but our Lord Himself says that "God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth" (John 4:24) I don't find a verse that says "Thou shalt not worship me with clumsy adolescent poetry "- interesting that Lawrence Henry used that term, too - or "thou shalt not borrow instrumentation from pop culture." Using an electric guitar or synthesizer or drums is no more caving to "the world" than is publishing "Christianity Today" as a "magazine" or producing feature films, as did the Billy Graham organization back in the 70's.
Also, it wasn't me who questioned anyone's salvation, but Mr. Henry did by stating that "real Christiantiy" consisted of devotion to "rigorous, difficult theology," inferring that anything else was not "real" Christianity. I in fact affrimed the neccesity of such theological integrity, but pointed out from scripture that our faith is more than just that one aspect.
It seems both you and Mr. Henry think "praise music" is just a marketing ploy. But if the songs are theologically sound and those who enjoy them are praising the attributes and character of the God of the Bible, is there some scriptural reason to deny them a form that helps them connect with that God?
Dan Adams| 6.10.09 @ 8:37PM
My apologies to Paul, who did reference scripture in his post, "Sing a new song." (Psalm 98:1 among others.)
Josh Marihugh | 11.19.09 @ 10:21PM
I'm a worship leader. My mix consists largely of modern praise and worship music, but I throw a number of the classic hymns and gospel songs in, although I'll usually rock them out again. Different songs for different people and different times -- God loves all of us equally, but that doesn't mean we're all the same!
Charles| 12.13.09 @ 2:22PM
Great article and I agree wholeheartedly. Praise music is just another symptom of the dumbing down of America. Trite, shallow & easy to sing crap -- religious pablum for the moronic masses.
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Bobby Williston| 12.30.09 @ 11:55AM
Amen, brother! Over the years I’ve just become very much averse to the whole “anti-traditionalist” movement in the contemporary evangelical church. This movement is most entrenched in the evangelical megachurches. Here are some of the trappings of this movement that I so despise:
1. Eschewing of traditional hymns (beautiful, classic hymns I might add) played by traditional instruments (piano, organ, possibly horns and strings) in favor of rock-style, guitar-and-drums dominated “worship music” This (goofy, in my opinion) music features abstract, sometimes downright weird lyrics.
2. Church buildings that abandon the traditional design and furniture of steeples, stained glass windows, and upholstered pews, in favor of more trendy architecture that looks more like a shopping center than a church. Additionally, the buildings look a lot more like a shopping mall than a church on the inside, too. A staple of the contemporary anti-traditionalist mega-church is the coffee shop and café, as well as the “student” area, which features all kinds of diversions for youth, from video games to pool and ping pong to basketball and even rock-climbing walls.
3. The leadership, including the “worship team” and the pastors, eschewing the traditional suit and tie and conservative grooming in favor of “hip” and “trendy” clothing and hairstyles. Their style of dress and hairstyles are now so ubiquitous among them that they are laughable. Such obvious attempts to try to sell themselves to those whom they perceive would be hostile to the traditional trappings of church. They’re like the clueless undercover cop who tries to pass himself off as a member of the criminal element he’s trying to infiltrate. What are some of the hallmarks of their style? One is the “bedhead” haircut. You won’t go to any contemporary megachurch without seeing at least two guys onstage with a bedhead. Another is the goatee. And no shirts tucked in. Those three are the essentials. And it’s not at all uncommon to see males with earrings.
4. The complete lack of any dress code among the congregation. Jeans and t-shirts and sweatshirts are not at all uncommon, and in the summer months it’s quite common to see people wearing shorts and open-toed shoes.
The way I see it they’ve become the very thing that they criticize as to the traditional church setting. They have themselves established their own brand of what is the orthodox church setting and what is not. To the staunch traditionalists, anything but a suit and tie and traditional hymns is unacceptable; if you stray from that, you’re being irreverent. And to them, anything but hip and trendy clothes and grooming and “worship music” is unacceptable; if you stray from this, it shows you’re focused on the wrong things. I believe these anti-traditionalists will be just as condemning of a person who comes to church in a suit and tie with a conservative haircut as a traditionalist would be of someone who comes to church dressed like them.
Mary| 2.2.10 @ 2:44PM
The early church sang a hymn after the preaching of the word and the early christians sang before being killed..In 2ndTimothy, there is a song the early christians sang...I realize we call praise music worship, but worship is as it is in Romans, ridding oneself of all that does not pease God..to offer oneself a living sacrifice unto God...When this happens, a christian will know from spending time in God's Word what is acceptable to God...There is NEVER TO BE ANY ARGUMENT OVER MUSIC...it is not what is important..what is important is to become a disciple that will ead others to the Lord..not to music but to the Lord...There isso much jealousy, greed and strife over the music and not to mention the industry of it...take time to be holy for the Lord thy God is holy and in His presence we come humbly and in reverrence...the time is so short and this world waxws worse...I recently read and was shocked over Ray Boltz..are you praying for him..please put what is more important first..
Reed| 9.4.10 @ 1:16PM
All of these posts are valid. We are all so different, and there is not a 'standard' that most would or could follow. I've played music since the early sixties. After years of Rock, Blues, Country, Community Choirs, Praise and Worship, and even Mexican bands, I prefer music that is not the norm. I like folk music from Eastern Europe, Russian Orthodox Liturgical, Old Irish, Civil War, Appalachian Mountain Music, and the list continues to grow. Praise music means something to those who like it, and can be annoying and nauseating to those who don't, like any other music. I think we assign too much value to form. I came to Christ after watching "Jesus Christ Superstar," I used to sing 'new songs' out of Scripture with my guitar. I've gone through many changes in my life, and my musical tastes have changed just as much. I don't listen to Praise music anymore, which does not mean that I am not a committed Christian. I don't listen to it because I don't care for it generally, with a few exceptions. Find what you like and commit to it, and don't get wrapped up in what you can't change.